Are the Knicks really having a bad off-season?

[Scalabrine]

The direction of the Knicks is unclear. Are they rebuilding ? If so I would expect them to be active in acquiring young assets but they aren't. If they are trying to turn around, why are they signing 3 role players who play the same position? They roster is now unbalanced.

Robinson/Portis
Randle/Gibson
Knox/Bullock/Dotson
Barrett/Trier/Dotson
Smith/Ntilikina

Aside from Gibson and Bullock the rest of that team is 4 or younger, most of them are 21 and younger. We are clearly rebuilding and will continue to develop players and keep cap room for the next 2 years. As a Knick fan, the direction of this team is as clear as it's been in a while. We're developing. This team should be fun.

[dakomish23]

Can someone make an argument for why it was better to pay Portis and Gibson 25 mil, after signing Randle, instead of facilitating the GSW deal?

[Texas Chuck]

Media will always laugh at the Knicks unless they win a championship. Just being a good team won't cut it like it does for other teams. Even if they signed Durant, media & posters on here would laugh at the Knicks for being a 17 win team and handing out a max contract to an injured player.

IDK man. Pretty big gap between championship and where the Knicks have been for years now. I do agree the Knicks get more criticism than your average NBA team--part of that is simply the city, but part of that they've brought upon themselves. When you have an incompetent owner, you are going to get criticism.

I think the Knicks could get plenty of respect by just showing competence for awhile. Take my little Mavs. In the 90's they were the worst franchise in all of North American professional sports. Awful teams, awful decision making, the owner only bought the team to do the real estate deal involving the new arena.

Then they hit pay dirt with Dirk and Cuban bought the team and brought passion, innovation, and the willingness to spend a ton of money. Took a decade before that led to a championship, but they were clearly a respected franchise again long before that. Now they are currently doing everything possible to turn themselves back into a joke, but I digress...

I don't know that people have a huge different standard for the Knicks. But if they can achieve relevance again but not be championship level I guess we'll see.

[FNQ]

Why the hell are you signing scrubs like Randle, Portia and Taj Gibson? They should have been the one taking on Iguodalas contract instead of Memphis and trading for Favors. Furthermore, there will be teams looking to get away from luxury tax that will attach picks to take on salary. It’s pretty common knowledge, the worst thing a rebuilding team can do with their capspace is resign their own players. This isn’t even considering the joke of not offering KD the full max, how do they think that looks to other players?

Randle isn't a scrub, Portis was trending up until a really poor/tumultuous last year. Gibson.. I dont get that one.

Randle and Portis still have a lot of upside and are on contracts that clearly jive together. If they dont work out, they still have another shot at FA while their youth is on their rookie deals. If one does work out, you can keep them or deal them for future assets.

That is exactly how you play FA in their shoes. Except Gibson, I really dont get that. A mentor to Robinson maybe? BTW - Taj isn't a scrub either. Role players arent scrubs. Neither are ascending, 24 y/o PFs that had positive metric impact.

This is shades of 2016 all over again when the Knicks used their capspace on pointless signings. 3 years later we’re replaying the same song over again. Randle, Portis, Gibson and Bullock aren’t moving the needle at all. Are the Knicks a rebuilding team or are they trying to make the playoffs. No ones giving up future assets for Portis or Gibson on those contracts, Randle is even more doubtful considering both the Lakers and Pelicans let him walk for nothing! You know who would have been a great mentor? Andre Iguodala and he would have come for free with a pick! That’s how you play the free agent game.

Just repeating that Randle and Gibson are scrubs doesnt make it so. They are positive impact players.

They arent trying to make the playoffs, clearly. They are signing guys who have upside (or in Gibson's case, a mentor) and doing it on deals that aren't damning.

They could have easily pushed for bigger names and paid out bigger salaries in an effort to win now. But instead everyone's on 2 year deals, you have an ascending Randle, you bought low on Portis and will see if his 3rd year was a fluke or his 4th year was.. and you have one of the smartest positional defenders now splitting time with Robinson.

Outside of signing KD/Kyrie, I dont know what you'd expect here. Maybe the Iguodala thing was available to you, maybe not. Much like with Bogut, I'd imagine the W's gave Iguodala a choice. Or maybe the Knicks wanted too much for Iguodala.

[FNQ]

Can someone make an argument for why it was better to pay Portis and Gibson 25 mil, after signing Randle, instead of facilitating the GSW deal?

Its not - but we could have let Iguodala choose where he goes, or the Grizz might have been more willing to accept a deal on our terms. We did let Bogut choose where he went when we dealt him to get KD

[dakomish23]

Can someone make an argument for why it was better to pay Portis and Gibson 25 mil, after signing Randle, instead of facilitating the GSW deal?

Its not - but we could have let Iguodala choose where he goes, or the Grizz might have been more willing to accept a deal on our terms. We did let Bogut choose where he went when we dealt him to get KD

Ok this gives me some hope I guess that it wasn't just the normal buffoonery by Steve "I want to compete for 30 wins" Mills.

[Stannis]

Media will always laugh at the Knicks unless they win a championship. Just being a good team won't cut it like it does for other teams. Even if they signed Durant, media & posters on here would laugh at the Knicks for being a 17 win team and handing out a max contract to an injured player.

IDK man. Pretty big gap between championship and where the Knicks have been for years now. I do agree the Knicks get more criticism than your average NBA team--part of that is simply the city, but part of that they've brought upon themselves. When you have an incompetent owner, you are going to get criticism.

I think the Knicks could get plenty of respect by just showing competence for awhile. Take my little Mavs. In the 90's they were the worst franchise in all of North American professional sports. Awful teams, awful decision making, the owner only bought the team to do the real estate deal involving the new arena.

Then they hit pay dirt with Dirk and Cuban bought the team and brought passion, innovation, and the willingness to spend a ton of money. Took a decade before that led to a championship, but they were clearly a respected franchise again long before that. Now they are currently doing everything possible to turn themselves back into a joke, but I digress...

I don't know that people have a huge different standard for the Knicks. But if they can achieve relevance again but not be championship level I guess we'll see.

I really don't see it. Even if they were consistently a playoff team, say like the 76ers or Pacers now. They'd get a lot of crap for throwing a lot of money and always finishing short or something. It's just the way it is because they have one of the biggest fanbases and are most valuable franchise.

Dolan is incompetent owner. But lately he has taken a step back to focus on his music (lol). He was even sued by his board members because they thought he was not involved with the day-to-day operations enough. Go figure. This time period is definitely not like the Isiah years, but the media is trying to make it so.

Anyways, Scott Perry is playing it safe. I'm not a fan of these recent moves. But they aren't bad moves. Yet, Knicks are still the punchline for all the jokes. Last I checked, Kevin Durant played for GS last, not the Knicks. Even if he did join the Knicks, would people be saying "good signing", or "Knicks just blew a bunch of cap for a guy who won't play the first year"?

It doesn't help that they got Screamin' A Smith representing the Knicks as a fanbase. Opposed to popular belief, most Knick fans can't stand him and don't share his opinions.

[ropjhk]

They are not having the offseason they had hoped for but I don't think they are doing that bad with plan B. As long as they don't make any really bad crippling signings then the offseason will be OK for them. The reality is that the Knicks will have to do a proper rebuild. Something that's been often talked about but never fully committed to in New York before.

[Pharmcat]

Can someone make an argument for why it was better to pay Portis and Gibson 25 mil, after signing Randle, instead of facilitating the GSW deal?

its the knicks...joke franchise

[dakomish23]

Can someone make an argument for why it was better to pay Portis and Gibson 25 mil, after signing Randle, instead of facilitating the GSW deal?

its the knicks...joke franchise

Yep

[meetbishop]

Knicks should have used their cap space to be a dumping ground for contracts instead of overpaying gibson/bullock/portis.

And no, they're not making the playoffs.


Philly
Toronto
Milwaukee
Boston
Indiana
Brooklyn
Orlando
Detroit
Miami
Atlanta
Chicago
Washington
Charlotte
Cleveland

I got those 14 teams clearly ahead of the Knicks next year in the east. They can battle for the 15 seed, though.

That is how the Nets started their process. And you end up getting some good picks and players in return. Rockets were trying to offload Eric Gordon. Take him with some picks and keep going.

[aliasxn]

All in all, I actually think they are having a good offseason. Drafted RJ and got a nice young big on friendly contract. Blowing all your cap just because you can and then staying in limbo with horrible contracts for half a decade is what I would consider bad. Kyrie is overrated anyway, he can't take anyone to the promissed land. And God knows how KD will comeback from the achilles injury, his mvp days are most likely over.

[TheProfessor]

Aside from the Randle deal, there off season hasn't been bad. Every player minus Randle was a great move.

[Najee12]

Knicks fantasy in May: Kevin Durant, Kyrie Irving and Zion Williamson

Knicks reality in June: R.J. Barrett, Taj Gibson, Bobby Portis and Julius Randle

What was hilarious is the Knicks rushed out its announcement it signed Randle to a big contract minutes after the announcement Durant is going to Brooklyn. The Knicks are the Keystone Kops of sports!

[Zenzibar]

Read on Twitter

Without Durant for the foreseeable future, Knicks hope to be feasting on Brooklyn for a New York minute.

[FNQ]

Knicks should have used their cap space to be a dumping ground for contracts instead of overpaying gibson/bullock/portis.

And no, they're not making the playoffs.


Philly
Toronto
Milwaukee
Boston
Indiana
Brooklyn
Orlando
Detroit
Miami
Atlanta
Chicago
Washington
Charlotte
Cleveland

I got those 14 teams clearly ahead of the Knicks next year in the east. They can battle for the 15 seed, though.

That is how the Nets started their process. And you end up getting some good picks and players in return. Rockets were trying to offload Eric Gordon. Take him with some picks and keep going.

Rockets were trying to do that if Butler wanted to play with them, doesnt seem like he did

[FNQ]

Aside from the Randle deal, there off season hasn't been bad. Every player minus Randle was a great move.

Randle is probably their best move

[Darth Celtic]

Not signing a guy coming off a full blown Achilles to a 164m max contract is the best thing the knicks have done in a decade. I mean, that's so a knicks move in the first place, but they are learning. Maybe it works out for the Nets, but maybe they swapped a young all star pg for a Load management PG who has a history of odd behavior and a top 5 player who might come back a top 50 player at 32 and make 40m a year.

It's like if Hayward broke his ankle on the last play of Utah's season and the Celtics signed him to max anyway. There is risk. Hayward might be back 2 years removed, same with KD. Just remember, the only person to come back and have a better season after was Dominique Wilkins.

Now, what have the Knicks done wrong? Signing multiple "filler" contracts to win a few more games. I get it, you have to pay somebody and the league doesn't like the Hinkie plan long term, but 1 more year of just signing 1 year young players and getting top odds at 1 would do good for the Knicks.

At least they can waive them all for nothing in 2 years and try again with the next wild batch of free agents. No Morris and rozier 4 year contracts.

[jfs1000d]

They traded away Porzingis, and were supposed to make a run for a major talent.

So, yes, huh disappointment.


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[Fat]

This roster will sneak into playoffs and be a tough matchup, you heard it here first.