2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery

[NDave79]

Of the players I have an opinion (mostly just top guys) on, here are my tiers of how I view them compared to sort of the general consensus.

higher

Rui
Clark
RJ (I would take him 2 instead of the projected 3)

similar

Zion
Garland (he's now projected around where I believed, but I spent a lot of the season championing him)
Culver (same as Garland)
Hunter (although if he is projected at 4, I would drop him to my lower list. He is sort of straddling this list and the next list.)

lower

Morant (I like him decent enough, but have a lot of questions about his game. Don't like him at #2)
White
Reddish
Bol Bol

[AKfanatic]

Read on Twitter

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I’d take Culver over Barrett all day.

Culver is a winner and he’s crazy versatile on both sides of the ball. His handle is what separates him from Hunter.

I could see the Lakers taking him. He won’t last pay Cavs.

Our pick will be between White Garland or Hunter. Culver will be long gone.

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

[johnnyvann840]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

[rtblues]

complaining about a 6'7" wing not having enough spacing is silly, because he was the primary reason duke had crappy spacing. if you're a wing whose primary skill is volume scoring, ya gotta be able to shoot.

givony has compared barrett to harden, which is such a dumb comparison because harden's game is almost entirely predicated on his outside shot being a gigantic threat!

Givony and Schmitz's evals don't hit like they used to. Maybe they've stayed the same while draft analysis has advanced a bit. Not sure. Stuff like this drives me crazy though.

I agree Givony has gone downhill since he joined ESPN.
Take a listen to the Dunc'd On podcast and their deep dive of Barrett which I believe is more accurate. Personally I take a hard pass on RJ but the Bulls won't have to make the decision on him anyway.

Yes! The Dunc'd On crew are excellent. Danny Leroux is good.
I also like Jonathan Tjarks and Kevin O'Connor from the Ringer NBA Show podcast. They know their stuff.

[BR0D1E86]

If Garland falls to #5, I predict that the Bulls move up for him.

It’s going to take a good asset to move up to 5 from 7. 38 is not going to be enough. Would have to be a player they like (I doubt it) or a future pick (Bulls should not trade a future pick).

Correct. Either a future 1st or Lauri or Carter. Nobody else on the roster has anything more than “throw in” trade value at best.

[Hangtime84]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

he might be a 2nd rounder

[JimmyJammer]

The Bulls board looks like this at 7:
1. Garland (not crazy about it but won't be there)
2. White
3. Culver (won't be available)
4. Reddish (we don't really need a wing but what the heck?)
5. Hunter
6. Hachimura

[johnnyvann840]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

he might be a 2nd rounder

.. I doubt that. He looks the part well enough to fool somebody into taking the gamble. Although, I wouldn't waste a top 20 1st round pick on him. This is billed as a really "weak draft" so he's surely going in the top 15. But there are just so many players, even in this draft, that I like enough ahead of taking that leap with him. I mean Brandon Clarke put up Zion-like numbers on a great team and he's mocked around 15 I think. But there is no way in hell I'm drafting Cam ahead of him.

[Dominator83]

I find what Rui did to team Australia (who are grown men and have a couple NBA players) last year incredibly impressive for a 20 year that is still relatively new to the game.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

I find him to be a very impressive young man.

I'm trying to imagine growing up in Japan and being a baseball player, then changing sports when you're 13-14 years old and picking up a basketball for the first time.... then a few years later having to take the SAT 5 times, because of translation issues, and actually scoring high enough to fulfill a basketball scholarship to Gonzaga, ....then arriving in Spokane, WA still not being able to speak hardly any English and needing a translator just to get coaching instruction. Becoming fluent in English in a couple of years time.

Then, leading your team to a 33-4 record and the Elite 8 giving Texas Tech all they could handle. I watch him play and I love his motor and attitude (and his feel for the game despite contrary opinions on that). I read that BS article in Fansided about how he doesn't have any feel for the game and I had to shake my head. I've been watching a lot of him and it sure looks to me like he has a pretty solid feel for the game. He does get lost on D sometimes, but he also makes some really good defensive plays and shows a LOT of potential on that end. Has good timing. He moves his feet extremely well. Great shooting touch. Uses his body and strength really well against opponents. Has a real knack for scoring. I just think he is being underrated by a lot of people.

Anyway, I'm rooting for the kid to prove his doubters wrong and I'm also betting he is going to do just that. I wouldn't be at all upset if the Bulls surprised us and picked him early. He is going to be a cash cow too. Whatever team he winds up on is going to sell a lot of jerseys in Japan.

The more i see of this guy, the more hes the one i want. I don't like the idea of Pax being stuck in this box of "the consensus top 7" when theres really about 15 guys that can realistically turn out to be the 2nd or 3rd best player from this draft. Rui is one of those guys who has a lot of good strengths, and weaknesses that are improveable. Also, his journey and progression thru hard work, is something that PAX usually loves in a guy. i certainly dont see why he can't have a better NBA career than Coby White. In fact, I think he does

[NecessaryEvil]

This season and this draft positioning is an absolute diasaster

[johnnyvann840]

The Bulls board looks like this at 7:
1. Garland (not crazy about it but won't be there)
2. White
3. Culver (won't be available)
4. Reddish (we don't really need a wing but what the heck?)
5. Hunter
6. Hachimura

Nah.. not buying that the Bulls are interested in Reddick over Hunter or Rui, even. This sounds a lot like the MPJ story last year as I've said. I have a lot of problems with Pax but drafting is not one of them. He has the tape and he is not putting Reddish's high school accolades above his less than mediocre crap, fully shat the bed season at Duke. No way.

[johnnyvann840]

Read on Twitter

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I’d take Culver over Barrett all day.

Culver is a winner and he’s crazy versatile on both sides of the ball. His handle is what separates him from Hunter.

I could see the Lakers taking him. He won’t last pay Cavs.

Our pick will be between White Garland or Hunter. Culver will be long gone.

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

[drosereturn]

I’d take Culver over Barrett all day.

Culver is a winner and he’s crazy versatile on both sides of the ball. His handle is what separates him from Hunter.

I could see the Lakers taking him. He won’t last pay Cavs.

Our pick will be between White Garland or Hunter. Culver will be long gone.

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

RJ can score 20ppg as a rookie easily and Derozan is his floor imo. You need to trade Lavine (making hefty 20)+ 7th pick to gain massive cap space and a tier 1 prospect.

[Chi town]

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

RJ can score 20ppg as a rookie easily and Derozan is his floor imo. You need to trade Lavine (making hefty 20)+ 7th pick to gain massive cap space and a tier 1 prospect.

AK... appreciate your posting. Normally, I’m in alignment with your views.

JVann... No thanks on trade for Barrett. I’m a believer in Lavine. Don’t think RJ will ever be as good as Lavine. Don’t think he will be able to get around anyone w his dribble.

[johnnyvann840]

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

RJ can score 20ppg as a rookie easily and Derozan is his floor imo. You need to trade Lavine (making hefty 20)+ 7th pick to gain massive cap space and a tier 1 prospect.

I'm down... especially if we could get a 3rd involved or find a non guaranteed or partial to absorb that $.... then we can throw the ranch at Malcolm Brogdon and pair him with RJ... now we're talking.

Brogdon
RJ
Otto
Lauri
WCJ

Awesome D. Shooting everywhere. Creators. Size. I would love that team.

[AKfanatic]

I’d take Culver over Barrett all day.

Culver is a winner and he’s crazy versatile on both sides of the ball. His handle is what separates him from Hunter.

I could see the Lakers taking him. He won’t last pay Cavs.

Our pick will be between White Garland or Hunter. Culver will be long gone.

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

Zach changed my view of him a lot last season and in a perfect world I’d rather keep him AND have RJ. While I wouldn’t expect a ton of success next season, I like the idea of RJ taking some of ball handling pressure off Zach and would be really intrigued to see how he could operate with Zach and Lauri stretching the floor.

If push came to shove, I’d probably lean towards the trade.... but I’d try to accomplish the trade without including Zach (or Lauri/Carter). Given that he’s (RJ) likely to go 3 I’d try to see if eating a contract from the Knicks and/or offering a top 5-7ish protected pick could get if done.

[johnnyvann840]

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

RJ can score 20ppg as a rookie easily and Derozan is his floor imo. You need to trade Lavine (making hefty 20)+ 7th pick to gain massive cap space and a tier 1 prospect.

AK... appreciate your posting. Normally, I’m in alignment with your views.

JVann... No thanks on trade for Barrett. I’m a believer in Lavine. Don’t think RJ will ever be as good as Lavine. Don’t think he will be able to get around anyone w his dribble.

See this is where I vehemently disagree about RJ. That is one of his strengths. I hate the Harden comp but that is where RJ actually can do some of those things that JH does. He has that funky hesitation and sort of a euro step that gets him around guys and to the rim. Really adept at stepping around guys in a unique way. And I think he'll be way better than Lavine. That is how RJ got a lot of his points using that little hesitation changing speeds to sidestep defenders kind of how Harden does. RJ is also already a solid defender something will never ever be. He's entering his 6th NBA season and still can't grasp simple concepts defensively.

[drosereturn]

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

RJ can score 20ppg as a rookie easily and Derozan is his floor imo. You need to trade Lavine (making hefty 20)+ 7th pick to gain massive cap space and a tier 1 prospect.

I'm down... especially if we could get a 3rd involved or find a non guaranteed or partial to absorb that $.... then we can throw the ranch at Malcolm Brogdon and pair him with RJ... now we're talking.

Brogdon
RJ
Otto
Lauri
WCJ

Awesome D. Shooting everywhere. Creators. Size. I would love that team.

Yes Brogdon makes sense in that scenario since the Bulls freed up 80mil in space (20*4) and got a better prospect than Lavine and #7 will ever be. The beauty of RJ is he can do everything. Shoot, defend, slash, score on 3 levels, and MOST IMPORTANTLY, become a point forward. He has tunnel vision at times but he usually makes the right passes he's a secondary ball handler at worst.
Can become Harden-lite if everything goes right best case scenario and Brogdon wouldnt mind deferring to RJ.

[Kurt Heimlich]

Read on Twitter

/video/1

I’d take Culver over Barrett all day.

Culver is a winner and he’s crazy versatile on both sides of the ball. His handle is what separates him from Hunter.

I could see the Lakers taking him. He won’t last pay Cavs.

Our pick will be between White Garland or Hunter. Culver will be long gone.

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

What makes you like Hunter over Culver then? The way you talked about trying to watch Culver and coming away unimpressed is literally me every time I watched Virginia and Hunter play. Maybe it's their style of play at VA, but he was a 3rd option on VA who shot fairly well on low volume. Culver was involved in initiating the offense, looked to score at all levels as well as assisting his teammates at nearly twice the rate, was active on the boards along with his high level defense.

Hunter is the guy I'm expecting we get, but to me he's the disappointing "settle" option of the common top 7 guys.

[johnnyvann840]

What makes you like Hunter over Culver then?

This is a good start...... shut him down head to head and won the NCAA Championship doing it...

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=401123374