ImageImageImageImageImage

Update: Harrison Barnes signs 4 yr $85M deal [Amick] (update #134)

Moderators: codydaze, KF10, City of Trees

BoogieTime
Starter
Posts: 2,498
And1: 902
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
 

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#101 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 29, 2019 2:40 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?

Is this a troll response?

He’s a top ten pick talent who isn’t deficient at anything who fits with our core


What do you mean by “top 10 pick talent”? And just because someone questions your opinion does not make them a “troll”. I was looking for specific answers; what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Because his advanced statistics are utterly horrific not to mention the fact that it doesn’t seem that he has a real passion for the game of basketball. So I will ask you one more time, what specifically makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Thanks



Advanced stats horrific? He’s a talented player with a solid work ethic and a class act
BoogieTime
Starter
Posts: 2,498
And1: 902
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
 

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#102 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 29, 2019 2:46 pm

I see the need to keep him, but for me the question is and will be whether or not a different GM could have gotten that number lower (naturally as a Vlade detractor)
gundysmullet
Rookie
Posts: 1,187
And1: 644
Joined: May 20, 2019

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#103 » by gundysmullet » Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:29 pm

BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:Is this a troll response?

He’s a top ten pick talent who isn’t deficient at anything who fits with our core


What do you mean by “top 10 pick talent”? And just because someone questions your opinion does not make them a “troll”. I was looking for specific answers; what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Because his advanced statistics are utterly horrific not to mention the fact that it doesn’t seem that he has a real passion for the game of basketball. So I will ask you one more time, what specifically makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Thanks



Advanced stats horrific? He’s a talented player with a solid work ethic and a class act

Yes, horrific advanced stats. Ok, to you being a hard worker and a good dude makes a player “legit”, fair enough but that sounds like a $6-8 million/ year player to me.
dckingsfan
RealGM
Posts: 15,777
And1: 3,607
Joined: May 28, 2010

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#104 » by dckingsfan » Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:34 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
benchmobbin02 wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:Why can’t Bojdonovic play small forward?

He can versus some SFs but he is better suited to be our 6th man off the bench that runs the offense when Fox is sitting.

I was just asking because dckingsfan said there wouldn’t be an sf on the team if they didn’t resign Barnes and I think Bogdonovic is better. I just do not understand spending so much money on such a mediocre player like Harrison Barnes.

Bogdan is a guard. He rebounds like a guard, defends like a guard and plays offense like a guard. I think it really hurt him this year (and the team) having to play him at SF.

My 1/2 cent.
BoogieTime
Starter
Posts: 2,498
And1: 902
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
 

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#105 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:41 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
What do you mean by “top 10 pick talent”? And just because someone questions your opinion does not make them a “troll”. I was looking for specific answers; what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Because his advanced statistics are utterly horrific not to mention the fact that it doesn’t seem that he has a real passion for the game of basketball. So I will ask you one more time, what specifically makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Thanks



Advanced stats horrific? He’s a talented player with a solid work ethic and a class act

Yes, horrific advanced stats. Ok, to you being a hard worker and a good dude makes a player “legit”, fair enough but that sounds like a $6-8 million/ year player to me.


You don’t know what your talking about. His advanced stats are “average”, but he passes the eye test and can improve in his prime given his talent level
dckingsfan
RealGM
Posts: 15,777
And1: 3,607
Joined: May 28, 2010

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#106 » by dckingsfan » Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:42 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:What do you mean by “top 10 pick talent”? And just because someone questions your opinion does not make them a “troll”. I was looking for specific answers; what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Because his advanced statistics are utterly horrific not to mention the fact that it doesn’t seem that he has a real passion for the game of basketball. So I will ask you one more time, what specifically makes Harrison Barnes “legit”? Thanks

Advanced stats horrific? He’s a talented player with a solid work ethic and a class act

Yes, horrific advanced stats. Ok, to you being a hard worker and a good dude makes a player “legit”, fair enough but that sounds like a $6-8 million/ year player to me.

To be fair, the top SFs are mostly max guys: Giannis Antetokounmpo, Kevin Durant, LeBron James, Paul George, Kawhi Leonard, Jimmy Butler, Khris Middleton, Otto Porter, Gordon Hayward (yeah, I am probably missing a couple here). And the group under them are probably $15M/yr guys.

I guess the question is: Is Barnes worth 22M/yr. If not, do we have other choices? The second question, I don't feel we have enough information to answer.

And his advanced stats are okay... note, playing PF is not a good place for him to be...

Code: Select all

Season   Age   Tm   Pos      PER    TS%     DRB%   STL%   BLK%   TOV%   WS/48   VORP
2012-13   20   GSW   SF      11.0   0.526   14.5   1.3    0.5   12.4   0.065    -0.2
2013-14   21   GSW   SF      09.8   0.486   11.9   1.5    0.7   10.0   0.070     0.3
2014-15   22   GSW   SF      13.4   0.573   15.1   1.3    0.6    9.0   0.139     1.8
2015-16   23   GSW   SF      12.3   0.559   12.4   1.0    0.4    7.6   0.116     0.9
2016-17   24   DAL   PF      16.3   0.541   13.1   1.2    0.5    6.8   0.078     0.1
2017-18   25   DAL   PF      15.8   0.539   17.1   0.9    0.5    8.1   0.070    -0.1
2018-19   26   TOT   PF-SF   12.8   0.550   12.7   0.9    0.4    7.9   0.068    -0.2
2018-19   26   DAL   PF      13.1   0.538   11.5   1.0    0.6    7.8   0.059    -0.4
2018-19   26   SAC   SF      12.3   0.578   14.8   0.8    0.2    8.0   0.084     0.2


Kevin Broom uses PPA - he has Barnes as an 88 where 100 is average. But to be fair, Barnes was playing PF at the time.
gundysmullet
Rookie
Posts: 1,187
And1: 644
Joined: May 20, 2019

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#107 » by gundysmullet » Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:53 pm

BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:

Advanced stats horrific? He’s a talented player with a solid work ethic and a class act

Yes, horrific advanced stats. Ok, to you being a hard worker and a good dude makes a player “legit”, fair enough but that sounds like a $6-8 million/ year player to me.


You don’t know what your talking about. His advanced stats are “average”, but he passes the eye test and can improve in his prime given his talent level

You are posting out of emotion, not logic, reason and facts. His advanced stats are terrible, and that is not a “personal” attack on him, by all accounts he’s a good dude. How many years has he been in the league? He is who he is; an average basketball player and a good guy. That does not equal $20 million/year .
BoogieTime
Starter
Posts: 2,498
And1: 902
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
 

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#108 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:12 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:Yes, horrific advanced stats. Ok, to you being a hard worker and a good dude makes a player “legit”, fair enough but that sounds like a $6-8 million/ year player to me.


You don’t know what your talking about. His advanced stats are “average”, but he passes the eye test and can improve in his prime given his talent level

You are posting out of emotion, not logic, reason and facts. His advanced stats are terrible, and that is not a “personal” attack on him, by all accounts he’s a good dude. How many years has he been in the league? He is who he is; an average basketball player and a good guy. That does not equal $20 million/year .


Your trolling. posting garbage that isn’t true for negative affect on the forum (he doesn’t have overtly bad advanced stats).
User avatar
cpower
RealGM
Posts: 12,400
And1: 4,613
Joined: Mar 03, 2011
   

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#109 » by cpower » Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:14 pm

The problem with the deal is you know exactly what you are getting..an average sf in todays game and he is not going to get better. You rather gamble on younger players.
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/position/5
OGSactownballer
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,024
And1: 397
Joined: Oct 02, 2005

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#110 » by OGSactownballer » Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:56 pm

City of Trees wrote:To gauge the Barnes signing lets look at the Small Forward salaries for 2019

1. LeBron James - $37,436,858

2. Paul George - $33,005,556

3. Gordon Hayward - $32,700,690

4. Andrew Wiggins - $27,504,630

5 Otto Porter Jr. - $27,250,575

6 Chandler Parsons- $25,102,511

7 Danilo Gallinari - $22,615,559

8 Evan Turner - $18,606,557

9 Andre Iguodala - $17,185,185

10 Justise Winslow - $13,000,000

11 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist - $13,000,000

12 Solomon Hill - $12,758,781

13 Joe Ingles - $11,954,546

14 Robert Covington - $11,301,219

15 Maurice Harkless - $11,011,236


Note: the free agent class will fill in this list once they've signed.

The possibility of Barnes not being paid top 10 in his position is very real. Barnes falling in line between 10-15 for his position feels right and feels like a win for Sac.


I really appreciate you laying it out like this.

It gives a great perspective view to everyone on what the landscape really looks like.

And I’ll add one other thing to the argument about where exactly Barnes sits in the general NBA pantheon.

He is invited to the Team USA camp. They don’t just hand that out to garbage players. We cannot on one hand get super stoked and hyped about Fox being invited to the select team, then turn around and crap all over Barnes who has been invited to tryout for the senior team.

Ultimately while we feel like we are looking st a slight overpay by the Real GM standards, we actually have to look at that list and say that he slots in at almost bargain price. Because you also have to remember that he usually doesn’t miss games whereas a LOT of those guys (here’s looking at you Robert Covington) miss a LOT.
OGSactownballer
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,024
And1: 397
Joined: Oct 02, 2005

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#111 » by OGSactownballer » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:14 pm

cpower wrote:The problem with the deal is you know exactly what you are getting..an average sf in todays game and he is not going to get better. You rather gamble on younger players.
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/position/5


No not really.

We have a core of young players that we have gambled on.

You don’t win consistently in the NBA without veterans who are ok with filling their roles. Barnes is exactly that. He has championship level experience and veteran NBA savvy. I’m not looking to get 20/10 from him for that contract. I want him to do the little things that make a team win. I want him to provide a steady influence when things get tight.
gundysmullet
Rookie
Posts: 1,187
And1: 644
Joined: May 20, 2019

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#112 » by gundysmullet » Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:29 pm

BoogieTime wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
You don’t know what your talking about. His advanced stats are “average”, but he passes the eye test and can improve in his prime given his talent level

You are posting out of emotion, not logic, reason and facts. His advanced stats are terrible, and that is not a “personal” attack on him, by all accounts he’s a good dude. How many years has he been in the league? He is who he is; an average basketball player and a good guy. That does not equal $20 million/year .


Your trolling. posting garbage that isn’t true for negative affect on the forum (he doesn’t have overtly bad advanced stats).

More emotion and not an ounce of facts, logic or reason. Again, people have opinions that differ from your own sometimes, that does not make them a “hater” or a “troll” it simply means that someone has an opinion that differs from your own. And that’s OK. Just try to take the emotion out of everything and be calm in life.
User avatar
benchmobbin02
Veteran
Posts: 2,962
And1: 362
Joined: May 28, 2015
     

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#113 » by benchmobbin02 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:18 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
benchmobbin02 wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:Why can’t Bojdonovic play small forward?


He can versus some SFs but he is better suited to be our 6th man off the bench that runs the offense when Fox is sitting.

I was just asking because dckingsfan said there wouldn’t be an sf on the team if they didn’t resign Barnes and I think Bogdonovic is better. I just do not understand spending so much money on such a mediocre player like Harrison Barnes.


That is because you don't watch or follow our team.

Bogi is more of a combo guard than a wing. Yes, he can guard some 3's man up but others he has trouble with. He isn't the best athlete either which plays into the former.

He is a great young player and he can spend minutes at the 1-2-3 but you don't want to put him in the position where he is counted on to be your primary 3 and defensive stopper on the court. You would idle want someone between 6'7 and 6'10, good athlete, can score in different sets and doesn't need plays called for him to have a big impact on the team.

That is Barnes. He can guard and play 2-4 (if we go small ball or max defense). He can hit the 3, isn't a mismatch versus the elite 3's in the league on the defensive end of the floor and is a good athlete with strong footwork and good length.

So it's not that Bogi can't do it but he is better in the role we have him in and having Barnes as our starting 3 and small ball 4.
"We are going to be in a better position in two years. I wanna hear from these same people in two years." - VLADFATHER FEB. 25TH 2017
City of Trees
Forum Mod - Kings
Forum Mod - Kings
Posts: 13,285
And1: 3,394
Joined: Dec 23, 2009
Location: Roseville, CA
Contact:
   

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#114 » by City of Trees » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:00 pm

gundysmullet wrote:
jeffjtk1234 wrote:It’s not a bad deal for Barnes. It’s a slight overpay but let’s be happy we have a legit 3 who knows Luke’s system.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?
Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.

28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.
jeffjtk1234
Starter
Posts: 2,054
And1: 288
Joined: Jan 01, 2007
Location: Sacramento, CA
     

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#115 » by jeffjtk1234 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:46 pm

City of Trees wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
jeffjtk1234 wrote:It’s not a bad deal for Barnes. It’s a slight overpay but let’s be happy we have a legit 3 who knows Luke’s system.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?
Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.

28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.


Yeah, i should have elaborated, but in essence the SF spot has been a problem for this team for years as you noted above and we finally have a steady 3 locked in for 4 years that is within shouting distance age wise of our main core. Needless to say i am happy with this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
gundysmullet
Rookie
Posts: 1,187
And1: 644
Joined: May 20, 2019

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#116 » by gundysmullet » Sun Jun 30, 2019 12:23 am

City of Trees wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
jeffjtk1234 wrote:It’s not a bad deal for Barnes. It’s a slight overpay but let’s be happy we have a legit 3 who knows Luke’s system.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?
Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.

28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.


OK, fair enough. I lived in SoCal for 10 years and always rooted for the Kings from a distance and still think about how they were robbed versus the Lakers so I’ve always wanted them to succeed. I just don’t think that Harrison Barnes is as good as you guys think he is, I think he is fools gold. I think the fact that the contract is so expensive compared to what he actually delivers on the court but as you and others have said I guess you’re paying for the fact that he’s a good dude too.
City of Trees
Forum Mod - Kings
Forum Mod - Kings
Posts: 13,285
And1: 3,394
Joined: Dec 23, 2009
Location: Roseville, CA
Contact:
   

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#117 » by City of Trees » Sun Jun 30, 2019 12:27 am

gundysmullet wrote:
City of Trees wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?
Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.

28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.


OK, fair enough. I lived in SoCal for 10 years and always rooted for the Kings from a distance and still think about how they were robbed versus the Lakers so I’ve always wanted them to succeed. I just don’t think that Harrison Barnes is as good as you guys think he is, I think he is fools gold. I think the fact that the contract is so expensive compared to what he actually delivers on the court but as you and others have said I guess you’re paying for the fact that he’s a good dude too.
Take a look at starting Small Forward salaries after free agency is over. You'll see Barnes salary is close to average among starters not on a rookie deal. Small forward is a premium position, it's like the NFL were nowadays you're paying $20M per year for an average QB.
OGSactownballer
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,024
And1: 397
Joined: Oct 02, 2005

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#118 » by OGSactownballer » Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:11 am

City of Trees wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
jeffjtk1234 wrote:It’s not a bad deal for Barnes. It’s a slight overpay but let’s be happy we have a legit 3 who knows Luke’s system.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?
Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.

28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.


A lot of the problem with the advanced stats is they do not account for misuse of the player.

Remember and say this to yourself a few times. Barnes was the starter for a championship and a 73-win team. The only reason he was displaced was because the team had the opportunity to sign Durant - the second best player in the world - who plays the same position.

Then he signed with Dallas who immediately tried to make him the number one option.

He’s not. That’s not his strength. And the advanced stats show it.

Then Joeger used him a LOT at the 4. Now I like him SITUATIONALLY at the 4 or 2 for small stretches with a specific matchup need. But ultimately he is NOT a 4 and again, the advanced stats tell the tale.

Let’s see what happens when he gets to play his natural position as the fourth or fifth offensive option the way he should be.
gundysmullet
Rookie
Posts: 1,187
And1: 644
Joined: May 20, 2019

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#119 » by gundysmullet » Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:23 am

OGSactownballer wrote:
City of Trees wrote:
gundysmullet wrote:
Honest question, what makes Harrison Barnes “legit”?
Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.

28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.


A lot of the problem with the advanced stats is they do not account for misuse of the player.

Remember and say this to yourself a few times. Barnes was the starter for a championship and a 73-win team. The only reason he was displaced was because the team had the opportunity to sign Durant - the second best player in the world - who plays the same position.

Then he signed with Dallas who immediately tried to make him the number one option.

He’s not. That’s not his strength. And the advanced stats show it.

Then Joeger used him a LOT at the 4. Now I like him SITUATIONALLY at the 4 or 2 for small stretches with a specific matchup need. But ultimately he is NOT a 4 and again, the advanced stats tell the tale.

Let’s see what happens when he gets to play his natural position as the fourth or fifth offensive option the way he should be.

Yes, yes, yes. Harrison Barnes on a good team is fourth or fifth option. Fourth or fifth options are decent tile players they do not make $20 million a year. That is simply my point.
User avatar
benchmobbin02
Veteran
Posts: 2,962
And1: 362
Joined: May 28, 2015
     

Re: Harrison Barnes declines $25.1m player option. [Update: Kings plan to offer extension in 4/90 range. Pg. 4] 

Post#120 » by benchmobbin02 » Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:39 am

gundysmullet wrote:
OGSactownballer wrote:
City of Trees wrote:Kings starting Small Forwards over the years

2007: Ron Artest
2008: John Salmons/Francisco Garcia
2009: Donte Green/Omri Casspi
2010: Francisco Garcia/Omri Casspi
2011: John Salmons/Donte Green
2012: John Salmons/Travis Outlaw
2013: Rudy Gay
2014: Rudy Gay
2015: Rudy Gay
2016: Rudy Gay
2017: Garret Temple/Justin Jackson
2018: Shumpert/Barnes


Since 2008, outside of Rudy Gay the Kings have seen a lot of below average play from the SF position.

I can't speak for jeffjtk but what I think he meant by "legit" is unlike years past the Kings have a penciled in starter in Harrison Barnes.


28 games is a small sample size but the Kings saw enough where they feel confident moving forward. 3 point shooting, rebounding, ability to switch on defense, acceptance of a smaller role, and his professionalism are attractive to the Kings.

One of Vlade's close friends Doug Christie is always hanging around the team. He's shared stories on Barnes being a positive influence on the young players. Cited how Barnes does everything right in his preparation and treatment, ect. Some of the money factors in as the vet role not just on court production.

I'll agree with you his advanced stats are bad which is weird. The eye test says he makes an impact on both sides of the floor. I have no answer its really weird.


A lot of the problem with the advanced stats is they do not account for misuse of the player.

Remember and say this to yourself a few times. Barnes was the starter for a championship and a 73-win team. The only reason he was displaced was because the team had the opportunity to sign Durant - the second best player in the world - who plays the same position.

Then he signed with Dallas who immediately tried to make him the number one option.

He’s not. That’s not his strength. And the advanced stats show it.

Then Joeger used him a LOT at the 4. Now I like him SITUATIONALLY at the 4 or 2 for small stretches with a specific matchup need. But ultimately he is NOT a 4 and again, the advanced stats tell the tale.

Let’s see what happens when he gets to play his natural position as the fourth or fifth offensive option the way he should be.

Yes, yes, yes. Harrison Barnes on a good team is fourth or fifth option. Fourth or fifth options are decent tile players they do not make $20 million a year. That is simply my point.


No, your point is YOU wouldn't pay a fourth option $20 mil a year. We get it.
"We are going to be in a better position in two years. I wanna hear from these same people in two years." - VLADFATHER FEB. 25TH 2017

Return to Sacramento Kings