What do you want to see coming out of an IDEAL draft?

[REHawksFan]

So my opinion on the Hawks draft seems to change every day. There's just so many possibilities and outcomes that I can't seem to make up my mind which I prefer. Do they stay at 8 / 10 and take BPA? Do they trade up? Trade back? Some combination of these?

Regardless of the HOW, let's talk about the WHAT. What do you want to see coming out of an ideal draft?

For me, I think I want to see a Wing, a Big, and a back up PG. Schlenk has already stated he doesn't see adding 5 rookies to this team, so I'm going with either trading back from 10 to have 3 1sts and then trading away the 2nds OR staying at 10 and then trading up with the 2nds into the late 1st round.

Option 1:

At 8: One of Hunter, Reddish, or Sekou
At 10: One of Bol, Bruno, Goga
Late 1 / Early 2: One of Jerome, Ponds, Howard?

Option 2:

At 8: PG Coby White
At 10: Wing Sekou
Late 1st: Big Bruno

If we come out of the draft with a starting Wing, a backup or starting C, and a backup PG I think I'm happy. At least that's today's thought.

Anyone else have an ideal draft from a position standpoint?

[frosgrim]

Not sure if we need to use both picks on rookies
I would see what sort if vet, esp young vet, 8 or 10 can return.

There is a ton of fluidity in this upcoming offseason. What is Boston going to do to fix their problems? If they cant get AD foes Jalen Brown become someone we can get? Likewise, what other teams could use a little cap relief that we can take advantage of?

If we keep 8 and 10, I like some combo of SD, Bruno, or Hayes

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

[_s_t_u_r_t_]

Broken record here, but who knows, maybe someone hasn't yet heard....



MINIMALLY... Schlenk *has* to come out of this draft with either a player who projects to become a cornerstone elite (multiple-top-5-MVP-vote) player, or an asset (presumably a future draft pick) that still allows him a very real chance to grab one in 2020's draft.

Position doesn't matter... even if it were PG or PF where we seemingly have some future ASG participants on the roster.

That means players with high ceilings... and if we're drafting from #8 and #10, that certainly means low floors.

To my amateur scout eyes, there are five. (Who knows what Schlenk thinks, until he does it... and which predictably he will tell us like any other basically sane GM, he was over-the-moon to be able to draft, so even then, skepticism is always merited.)

If we can't get Zion, then that leaves us to pursue any two of the four with high-enough ceilings to justify the pick:

Bruno Fernando, Cam Reddish, Bol Bol and Sekou Doumbouya.

You have to like the history that says if you draft two in the #5-#10 range, one of those has a decent shot at panning out as exceeding draft night expectations at least.




IDEALLY... Schlenk gets Reddish @ #8, then swings a deal with Ainge, posited on us drafting Bol for him @ #10, and him drafting Bruno for us @ #14... and then allowing us to pick up an additional pick @ #20.

In that event, even if Bruno got picked before #14, we still end up with Bol.

Then, too, we would be able to swing a deal with someone for all of the 2nd rounders (#35/#41/#42) to move back up for another pick in the back of the 1st round.

With those, I'm primarily interested in Thybulle and Jerome, and not necessarily in that order.

[peoriabird]

MINIMALLY... Schlenk *has* to come out of this draft with either a player who projects to become a cornerstone elite (multiple-top-5-MVP-vote) player, or an asset (presumably a future draft pick) that still allows him a very real chance to grab one in 2020's draft.

Is this sarcasm or do you really feel this way?

[REHawksFan]

MINIMALLY... Schlenk *has* to come out of this draft with either a player who projects to become a cornerstone elite (multiple-top-5-MVP-vote) player, or an asset (presumably a future draft pick) that still allows him a very real chance to grab one in 2020's draft.

Is this sarcasm or do you really feel this way?

Oh he definitely believes it. Although my belief is that it's less about doubting Trae and more about flooding the roster with potentially elite players and letting the players sort it out over time. Could be wrong on that though.

For me, I'm more in a build around Trae and JC mindset, so I'm looking to get BPA but ultimately fill certain areas of need. IMO, those need areas are Wing, Big, and backup PG.

I'm thinking if Schlenk can turn 5 picks into 3 players that all look to be legit NBA players or above, that would be best case scenario.

[peoriabird]

Oh he definitely believes it.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

[King Ken]

1. Cam Reddish
2. DeAndre Hunter
3. A center. Whoever they like the most. Could be Fernando, Hayes or Bol

[fuzzy1]

I'm a big Deandre Hunter fan (I'd probably pick him 3rd after Zion and Ja), so if he slips all the way to 8, excellent! Bol is ... intriguing. If he can put on just a LITTLE bit of strength and not get hurt I like him. Sekou is interesting, as are Coby White/Garland. Reddish I'm ok with. Some combination of those 6 would be ideal for me. I wouldn't hate if we picked Hayes, but I'm not in love with his fit next to Collins.

[REHawksFan]

Oh he definitely believes it.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

Don't know about the MVP stuff, but what I do know is this:

Over the last 30 years, only 3 players drafted number 1 overall went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. Those were Tim Duncan, LBJ, and Kyrie. That's a 10% NBA title success rate. And that's far greater than the rest of the Top 5. Only 7 players total drafted in the top 5 went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. In addition to the above three, they include Jason Kidd (2 overall), Sean Elliott (3), Grant Hill (3), and Dwyane Wade (5). That's it as far as I can tell.

The conclusion I draw from that is that while teams HAVE to have elite players to win a title, there's no standard or correct way to acquire that talent. And drafting top 5 certainly is not a requirement.

It's been mentioned already, but look at the teams left in the playoffs this year and their leaders:

Giannis - 15th pick
Middleton - 39th pick
Kawhi - 15th pick
Lowry - 24th pick
Dame - 6th pick
McCollum - 10th pick
Steph - 7th pick
Klay - 11th pick
KD - 2nd pick

So elite talent is a must. High draft picks are certainly not a must.

[peoriabird]

Oh he definitely believes it.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

Don't know about the MVP stuff, but what I do know is this:

Over the last 30 years, only 3 players drafted number 1 overall went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. Those were Tim Duncan, LBJ, and Kyrie. That's a 10% NBA title success rate. And that's far greater than the rest of the Top 5. Only 7 players total drafted in the top 5 went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. In addition to the above three, they include Jason Kidd (2 overall), Sean Elliott (3), Grant Hill (3), and Dwyane Wade (5). That's it as far as I can tell.

The conclusion I draw from that is that while teams HAVE to have elite players to win a title, there's no standard or correct way to acquire that talent. And drafting top 5 certainly is not a requirement.

It's been mentioned already, but look at the teams left in the playoffs this year and their leaders:

Giannis - 15th pick
Middleton - 39th pick
Kawhi - 15th pick
Lowry - 24th pick
Dame - 6th pick
McCollum - 10th pick
Steph - 7th pick
Klay - 11th pick
KD - 2nd pick

So elite talent is a must. High draft picks are certainly not a must.

The tankers undoubtedly disagree with you!

[Sothron]

My ideal draft would be to trade the picks for an established young star player. We need either a good young center or wing player that can mesh with Trae and JC.

[gurpilo]

Pick 8: Reddish or Hunter
Pick 10: Hayes or Bol

2nd rounders: Any of Carsen Edwards, Chuma Okeke, Daniel Gafford, Charles Bassey, Talen
Horton, Luka Samanic, Grant Williams, Kabengele, Thybulle, Kevin Porter, Pj Washington, Ty Jerome. 2 or 3 of this list is going to fall to 2nd round. I would even include Tacko Fall

FA signings Danuel House and TJ McConnell or Tim Frazier

Trae/McConnell/Ty Jerome
Huerter/Bembry/Bazemore
Reddish/Prince
Collins/Spelman/Samanic
Len/Hayes/Dedmon?/Gafford

I see a playoff team there

[jayu70]

My ideal draft would be to trade the picks for an established young star player. We need either a good young center or wing player that can mesh with Trae and JC.

Which available established young star can we realistically get with #8 and #10.
Who would you target?

[IheartTHEhurt]

Over the last ten games of the season, Alex Len averaged 18 pts per game to end the season. Could we actually already have our center moving forward? Anyone think maybe Len turned a corner to end the year last year?

[macd-gm]

Over the last ten games of the season, Alex Len averaged 18 pts per game to end the season. Could we actually already have our center moving forward? Anyone think maybe Len turned a corner to end the year last year?

I like Len. I think his rebounding and play on the offensive end are underrated. The issue maybe that Len/Collins is a super strong defensive combo, but i think Len really works in this offense.

[Atlanta Hawk Fan]

Oh he definitely believes it.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

I'm with peoriabird on this. That is waaaayyyyyy too much to ask. The only player whose ceiling projects to ever be in the top 5 is Zion. We aren't getting him so we won't get anyone who projects to that kind of success. Doesn't mean someone couldn't emerge (Kawhi didn't project to be as good as he is) but based on their profile today we absolutely will not be getting someone who projects to be that good.

Oh he definitely believes it.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

Don't know about the MVP stuff, but what I do know is this:

Over the last 30 years, only 3 players drafted number 1 overall went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. Those were Tim Duncan, LBJ, and Kyrie. That's a 10% NBA title success rate. And that's far greater than the rest of the Top 5. Only 7 players total drafted in the top 5 went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. In addition to the above three, they include Jason Kidd (2 overall), Sean Elliott (3), Grant Hill (3), and Dwyane Wade (5). That's it as far as I can tell.

The conclusion I draw from that is that while teams HAVE to have elite players to win a title, there's no standard or correct way to acquire that talent. And drafting top 5 certainly is not a requirement.

It's been mentioned already, but look at the teams left in the playoffs this year and their leaders:

Giannis - 15th pick
Middleton - 39th pick
Kawhi - 15th pick
Lowry - 24th pick
Dame - 6th pick
McCollum - 10th pick
Steph - 7th pick
Klay - 11th pick
KD - 2nd pick

So elite talent is a must. High draft picks are certainly not a must.

Giannis and Kawhi are defintely outliers being one pick out of the lottery. KD and Steph are the others worth talking about, IMO. Portland doesn't have the talent to win a title. All the others mentioned are support cast players.

In terms of winning titles, I'm confused by your list. For example, Kyrie Irving was the #1 pick and won a title with Cleveland. Grant Hill never won a title with Detroit or any other team. Not sure one is omitted from the list and the other is on the list. I'm not going to go do the research on it just saying I don't think the list is correct. You've also got some others who should be in the discussion who made the finals on legit contenders like Gary Payton, Dwight Howard, Shaq/Penny, AI, Harden, etc.

Totally agree with the notion that you must have elite talent and the conversation becomes around how you get that talent. Three paths: draft, free agency and trade. Picks get you players from the draft. Picks and promising young players get you trades. The viability of free agency varies by franchise. FA is a very valid path to elite talent for some franchises (ex: Miami) and not at all for others (ex: Minnesota). You've got to look at your team, see what promise each path offers, and look at what paths you can take to get there.

Top 5 of the draft is not at all the only path but top 5 picks do give you some nice assets for two of those three paths.

[pssshhhrrr87]

Reddish and Bol

[REHawksFan]

Oh he definitely believes it.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

I'm with peoriabird on this. That is waaaayyyyyy too much to ask. The only player whose ceiling projects to ever be in the top 5 is Zion. We aren't getting him so we won't get anyone who projects to that kind of success. Doesn't mean someone couldn't emerge (Kawhi didn't project to be as good as he is) but based on their profile today we absolutely will not be getting someone who projects to be that good.

Multiple top 5 in mvp votes from the 8th and 10th in a weak draft? Seriously? How many multiple top 5 MVP vote getters do we see per draft class over the past 20 drafts? 2 or 3? This obsession with the draft has to stop!

Don't know about the MVP stuff, but what I do know is this:

Over the last 30 years, only 3 players drafted number 1 overall went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. Those were Tim Duncan, LBJ, and Kyrie. That's a 10% NBA title success rate. And that's far greater than the rest of the Top 5. Only 7 players total drafted in the top 5 went on to win an NBA title with their drafting team. In addition to the above three, they include Jason Kidd (2 overall), Sean Elliott (3), Grant Hill (3), and Dwyane Wade (5). That's it as far as I can tell.

The conclusion I draw from that is that while teams HAVE to have elite players to win a title, there's no standard or correct way to acquire that talent. And drafting top 5 certainly is not a requirement.

It's been mentioned already, but look at the teams left in the playoffs this year and their leaders:

Giannis - 15th pick
Middleton - 39th pick
Kawhi - 15th pick
Lowry - 24th pick
Dame - 6th pick
McCollum - 10th pick
Steph - 7th pick
Klay - 11th pick
KD - 2nd pick

So elite talent is a must. High draft picks are certainly not a must.

Giannis and Kawhi are defintely outliers being one pick out of the lottery. KD and Steph are the others worth talking about, IMO. Portland doesn't have the talent to win a title. All the others mentioned are support cast players.

In terms of winning titles, I'm confused by your list. For example, Kyrie Irving was the #1 pick and won a title with Cleveland. Grant Hill never won a title with Detroit or any other team. Not sure one is omitted from the list and the other is on the list. I'm not going to go do the research on it just saying I don't think the list is correct. You've also got some others who should be in the discussion who made the finals on legit contenders like Gary Payton, Dwight Howard, Shaq/Penny, AI, Harden, etc.

Totally agree with the notion that you must have elite talent and the conversation becomes around how you get that talent. Three paths: draft, free agency and trade. Picks get you players from the draft. Picks and promising young players get you trades. The viability of free agency varies by franchise. FA is a very valid path to elite talent for some franchises (ex: Miami) and not at all for others (ex: Minnesota). You've got to look at your team, see what promise each path offers, and look at what paths you can take to get there.

Top 5 of the draft is not at all the only path but top 5 picks do give you some nice assets for two of those three paths.

Oops. Grant Hill is my bad. I was going off of memory and was thinking he was still on the team in 04 when they won, but alas he was with Orlando by then. The point I was making with the list is that winning a title isn't tied to Top 5 picks in the draft. I've seen that narrative all too often. In actuality, only 6 players drafted in the Top 5 over the last 30 years (now excluding Hill) ended up winning an NBA title with the team that drafted them.

What is inarguable is that elite talent is required to win a title. I think that's been proven over and over again. The question is where you get that elite talent. I will argue that, through the draft, it can be done at multiple levels if you have the right talent evaluator (which I believe TS is).

When I posted the list of current best players left in the playoffs, my intention was not to imply that all of those players are elite, but that they are key contributors to potentially title teams that were drafted well beyond the Top 5.

[Sothron]

My ideal draft would be to trade the picks for an established young star player. We need either a good young center or wing player that can mesh with Trae and JC.

Which available established young star can we realistically get with #8 and #10.
Who would you target?

Bradley Beal comes to mind.

[_s_t_u_r_t_]

MINIMALLY... Schlenk *has* to come out of this draft with either a player who projects to become a cornerstone elite (multiple-top-5-MVP-vote) player, or an asset (presumably a future draft pick) that still allows him a very real chance to grab one in 2020's draft.

Is this sarcasm or do you really feel this way?

I should have said more accurately "projects to potentially become, though I think when I insert the part about low floors, it probably could have been taken just from the rest of the context that that's what I meant.