2019 Draft Thread Volume #6 - Post Lottery

[Dresden]

I don't see anything in Culver that would make me want to take him over Hunter, except that he's younger. Hunter is a better defender, a much better 3 pt shooter, and lead his team to a national title. He can play from Day 1 in the nba, meaning you'll get more use out of him on his rookie contract. I would probably take Reddish ahead of Culver. I just don't like him at all.

[Chi town]

I’m completely opposite.

I’ve tried to be impressed by Culver. Watched a ton of games and focused on him the entire time, I just always came away unimpressed. Not to say he’s bad, he does things well. He’s solid defensively and when watching him I saw a guy that was really good at finding open spots when he was off ball, but I’d take a swing on Barrett over Culver 10 times out of ten. RJ has the length and base skills that could lead to him really excelling in the NBA. I do think he was hampered at Duke due to the team’s lack of an ability to spread the floor. He needs to add strength to his game and improve his shot, but there’s a ton of upside with RJ that I just don’t see in Culver.


Of course it’s a moot point as RJ will undoubtably be gone by the time the Bulls pick.

If Culver ends up the pick I’ll hope he succeeds, but if he’s available and Hunter is there also, I’d take Hunter. The only way I’d take Culver over Hunter is if a team a spot or two below the Bulls want Culver and a draft trade can be worked out.

Hell, if Hunter was unavailable to swap picks (and an asset) from a team selecting later.... I’d happily trade Culver for Rui and another pick

I like Culver more than you do, but I'm with you on Hunter over him and of course RJ over him. Only thing Culver has on RJ is he is more of a dog on D. But RJ is no slouch defensively either. Very good. But Hunter is my guy if he's there. I just like what he does on both ends... and he can shoot, which is huge. Culver I don't see becoming a great 3 pt shooter, you just hope he can be decent enough to keep D's honest. RJ I think can become a good shooter from deep because he is younger by quite a bit and has time... hasn't grooved his current stroke as deep. I would give up Lavine and 7 if we could move up for Barrett. No brainer for me.

Zach changed my view of him a lot last season and in a perfect world I’d rather keep him AND have RJ. While I wouldn’t expect a ton of success next season, I like the idea of RJ taking some of ball handling pressure off Zach and would be really intrigued to see how he could operate with Zach and Lauri stretching the floor.

If push came to shove, I’d probably lean towards the trade.... but I’d try to accomplish the trade without including Zach (or Lauri/Carter). Given that he’s (RJ) likely to go 3 I’d try to see if eating a contract from the Knicks and/or offering a top 5-7ish protected pick could get if done.

Otto is a much better fit for Lavine than RJ.

Because we don’t have a PG I think people are overcompensating.

[Dresden]

the problems with Hachimura are that he's not a great rebounder or defender, and he cannot shoot the 3 at all. He's also a tweener, and he'll have trouble guarding 3's in the nba. So he's really an undersized 4 who can't stretch the floor, and will possibly we a weakness on the glass.

The one strength he has is that he has an excellent mid range game. not enough going for him to want to draft him at 7.

[Chi town]

I don't see anything in Culver that would make me want to take him over Hunter, except that he's younger. Hunter is a better defender, a much better 3 pt shooter, and lead his team to a national title. He can play from Day 1 in the nba, meaning you'll get more use out of him on his rookie contract. I would probably take Reddish ahead of Culver. I just don't like him at all.

In this NBA the ability to handle and play make is premium. Hunter can’t do either. Culver does both. People forget Culver shot 38% from 3 as a freshman when he was t asked to to everything.

[Kurt Heimlich]

What makes you like Hunter over Culver then?

This is a good start...... shut him down head to head and won the NCAA Championship doing it...

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=401123374

Is that where most pro-Hunter people got their preference then? I won't argue he had the better game, and VA was certainly the better team that TT. But Jerome and Guy were big pieces to that team too. Culver didn't have quite the same supporting cast.

Culver just seems more toolsy than Hunter and showed more throughout the seasonn (and tourny) outside of the one game as a scorer ball handler, defender and athlete. Is Hunter viewed as a safer pick as a 3 + D guy? I've seen some people compare Hunter to Kawhi which just blows my mind and makes me question what people are looking at.

[johnnyvann840]

What makes you like Hunter over Culver then?

This is a good start...... shut him down head to head and won the NCAA Championship doing it...

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=401123374

Is that where most pro-Hunter people got their preference then? I won't argue he had the better game, and VA was certainly the better team that TT. But Jerome and Guy were big pieces to that team too. Culver didn't have quite the same supporting cast.

Culver just seems more toolsy than Hunter and showed more throughout the seasonn (and tourny) outside of the one game as a scorer ball handler, defender and athlete. Is Hunter viewed as a safer pick as a 3 + D guy? I've seen some people compare Hunter to Kawhi which just blows my mind and makes me question what people are looking at.

Yeah, the Kawhi comparisons are out there a bit. Regarding the game. It was only one game but there is a history of this kind of thing in big games where the guy who won the H2H wound up the better player. Not saying it's the way to pick one player over another. Remember Noah vs. Oden... or D'Aaron Fox vs. Ball head to head a couple of times. I think a lot of people really like Hunter because he is like the Timmy of 3/4's the mid-fundamental. He just plays the game the right way. Makes the right reads, makes the right passes, takes good shots, avoids bad ones.... oh, and he can flat out shoot the ball, which in itself is a good foundation to start from. Culver may be the better overall defender on paper, but Hunter is a great defender. Super efficient. Edward (Red) posted a Synergy chart of Hunter and it is damn impressive. It really suggests that he may be a "sneaky good scorer" at the next level, as he put it.

[johnnyvann840]

the problems with Hachimura are that he's not a great rebounder or defender, and he cannot shoot the 3 at all. He's also a tweener, and he'll have trouble guarding 3's in the nba. So he's really an undersized 4 who can't stretch the floor, and will possibly we a weakness on the glass.

The one strength he has is that he has an excellent mid range game. not enough going for him to want to draft him at 7.

Well, he can shoot the 3. At least when he did shoot it. He shot over .400, although on fairly low volume, but he showed a good stroke.

oh, and I don't think he "can't rebound"... when you play next to Brandon Clarke, there isn't going to be much left there to rebound. lol. jk... but, Rui averaged 8.6 rebs per 40. Really not bad. He definitely needs to improve there. That is the one place where I'll agree about his "feel" lacking a bit.

[johnnyvann840]

.......I would probably take Reddish ahead of Culver. I just don't like him at all.

Watch on YouTube

[RastaBull]

If Culver sneaks into the top 4, I'd wager that Hunter is the one who drops down to us at 7.

I think we're going to end up drafting Hunter. He's not a bad result to be honest. He'll be a solid, winning player. His athletic profile, floor, and perceived lack of upside remind me a bit of WCJ.

If we could get a bonafide vet to fill the PG spot, someone we could rely on in that role to make us competitive, then Hunter becomes my favorite prospect.

Outside of Zion, he's the most "interesting" potential relative to "new NBA" trends and positioning. He's only 6'7" according to measurements, but in college game he looked really big. His weight is about same as Draymond, and from eye test of him and college this year I think it is VERY VIABLE to consider him a combo forward pretty much soon as he starts his NBA career.

He's got a lot of skill and an admirable athletic profile across the board (strength, agility, leaping ability, speed, length, etc.). I didn't know a whole lot about him as a freshman, but he seemed to have a lot of untapped potential and more of a defensive specialist, but very coachable/team guy. This year seemed to be REALLY productive for him on offensive end, learn a little bit about being a go to scorer. And he took well to it. What is his rebounding profile? Looked good in the tournament.

Feel like Bulls with Lauri and Porter would be a great landing spot for him. Immediately he'll get playing time because his specialty (defense) will be valuable and he can be on court with both Lauri or Porter. I think on Bulls it'd offer good opportunities, but not overwhelming pressure, for his offensive game to develop. Could be a perfectly placed to replace Otto in two years.

[RastaBull]

Not a starting lineup ... but Laurie/Hunter/Porter could be a wicked frontline for stretches.

Those three in general makes for a lot of flexibility and depth on the forward spot.

[kodo]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

Andre Iguodala as a frosh shot 38% overall 20% from 3 and went on to be a Finals MVP.

The reasons to draft Reddish are defensive potential with his 7’ wingspan, high steals rate. Don’t see him as an offensive star, but it’s very likely there are no stars past Zion.

I have little interest in Reddish but a star at 7 is highly unlikely no matter who it is.

[Jcool0]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

Andre Iguodala as a frosh shot 38% overall 20% from 3 and went on to be a Finals MVP.

The reasons to draft Reddish are defensive potential with his 7’ wingspan, high steals rate. Don’t see him as an offensive star, but it’s very likely there are no stars past Zion.

Uh you do know Iguodala didnt come out after his freshman year right?

[kodo]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

Andre Iguodala as a frosh shot 38% overall 20% from 3 and went on to be a Finals MVP.

The reasons to draft Reddish are defensive potential with his 7’ wingspan, high steals rate. Don’t see him as an offensive star, but it’s very likely there are no stars past Zion.

Uh you do know Iguodala didnt come out after his freshman year right?

That has nothing to do with development paths.
At point X which is the same for two players, both players performed the same.

When each player chooses to enter the draft is irrelevant.

If Reddish stays 1 more year almost certainly his #s skyrocket without RJ and Zion on the team. That shouldn’t make him a better pick next year, he’s still Cam Reddish.

[Jcool0]

Andre Iguodala as a frosh shot 38% overall 20% from 3 and went on to be a Finals MVP.

The reasons to draft Reddish are defensive potential with his 7’ wingspan, high steals rate. Don’t see him as an offensive star, but it’s very likely there are no stars past Zion.

Uh you do know Iguodala didnt come out after his freshman year right?

That has nothing to do with development paths.
At point X which is the same for two players, both players performed the same.

When each player chooses to enter the draft is irrelevant.

If Reddish stays 1 more year almost certainly his #s skyrocket without RJ and Zion on the team. That shouldn’t make him a better pick next year, he’s still Cam Reddish.

So you think you can develop the same way in college and in the NBA? Yeah i am not sure that is actuate.

[johnnyvann840]

When is the last time a player who shot .356 from the field /.333 from deep, had a sub .500 TS%, played like he was at his local Y on a Sunday afternoon for most of the season. At his size and WS averaged 3.7 rebounds and for a guy with RJ Barrett and Zion Williamson on his team had less than 2 assists per game... with 2.7 turnovers (almost 4 per 40) ......when is the last time THAT player wound up being a star in the NBA? I'm not sure that it's ever happened on that level of just bad to being good at the next level. Yeah, I'm going to say he's going to drop in similar fashion to MPJ last draft. Even some of these NBA execs cannot be that stupid, can they?

Andre Iguodala as a frosh shot 38% overall 20% from 3 and went on to be a Finals MVP.

The reasons to draft Reddish are defensive potential with his 7’ wingspan, high steals rate. Don’t see him as an offensive star, but it’s very likely there are no stars past Zion.

I have little interest in Reddish but a star at 7 is highly unlikely no matter who it is.

Meh.... Iggy went back to school and greatly improved shooting .450 and .315 the next season and was a defensive beast. He was a doberman. Reddish is nothing like that. He plays like a eunuch. No fight in that dog. Bad comparison really.

Regarding no stars past Zion. I highly doubt it. Maybe no superstars... but there will be a few surprises. There always are. Even the worst drafts produce a couple of all stars. Especially in recent years where a lot of the best players come out of nowhere later in the draft. Even the worst drafts have a couple of all stars. Like 2013 which looked bad.. But Dipo developed well and Giannis came at 15... Gobert at 27.... People said that in 2012 after AD... but then Dame happened.. and all of a sudden Draymond at 35 and Middleton at 39. Find me a draft with "no stars" in the last 10 years.

[johnnyvann840]

Andre Iguodala as a frosh shot 38% overall 20% from 3 and went on to be a Finals MVP.

The reasons to draft Reddish are defensive potential with his 7’ wingspan, high steals rate. Don’t see him as an offensive star, but it’s very likely there are no stars past Zion.

Uh you do know Iguodala didnt come out after his freshman year right?

That has nothing to do with development paths.
At point X which is the same for two players, both players performed the same.

When each player chooses to enter the draft is irrelevant.

If Reddish stays 1 more year almost certainly his #s skyrocket without RJ and Zion on the team. That shouldn’t make him a better pick next year, he’s still Cam Reddish.

This is such flawed logic. The fact is his numbers were what they were and he isn't going back to school. If he did and actually improved he would be a MUCH better pick, because he would have actually shown something before being drafted. But he hasn't shown anything except that he sucked ass. And why would his numbers skyrocket without RJ and Zion? Maybe his PPG would, but would his efficiency? I would say it likely gets worse without those guys getting all the defensive attention. Reddish was missing wide open looks, he turned the ball over more than he assisted two of the top 5 picks in his draft. He didn't rebound anything that didn't come right to him. He was flat out awful.

[Jcool0]

Speaking of Iguodala... I always wonder if the Bulls would of been any better if they had drafted him instead of Deng.

[cjbulls]

What happens once the league year starts for this draft board? Do all the people with strong takes just stay quiet and wait? For example, I am sure there were people saying Trae is a bum. And others predicting MPJ would play this year and be better than WCJ.

[cjbulls]

Uh you do know Iguodala didnt come out after his freshman year right?

That has nothing to do with development paths.
At point X which is the same for two players, both players performed the same.

When each player chooses to enter the draft is irrelevant.

If Reddish stays 1 more year almost certainly his #s skyrocket without RJ and Zion on the team. That shouldn’t make him a better pick next year, he’s still Cam Reddish.

This is such flawed logic. The fact is his numbers were what they were and he isn't going back to school. If he did and actually improved he would be a MUCH better pick, because he would have actually shown something before being drafted. But he hasn't shown anything except that he sucked ass. And why would his numbers skyrocket without RJ and Zion? Maybe his PPG would, but would his efficiency? I would say it likely gets worse without those guys getting all the defensive attention. Reddish was missing wide open looks, he turned the ball over more than he assisted two of the top 5 picks in his draft. He didn't rebound anything that didn't come right to him. He was flat out awful.

I don't understand the flawed logic here. It's fair to compare freshman numbers to another players freshman numbers. Just because the NBA didn't want Iguodala after that year doesn't change the comparison.

Reddish is coming out because he's going to get drafted top 10 and this is the earliest the NBA will let him be drafted. If Iguodala was projected as a top 10 pick after his freshman year, he would have came out as well, and almost certainly would have become the same player.

[johnnyvann840]

What happens once the league year starts for this draft board? Do all the people with strong takes just stay quiet and wait? For example, I am sure there were people saying Trae is a bum. And others predicting MPJ would play this year and be better than WCJ.

Nobody is right all the time. I'll admit I didn't like Trae Young much. I wasn't as down on him as Duck was, but I'll be the first to admit I didn't like him. But, really, you cannot judge a draft until at least a few years later, if not 4. I mean MCW was ROY and everyone though he was going to be a star. Victor Oladipo didn't look like a star after his first couple of seasons. A lot of players are like that.. Look at how long it took Jimmy Butler to blossom into a star player. And he was a #30.