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What are your expectations for the season?

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What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#1 » by NatiboyB » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:25 pm

Don't shoot me drastic take upcoming. I am not looking for nothing out of this season outside of coach establishing a culture and player development. I really would like to get a player like Steven Adams however. I know team's aren't valuing non-big man shooter but having a tough player like him and hopefully bringing back Nwaba helps improve the effort of others...

Now my second hot take why don't we throw expiring's at the T-wovles for Andrew Wiggins and hope that coach can motivate Wiggins to improve. His contract is horrible but he does have "physical tools" and even if he doesn't work out we won't win much to the point of being on the treadmill.

Current Roster:

C:Thompson/Henson/Zizic
PF: Love/Nance/
SF: Osman/Windler
SG: Sexton?/Clarkson/Porter
PG: Garland/Knight/Delladova

team I would like to start the season with

C:Adams/Zizic
PF: Love/Nance/
SF: Wiggins/Osman/Windler/Nwaba
SG: Sexton/Clarkson/Porter
PG: Garland/Knight

Trades:
Andrew Wiggins for Tristan Thompson/Matthew Delladova

JR Smith/John Henson for Steven Adams
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#2 » by jbk1234 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 3:05 am

A few things: The Cavs are not going back into the repeater tax for any trade like this. If they can get a lightly protected first, or really good prospect, they might trade JR. Otherwise, he's getting cut.

Wiggins has had three coaches try to motivate him. He's essentially a lazier, less efficient, version of Jordan Clarkson on a four-year deal making twice as much money with a much worse handle. We also just drafted four guards in the first round over the last two years, and despite the fact he has the perfect frame for SF, he's too soft to play the position well. We're taking a chance on KPJ for 1/30th of the salary. Let some other team talk themselves into motivating a player who never should've gotten that contract.

If the Cavs are trading for the second year of Adam's deal, they should be compensated. The center market is in the process of re-setting and Adams is making twice the going rate. I don't dislike Adams but I'd rather see if we can get a younger guy who has more lateral speed, or who is actually making the current market value.

But the biggest problem is the team is probably good enough for us just to miss the playoffs and convey our pick. This isn't the year for us to go all in. We hired a developmental coach for a reason.



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It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#3 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:31 pm

jbk1234 wrote:A few things: The Cavs are not going back into the repeater tax for any trade like this. If they can get a lightly protected first, or really good prospect, they might trade JR. Otherwise, he's getting cut.

Wiggins has had three coaches try to motivate him. He's essentially a lazier, less efficient, version of Jordan Clarkson on a four-year deal making twice as much money with a much worse handle. We also just drafted four guards in the first round over the last two years, and despite the fact he has the perfect frame for SF, he's too soft to play the position well. We're taking a chance on KPJ for 1/30th of the salary. Let some other team talk themselves into motivating a player who never should've gotten that contract.

If the Cavs are trading for the second year of Adam's deal, they should be compensated. The center market is in the process of re-setting and Adams is making twice the going rate. I don't dislike Adams but I'd rather see if we can get a younger guy who has more lateral speed, or who is actually making the current market value.

But the biggest problem is the team is probably good enough for us just to miss the playoffs and convey our pick. This isn't the year for us to go all in. We hired a developmental coach for a reason.



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My expectations is that with the team as is, including any non-Love trades, that if Love remains mostly healthy this season that the Cavs end up just missing the playoffs and conveying the pick. I'm perfectly fine with that result as well because that means that our players improved throughout the year and that Beilein can coach in the NBA. With all the young players already on roster, I don't know if adding yet another top 10 pick would really make much difference unless we got a top 2-3 pick, which could still happen if we just miss the playoffs, look at all the teams that jumped this year.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#4 » by jbk1234 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:43 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:A few things: The Cavs are not going back into the repeater tax for any trade like this. If they can get a lightly protected first, or really good prospect, they might trade JR. Otherwise, he's getting cut.

Wiggins has had three coaches try to motivate him. He's essentially a lazier, less efficient, version of Jordan Clarkson on a four-year deal making twice as much money with a much worse handle. We also just drafted four guards in the first round over the last two years, and despite the fact he has the perfect frame for SF, he's too soft to play the position well. We're taking a chance on KPJ for 1/30th of the salary. Let some other team talk themselves into motivating a player who never should've gotten that contract.

If the Cavs are trading for the second year of Adam's deal, they should be compensated. The center market is in the process of re-setting and Adams is making twice the going rate. I don't dislike Adams but I'd rather see if we can get a younger guy who has more lateral speed, or who is actually making the current market value.

But the biggest problem is the team is probably good enough for us just to miss the playoffs and convey our pick. This isn't the year for us to go all in. We hired a developmental coach for a reason.



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My expectations is that with the team as is, including any non-Love trades, that if Love remains mostly healthy this season that the Cavs end up just missing the playoffs and conveying the pick. I'm perfectly fine with that result as well because that means that our players improved throughout the year and that Beilein can coach in the NBA. With all the young players already on roster, I don't know if adding yet another top 10 pick would really make much difference unless we got a top 2-3 pick, which could still happen if we just miss the playoffs, look at all the teams that jumped this year.


If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#5 » by Stillwater » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:37 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:A few things: The Cavs are not going back into the repeater tax for any trade like this. If they can get a lightly protected first, or really good prospect, they might trade JR. Otherwise, he's getting cut.

Wiggins has had three coaches try to motivate him. He's essentially a lazier, less efficient, version of Jordan Clarkson on a four-year deal making twice as much money with a much worse handle. We also just drafted four guards in the first round over the last two years, and despite the fact he has the perfect frame for SF, he's too soft to play the position well. We're taking a chance on KPJ for 1/30th of the salary. Let some other team talk themselves into motivating a player who never should've gotten that contract.

If the Cavs are trading for the second year of Adam's deal, they should be compensated. The center market is in the process of re-setting and Adams is making twice the going rate. I don't dislike Adams but I'd rather see if we can get a younger guy who has more lateral speed, or who is actually making the current market value.

But the biggest problem is the team is probably good enough for us just to miss the playoffs and convey our pick. This isn't the year for us to go all in. We hired a developmental coach for a reason.



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My expectations is that with the team as is, including any non-Love trades, that if Love remains mostly healthy this season that the Cavs end up just missing the playoffs and conveying the pick. I'm perfectly fine with that result as well because that means that our players improved throughout the year and that Beilein can coach in the NBA. With all the young players already on roster, I don't know if adding yet another top 10 pick would really make much difference unless we got a top 2-3 pick, which could still happen if we just miss the playoffs, look at all the teams that jumped this year.


If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.

Yeah Cavs are not making any big trades and cetainly wouldn't try to turn one of the worst contracts in the league into a player worth that contract when they have had ample time in the league and are still the exact same less than worth the contract player.
I don't see any point in any team having interest in Wiggins at tis point and would be shocked if he got another contract unless he actually does suddenly become one of those guys that was sleepwalking early in their career.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#6 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:38 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:A few things: The Cavs are not going back into the repeater tax for any trade like this. If they can get a lightly protected first, or really good prospect, they might trade JR. Otherwise, he's getting cut.

Wiggins has had three coaches try to motivate him. He's essentially a lazier, less efficient, version of Jordan Clarkson on a four-year deal making twice as much money with a much worse handle. We also just drafted four guards in the first round over the last two years, and despite the fact he has the perfect frame for SF, he's too soft to play the position well. We're taking a chance on KPJ for 1/30th of the salary. Let some other team talk themselves into motivating a player who never should've gotten that contract.

If the Cavs are trading for the second year of Adam's deal, they should be compensated. The center market is in the process of re-setting and Adams is making twice the going rate. I don't dislike Adams but I'd rather see if we can get a younger guy who has more lateral speed, or who is actually making the current market value.

But the biggest problem is the team is probably good enough for us just to miss the playoffs and convey our pick. This isn't the year for us to go all in. We hired a developmental coach for a reason.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app


My expectations is that with the team as is, including any non-Love trades, that if Love remains mostly healthy this season that the Cavs end up just missing the playoffs and conveying the pick. I'm perfectly fine with that result as well because that means that our players improved throughout the year and that Beilein can coach in the NBA. With all the young players already on roster, I don't know if adding yet another top 10 pick would really make much difference unless we got a top 2-3 pick, which could still happen if we just miss the playoffs, look at all the teams that jumped this year.


If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.


Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#7 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:40 pm

Stillwater wrote:Yeah Cavs are not making any big trades and cetainly wouldn't try to turn one of the worst contracts in the league into a player worth that contract when they have had ample time in the league and are still the exact same less than worth the contract player.
I don't see any point in any team having interest in Wiggins at tis point and would be shocked if he got another contract unless he actually does suddenly become one of those guys that was sleepwalking early in their career.


Wiggins will get another contract simply because he can put the ball in the bucket, but his next contract won't be anything close to a max. Maybe a 10-11 mil/yr contract similar to the level of TJ Warren. Having a bench scorer, even if it's not the most efficient, is still valuable in the NBA.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#8 » by Stillwater » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:40 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
My expectations is that with the team as is, including any non-Love trades, that if Love remains mostly healthy this season that the Cavs end up just missing the playoffs and conveying the pick. I'm perfectly fine with that result as well because that means that our players improved throughout the year and that Beilein can coach in the NBA. With all the young players already on roster, I don't know if adding yet another top 10 pick would really make much difference unless we got a top 2-3 pick, which could still happen if we just miss the playoffs, look at all the teams that jumped this year.


If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.


Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.

OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#9 » by jbk1234 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:54 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
My expectations is that with the team as is, including any non-Love trades, that if Love remains mostly healthy this season that the Cavs end up just missing the playoffs and conveying the pick. I'm perfectly fine with that result as well because that means that our players improved throughout the year and that Beilein can coach in the NBA. With all the young players already on roster, I don't know if adding yet another top 10 pick would really make much difference unless we got a top 2-3 pick, which could still happen if we just miss the playoffs, look at all the teams that jumped this year.


If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.


Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.


See the problem is that the most common play in the NBA is the 1/5 high PNR so if they're dragging Adams out to the three point line, and they will, I'm not sure he's better suited to be out there than Nance or even TT.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#10 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:54 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.


Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.

OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.


I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#11 » by Stillwater » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:56 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Yeah Cavs are not making any big trades and cetainly wouldn't try to turn one of the worst contracts in the league into a player worth that contract when they have had ample time in the league and are still the exact same less than worth the contract player.
I don't see any point in any team having interest in Wiggins at tis point and would be shocked if he got another contract unless he actually does suddenly become one of those guys that was sleepwalking early in their career.


Wiggins will get another contract simply because he can put the ball in the bucket, but his next contract won't be anything close to a max. Maybe a 10-11 mil/yr contract similar to the level of TJ Warren. Having a bench scorer, even if it's not the most efficient, is still valuable in the NBA.

If he doesn't improve he may not last the length of the contract he is on.
It will be interesting how long he continues to get the usage , because despite having the ability to go and score, his effort is bad defensively 90% of the time, and worse his effort offensively never extends beyond pacing himself.
I would be up in his grill all day if I had access. He has all the **** talent in the world with proto size elite athleticism and bbiq yet has zero motivation to dominate which is absolutely the biggest head scratcher I can think of in the last 10 seasons.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#12 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:56 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
If people want to take on an extra year of salary to arguably bump up the role player talent on the roster from C- to C+/B-, I guess I understand that. I disagree and think you're doing it a year early, but I understand it.

What I don't understand is any discussion regarding Wiggins. That's just crazy talk to me. Guys like Dipo and Danny Green are very, very rare statistically. Usually if you're not good after five NBA seasons, you just not good.


Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.


See the problem is that the most common play in the NBA is the 1/5 high PNR so if they're dragging Adams out to the three point line, and they will, I'm not sure he's better suited to be out there than Nance or even TT.


Which is fair and I'm happy just running it back with our current roster and letting everyone just expiring unless good trades come up at the deadline.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#13 » by jbk1234 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:57 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.

OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.


I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.


Yeah, I'm definitely getting off the train if we're taking back Schroder and his second year. That's all kinds of bad. Can you imagine Clarkson, Sexton, and Schroder letting anyone else on the team shoot? Plus, I suspect that leaves both teams in the tax. I think the Cavs are a couple million over the tax line if they just cut JR.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#14 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:58 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Yeah Cavs are not making any big trades and cetainly wouldn't try to turn one of the worst contracts in the league into a player worth that contract when they have had ample time in the league and are still the exact same less than worth the contract player.
I don't see any point in any team having interest in Wiggins at tis point and would be shocked if he got another contract unless he actually does suddenly become one of those guys that was sleepwalking early in their career.


Wiggins will get another contract simply because he can put the ball in the bucket, but his next contract won't be anything close to a max. Maybe a 10-11 mil/yr contract similar to the level of TJ Warren. Having a bench scorer, even if it's not the most efficient, is still valuable in the NBA.

If he doesn't improve he may not last the length of the contract he is on.
It will be interesting how long he continues to get the usage , because despite having the ability to go and score, his effort is bad defensively 90% of the time, and worse his effort offensively never extends beyond pacing himself.
I would be up in his grill all day if I had access. He has all the **** talent in the world with proto size elite athleticism and bbiq yet has zero motivation to dominate which is absolutely the biggest head scratcher I can think of in the last 10 seasons.


Maybe he just doesn't like Minnesota? It could just be he's not happy in his situation and needs a change of scenery, I just don't want the Cavs to be that team that gives it to him. Let someone like the Knicks, Raptors, etc give him a chance. Honestly I could see the Raptors possibly being a good fit. Let him go back to playing in Canada, maybe it'll get him motivated again.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#15 » by Stillwater » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:59 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Yeah Wiggins is a no-go in my book. Personally I'm not a huge fan of bringing in Adams either, but if it's only going to costs us like TT & Henson or something along those lines, then I say make the trade. His size and defense around the the basket will work with Love better than Nance as the starting center and we can have Nance get minutes at both PF and C as he's working on extending his range to the 3pt line. I just want our young players to be playing meaningful basketball and not feel like they are being in a position to fail due to a desire to tank for a better pick. I think that sets a bad precedent and will make it harder when they do decide it's time to win.

OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.


I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.

Does this factor in how much OKC needs to drop to get below the repeater themselves? If it does, I get it.
I just don't see OKC being the best landing spot for CLE to move Smith even though OKC is absolutely calling about his unique deal
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#16 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:00 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.


I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.


Yeah, I'm definitely getting off the train if we're taking back Schroder and his second year. That's all kinds of bad. Can you imagine Clarkson, Sexton, and Schroder letting anyone else on the team shoot? Plus, I suspect that leaves both teams in the tax. I think the Cavs are a couple million over the tax line if they just cut JR.


I think the Cavs were like 1 mil under the Tax if they cut JR before the extended deadline, so who knows about now. This would keep the Cavs over the tax number currently, but by making the trade where Knight is moved out as well, the Cavs are in a position where a simple waive & stretch or buyout could get them under it. I also think Clarkson would end up on his way out if Schroeder was brought in which could be another place they could save a few million in a trade.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#17 » by Stillwater » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:00 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Wiggins will get another contract simply because he can put the ball in the bucket, but his next contract won't be anything close to a max. Maybe a 10-11 mil/yr contract similar to the level of TJ Warren. Having a bench scorer, even if it's not the most efficient, is still valuable in the NBA.

If he doesn't improve he may not last the length of the contract he is on.
It will be interesting how long he continues to get the usage , because despite having the ability to go and score, his effort is bad defensively 90% of the time, and worse his effort offensively never extends beyond pacing himself.
I would be up in his grill all day if I had access. He has all the **** talent in the world with proto size elite athleticism and bbiq yet has zero motivation to dominate which is absolutely the biggest head scratcher I can think of in the last 10 seasons.


Maybe he just doesn't like Minnesota? It could just be he's not happy in his situation and needs a change of scenery, I just don't want the Cavs to be that team that gives it to him. Let someone like the Knicks, Raptors, etc give him a chance. Honestly I could see the Raptors possibly being a good fit. Let him go back to playing in Canada, maybe it'll get him motivated again.

He signed that extention I mean he could have moved on already.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#18 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 10:00 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.


I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.

Does this factor in how much OKC needs to drop to get below the repeater themselves? If it does, I get it.
I just don't see OKC being the best landing spot for CLE to move Smith even though OKC is absolutely calling about his unique deal


Using the Shamsports Capulator it looks like they are currently only about 400k over the Luxury line. Make the above trade and waiving JR puts them about 2.8 mil under the luxury tax. For Cleveland this trade puts them at about 5.8 mil over the tax line. For some reason any trade with getting KPJ on the Cavs moves it to next year's salary not this years. So the Cavs would still be able to get under it fairly easily with a few trades of players like Clarkson and Henson or waive and stretching one even.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#19 » by Revenged25 » Fri Jul 12, 2019 10:06 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:OKC isn't trading Adams to CLE without getting the salary cap savings from Smith and so the salary of a Adams returning puts us back in the repeater and requires another move by Altman some time during the season to get back under it and unless they have a trade in place it all just seems less than worth the bother.


I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.


Yeah, I'm definitely getting off the train if we're taking back Schroder and his second year. That's all kinds of bad. Can you imagine Clarkson, Sexton, and Schroder letting anyone else on the team shoot? Plus, I suspect that leaves both teams in the tax. I think the Cavs are a couple million over the tax line if they just cut JR.


If the Cavs got Schroeder in this deal I would expect Clarkson to be out the door as he'd be easier to move than having to append assets to Schroeder. Though looking at the trade more, Cleveland would likely be able to get a future protected 1st out of it as well. This trade though using the Capulator would put OKC under the tax by about 2.8 mil. The Cavs would be about 5.8 mil over but trading Clarkson could find some cap saving as well as looking to buyout Henson and/or Delly if not outright waive/stretching them. Plenty of opportunities to still make sure they get under the luxury line before end of the year.
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Re: What are your expectations for the season? 

Post#20 » by Stillwater » Sat Jul 13, 2019 12:23 am

Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
I think there might be a deal still in place where the Cavs can limit their exposure to the luxury tax while still providing OKC some relief this year as well as further relief going forward. For example:

Cavs Trade:
Tristan Thompson
JR Smith
Brandon Knight
Total: $49,862,880 ($38.6 mil after waiving JR)

OKC Trade:
Steven Adams
Dennis Schroeder
Total: $41,342,697

Cavs technically take back 8 mil less in salary, but OKC actually ends up dropping 3 mil in salary after waiving JR and saves $43 million the following year in salary. This will make it easier for the Cavs to maneuver to stay under the luxury tax while providing significant cap relief to OKC in the future, though only minor relief immediately unless buyouts/additional trades are worked out from there.

I think that would be a good trade for both sides.


Yeah, I'm definitely getting off the train if we're taking back Schroder and his second year. That's all kinds of bad. Can you imagine Clarkson, Sexton, and Schroder letting anyone else on the team shoot? Plus, I suspect that leaves both teams in the tax. I think the Cavs are a couple million over the tax line if they just cut JR.


If the Cavs got Schroeder in this deal I would expect Clarkson to be out the door as he'd be easier to move than having to append assets to Schroeder. Though looking at the trade more, Cleveland would likely be able to get a future protected 1st out of it as well. This trade though using the Capulator would put OKC under the tax by about 2.8 mil. The Cavs would be about 5.8 mil over but trading Clarkson could find some cap saving as well as looking to buyout Henson and/or Delly if not outright waive/stretching them. Plenty of opportunities to still make sure they get under the luxury line before end of the year.


Not sure I'm understanding why CLE would want to eat Schroeder at all , definitely not to get Adams while losing TT for nothing
and only benefitting from Knight being gone that could be dumped at the dl anyway along with TT.
If a trade like that happened CLE would have to be getting back draft assets and I highly doubt OKC is interested in paying to get rid of the 2 best players in this trade
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