ATL: DeMarcus Cousins blows out ACL, pg 89

[Bucksfan28]

Heart skipped a beat when I saw the "Bertans waived" headline. It skipped two when I saw that the better Bertans got traded to the Wiz

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Happy for Jabari. He's not a bad kid, just delusional. Maybe he turned a bit of a corner after getting dropped from another team.

Never understood how this board judges a player:

Larry Sanders: Abused animals, abused members of the general public, abused team mates, violated league rules to the point of missing dozens of games (I think pot should be legal but its in his contract not to smoke...so don't), quit on the team.....
First 2 months after quitting: Hope he comes back!!!

Jabari Parker: Delusional on the defensive end/overall ability, loves Milwaukee and did a lot of community service.
This guy would destroy team chemistry, wouldn't want him back on the minimum!!!

Fans will generally root for the players who help their team win. Sanders at one point was a really dominant force to that end. Parker never came close to that kind of impact.

Jabari was just as dominant on the offensive end and Sanders was just as atrocious on the offensive end as Jabari was on the defensive end. At 21, Jabari was putting up 21/6 on 56%TS on limited minutes coming off injury. That is pretty dominant on the offensive side of the court. Both were really flawed players.

Jabari had the stigma of being the 2nd pick. Sanders sucked and was written off the first 2 years and looked bad the 3rd year summer league before having one good season at age 24. Expectations were lower for Sanders and this board never gave Jabari slack for having 2 years derailed due to injuries. Healthy and with a good coach, he would've been a decent player.

Sanders never helped us win anything but stole money from us. Jabari never got to that point.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sandela01.html

[ReasonablySober]

Never understood how this board judges a player:

Larry Sanders: Abused animals, abused members of the general public, abused team mates, violated league rules to the point of missing dozens of games (I think pot should be legal but its in his contract not to smoke...so don't), quit on the team.....
First 2 months after quitting: Hope he comes back!!!

Jabari Parker: Delusional on the defensive end/overall ability, loves Milwaukee and did a lot of community service.
This guy would destroy team chemistry, wouldn't want him back on the minimum!!!

Fans will generally root for the players who help their team win. Sanders at one point was a really dominant force to that end. Parker never came close to that kind of impact.

Jabari was just as dominant on the offensive end and Sanders was just as atrocious on the offensive end as Jabari was on the defensive end. At 21, Jabari was putting up 21/6 on 56%TS on limited minutes coming off injury. That is pretty dominant on the offensive side of the court. Both were really flawed players.

Jabari had the stigma of being the 2nd pick. Sanders sucked and was written off the first 2 years and looked bad the 3rd year summer league before having one good season at age 24. Expectations were lower for Sanders and this board never gave Jabari slack for having 2 years derailed due to injuries. Healthy and with a good coach, he would've been a decent player.

Sanders never helped us win anything but stole money from us. Jabari never got to that point.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sandela01.html

Yea, lost me right there.

[jakecronus8]

Never understood how this board judges a player:

Larry Sanders: Abused animals, abused members of the general public, abused team mates, violated league rules to the point of missing dozens of games (I think pot should be legal but its in his contract not to smoke...so don't), quit on the team.....
First 2 months after quitting: Hope he comes back!!!

Jabari Parker: Delusional on the defensive end/overall ability, loves Milwaukee and did a lot of community service.
This guy would destroy team chemistry, wouldn't want him back on the minimum!!!

Fans will generally root for the players who help their team win. Sanders at one point was a really dominant force to that end. Parker never came close to that kind of impact.

Jabari was just as dominant on the offensive end and Sanders was just as atrocious on the offensive end as Jabari was on the defensive end. At 21, Jabari was putting up 21/6 on 56%TS on limited minutes coming off injury. That is pretty dominant on the offensive side of the court. Both were really flawed players.

Jabari had the stigma of being the 2nd pick. Sanders sucked and was written off the first 2 years and looked bad the 3rd year summer league before having one good season at age 24. Expectations were lower for Sanders and this board never gave Jabari slack for having 2 years derailed due to injuries. Healthy and with a good coach, he would've been a decent player.

Sanders never helped us win anything but stole money from us. Jabari never got to that point.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/sandela01.html

Not even close. Jabari has the worst defensive awareness I’ve ever seen in a basketball player. Goes into a coma when the ball isn’t directly in front of him.

I was a Jabari skeptic from day one. At the end I turned on him completely when he quit on the team in the playoffs. We lost in 7 and he blatantly tanked it in two of those games after pouting about not starting and playing time. Also never took his rehab seriously and just generally seemed aloof.

Sanders on the other hand was indeed a douche bag off the court. On the court, there’s probably not many teammates who would prefer Jabari to him.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Not even close. Jabari has the worst defensive awareness I’ve ever seen in a basketball player. Goes into a coma when the ball isn’t directly in front of him.

I was a Jabari skeptic from day one. At the end I turned on him completely when he quit on the team in the playoffs. We lost in 7 and he blatantly tanked it in two of those games after pouting about not starting and playing time. Also never took his rehab seriously and just generally seemed aloof.

Sanders on the other hand was indeed a douche bag off the court. On the court, there’s probably not many teammates who would prefer Jabari to him.

Just to be clear, my stance is more about me doubting that Sanders is a basketball player on a winning team. (I don't think Jabari is a key player on a winning team, either). Sanders had one above average season where he averaged 27 min on a 38-win team. This was his PRIME-70 games of above average basketball. But yeah, he was a headcase who would get ejected and give thumbs up to the refs to show restraint. He had punched team mates, abused animals, couldn't follow team rules, and literally quit the team and expected to be paid. He didn't take 3 plays off....He literally quit the team and expected to be paid 44m dollars. Great player to have on the team. He should be the most hated Buck of all-time.

Also, Jabari looked pretty good coming back from the first injury. He looked BETTER athletically coming back and there were a ton of fluff pieces on his rehab with Suki. I do think there was some displacement of his anger of getting injured the second time and placing it on the Bucks with the mindset they rushed him back too soon/not rehabbed properly.

Sorry to derail this thread, I just hate Sanders with a passion. He set the team back a couple years.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Does Toronto retire Leonard's jersey?

[JayMKE]

Does Toronto retire Leonard's jersey?

only reason they have a ring so yeah

[DingleJerry]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

[paulpressey25]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

And GSW wants to retire Iggy's.

Their call, but think they are going overboard.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

What's your requirements for jersey retirement? I would think KD would fill that based on rings, all-nba teams, etc.

Giannis would be really close right now for me: MVP, couple all-NBA teams, top 5 rebounder/blocks; close to top 10 in asts/points. A finals appearance probably would've out him over the top for me. After next year, he has enough boxscore stats and hopefully enough post-season wins to seal it for me.

[DingleJerry]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

And GSW wants to retire Iggy's.

Their call, but think they are going overboard.

Yea let's say he'd been a GSW lifer as a role player and then all this came together for the titles. Sure, ok. But he was there short term too.

On the topic, Collison for OKC? It's been announced. I assume Haslem will get his in Miami too but I don't recall if they've said it.

[DingleJerry]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

What's your requirements for jersey retirement? I would think KD would fill that based on rings, all-nba teams, etc.

Giannis would be really close right now for me: MVP, couple all-NBA teams, top 5 rebounder/blocks; close to top 10 in asts/points. A finals appearance probably would've out him over the top for me. After next year, he has enough boxscore stats and hopefully enough post-season wins to seal it for me.

I'd say a baseline minimum to me would be playing at least 6-7ish years for the team. Just can't get behind 3 years. Maybe for an all timer like him I'd flex down a bit, but 3 years I don't think I can get there. On that topic, LBJ only did 4 in Miami and got 2 titles. I'd guess they'll do it since they did Bosh and did another player who never even played for their team though.

[Ron Swanson]

Don't care that he was the reason they won a title. Retiring the jersey of a guy that spent one season with your franchise is an all-time "lame as ****" move. Hell, I'm even a bit indifferent on whether we should have retired Oscar's number, and he spent what? 4-5 seasons in Milwaukee?

[RRyder823]

When a team retires a jersey number the player should almost be synonymous with the team imo and played at a HoF level for that team for 5-7 years minimum. Jordan is a Bull. Kobe is a Laker. Russel is a Celtic. Really Kareem is pretty much is the only exception I can think of.

As a cross sport example Woodson was probably my favorite Packers player in the past 15 years. He's a HoFer, won a DoPY award and a Super Bowl..... Should GB retire his number? Nope

Sent from my SM-G892A using RealGM mobile app

[jakecronus8]

Numbers should never be retired. Teams should just be very selective when they assign them. Jerseys can be hung and honored in arenas but that should also be very rare. I hate Kareem but in my eyes he’s the only Buck whose Jersey should hang until Giannis retires.

[BJ Sandered]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

And GSW wants to retire Iggy's.

Their call, but think they are going overboard.

Yeah, what's with all this recent crazy amount of retire jersey nonsense? I don't understand why some of these numbers should be retired with some of these teams in general, and retiring a jersey of an active player is just weird.

[jschligs]

I don't think they should, I also don't think GSW should for KD. I guess I'm just a stickler when it comes to retiring jerseys.

And GSW wants to retire Iggy's.

Their call, but think they are going overboard.

Yeah, what's with all this recent crazy amount of retire jersey nonsense? I don't understand why some of these numbers should be retired with some of these teams in general, and retiring a jersey of an active player is just weird.

It’s just like rushing the court in college basketball, it’s becoming way overdone.

[MVP2110]

I actually have no problem with the Warriors wanting to retire anyone from the core of their team the last few years. That was one of the best runs of Basketball we'll ever see. I also don't mind if the Raptors retire Kawhi's #, He is the reason they won a Championship. This coming from someone who thinks the Bucks have way too many jerseys retired

[chonestown]

Retiring numbers is a nice touch, but would be more impactful imo to inter the body [or ashes] of the honored in some sort of mausoleum within the arena. Would present interesting branding opportunities within Fiserv and perhaps reduce the sting of luxury tax payments. LED taps a new revenue stream and future Bucks are not doomed to wear goofy-ass numbers like 61. A flawless plan.

"Honey, I have to go to the restroom."
"Okay, I'll meet you by the Northwestern Mutual Repository of Champions."

Tell me you don't get chills picturing the scene.

[theFireBlanket]

Numbers should never be retired. Teams should just be very selective when they assign them. Jerseys can be hung and honored in arenas but that should also be very rare. I hate Kareem but in my eyes he’s the only Buck whose Jersey should hang until Giannis retires.

But not Oscar? Strange.