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Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant

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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#721 » by Danny Darko » Sun May 12, 2019 7:47 am

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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#722 » by Spanish_Laker » Sun May 12, 2019 9:51 am

Good luck Vogel, your luck will be ours.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#723 » by Rafer24 » Sun May 12, 2019 11:28 am

Vogel is a good coach, a clear upgrade over Walton.

Let´s hope he can have a good staff, even with Kidd.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#724 » by dockingsched » Sun May 12, 2019 12:41 pm

RRyder823 wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:
KidA24 wrote:Hey all. Bucks fan here.

Let me give you my super brief JKidd rundown.

He's a terrible coach. He didn't develop young players at all - See MCW, Thon, Rashard Vaughn, Jabari.

He favored playing guys who offered no reasonable skill beyond looking like they tried hard or that were his friends (or friends kids) such as GP3, DeAndre Liggins and Miles Plumlee, and 54 year old Jason Terry.

He also ran an offense that regularly featured initiating it at the elbow through John Henson.

Yes. That elite playmaker, John Henson. Over Middleton, Brogdon or a Giannis.

I have no doubt he'll cause dysfunction in your locker room or on the coaching staff, he avoids blame, and forces it upon everyone else publicly to make himself look good (the opposite of what a good leader does).

Good luck with him.


Giannis credits his development to Kidd and you can see a lot of what makes Giannis so good is replicating elements of Kidds game, things he developed while under Kidd.

Why do Bucks fans try to ignore this? The greatest thing you have is partly because of Kidd
You're completely over selling Kidds development skills. The best I can say about him is he does a good job of keeping a developing player from developing to many bad habits. Problem is he does this by completely limiting any and all facets of a players game where it might be factor. As an example I guarantee that no one will need to worry about Ball becoming a "chucker" and it'll be because Kidd will expressly forbid him from shooting any and all shots with a player within 5 ft of him.

Absolutely horrible when it comes to setting lineups and rotations. Even worse at managing minutes. Cant draw up a play and is a horrible leader who WILL cause division in the locker room.

As a Bucks fan who has called the Lakers my #2 team since Showtime got me interested in basketball when I was a kid the news of Kidd made me sad (made every other Bucks fan happy though of course)

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Thoughts on Zach Lowe’s recent comments about Kidd?

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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#725 » by LAKESHOW » Sun May 12, 2019 1:25 pm

Its all on Frank Vogel. Frank has got to X and O his way out of this stuff. Or find staffers that will. We already know what were gettin with Kidd. Its historically proven, many All Star caliber players arent X and O guys. Magic, etc and many more. They were instinctual players, but cant find the translation when teaching and imparting that wisdom to players. And end up as lousy coaches. Not all, but the proof is there. We hired Frank to get the job done. Its all on him.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#726 » by leeprettyp » Sun May 12, 2019 1:40 pm

Kilroy wrote:If the plan really is to just have Vogel here to be a buffer until Kidd can take over, then this sucks ass... But if they brought Kidd in to basically mentor Ball, and maybe even Ingram, then this is a decent hire, even if Vogel isn't name brand enough.

If Vogel is coming in thinking Kidd's here to replace him, I can't imagine he's going to put a whole lot into this...


I want to see if he's really up for the challenge, I feel the Kidd angle has more to it then we know. Attempt to appease LBJ or maybe a F.A. wouldn't mind playing under him?

But, the development of our baby Lakers is important... Now lets see if we can get a top tier free agent and construct a better roster. I swear the injuries were such a huge issue last season. We didn't even get a chance to get our young Lakers playoff experience smh.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#727 » by PockyCandy » Sun May 12, 2019 3:05 pm

Landsberger wrote:The base seems upset that we've looked at older more established coaches. I get the whole "new game" stuff but I also thing it's so overblown it's not funny as well.

A good coach sets up a system to benefit his players rather than bend his players to a system. We hired a retired coach way back in the late 90's who ran a system developed decades earlier and in no way was "modern" and we did OK. Vogel seems to be a pretty good upgrade to Luke and the hate for Kidd seems really misplaced to me. He's seems perfect for an assistant job. A hell of a lot better than Madsen for example.


I haven't read through all 40 pages of this thread, but it seems like most Lakers fans are OK with hiring Vogel. Seems to know how to run a defense and has a decent track record of success.

But Kidd on the other hand......yikes. The off the court stuff is troubling, as well as literally every Bucks fan on this site telling us how Kidd is a terrible person who will ruin the locker room. And it's not like upgrading from Mark Madsen is difficult.

I mean c'mon, they're the Lakers. They should have enough money to hire the best assistant coaches in the industry.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#728 » by Slava » Sun May 12, 2019 4:00 pm

PockyCandy wrote:
Landsberger wrote:The base seems upset that we've looked at older more established coaches. I get the whole "new game" stuff but I also thing it's so overblown it's not funny as well.

A good coach sets up a system to benefit his players rather than bend his players to a system. We hired a retired coach way back in the late 90's who ran a system developed decades earlier and in no way was "modern" and we did OK. Vogel seems to be a pretty good upgrade to Luke and the hate for Kidd seems really misplaced to me. He's seems perfect for an assistant job. A hell of a lot better than Madsen for example.


I haven't read through all 40 pages of this thread, but it seems like most Lakers fans are OK with hiring Vogel. Seems to know how to run a defense and has a decent track record of success.

But Kidd on the other hand......yikes. The off the court stuff is troubling, as well as literally every Bucks fan on this site telling us how Kidd is a terrible person who will ruin the locker room. And it's not like upgrading from Mark Madsen is difficult.

I mean c'mon, they're the Lakers. They should have enough money to hire the best assistant coaches in the industry.


That's the thing though, they are spending a lot of money on an assistant and that assistant turns out to be Kidd. The front office hasn't been about saving cash but more about investing it in the wrong places and empowering incompetent people.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#729 » by zimpy27 » Sun May 12, 2019 4:29 pm

PockyCandy wrote:
Landsberger wrote:The base seems upset that we've looked at older more established coaches. I get the whole "new game" stuff but I also thing it's so overblown it's not funny as well.

A good coach sets up a system to benefit his players rather than bend his players to a system. We hired a retired coach way back in the late 90's who ran a system developed decades earlier and in no way was "modern" and we did OK. Vogel seems to be a pretty good upgrade to Luke and the hate for Kidd seems really misplaced to me. He's seems perfect for an assistant job. A hell of a lot better than Madsen for example.


I haven't read through all 40 pages of this thread, but it seems like most Lakers fans are OK with hiring Vogel. Seems to know how to run a defense and has a decent track record of success.

But Kidd on the other hand......yikes. The off the court stuff is troubling, as well as literally every Bucks fan on this site telling us how Kidd is a terrible person who will ruin the locker room. And it's not like upgrading from Mark Madsen is difficult.

I mean c'mon, they're the Lakers. They should have enough money to hire the best assistant coaches in the industry.

Kidd gets way too much blame for the Bucks problems, look at the roster changes they've had between now and when he was a coach. He's an average coach, not a bad coach. fwiw
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#730 » by pb-ceo » Sun May 12, 2019 4:40 pm

man I can almost guarantee lots and lots of drama and dysfunction starting in training camp with your coaching setup. if the GM had a goal and said you know I want to create the most Chaotic environment and go for max dysfunction I am going to put these two coaches together with LBJ. you could not draw it up any better than that if your goal was chaos.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#731 » by mc140 » Sun May 12, 2019 5:42 pm

Hopefully Vogel gives Kidd the Lawrence Frank treatment by Thanksgiving.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#732 » by tlifeset » Sun May 12, 2019 7:08 pm

Here's how I understand the Lakers interview timeline (I'm only bringing up the key names)...

Interviewed Monty and liked him, had a 2nd interview but never offered him the job.
Interviewed Kidd and liked him, but decided he should be on the staff.
Interviewed Lue and liked him, Lue brought up Thibs but for his staff but then it didn't seem likely, Vogel was mentioned as assistant during reporting, they offered 3 years and requested Kidd on the staff as well, Lue pulled out.
Interviewed Vogel, offered 3 years and requested Kidd, he accepted.

So, here's my question... Was it Lue that brought up Vogel as a replacement name for his staff when he couldn't get Thibs OR did the Lakers bring up Vogel as a name they wanted to see on the staff with or without Thibs?

Because the way it's being reported (or was reported) made it appear that Vogel didn't come up until Lue was a candidate for HC and ONLY after Thibs was off the table, which made it seem like it was Lue's idea to bring in Vogel. Because his name never appeared on a short list.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#733 » by Ball so hard » Sun May 12, 2019 9:01 pm

Vogel appears to be an upgrade over Luke. His success will be heavily dependent on how he fills out his remaining coaching staff.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#734 » by lakerRD » Sun May 12, 2019 9:18 pm

Ball so hard wrote:Vogel appears to be an upgrade over Luke. His success will be heavily dependent on how he fills out his remaining coaching staff.


...and how the roster fills out.

Truthfully, if we get KD or Kawhi or even Kyrie, would it have mattered if the coach is Lue or Williams or Vogel?
It becomes less and less material who coaches if you have a couple of superstars on the team. In those types of situations the most successful coaches find a way to get out the way of the players.
If the roster is marginal, like the Clipps, then coaching becomes more relevant.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#735 » by Ill-yasova » Sun May 12, 2019 9:39 pm

zimpy27 wrote:
PockyCandy wrote:
Landsberger wrote:The base seems upset that we've looked at older more established coaches. I get the whole "new game" stuff but I also thing it's so overblown it's not funny as well.

A good coach sets up a system to benefit his players rather than bend his players to a system. We hired a retired coach way back in the late 90's who ran a system developed decades earlier and in no way was "modern" and we did OK. Vogel seems to be a pretty good upgrade to Luke and the hate for Kidd seems really misplaced to me. He's seems perfect for an assistant job. A hell of a lot better than Madsen for example.


I haven't read through all 40 pages of this thread, but it seems like most Lakers fans are OK with hiring Vogel. Seems to know how to run a defense and has a decent track record of success.

But Kidd on the other hand......yikes. The off the court stuff is troubling, as well as literally every Bucks fan on this site telling us how Kidd is a terrible person who will ruin the locker room. And it's not like upgrading from Mark Madsen is difficult.

I mean c'mon, they're the Lakers. They should have enough money to hire the best assistant coaches in the industry.

Kidd gets way too much blame for the Bucks problems, look at the roster changes they've had between now and when he was a coach. He's an average coach, not a bad coach. fwiw

He’s bad. The only real full season addition from last year was Lopez who started. Ersan and Pat have both been injured, or in and out of the lineup all season, and Niko was traded for around the All Star Break and missed a full month with an injury. It’s literally all been about a change in the terrible schemes Kidd had.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#736 » by S.W.A.N » Sun May 12, 2019 9:45 pm

Honestly.... Besides an end to the drama fest. Who the F cares who the coach of the Lakers is?

Seriously. The laker season is going to come down to two things. Health and roster upgrades.

Not having good shooters around Lebron was stupid. Lesson learned. Now they will had a second star (Kyrie, Butler, Walker, etc.) and a shooter or two. This is what is going to define the Lakers season. Not the damn coach....
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#738 » by myersia » Mon May 13, 2019 12:15 am

Slava wrote:https://www.theringer.com/2019/5/12/18616750/frank-vogel-los-angeles-lakers-head-coach


He’s our dude. Great article


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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#739 » by Cafu » Mon May 13, 2019 2:54 am

With this much flack the FO getting for hiring Kidd, I think no way Kidd would get a chance to replace Vogel even if Vogel would not work out. I think Jennie would care too much for the damage reputation of hiring Kidd as a HC lol. She is reported livid right now because of the bad press.
So I think we should not be worried much about Kidd becomes our HC.
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Re: Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant 

Post#740 » by tlifeset » Mon May 13, 2019 4:08 am

myersia wrote:
Slava wrote:https://www.theringer.com/2019/5/12/18616750/frank-vogel-los-angeles-lakers-head-coach


He’s our dude. Great article


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Refreshing to read an article that doesnt have jason kidd in the first paragraph and is actually about frank vogel. Incredible that a national publication can produce this quality angle but not one local lakers source can do anything other than cry about the process, and spew homespun bs from an endless supply of lies and page view tactics.

They can call the lakers fo embarrassing but nothing is more embarrassing than our media coverage. Period.

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