Free agency and trade ideas: Which wings do we go after this summer?

[lilfishi22]

So 10m In cap ?

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Salary dump JJ and you're looking at around $17m

Might have to attach the Bucks pick or say there is a team wanting to trade up - maybe Suns attach Josh to get cap space that way.

I tried to attach Josh to Tyler for JR Smith but the only real player to take back is Nance. The Cavs just don’t have enough smaller contracts

I don't think we'll need to give up much to salary dump JJ. Maybe a future 2nd but I think there would be teams that would like to take a low cost, potentially high reward chance on JJ.

Ideally he'd be used in a trade package for a vet player but I'm OK with pure salary dump if we knew who we're targeting and it's a starting level player in free agency (not sure who that might be)

[lilfishi22]

Yeah, he has everything that you want on a modern PF.

Except he doesn't rebound, block shots, or shoot much from range. Also doesn't pass much. 6 seems really high for him though. I see him ranked between 18-37...thought at first you were thinking maybe 2nd round pick if he's there.

Just compare the numbers to his teammate....

http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=brandon-clarke--rui-hachimura

All of this while also being much less accomplished as a defender, even though Clarke would often have a tougher match-up. While being in Gonzaga's system for 3 years he still hits at lower clip % across the board lol. Hachimura is younger, and slightly longer that's like the only things in his favor.

Like the idea of Hachimura as a spark off the bench but I think #6 is way too high for a spark off the bench

[Waylay13]

So 10m In cap ?

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Salary dump JJ and you're looking at around $17m

Salary Dump Warren and you are looking at around $20M

[King4Day]

In discussing the idea of Zion returning to school... If he chose to use that as a real threat, he would probably tell New Orleans, "here are the teams I'd go to". Unless they are getting back Giannis or something, I'd just call Zion's bluff. If he goes back to school, I'd apologize to Memphis and draft Morant.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2019/05/zion-williamson-pelicans-trade-options-duke-draft-lottery-new-orleans-nba

[Slim Charless]

Ya at 32 sign me up (though if Thybulle is there I'd look long and hard at him too). At 6 though that's way too high for a guy who isn't even the best player on his own college team. Best case scenario he MIGHT be our 3rd option scorer? Meh. Clarke can at least hopefully offer some defense, blocked shots and rebounding to complement Ayton.

[bigfoot]

For clarity I think this is the situation with our cap space (someone correct me if I'm wrong) ...

1. We are over the cap right now because our player exceptions count against the cap. We can sign free agents using our two exceptions, $9.1M and $3.5M. We don't have to renounce any of our free agents. This allows us to make the best offers to any of our RFAs, UFAs like Oubre, Holmes, Bender, Daniels, and Crawford as well as retain Spalding and/or Jimmer if we want.

2. If we want to get under the cap we must renounce our exceptions and most of our free agents. Renouncing the exceptions and everyone but Oubre and Holmes nets us $9.2M in cap space. Basically we are better off using our exceptions to add free agents unless we need more dollars. In order to get more dollars we have to find willing trade partners, stretch players, or renounce our RFAs.

3. More cap space can be had by renouncing Holmes gaining $700K or pushing the space to $10M. Sending Jackson away in a salary dump in exchange for a future first round pick would net another $6M assuming we renounce the trade exception we get in return. That would put us at $16M. Stretching Johnson gets us another $12M or $28M total. Trading away our #6 pick pulls in another $5M or $32M total. Finally, renouncing Oubre another $9M. Best case scenario, we have about $41M in cap space. But that means we have Tyler Johnson on the books at $6M for the next three years unless we can find a team that would take him off our hands and get us another $7M in space or $48M.

Our gutted roster would look like Booker, Warren, Ayton, Bridges, Melton, and Okobo although I find it unlikely we would renounce Holmes because he just doesn't cost much cap space.

Personally, I think we are better off trading away Jackson, #6 pick, and future picks to get a real PG and then use the $9.2M and $3.5M player exceptions to pick up other vets. Then we can decide who we want to keep of Oubre, Holmes, Daniels, and Bender by exceeding the salary cap using our bird rights. With our bird rights we can offer our free agents more dollars than other teams.

[lilfishi22]

So 10m In cap ?

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Salary dump JJ and you're looking at around $17m

Salary Dump Warren and you are looking at around $20M

Why salary dump someone who has actual value ?

[bwgood77]

Except he doesn't rebound, block shots, or shoot much from range. Also doesn't pass much. 6 seems really high for him though. I see him ranked between 18-37...thought at first you were thinking maybe 2nd round pick if he's there.

Just compare the numbers to his teammate....

http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=brandon-clarke--rui-hachimura

All of this while also being much less accomplished as a defender, even though Clarke would often have a tougher match-up. While being in Gonzaga's system for 3 years he still hits at lower clip % across the board lol. Hachimura is younger, and slightly longer that's like the only things in his favor.

Like the idea of Hachimura as a spark off the bench but I think #6 is way too high for a spark off the bench

He's not all that different from Oubre...as being maybe a high end comp. I don't think we should expect to necessarily find an immediate starter at 6 in this draft. I know our team has been putrid, and that is saying a lot, but I don't see it. Maybe a guy like Garland or Clarke could start in time if they add some skills.

[lilfishi22]

All of this while also being much less accomplished as a defender, even though Clarke would often have a tougher match-up. While being in Gonzaga's system for 3 years he still hits at lower clip % across the board lol. Hachimura is younger, and slightly longer that's like the only things in his favor.

Like the idea of Hachimura as a spark off the bench but I think #6 is way too high for a spark off the bench

He's not all that different from Oubre...as being maybe a high end comp. I don't think we should expect to necessarily find an immediate starter at 6 in this draft. I know our team has been putrid, and that is saying a lot, but I don't see it. Maybe a guy like Garland or Clarke could start in time if they add some skills.

I don't expect anyone outside of Zion and maybe Morant/RJ being immediate starters. I think once you get outside the top 3, if they become an immediate starter, it's likely out of necessity rather than because they are deserving. And at 6, I definitely don't think we're finding a starter there.

I think Oubre is considerably better than Hachimura. Better shooter, better defense, more athletic, more versatile and has better ball handling.

[nevetsov]

Worst case scenario

Josh for Bjelica
Warren for Dinwiddie
#6 for Clarke
#32 for a SF
Oubre to 4/50
Holmes for MLE
Bender for LLE
Daniels for vet min
Alan Williams for vet min

Dinwiddie, Johnson, Melton, Okobo
Booker, Bridges, Daniels
Oubre, Bridges, #32
Clarke, Bjelica, Bender
Ayton, Holmes, Williams

[Waylay13]

Salary dump JJ and you're looking at around $17m

Salary Dump Warren and you are looking at around $20M

Why salary dump someone who has actual value ?

Because the Suns need the cap space to get a point guard. Cap space has value and we want someone to give us cap space earlier so that we can offer a contact to someone early on. If teams are going to buy in to taking Jackson for cap space they have to believe that there is some value there. That means that they are going to buy into having him for more than the 2 years left on his contact. With Warren they are locked into a having a good scoring 6th man for 3 years and the Suns have already shown that he isnt part of their future marketing.

[Kerrsed]

Don't count Zion out Suns fans!

This is from a random non-informed poster on the Pelicans Roost forum.



If Zion sat out a year (as opposed to going back to Duke) could the Suns or any other team sign him to a large contract or would he still be considered a rookie?

That'd be awesome frankly.....But would he actually risk it?

Has a player ever been drafted and gone back to college?

I've heard of players pulling out before the draft but I can't think of a time when a player entered the draft, gotten drafted and then returning to college. Either way, that's a crazy risk and I'm not sure if it's worth walking away from potentially $130m (rookie scale + endorsements) just because you don't like who drafted you

Its against the rules.

Some rules have changed this season regarding college eligibility, but if someone gets drafted, they cant return back to college and the team who drafted them own their rights. Now, if a player goes UNDRAFTED, then he can elect to return to college.

Zion could still pull out of the draft and pray that he doesnt get injured next season and a better team (In his eyes) wins the lotto, but honestly it would be stupid of him to waste that year returning to college where he could get hurt....all for the unknown team to take him in next years draft that could be better or worse than New Orleans.

[darealjuice]

Salary dump JJ and you're looking at around $17m

Salary Dump Warren and you are looking at around $20M

Why salary dump someone who has actual value ?

I don't get why anyone would be getting salary dumped. We're not likely to be attracting big time free agents, and there's no point dumping salary until you have a signing in the works.

The $10M we have after the draft should be plenty to get us a veteran point guard or power forward. After that we can sign Oubre and use the mid-level exception to bring in another decent veteran to help bring along our rookie. I'm definitely open to trading TJ or JJ to clear up the wing log jam, but I don't think salary dump is the right way to do it. Obviously that changes if a worthwhile free agent wants to come to Phoenix, but I don't think that will be the case. It definitely shouldn't be for chasing RFA's that will be matched.

[bwgood77]

Like the idea of Hachimura as a spark off the bench but I think #6 is way too high for a spark off the bench

He's not all that different from Oubre...as being maybe a high end comp. I don't think we should expect to necessarily find an immediate starter at 6 in this draft. I know our team has been putrid, and that is saying a lot, but I don't see it. Maybe a guy like Garland or Clarke could start in time if they add some skills.

I don't expect anyone outside of Zion and maybe Morant/RJ being immediate starters. I think once you get outside the top 3, if they become an immediate starter, it's likely out of necessity rather than because they are deserving. And at 6, I definitely don't think we're finding a starter there.

I think Oubre is considerably better than Hachimura. Better shooter, better defense, more athletic, more versatile and has better ball handling.

Well he obviously is now....Oubre was the better steal guy and higher volume 3 pt shooter at a lesser %..but was a lot younger too...a Freshman and not a Junior. I'm not real high on Rui. I watched Gonzaga a bit...it was quite clear Clarke was their best player by a long shot.

[lilfishi22]

Salary Dump Warren and you are looking at around $20M

Why salary dump someone who has actual value ?

I don't get why anyone would be getting salary dumped. We're not likely to be attracting big time free agents, and there's no point dumping salary until you have a signing in the works.

The $10M we have after the draft should be plenty to get us a veteran point guard or power forward. After that we can sign Oubre and use the mid-level exception to bring in another decent veteran to help bring along our rookie. I'm definitely open to trading TJ or JJ to clear up the wing log jam, but I don't think salary dump is the right way to do it. Obviously that changes if a worthwhile free agent wants to come to Phoenix, but I don't think that will be the case. It definitely shouldn't be for chasing RFA's that will be matched.

Obviously the plan wouldn't be the salary dump with no realistic targets in mind. The whole point of cap space is to have a target in free agency that is better than the player you salary dumped (kind of a low bar). If you can get an asset like a mid-2nd or something for JJ then even better but generally salary dumps don't entail the receiving team giving up much value.

I'm not confident you can get a solid starting level vet PG for $10m which is why I think we may need to salary dump to open up 70% more cap space.

[WeekapaugGroove]

What sucks with even these whispers of Zion not wanting to play in NO is for the NO fans the joy of getting him comes with a little 'oh great we get to deal with AD situation 2.0 in like 4-5 years' and that sucks.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

[lilfishi22]

Salary Dump Warren and you are looking at around $20M

Why salary dump someone who has actual value ?

Because the Suns need the cap space to get a point guard. Cap space has value and we want someone to give us cap space earlier so that we can offer a contact to someone early on. If teams are going to buy in to taking Jackson for cap space they have to believe that there is some value there. That means that they are going to buy into having him for more than the 2 years left on his contact. With Warren they are locked into a having a good scoring 6th man for 3 years and the Suns have already shown that he isnt part of their future marketing.

I'm saying one player is obviously more likely to be salary dumped because they don't have much trade value than the other who actually does.

Warren is a proven NBA commodity and has real value. JJ doesn't and has a salary that's only a few mil less than TJ. It makes way more sense to salary dump JJ and/or potentially trade TJ for something of value.

[lilfishi22]

He's not all that different from Oubre...as being maybe a high end comp. I don't think we should expect to necessarily find an immediate starter at 6 in this draft. I know our team has been putrid, and that is saying a lot, but I don't see it. Maybe a guy like Garland or Clarke could start in time if they add some skills.

I don't expect anyone outside of Zion and maybe Morant/RJ being immediate starters. I think once you get outside the top 3, if they become an immediate starter, it's likely out of necessity rather than because they are deserving. And at 6, I definitely don't think we're finding a starter there.

I think Oubre is considerably better than Hachimura. Better shooter, better defense, more athletic, more versatile and has better ball handling.

Well he obviously is now....Oubre was the better steal guy and higher volume 3 pt shooter at a lesser %..but was a lot younger too...a Freshman and not a Junior. I'm not real high on Rui. I watched Gonzaga a bit...it was quite clear Clarke was their best player by a long shot.

I'm just looking at Oubre now and his development and thinking whether Rui has the potential to be as good a defender, defender and also have that same level of versatility. I don't really see that. Rui being fairly old for his draft class also works again him. Totally agree with you that Clarke is far and away the better player on that team. For some reason I'm still kind of high on watching Rui in the NBA though, just not on the Suns

[darealjuice]

Obviously the plan wouldn't be the salary dump with no realistic targets in mind. The whole point of cap space is to have a target in free agency that is better than the player you salary dumped (kind of a low bar). If you can get an asset like a mid-2nd or something for JJ then even better but generally salary dumps don't entail the receiving team giving up much value.

I'm not confident you can get a solid starting level vet PG for $10m which is why I think we may need to salary dump to open up 70% more cap space.

I think we'd have a good shot at Darren Collison or Patrick Beverley with $10M. Potentially George Hill after the Bucks waive his non-guaranteed contract. I don't think Ricky Rubio comes here, but he would require a little more money. We're not getting Kyrie or Kemba, and DeAngelo Russell and Malcolm Brogdon will have their offers matched.

Unfortunately we'll just be kicking this can down the road until we draft or trade for a long-term option.

[King4Day]

I forgot about Kemba.
I wonder if we can get a meeting with him. If he wanted to sign, we could def work something out with Charlotte to give them Johnson and our pick. This way we don't lose all of our capspace