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Kenny Atkinson's idea

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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#21 » by ecuhus1981 » Wed May 8, 2019 8:51 pm

Prok's comin' thru with some HOT TAKES today!

First, Randle has backed up both bigman spots in the past, but he would not come off of the bench here, unless we also signed Durant. He'd start alongside Jarrett. He's not a top choice for me, but he's a starter.

Brook, on the other hand, could be a supersub C for us. I think he would carve into Ed's role quite a bit, and it's unlikely he leaves MIL, but he would fit us well.

Danny Green would be a worthwhile addition on a 1-year, $12mil contract, IF we strike out on absolutely everyone else and no salary absorption deals seem palatable. Long shot.

The elite guards (including Klay also) are not my highest priority, I would rather upgrade our forward spots. But we could far worse with $30mil than sign one of those, and I'd taker any of them over a 2nd-tier forward.

Jimmy has proven his pedigree, taking ragtag teams to the postseason and playing big in big moments. I wouldn't say he's been a model citizen in Philly, but a more winning environment has smoother the rough edges. Every FA has a past, and we could poke holes in any star's flaws if we really wanted. Bottom line, they would improve us significantly. I hope we get one.
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#22 » by Prokorov » Wed May 8, 2019 9:22 pm

ecuhus1981 wrote:Prok's comin' thru with some HOT TAKES today!

First, Randle has backed up both bigman spots in the past, but he would not come off of the bench here, unless we also signed Durant. He'd start alongside Jarrett. He's not a top choice for me, but he's a starter.


He isn't a fit here. Thats the point, if he did come here it would have to be as a backup center because allen is the center of the future and dont play 2 bigs in our system/he isnt a fit here at PF. I have nothing against randle. If Allen wasnt here id sign him in a heartbeat as our center. same with Bobby portis. But allen is already very good at 20 and is on a rookie deal.

Brook, on the other hand, could be a supersub C for us. I think he would carve into Ed's role quite a bit, and it's unlikely he leaves MIL, but he would fit us well.


we wouldnt bring in brook if ed davis was here, it would be to replace davis. im sure he would be a fine backup, but again, we cant afford to pay backups 10+ million. it would kill our ability to use our cap to go sign an all-star calibur player. Lopez is also 31 now, and more of a "win now" type player then someone you build a young team with

Danny Green would be a worthwhile addition on a 1-year, $12mil contract, IF we strike out on absolutely everyone else and no salary absorption deals seem palatable. Long shot.


it would be a bad fit. we have Harris and Crabbe for that role and are better off using the room exception if we want a third shooter. unless they played green at PF, he probably wouldnt start here and again, you cant spend 10-12 million on a backup, especially with spencer and crabbe already making 30 million off the bench combined.

if we strike out on everyone, we should be absorbing salary with picks attached and trying to facilitate someone trying to get a second max slot

The elite guards (including Klay also) are not my highest priority, I would rather upgrade our forward spots. But we could far worse with $30mil than sign one of those, and I'd taker any of them over a 2nd-tier forward.


agree 100%. our biggest need is TALENT. if we end up with kemba cause tobias or kawhi wont come here thats still a great offseason. better then adding more role players with our cap

Jimmy has proven his pedigree, taking ragtag teams to the postseason and playing big in big moments. I wouldn't say he's been a model citizen in Philly, but a more winning environment has smoother the rough edges. Every FA has a past, and we could poke holes in any star's flaws if we really wanted. Bottom line, they would improve us significantly. I hope we get one.


passing on butler for "charecter" reasons would be a mistake. i think butler is still on the right side of the overly competitive vs. locker room cancer line. and i think we have coach, player, front office infrustructure to insulate against that. similar to the patriots taking on corey dillon or randy moss
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#23 » by kamaze » Wed May 8, 2019 9:56 pm

Prokorov wrote:
kamaze wrote:
kamaze wrote:


I was talking about small forwards getting to the rim not shooting guards.
Harris and Crabbe are shooting guards that can play small forward but playing on the perimeter is their bread and butter.

It's ok if your shooting guard doesn't go to the rim if the rest of the team does.
The point guard, the small forward, the power forward and the center.
The problem is when you don't have a point guard that get to the line, a small forward who doesn't and neither does the power forward.


That still doesnt change the fact that green isnt good at the rim, makes our problem worse, would use up a huge portion of our cap preventing us from bringing in good players, and is completely redundant with harris and crabbe


How does Green make anything worse?

Did you not read what I wrote?
I was talking about small forwards getting to the rim not shooting guards. It's ok if your shooting guard doesn't go to the rim if the rest of the team does.



The first thing thing they'll do in free agency is go after a power forward, after that they can see about the rest of the roster.
I doubt he'll get close to the same contract the Spurs gave him he's a little older. He's from Long Island he might want to finish his career in NY, who wouldn't.

Allen Crabbe started next to Harris after the All Star Break when the word got out how good of a shooter he was. That gave the team the shooting it was missing since teams wouldn't leave Joe open. In the playoffs Crabbe was out and Joe struggled with his shot so did DeMarre. If they run the same offense, they'll need two good three point shooters in the starting lineup and could use one off the bench since in my ideal scenario they'd draft or sign a small forward that can attack the rim and get to the line.

This is a team that relies on 3 point shooting so they can never get too many three point specialists.
Who's going to sacrifice for their teammates here? Defense? Unselfishness?
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#24 » by kamaze » Wed May 8, 2019 9:59 pm

NetsJets wrote:Lol at backup center


He's a starting power forward averaging 21 & 8 lol. The team needs big men that's what you spend money on.
Who's going to sacrifice for their teammates here? Defense? Unselfishness?
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#25 » by Prokorov » Wed May 8, 2019 10:00 pm

kamaze wrote:
How does Green make anything worse?


the problem isnt that he makes us worse, the problem is that he doesnt really make us better and eats up a huge portion of our cap and prevents us from signing an all-star or starting calibur forward.


The first thing thing they'll do in free agency is go after a power forward, after that they can see about the rest of the roster.
I doubt he'll get close to the same contract the Spurs gave him he's a little older. He's from Long Island he might want to finish his career in NY, who wouldn't.


nets cant afford a max player and green

Allen Crabbe started next to Harris after the All Star Break when the word got out how good of a shooter he was. That gave the team the shooting it was missing since teams wouldn't leave Joe open. In the playoffs Crabbe was out and Joe struggled with his shot so did DeMarre. If they run the same offense, they'll need two good three point shooters in the starting lineup and could use one off the bench since in my ideal scenario they'd draft or sign a small forward that can attack the rim and get to the line.

This is a team that relies on 3 point shooting so they can never get too many three point specialists.


danny green isnt good enough to value him over a starting forward. we already have 2 danny greens in crabbe and harris
Kswiss wrote:Go watch a D'Angelo Russell highlight tape and tell me with a straight face the kid looks like a NBA prospect. I just can't see him in the league in three years.


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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#26 » by kamaze » Wed May 8, 2019 10:17 pm

Prokorov wrote:
kamaze wrote:
How does Green make anything worse?


the problem isnt that he makes us worse, the problem is that he doesnt really make us better and eats up a huge portion of our cap and prevents us from signing an all-star or starting calibur forward.


The first thing thing they'll do in free agency is go after a power forward, after that they can see about the rest of the roster.
I doubt he'll get close to the same contract the Spurs gave him he's a little older. He's from Long Island he might want to finish his career in NY, who wouldn't.


nets cant afford a max player and green

Allen Crabbe started next to Harris after the All Star Break when the word got out how good of a shooter he was. That gave the team the shooting it was missing since teams wouldn't leave Joe open. In the playoffs Crabbe was out and Joe struggled with his shot so did DeMarre. If they run the same offense, they'll need two good three point shooters in the starting lineup and could use one off the bench since in my ideal scenario they'd draft or sign a small forward that can attack the rim and get to the line.

This is a team that relies on 3 point shooting so they can never get too many three point specialists.


danny green isnt good enough to value him over a starting forward. we already have 2 danny greens in crabbe and harris


A 45 % 3 point shooter and a good defender would make any 3 point shooting team better. Like I said they'd sign a power forward first then fix the rest of the roster we'll see what happens.

It's the gm's job to figure out the price range and such. Again they don't have to sign him outright they can trade for him I believe.

They could use better shooting DMC shot 25% from 3 in the playoffs, Kurucs (I know he's a rookie)25%, Dlo shot 28%. They can and will get better by adding better players.
Who's going to sacrifice for their teammates here? Defense? Unselfishness?
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#27 » by Prokorov » Wed May 8, 2019 11:26 pm

kamaze wrote:
A 45 % 3 point shooter and a good defender would make any 3 point shooting team better. Like I said they'd sign a power forward first then fix the rest of the roster we'll see what happens.


not really... not when his minutes would be replacing someone else who is already a 40%+ 3 point shooter. its also likely greens 3 point shooting drops closer to his career average, similar to what we saw of crabbe and are likely to see of harris. 44-46% years are typically anomoly years. not that he wouldnt still shoot well.

Green would replace minutes that this year went to harris,crabbe, carroll. who all shoot and have played solid defense.

we also couldnt sign Green and add a high end PF. we dont have the cap for both

It's the gm's job to figure out the price range and such. Again they don't have to sign him outright they can trade for him I believe.


1) the GM would have figured out its not possible to sign green unless he is your big offseason signing. that would be dumb since we plenty of guys like green already

2) for us to trade for him and have it not count against our cap we would need to use all our cap space, then give up an asset to toronto who would have to sign and trade him to us. unlikely and would cost us an assett to do it. again makes no sense for someone who doesnt help us much

They could use better shooting DMC shot 25% from 3 in the playoffs, Kurucs (I know he's a rookie)25%, Dlo shot 28%. They can and will get better by adding better players.


those players wont be danny green
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#28 » by Aussienet3 » Thu May 9, 2019 1:22 am

Prokorov wrote:
Aussienet3 wrote:KD and Brook Lopez plus internal development will get this team to the ECF finals as a minimum. I still don't get how people on here are in love with us signing ball hogging guards like Kyrie, Kemba or Butler. Our guards know the system and how to share the ball. If we can't get KD then maybe Harris or Randle.


Everyone would want KD, obviously.

Brook Lopez is a role player, we were smart to move on from him and have done nothing but improve since we got rid of him and moved to modern centers.

Randle will cost to much, cant justify paying a backup center 15-20 million.

Kemba, Butler, and Kyrie are all star players who for 82 games give you what Russell gave us for 3 months. all are perfect fits hit and all would move the needle in a big way. Kennys system wants 2 ball handlers who can shoot on the floor at all times. id be trhilled with any of those guys


2 ball handlers? We already have Russell LeVert and Dinwiddie. The last 2 suffering injuries during the year. Both on cap friendly deals. I don't think Kemba, Kyrie and Butler are bad players. I'm just extremely confident with the guys we have and really looking for that 4 spot to be filled first and foremost.
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#29 » by Prokorov » Thu May 9, 2019 3:23 am

Aussienet3 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
Aussienet3 wrote:KD and Brook Lopez plus internal development will get this team to the ECF finals as a minimum. I still don't get how people on here are in love with us signing ball hogging guards like Kyrie, Kemba or Butler. Our guards know the system and how to share the ball. If we can't get KD then maybe Harris or Randle.


Everyone would want KD, obviously.

Brook Lopez is a role player, we were smart to move on from him and have done nothing but improve since we got rid of him and moved to modern centers.

Randle will cost to much, cant justify paying a backup center 15-20 million.

Kemba, Butler, and Kyrie are all star players who for 82 games give you what Russell gave us for 3 months. all are perfect fits hit and all would move the needle in a big way. Kennys system wants 2 ball handlers who can shoot on the floor at all times. id be trhilled with any of those guys


2 ball handlers? We already have Russell LeVert and Dinwiddie. The last 2 suffering injuries during the year. Both on cap friendly deals. I don't think Kemba, Kyrie and Butler are bad players. I'm just extremely confident with the guys we have and really looking for that 4 spot to be filled first and foremost.


kemba and kyrie are on another planet then dinwidie and levert. a good game for dinwiddie or levert is what those guys do on a nightly basis. you can play levert alongside those 2 since they both shoot so well. you can contnue to bring dinwiddie off the bench as a super sub. 4 ball handlers is ideal.

we can draft a PF and continue to develop rodi
Kswiss wrote:Go watch a D'Angelo Russell highlight tape and tell me with a straight face the kid looks like a NBA prospect. I just can't see him in the league in three years.


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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#30 » by Aussienet3 » Thu May 9, 2019 9:30 am

Prokorov wrote:
Aussienet3 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
Everyone would want KD, obviously.

Brook Lopez is a role player, we were smart to move on from him and have done nothing but improve since we got rid of him and moved to modern centers.

Randle will cost to much, cant justify paying a backup center 15-20 million.

Kemba, Butler, and Kyrie are all star players who for 82 games give you what Russell gave us for 3 months. all are perfect fits hit and all would move the needle in a big way. Kennys system wants 2 ball handlers who can shoot on the floor at all times. id be trhilled with any of those guys


2 ball handlers? We already have Russell LeVert and Dinwiddie. The last 2 suffering injuries during the year. Both on cap friendly deals. I don't think Kemba, Kyrie and Butler are bad players. I'm just extremely confident with the guys we have and really looking for that 4 spot to be filled first and foremost.


kemba and kyrie are on another planet then dinwidie and levert. a good game for dinwiddie or levert is what those guys do on a nightly basis. you can play levert alongside those 2 since they both shoot so well. you can contnue to bring dinwiddie off the bench as a super sub. 4 ball handlers is ideal.

we can draft a PF and continue to develop rodi


Did you see Kyries numbers versus the Bucks? Thats the type of player I don't want on my team. He can stay on that sh*tty planet with Kemba!
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#31 » by NyCeEvO » Thu May 9, 2019 5:21 pm

Aussienet3 wrote:
drchaos wrote:
Aussienet3 wrote:KD and Brook Lopez plus internal development will get this team to the ECF finals as a minimum. I still don't get how people on here are in love with us signing ball hogging guards like Kyrie, Kemba or Butler. Our guards know the system and how to share the ball. If we can't get KD then maybe Harris or Randle.


Butler is an elite defender that we are sorely lacking.

Anything he does on offense is just gravy.


I see a player who has burned through 3 teams in 4 years. Something doesn't add up. Therefore it's a no from me.

He certainly hasn't worn out his welcome in Philly.

When it's best for the team to work through another player (e.g. Embiid), he defers, and when he's asked to step up and be the focal point, he does it pretty well.

I like Butler. But if he comes on his own, the general consensus is that our ceiling would be capped as a 2nd round or maybe dark horse ECF contender. We'd really need Levert and DLo to really blossom into full blown allstars in order for us to be something more than that.
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#32 » by MrDollarBills » Thu May 9, 2019 6:26 pm

NyCeEvO wrote:
Aussienet3 wrote:
drchaos wrote:
Butler is an elite defender that we are sorely lacking.

Anything he does on offense is just gravy.


I see a player who has burned through 3 teams in 4 years. Something doesn't add up. Therefore it's a no from me.

He certainly hasn't worn out his welcome in Philly.

When it's best for the team to work through another player (e.g. Embiid), he defers, and when he's asked to step up and be the focal point, he does it pretty well.

I like Butler. But if he comes on his own, the general consensus is that our ceiling would be capped as a 2nd round or maybe dark horse ECF contender. We'd really need Levert and DLo to really blossom into full blown allstars in order for us to be something more than that.


When Butler is in a winning situation he behaves himself, I think that has been made clear.

I'd be willing to give him a chance tbh but I agree, Russell and LeVert need to continue to keep improving for that to even remotely work. If they don't and we spend the next two seasons stuck in the same position Butler will probably not be as agreeable.

I'd still rather have Kevin Durant. :-?
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#33 » by NyCeEvO » Thu May 9, 2019 7:33 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
NyCeEvO wrote:
Aussienet3 wrote:
I see a player who has burned through 3 teams in 4 years. Something doesn't add up. Therefore it's a no from me.

He certainly hasn't worn out his welcome in Philly.

When it's best for the team to work through another player (e.g. Embiid), he defers, and when he's asked to step up and be the focal point, he does it pretty well.

I like Butler. But if he comes on his own, the general consensus is that our ceiling would be capped as a 2nd round or maybe dark horse ECF contender. We'd really need Levert and DLo to really blossom into full blown allstars in order for us to be something more than that.


When Butler is in a winning situation he behaves himself, I think that has been made clear.

I'd be willing to give him a chance tbh but I agree, Russell and LeVert need to continue to keep improving for that to even remotely work. If they don't and we spend the next two seasons stuck in the same position Butler will probably not be as agreeable.

I'd still rather have Kevin Durant. :-?

Oh yeah, I think we all would.

But if the KD and Kawhi don't work out, the Nets will have to ask themselves if the guys on next tier down are worth it.

Unless a number of players opt-in for unexpected reasons, the 2020 FA class isn't good outside of Davis.
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#34 » by TheNetsFan » Thu May 9, 2019 10:59 pm

I’d strongly consider Butler. This team needs a player of his ability and grit. He’d probably be about the 5th option, but It would still be a successful offseason if we add him.
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#35 » by MrDollarBills » Fri May 10, 2019 10:45 am

TheNetsFan wrote:I’d strongly consider Butler. This team needs a player of his ability and grit. He’d probably be about the 5th option, but It would still be a successful offseason if we add him.


I highly doubt Philly lets him walk. It may come down to him or Tobias Harris, they can't feasibly keep both unless they don't care about tax implications.
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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#36 » by Prokorov » Fri May 10, 2019 12:10 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
TheNetsFan wrote:I’d strongly consider Butler. This team needs a player of his ability and grit. He’d probably be about the 5th option, but It would still be a successful offseason if we add him.


I highly doubt Philly lets him walk. It may come down to him or Tobias Harris, they can't feasibly keep both unless they don't care about tax implications.


they can max both and be under the tax. neither butler or harris is a 35% max player, and embiid and simmons are on rookie deals.
Kswiss wrote:Go watch a D'Angelo Russell highlight tape and tell me with a straight face the kid looks like a NBA prospect. I just can't see him in the league in three years.


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Re: Kenny Atkinson's idea 

Post#37 » by TheNetsFan » Fri May 10, 2019 5:32 pm

Prokorov wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
TheNetsFan wrote:I’d strongly consider Butler. This team needs a player of his ability and grit. He’d probably be about the 5th option, but It would still be a successful offseason if we add him.


I highly doubt Philly lets him walk. It may come down to him or Tobias Harris, they can't feasibly keep both unless they don't care about tax implications.


they can max both and be under the tax. neither butler or harris is a 35% max player, and embiid and simmons are on rookie deals.

Embiid’s already into his max, and Simmons is due in 2020.

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