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2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery

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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#701 » by coldfish » Sat May 25, 2019 11:44 pm

Jcool0 wrote:
Chi town wrote:
R3AL1TY wrote:That just may be the case too, but I'm going by the hole in their 3 pt shooting at the SF spot + you got a guy in Reddish that has all the tools but just need the decision making and assertiveness to go with it. Plus, he already got some chemistry with Zion.


Griffin is top 5 GM in the league. He won’t be suckered but reddish. He’d go Culver or Hunter before Reddish.


I guess really LeBron really is the goat to have made him a top 5 GM.


Lebron was in Cleveland at first, he got guys like Larry Hughesless next to him and left. He came back to Cleveland and got virtually all shooters around him with Griffin. It pisses Lebron off to no end but its what works best. End result was a title and multiple finals. Goes to LA, misses playoffs as Magic actually listens to Lebron and puts "playmakers" like Rondo, Stephensen and Ball next to him.

Griffin has definitely done a better job putting a team around Lebron than several of the other GM's.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#702 » by Chi town » Sat May 25, 2019 11:54 pm

NDave79 wrote:This isn't a 100 percent draft related, but enough imo (since we are debating point guards a lot here) that I preferred to post here than start a new thread.

I'm kinda confused what direction we want to go with PG.

On one hand there is all this talk about this new offense about the sharing of ball handling and creation. Boylen said his biggest regret of his rookie head coaching season was that he didn't incorporate the new system sooner. Lauri and Lavine seemed to thrive and for a stretch we had the best offense in the NBA according to certain stats.

Obviously Dunn struggled as would be expected as his offensive strengths relate to things he does with the ball in his hands (unfortunately, his strengths don't really justify catering your offense around him so far. He just hasn't been good enough to warrant that).

But Pax keeps talking about bringing in a PG that has the ability to find and pass the ball to our elite shooters; basically a guard that needs the ball in his hands to play to his strengths. There are rumors about Lonzo Ball and I get the feeling they were infatuated with Morant.

These guys need the ball in there hands to be effective, but Boylen talks about a system that is very different from a ball dominant PG system. I guess I'm just confused and it seems like maybe there isn't an exact consensus within the Bulls about the best way to go forward.

I'm a fan of the multiple ball handler system and feel like we have seen enough success (in the short span where we had some offensive success) to go forward down this path, but from interviews and stuff, Pax seems set on finding a traditional PG imo, even though he already played and had success in a multi ball handler system.

I feel like a player like with the theoretical skills of Garland would be ideal, but Pax talks like the Bulls need a more traditional elite passer like Ball or Morant. I guess I feel like Boylen wants the off ball player and Pax wants the on ball player. Obviously, in perfect world you would get someone who excels at both, but that doesn't seem to be a realistic option.

What is our plan, lol?


Well said and documented.

I think Pax thinks we have enough offense 2-5 and just need a pure PG to set those guys up hence Morant and Ball.

I think he’s wrong. I think a multi handler system with a PG that can shoot and play off ball is best.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Pax puts word out he will trade for Garland just so he can take White who has the better defensive potential and pushes pace. Total bluff.

Keep in mind that Brogdon keeps coming up as Bulls #1 target.

I think garland is def more of a setup PG than White but both could work in our system. I think Pax will Pick the one that falls and if one doesn’t fall he will move up and get one. I don’t see him sitting at 7 and taking a wing. I don’t see him trading for a vet when he can sign one for free.

I will be surprised if we leave the draft without garland or white
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#703 » by Jcool0 » Sat May 25, 2019 11:55 pm

coldfish wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
Chi town wrote:
Griffin is top 5 GM in the league. He won’t be suckered but reddish. He’d go Culver or Hunter before Reddish.


I guess really LeBron really is the goat to have made him a top 5 GM.


Lebron was in Cleveland at first, he got guys like Larry Hughesless next to him and left. He came back to Cleveland and got virtually all shooters around him with Griffin. It pisses Lebron off to no end but its what works best. End result was a title and multiple finals. Goes to LA, misses playoffs as Magic actually listens to Lebron and puts "playmakers" like Rondo, Stephensen and Ball next to him.

Griffin has definitely done a better job putting a team around Lebron than several of the other GM's.


Wasn't LA 3rd or 4th in the West before Lebrons injury? Lets not act like the Lakers were a bad team all year with Lebron. They only fell apart once he got hurt. Something that never really happened in Cleveland.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#704 » by VolumePoster » Sun May 26, 2019 12:03 am

Payt10 wrote:I don't know if it's just me, but Coby White looks like the shortest 6'5 guy I have ever seen. He looks so tiny in all the highlights I've watched. I would have been less shocked to find out he was closer to 6'0.


He plays small. Short short arms and a poor leaper. I’m not saying he’s Bobby Portis but the 6’5 thing is pretty much window dressing.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#705 » by VolumePoster » Sun May 26, 2019 12:05 am

holv03 wrote:Bulls could move up to 5th and draft Garland if the Lakers pick someone else.


I would rather enjoy jumping phoenix. For the same reason however I can see them moving up as well.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#706 » by Chi town » Sun May 26, 2019 12:07 am

VolumePoster wrote:
holv03 wrote:Bulls could move up to 5th and draft Garland if the Lakers pick someone else.


I would rather enjoy jumping phoenix. For the same reason however I can see them moving up as well.


ID love sitting where we are and watching them taking white and Garland falls to us.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#707 » by VolumePoster » Sun May 26, 2019 12:08 am

Chi town wrote:
VolumePoster wrote:
holv03 wrote:Bulls could move up to 5th and draft Garland if the Lakers pick someone else.


I would rather enjoy jumping phoenix. For the same reason however I can see them moving up as well.


ID love sitting where we are and watching them taking white and Garland falls to us.


Now that would be perfect. But I don’t see it happening.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#708 » by Chi town » Sun May 26, 2019 12:10 am

VolumePoster wrote:
Chi town wrote:
VolumePoster wrote:
I would rather enjoy jumping phoenix. For the same reason however I can see them moving up as well.


ID love sitting where we are and watching them taking white and Garland falls to us.


Now that would be perfect. But I don’t see it happening.


Either do I. I think draft goes... Zion Morant Barrett Hunter then we move up for Garland. White 6 and Reddish or Culver 7 to CLE
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#709 » by coldfish » Sun May 26, 2019 12:15 am

Jcool0 wrote:
coldfish wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
I guess really LeBron really is the goat to have made him a top 5 GM.


Lebron was in Cleveland at first, he got guys like Larry Hughesless next to him and left. He came back to Cleveland and got virtually all shooters around him with Griffin. It pisses Lebron off to no end but its what works best. End result was a title and multiple finals. Goes to LA, misses playoffs as Magic actually listens to Lebron and puts "playmakers" like Rondo, Stephensen and Ball next to him.

Griffin has definitely done a better job putting a team around Lebron than several of the other GM's.


Wasn't LA 3rd or 4th in the West before Lebrons injury? Lets not act like the Lakers were a bad team all year with Lebron. They only fell apart once he got hurt. Something that never really happened in Cleveland.


Lakers were 29-27 when Lebron played.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#710 » by Jcool0 » Sun May 26, 2019 12:16 am

coldfish wrote:
Jcool0 wrote:
coldfish wrote:
Lebron was in Cleveland at first, he got guys like Larry Hughesless next to him and left. He came back to Cleveland and got virtually all shooters around him with Griffin. It pisses Lebron off to no end but its what works best. End result was a title and multiple finals. Goes to LA, misses playoffs as Magic actually listens to Lebron and puts "playmakers" like Rondo, Stephensen and Ball next to him.

Griffin has definitely done a better job putting a team around Lebron than several of the other GM's.


Wasn't LA 3rd or 4th in the West before Lebrons injury? Lets not act like the Lakers were a bad team all year with Lebron. They only fell apart once he got hurt. Something that never really happened in Cleveland.


Lakers were 29-27 when Lebron played.


James missed 17 consecutive games from late December to late January after sustaining a strained left groin against Golden State on Christmas. At the time, the Lakers were 20-14 and in fourth place in the Western Conference. But the Lakers were 6-11 in those 17 games without James and dropped in the standings.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/lakers/2019/03/30/lebron-james-miss-rest-lakers-season-recover-injury/3321710002/
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#711 » by GimmeDat » Sun May 26, 2019 1:14 am

Whatever it will cost us to move up even a few spots just won't be worth it. We should trade down or out, or take the BPA at 7.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#712 » by bearadonisdna » Sun May 26, 2019 1:22 am

Value at 4 is the same at 7, I don't see the reason to trade up.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#713 » by Grodoboldo » Sun May 26, 2019 1:36 am

Chi town wrote:
VolumePoster wrote:
Chi town wrote:
ID love sitting where we are and watching them taking white and Garland falls to us.


Now that would be perfect. But I don’t see it happening.


Either do I. I think draft goes... Zion Morant Barrett Hunter then we move up for Garland. White 6 and Reddish or Culver 7 to CLE


Man, if Culver drops to 7 and we trade him to get Garland I'm gonna be pissed.
I know I'm on an island on this board, but I prefer both Culver and White to him.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#714 » by AshyLarrysDiaper » Sun May 26, 2019 1:48 am

NDave79 wrote:This isn't a 100 percent draft related, but enough imo (since we are debating point guards a lot here) that I preferred to post here than start a new thread.

I'm kinda confused what direction we want to go with PG.

On one hand there is all this talk about this new offense about the sharing of ball handling and creation. Boylen said his biggest regret of his rookie head coaching season was that he didn't incorporate the new system sooner. Lauri and Lavine seemed to thrive and for a stretch we had the best offense in the NBA according to certain stats.

Obviously Dunn struggled as would be expected as his offensive strengths relate to things he does with the ball in his hands (unfortunately, his strengths don't really justify catering your offense around him so far. He just hasn't been good enough to warrant that).

But Pax keeps talking about bringing in a PG that has the ability to find and pass the ball to our elite shooters; basically a guard that needs the ball in his hands to play to his strengths. There are rumors about Lonzo Ball and I get the feeling they were infatuated with Morant.

These guys need the ball in there hands to be effective, but Boylen talks about a system that is very different from a ball dominant PG system. I guess I'm just confused and it seems like maybe there isn't an exact consensus within the Bulls about the best way to go forward.

I'm a fan of the multiple ball handler system and feel like we have seen enough success (in the short span where we had some offensive success) to go forward down this path, but from interviews and stuff, Pax seems set on finding a traditional PG imo, even though he already played and had success in a multi ball handler system.

I feel like a player like with the theoretical skills of Garland would be ideal, but Pax talks like the Bulls need a more traditional elite passer like Ball or Morant. I guess I feel like Boylen wants the off ball player and Pax wants the on ball player. Obviously, in perfect world you would get someone who excels at both, but that doesn't seem to be a realistic option.

What is our plan, lol?



Ball and Morant shouldn’t be grouped in this way.

Ball thrives as a relatively low usage PG who creates by making quick decisions without stopping the ball. A perfect PG for a multi ball handler system, in other words (if you believe the shooting will come around).

Morant is much more ball dominant so I imagine Pax’s interest in him was about talent rather than our system. Which is how it should be imo. Multi ball handler is nice but the Bulls don’t have anything going on (talent, system, coach, etc) that they should bend their draft priorities to fit.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#715 » by AshyLarrysDiaper » Sun May 26, 2019 1:50 am

Lemme guess. Pax wants to package both of the Memphis second rounders to move up for Garland.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#716 » by BullsFTW » Sun May 26, 2019 1:51 am

holv03 wrote:Bulls could move up to 5th and draft Garland if the Lakers pick someone else.

If we can’t move up, who are we looking at #7?
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#717 » by BullsFTW » Sun May 26, 2019 1:53 am

Draft Culver and trade Otto Porter for Conley
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#718 » by Chi town » Sun May 26, 2019 1:56 am

GimmeDat wrote:Whatever it will cost us to move up even a few spots just won't be worth it. We should trade down or out, or take the BPA at 7.


I’m not so sure. I think a non 1st or a highly protected 1st at the most.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#719 » by GimmeDat » Sun May 26, 2019 2:00 am

Chi town wrote:
GimmeDat wrote:Whatever it will cost us to move up even a few spots just won't be worth it. We should trade down or out, or take the BPA at 7.


I’m not so sure. I think a non 1st or a highly protected 1st at the most.


If that's it, and the Bulls are particularly high on someone at 4, then sure, but I feel like we're largely looking at the same tier of players here. If it's more, I would hope not. Think we should be more actively looking to move back, if anything else. If we can be the team getting the additional asset I think we'd be in better stead.
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Re: 2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery 

Post#720 » by dumbell78 » Sun May 26, 2019 2:07 am

Last time we were high on someone, McDermott and Payne happened.
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