Welcome Jevon Carter! (traded for JJ/Melton/2nd's)

Post #21 » by **Qwigglez** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 2:05 am

I'm happy Jackson may get a second chance in the league. He was never going to shine and play meaningful minutes after we saw how well Bridges played this past season. In regards to Melton, I thought he was a quality backup PG. He has the wingspan and defensive instincts to stick around the league. He needs to improve his offense immensely though. However, Booker didn't seem to like Melton at all. I have no idea why, but I remember in at least one game where he yelled at the coach to get Melton's ass on the bench and to put Okobo in.

I don't hate the trade at all. It makes sense what the new front office is trying to do. Trim the fat, cut our losses and move on. Jackson was just going to be a disgruntled young guy who was going to cause problems in the locker room.

Post #22 » by **bwgood77** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 3:12 am

Qwigglez wrote:I'm happy Jackson may get a second chance in the league. He was never going to shine and play meaningful minutes after we saw how well Bridges played this past season. In regards to Melton, I thought he was a quality backup PG. He has the wingspan and defensive instincts to stick around the league. He needs to improve his offense immensely though. However, Booker didn't seem to like Melton at all. I have no idea why, but I remember in at least one game where he yelled at the coach to get Melton's ass on the bench and to put Okobo in.

I don't hate the trade at all. It makes sense what the new front office is trying to do. Trim the fat, cut our losses and move on. Jackson was just going to be a disgruntled young guy who was going to cause problems in the locker room.

He's going to be surrounded by some high iq players too in Anderson, Jackson and Clarke along with a great passing PG in Ja and a very solid backup in Wright...and then also will have an ex teammate in Melton. He will likely be on the worst team in the west but he is around capable teammates, so maybe some of their stuff will rub off on him. I don't really expect it...but if his shooting can hold from the end of the year and he can work on finishing, who knows?

Moochthemonkey · Post #23 » by **Moochthemonkey** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 3:17 am

hollywood6964 wrote:I don't like virtually any of the moves. We're playing give away. At some point Sarver has to realize the value of a good general manager. I don't know what that point is, looking like maybe never.

not sure if JJ or Oprah is serving as the GM.

Post #24 » by **lilfishi22** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 3:20 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Qwigglez wrote:I'm happy Jackson may get a second chance in the league. He was never going to shine and play meaningful minutes after we saw how well Bridges played this past season. In regards to Melton, I thought he was a quality backup PG. He has the wingspan and defensive instincts to stick around the league. He needs to improve his offense immensely though. However, Booker didn't seem to like Melton at all. I have no idea why, but I remember in at least one game where he yelled at the coach to get Melton's ass on the bench and to put Okobo in.

I don't hate the trade at all. It makes sense what the new front office is trying to do. Trim the fat, cut our losses and move on. Jackson was just going to be a disgruntled young guy who was going to cause problems in the locker room.

He's going to be surrounded by some high iq players too in Anderson, Jackson and Clarke along with a great passing PG in Ja and a very solid backup in Wright...and then also will have an ex teammate in Melton. He will likely be on the worst team in the west but he is around capable teammates, so maybe some of their stuff will rub off on him. I don't really expect it...but if his shooting can hold from the end of the year and he can work on finishing, who knows?

I just realised Memphis has quite a number of offensively challenged (ie yet to fully develop an offensive game) but talented defensive players

Clarke, JJ, Melton and you could even put Jaren Jackson there too.

Post #25 » by **bwgood77** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 3:27 am

lilfishi22 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Qwigglez wrote:I'm happy Jackson may get a second chance in the league. He was never going to shine and play meaningful minutes after we saw how well Bridges played this past season. In regards to Melton, I thought he was a quality backup PG. He has the wingspan and defensive instincts to stick around the league. He needs to improve his offense immensely though. However, Booker didn't seem to like Melton at all. I have no idea why, but I remember in at least one game where he yelled at the coach to get Melton's ass on the bench and to put Okobo in.

I don't hate the trade at all. It makes sense what the new front office is trying to do. Trim the fat, cut our losses and move on. Jackson was just going to be a disgruntled young guy who was going to cause problems in the locker room.

He's going to be surrounded by some high iq players too in Anderson, Jackson and Clarke along with a great passing PG in Ja and a very solid backup in Wright...and then also will have an ex teammate in Melton. He will likely be on the worst team in the west but he is around capable teammates, so maybe some of their stuff will rub off on him. I don't really expect it...but if his shooting can hold from the end of the year and he can work on finishing, who knows?

I just realised Memphis has quite a number of offensively challenged (ie yet to fully develop an offensive game) but talented defensive players

Clarke, JJ, Melton and you could even put Jaren Jackson there too.

I was never sure why JJJ had that rep in the draft and really am unsure why he would now. The guy finished 73% at the rim and 36% from 3 and had over a 59% TS% as a rookie. The guy is a stud who can play inside and out. If he has a weakness it's rebounding and maybe passing but he's a great scorer, defender and rim protector.

Shot chart https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jacksja02/shooting/2019

Post #26 » by **lilfishi22** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 3:32 am

bwgood77 wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
He's going to be surrounded by some high iq players too in Anderson, Jackson and Clarke along with a great passing PG in Ja and a very solid backup in Wright...and then also will have an ex teammate in Melton. He will likely be on the worst team in the west but he is around capable teammates, so maybe some of their stuff will rub off on him. I don't really expect it...but if his shooting can hold from the end of the year and he can work on finishing, who knows?

I just realised Memphis has quite a number of offensively challenged (ie yet to fully develop an offensive game) but talented defensive players

Clarke, JJ, Melton and you could even put Jaren Jackson there too.

I was never sure why JJJ had that rep in the draft and really am unsure why he would now. The guy finished 73% at the rim and 36% from 3 and had over a 59% TS% as a rookie. The guy is a stud who can play inside and out. If he has a weakness it's rebounding and maybe passing but he's a great scorer, defender and rim protector.

Shot chart https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jacksja02/shooting/2019

I didn't say he is offensively challenged. I just meant that you could make an argument for him to be in that far better defensively than they are offensively bucket. I think he's fine offensively but he's way more developed defensively than he is offensively

kennydorglas · Post #27 » by **kennydorglas** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 3:38 am

At least they took Jevon Carter back.
Everyone knew JJ was done here.

denial · Post #28 » by **denial** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 5:24 am

This board and nba fans in general overvalue draft picks imo. If I’m gm and I’m putting value ratings of 1-10 on all my assets, second round draft picks are a 1. I can think of no tradable asset that is less valuable. If I have to throw in a second round pick to make a deal happen, you won’t have to twist my arm too hard

DRK · Post #29 » by **DRK** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 5:25 am

Liked Carter out of college. Was #32 pick last year in the draft- projected 1st rounder.

Was a great defender in college, big body, and can hit the three. I like his game

Post #30 » by **lilfishi22** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 5:35 am

Seeing as Jevon Carter is the only one (I assume) that is sticking around from the trade, I've changed the title of this thread to a Jevon Carter thread!

Some highlight videos from his rookie season

Watch on YouTube

Some college tape

Watch on YouTube

Biff · Post #31 » by **Biff** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 6:22 am

What the hell is going on with our FO? Why are we giving away so many 2nd round picks for nothing? Tomorrow we'll find out we traded Booker and 4 future unprotected 1sts for Chris Paul.

DirtyDez · Post #32 » by **DirtyDez** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 6:33 am

I would’ve rather paid JJ 2.3m a year for three years to disappear. This was an amateur trade.

Fo-Real · Post #33 » by **Fo-Real** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 6:49 am

Getting Carter in the trade signals Okobo's days in a Suns Uni wont get past Summer League!

Frank Lee · Post #34 » by **Frank Lee** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 11:02 am

Fo-Real wrote:Getting Carter in the trade signals Okobo's days in a Suns Uni wont get past Summer League!

And half this site will come unglued when we trade him for one of those prized second round picks...

jcsunsfan · Post #35 » by **jcsunsfan** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 11:05 am

I really like Carter. I think he is better than Melton. And I don’t think it’s that close.

NavLDO · Post #36 » by **NavLDO** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 1:14 pm

jcsunsfan wrote:I really like Carter. I think he is better than Melton. And I don’t think it’s that close.

I'm speculating here, but it seems as if 'someone' with a clue, in a leadership role on the Suns have figured out that that we cannot develop players worth a darn; everyone, sans our 'UDFA' signing, is NBA Ready now, and the fact is Jevon Carter is more NBA-Ready, (as evidenced by his steadily improved numbers throughout the season last year) than Melton.

What do Carter, Johnson, and Jerome have in common?? All were upperclassmen upon entering the draft-NBA Ready players now.

I think Sarver, actually, has had enough; he likely set an ultimatum, by tell Jones "Field an NBA-competitive team--NOW--or everyone is fired!!" OK, not that dramatic, but seriously, he likely had a hand in the direction we took--no more sub-30 win seasons--make us competitive--NOW!! You have your developmental-draft guys already in Bridges and Ayton, (and now Lecque)--get 'players' not 'projects'.

I must say, that is what this off-season has been all about, and while I don't think we are anywhere near a playoff team, I don't think we will be an embarrassment, either.

Midnight_Suns · Post #37 » by **Midnight_Suns** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 4:40 pm

Y'all are really over-valuing 2nd round picks lol. For every Jokic or Draymond there are 1,000 scrubs who never sniff the floor.

DirtyDez · Post #38 » by **DirtyDez** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 6:57 pm

jcsunsfan wrote:I really like Carter. I think he is better than Melton. And I don’t think it’s that close.

Rookie season:

Carter (23 years old) -
Per/36: 10.7 PPG - 4.3 APG - 4.1 RPG - 1.6 STL - PER- 7.8 - .432 TS% - 90 Ortg/109 Drtg - BPM: -4.0 - VORP: -0.3

Melton (20 years old)
Per/36: 9.1 PPG - 5.8 APG - 4.9 RPG - 2.5 STL - PER - 9.9 - 4.66 TS% - 93 Ortg/112 Drtg - BPM: -2.6 - VOTP: -0.1

jcsunsfan · Post #39 » by **jcsunsfan** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 7:09 pm

NavLDO wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:I really like Carter. I think he is better than Melton. And I don’t think it’s that close.

I'm speculating here, but it seems as if 'someone' with a clue, in a leadership role on the Suns have figured out that that we cannot develop players worth a darn; everyone, sans our 'UDFA' signing, is NBA Ready now, and the fact is Jevon Carter is more NBA-Ready, (as evidenced by his steadily improved numbers throughout the season last year) than Melton.

What do Carter, Johnson, and Jerome have in common?? All were upperclassmen upon entering the draft-NBA Ready players now.

I think Sarver, actually, has had enough; he likely set an ultimatum, by tell Jones "Field an NBA-competitive team--NOW--or everyone is fired!!" OK, not that dramatic, but seriously, he likely had a hand in the direction we took--no more sub-30 win seasons--make us competitive--NOW!! You have your developmental-draft guys already in Bridges and Ayton, (and now Lecque)--get 'players' not 'projects'.

I must say, that is what this off-season has been all about, and while I don't think we are anywhere near a playoff team, I don't think we will be an embarrassment, either.

I don't think this is Sarver laying down the law, I think this is James' Jones philosophy. Its a San Antonio Spurs approach to team building and player development. There is no point in drafting promising rookies if you do not have a team culture designed to develop those rookies. Our revolving door for coaches, and sometimes 6 and 7 players 21 and under was an environment ideal for rookie failure, and we saw it. The Clippers of the 1980's and 1990's were exactly the same.

You have to build a culture and then bring the young guys into it selectively. They have decided to build around Booker, Ayton, Bridges, and Oubre (if they sign him), which is the only reasonable thing to do.

NavLDO · Post #40 » by **NavLDO** » Thu Jul 4, 2019 8:15 pm

jcsunsfan wrote:
NavLDO wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:I really like Carter. I think he is better than Melton. And I don’t think it’s that close.

I'm speculating here, but it seems as if 'someone' with a clue, in a leadership role on the Suns have figured out that that we cannot develop players worth a darn; everyone, sans our 'UDFA' signing, is NBA Ready now, and the fact is Jevon Carter is more NBA-Ready, (as evidenced by his steadily improved numbers throughout the season last year) than Melton.

What do Carter, Johnson, and Jerome have in common?? All were upperclassmen upon entering the draft-NBA Ready players now.

I think Sarver, actually, has had enough; he likely set an ultimatum, by tell Jones "Field an NBA-competitive team--NOW--or everyone is fired!!" OK, not that dramatic, but seriously, he likely had a hand in the direction we took--no more sub-30 win seasons--make us competitive--NOW!! You have your developmental-draft guys already in Bridges and Ayton, (and now Lecque)--get 'players' not 'projects'.

I must say, that is what this off-season has been all about, and while I don't think we are anywhere near a playoff team, I don't think we will be an embarrassment, either.

I don't think this is Sarver laying down the law, I think this is James' Jones philosophy. Its a San Antonio Spurs approach to team building and player development. There is no point in drafting promising rookies if you do not have a team culture designed to develop those rookies. Our revolving door for coaches, and sometimes 6 and 7 players 21 and under was an environment ideal for rookie failure, and we saw it. The Clippers of the 1980's and 1990's were exactly the same.

You have to build a culture and then bring the young guys into it selectively. They have decided to build around Booker, Ayton, Bridges, and Oubre (if they sign him), which is the only reasonable thing to do.

2 points:

1) If you are correct,and this is mostly Jones, then outstanding...and

2) If this is mostly James Jones philosophy, why are so many fans here upset...especially after it's evidenced, that this other approach has not worked for the last 7-8 years.

Trying something different philosophically different is at least worth trying...it's not like we could be any worse. I'm sorry, but a team with talents like Booker, Ayton, and honestly, Oubre, in no universe, should win less than 20 games in a season. And with Bridges, and now a PG, like Rubio, who honestly, doesn't thrill me, but at least is a huge step forward; this team should easily win 35 games next season, providing the key players stay healthy.

I have no idea how good of a 'mentor' Rubio is, but wow, what blessing for Lecque to be in the same locker room with 'true PG'.