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Cavs 2019-2020 Regular Season

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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#101 » by Stillwater » Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:50 pm

https://youtu.be/DHVoySsdiTg?t=64
some decent film if unfamiliar with Macura
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#102 » by Richfield » Sun Jul 28, 2019 3:11 am

Stillwater wrote:
Richfield wrote:JP Macura signed to Exhibit 10 with Cavs.

I love that Cavs passed on one dimensional Bender for a more versatile player.

Not sure what he can do with this chance but I do know he's a fun player to watch and root for.

I am impressed with this front office a lot for this move...
Macura is one of the most overlooked solid young players in the league and it comes as no surprise
Charlotte failed to utilize him properly only using him twice... pathetic waste of a roster spot by them.
Those thinking he needs development are wrong. He is already NBA ready back up level player who is solid with no apparent weakness' just is not exceptional at any one thing either otherwise he would have been drafted in 2018.
Macura however was very reliable & was a strong presence in college making smart in game decisions and playing with Delly like tenacity.
Beilein type guy through and through with above avg shooting , cutting and passing tools along with good positional size off ball lateral quickness and decent above the rim pop athleticism and speed grabbing a lot of steals and turning them into transition points.
The biggest knocks on him in the draft imo aside from being a pretty strong draft in 2018, he never added much weight and likely won't with that frame, and he was already older. That being said I have no doubt he will emerge as a rotation player for this roster if they give him the chance.
Love this signing


Probably just semantics of how I'm reading it versus how you meant it, but there are plenty of areas he can develop and improve in. He can tighten up his handles for one. Get stronger and learn how to use it. How's his post game? Lots of little stuff he can and should keep developing. Getting better and developing areas that need improvement is a career long process. The idea that you're either developing or just playing ball is a myth that I think the Cavs have participated in perpetrating over recent years. The best organizations are always focused on developing further for players 1-15 on the roster whether they're competing for titles or not.

But if you're saying he has all around game and a basis to work with in a number of categories I don't disagree with that.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#103 » by Stillwater » Sun Jul 28, 2019 12:13 pm

^ I meant what i said...hes nba ready & doesnt need to be coached up or hit the film room. He can step into a ltd role do his job and help the team learning the system quickly on the fly. he is not a "work in progress"
If want to speak of ceiling and maybe improving further through"development" sure , but that was a given imo ,and overall hes probably maxed out his skill level already so any further refinement wont be very evident in the box score.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#104 » by JonFromVA » Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:14 pm

Patience may be a virtue, but it sucks we have to wait to see what we've got in Garland and Porter Jr.

It's not a stretch to imagine Darius would have been the top PG prospect in the draft if he didn't get hurt, but it's just really rough to try to extrapolate that based on just 4.5-games.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#105 » by Stillwater » Thu Aug 1, 2019 1:20 am

JonFromVA wrote:Patience may be a virtue, but it sucks we have to wait to see what we've got in Garland and Porter Jr.

It's not a stretch to imagine Darius would have been the top PG prospect in the draft if he didn't get hurt, but it's just really rough to try to extrapolate that based on just 4.5-games.

I think it's pretty obvious the Front Office feels Garland is a good enough shooter regardless of if other aspects of his game transfer right away or not that he can play off Sexton from day 1. I also think they are hoping his playmaking ability is good enough they can use him in that lead ball handler role interchangeably knowing Sexton can also play off ball evident from time's he did well off ball last season.
KPJ needs some time probably , but I also would not be surprised if he gets plenty of PT along with interchanging rotations with Windler,Cedi and KPJ all rotating around between 2/3 and some 4 for Cedi
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#106 » by jbk1234 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 12:22 pm

Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:Patience may be a virtue, but it sucks we have to wait to see what we've got in Garland and Porter Jr.

It's not a stretch to imagine Darius would have been the top PG prospect in the draft if he didn't get hurt, but it's just really rough to try to extrapolate that based on just 4.5-games.

I think it's pretty obvious the Front Office feels Garland is a good enough shooter regardless of if other aspects of his game transfer right away or not that he can play off Sexton from day 1. I also think they are hoping his playmaking ability is good enough they can use him in that lead ball handler role interchangeably knowing Sexton can also play off ball evident from time's he did well off ball last season.
KPJ needs some time probably , but I also would not be surprised if he gets plenty of PT along with interchanging rotations with Windler,Cedi and KPJ all rotating around between 2/3 and some 4 for Cedi
Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.

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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#107 » by Stillwater » Thu Aug 1, 2019 12:47 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:Patience may be a virtue, but it sucks we have to wait to see what we've got in Garland and Porter Jr.

It's not a stretch to imagine Darius would have been the top PG prospect in the draft if he didn't get hurt, but it's just really rough to try to extrapolate that based on just 4.5-games.

I think it's pretty obvious the Front Office feels Garland is a good enough shooter regardless of if other aspects of his game transfer right away or not that he can play off Sexton from day 1. I also think they are hoping his playmaking ability is good enough they can use him in that lead ball handler role interchangeably knowing Sexton can also play off ball evident from time's he did well off ball last season.
KPJ needs some time probably , but I also would not be surprised if he gets plenty of PT along with interchanging rotations with Windler,Cedi and KPJ all rotating around between 2/3 and some 4 for Cedi
Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.

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right but they are developing players who will get minutes over him at his optimal assignments defensively because they have better offensive upsides.
Cedi is on his last leg with this roster imo as a potential long term answer at the 3 and if his shot has not dramatically improved this summer i definitely see him losing minutes at the 2/3 to the rooks.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#108 » by jbk1234 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 1:31 pm

Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:I think it's pretty obvious the Front Office feels Garland is a good enough shooter regardless of if other aspects of his game transfer right away or not that he can play off Sexton from day 1. I also think they are hoping his playmaking ability is good enough they can use him in that lead ball handler role interchangeably knowing Sexton can also play off ball evident from time's he did well off ball last season.
KPJ needs some time probably , but I also would not be surprised if he gets plenty of PT along with interchanging rotations with Windler,Cedi and KPJ all rotating around between 2/3 and some 4 for Cedi
Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.

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right but they are developing players who will get minutes over him at his optimal assignments defensively because they have better offensive upsides.
Cedi is on his last leg with this roster imo as a potential long term answer at the 3 and if his shot has not dramatically improved this summer i definitely see him losing minutes at the 2/3 to the rooks.
Worse case scenario, he's a rotation-level defensive wing. With Nwaba gone now, I think fans are about to get a hard look at why they're important to a balanced unit.

Moving your only wing defender to a position he can't play well is dumb and the results will be a layup drill for the other team.

I'm also not sure the Cavs should be gifting rookie big minutes or starting roles at the 3 if they can't defend the position. Part of development should involve playing guys in the role you foresee them playing long term. The Cavs sill never be a playoff team if none of the guys starting 1-3 can defend the position.

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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#109 » by JonFromVA » Thu Aug 1, 2019 2:31 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:Patience may be a virtue, but it sucks we have to wait to see what we've got in Garland and Porter Jr.

It's not a stretch to imagine Darius would have been the top PG prospect in the draft if he didn't get hurt, but it's just really rough to try to extrapolate that based on just 4.5-games.

I think it's pretty obvious the Front Office feels Garland is a good enough shooter regardless of if other aspects of his game transfer right away or not that he can play off Sexton from day 1. I also think they are hoping his playmaking ability is good enough they can use him in that lead ball handler role interchangeably knowing Sexton can also play off ball evident from time's he did well off ball last season.
KPJ needs some time probably , but I also would not be surprised if he gets plenty of PT along with interchanging rotations with Windler,Cedi and KPJ all rotating around between 2/3 and some 4 for Cedi
Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.


And Kevin isn't a Center and doesn't like playing Center, but putting 4 or 5 shooters on the floor is such an effective offensive weapon - Beilein may be tempted to see how it looks and may end up liking how it looks compared to the alternatives.

Heck, asking Windler or Porter Jr to defend SF's at this point in their career is a stretch just like asking Sexton to defend SG's.

We know Beilein values shooting, we just don't know how much it and finding minutes for the kids is going to trump other concerns at this point.

We're just left to guess since we got no crumbs out of Summer league.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#110 » by Stillwater » Thu Aug 1, 2019 3:26 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.

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right but they are developing players who will get minutes over him at his optimal assignments defensively because they have better offensive upsides.
Cedi is on his last leg with this roster imo as a potential long term answer at the 3 and if his shot has not dramatically improved this summer i definitely see him losing minutes at the 2/3 to the rooks.
Worse case scenario, he's a rotation-level defensive wing. With Nwaba gone now, I think fans are about to get a hard look at why they're important to a balanced unit.

Moving your only wing defender to a position he can't play well is dumb and the results will be a layup drill for the other team.

I'm also not sure the Cavs should be gifting rookie big minutes or starting roles at the 3 if they can't defend the position. Part of development should involve playing guys in the role you foresee them playing long term. The Cavs sill never be a playoff team if none of the guys starting 1-3 can defend the position.

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If it were me I would plan to use Cedi in a point forward role on the second unit with shooters around him after the deadline when hopefully bKnight is gone.

I don't like Cedi at the 4 either, but we saw it last year at times due his shooting oh and that word "tank" we all hate.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#111 » by jbk1234 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 5:53 pm

Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:right but they are developing players who will get minutes over him at his optimal assignments defensively because they have better offensive upsides.
Cedi is on his last leg with this roster imo as a potential long term answer at the 3 and if his shot has not dramatically improved this summer i definitely see him losing minutes at the 2/3 to the rooks.
Worse case scenario, he's a rotation-level defensive wing. With Nwaba gone now, I think fans are about to get a hard look at why they're important to a balanced unit.

Moving your only wing defender to a position he can't play well is dumb and the results will be a layup drill for the other team.

I'm also not sure the Cavs should be gifting rookie big minutes or starting roles at the 3 if they can't defend the position. Part of development should involve playing guys in the role you foresee them playing long term. The Cavs sill never be a playoff team if none of the guys starting 1-3 can defend the position.

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If it were me I would plan to use Cedi in a point forward role on the second unit with shooters around him after the deadline when hopefully bKnight is gone.

I don't like Cedi at the 4 either, but we saw it last year at times due his shooting oh and that word "tank" we all hate.
Cedi was at the 4 because Love was hurt, we had already traded Dekker, and we had yet to sign Chriss.

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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#112 » by jbk1234 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 9:32 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:I think it's pretty obvious the Front Office feels Garland is a good enough shooter regardless of if other aspects of his game transfer right away or not that he can play off Sexton from day 1. I also think they are hoping his playmaking ability is good enough they can use him in that lead ball handler role interchangeably knowing Sexton can also play off ball evident from time's he did well off ball last season.
KPJ needs some time probably , but I also would not be surprised if he gets plenty of PT along with interchanging rotations with Windler,Cedi and KPJ all rotating around between 2/3 and some 4 for Cedi
Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.


And Kevin isn't a Center and doesn't like playing Center, but putting 4 or 5 shooters on the floor is such an effective offensive weapon - Beilein may be tempted to see how it looks and may end up liking how it looks compared to the alternatives.

Heck, asking Windler or Porter Jr to defend SF's at this point in their career is a stretch just like asking Sexton to defend SG's.

We know Beilein values shooting, we just don't know how much it and finding minutes for the kids is going to trump other concerns at this point.

We're just left to guess since we got no crumbs out of Summer league.


I think the advantage added by a 5th shooter is far outweighed by the disadvantage of playing three guys out of position and running out the defensive version of the Washington Generals. But's that just me.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#113 » by JonFromVA » Thu Aug 1, 2019 10:08 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.


And Kevin isn't a Center and doesn't like playing Center, but putting 4 or 5 shooters on the floor is such an effective offensive weapon - Beilein may be tempted to see how it looks and may end up liking how it looks compared to the alternatives.

Heck, asking Windler or Porter Jr to defend SF's at this point in their career is a stretch just like asking Sexton to defend SG's.

We know Beilein values shooting, we just don't know how much it and finding minutes for the kids is going to trump other concerns at this point.

We're just left to guess since we got no crumbs out of Summer league.


I think the advantage added by a 5th shooter is far outweighed by the disadvantage of playing three guys out of position and running out the defensive version of the Washington Generals. But's that just me.


That really depends ... how much worse than "Worst of All-Time Defense" could the Cavs get playing guys out of position?

A well constructed team doesn't need a 5th shooter to ignite a spread offense, but you've got to get the opposing C out of the paint somehow. Our PGs can potentially do that by burying 3's whenever the C lays back on a P&R; but then your C better be a serious roll threat or the D will trap/switch and dare your C to do something.

Or you enter the cheat code, drop 5 shooters, and enfuego.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#114 » by substancej » Thu Aug 1, 2019 10:39 pm

In my opinion, even playing Cedi at the 3 is a mistake. So putting him at the 4 means he wouldn't get many rebounds, nor would he be able to play any D on someone like Blake. He's a good oversized 2.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#115 » by JonFromVA » Thu Aug 1, 2019 10:51 pm

substancej wrote:In my opinion, even playing Cedi at the 3 is a mistake. So putting him at the 4 means he wouldn't get many rebounds, nor would he be able to play any D on someone like Blake. He's a good oversized 2.


Sure, when you go small, you invite the other team to try to post you up, but as long as Cedi doesn't foul it's only 2 and we'd be gunning for 3 on the other end of the floor.

I'm just comparing it to last season when we made opponents make a pass or two before they settled for either an open layup or an open 3.

With Longabardi gone, there's a chance we can put together a competent defense and wouldn't have to rely on a gimmick so we'd at least generate some offense; but TBD.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#116 » by Stillwater » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:54 pm

These Cavs are going to be better at moving the ball than we have seen on this roster in a long time. They are going to struggle defensively until the guards get stronger and improve techniques and positioning as well as getting owned in the paint yet again unless Henson gets minutes and does a better job of protecting the rim from what we have gotten lately.
I am not incredibly concerned about the defense on the perimeter yet as I think that Windler and KPJ are athletic enough and fast enough to reach a high level defensively after awhile.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#117 » by JonFromVA » Fri Aug 2, 2019 3:30 pm

Stillwater wrote:These Cavs are going to be better at moving the ball than we have seen on this roster in a long time. They are going to struggle defensively until the guards get stronger and improve techniques and positioning as well as getting owned in the paint yet again unless Henson gets minutes and does a better job of protecting the rim from what we have gotten lately.
I am not incredibly concerned about the defense on the perimeter yet as I think that Windler and KPJ are athletic enough and fast enough to reach a high level defensively after awhile.


Well, they'll sure try. Which players actually fit what Beilein wants to run is tbd.

If they don't quite get it, and we don't clear space; we'll see a lot of the old passing the ball around and nothing happening until someone forces up a contested shot.

Garland and Porter might just be good at that, but ... it's presumably not what we're shooting for.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#118 » by Stillwater » Fri Aug 2, 2019 6:52 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:These Cavs are going to be better at moving the ball than we have seen on this roster in a long time. They are going to struggle defensively until the guards get stronger and improve techniques and positioning as well as getting owned in the paint yet again unless Henson gets minutes and does a better job of protecting the rim from what we have gotten lately.
I am not incredibly concerned about the defense on the perimeter yet as I think that Windler and KPJ are athletic enough and fast enough to reach a high level defensively after awhile.


Well, they'll sure try. Which players actually fit what Beilein wants to run is tbd.

If they don't quite get it, and we don't clear space; we'll see a lot of the old passing the ball around and nothing happening until someone forces up a contested shot.

Garland and Porter might just be good at that, but ... it's presumably not what we're shooting for.

I mean both Garland and KPJ are already iso threats so when the ball is moving they become even more lethal if defenders don't stay attached because of the movement. This will be esp true if Sexton is pushing the pace scoring better in the paint and still hitting long range shots at a 40% clip.I also see Windler as a more than capable ball mover and high IQ presence to help keep the offense moving and not get stifled.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#119 » by JonFromVA » Fri Aug 2, 2019 7:01 pm

Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:These Cavs are going to be better at moving the ball than we have seen on this roster in a long time. They are going to struggle defensively until the guards get stronger and improve techniques and positioning as well as getting owned in the paint yet again unless Henson gets minutes and does a better job of protecting the rim from what we have gotten lately.
I am not incredibly concerned about the defense on the perimeter yet as I think that Windler and KPJ are athletic enough and fast enough to reach a high level defensively after awhile.


Well, they'll sure try. Which players actually fit what Beilein wants to run is tbd.

If they don't quite get it, and we don't clear space; we'll see a lot of the old passing the ball around and nothing happening until someone forces up a contested shot.

Garland and Porter might just be good at that, but ... it's presumably not what we're shooting for.

I mean both Garland and KPJ are already iso threats so when the ball is moving they become even more lethal if defenders don't stay attached because of the movement. This will be esp true if Sexton is pushing the pace scoring better in the paint and still hitting long range shots at a 40% clip.I also see Windler as a more than capable ball mover and high IQ presence to help keep the offense moving and not get stifled.


Yep, that's what I hope to see too, but until we actually do ... it's hard to assume really anything.
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Re: Cavs 2019 off-season 

Post#120 » by gflem » Sat Aug 3, 2019 2:26 am

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Cedi is not a 4. That should be obvious by now. I hate forcing young guys to play out of position.


And Kevin isn't a Center and doesn't like playing Center, but putting 4 or 5 shooters on the floor is such an effective offensive weapon - Beilein may be tempted to see how it looks and may end up liking how it looks compared to the alternatives.

Heck, asking Windler or Porter Jr to defend SF's at this point in their career is a stretch just like asking Sexton to defend SG's.

We know Beilein values shooting, we just don't know how much it and finding minutes for the kids is going to trump other concerns at this point.

We're just left to guess since we got no crumbs out of Summer league.


I think the advantage added by a 5th shooter is far outweighed by the disadvantage of playing three guys out of position and running out the defensive version of the Washington Generals. But's that just me.

I totally agree. Cedi got absolutely destroyed at the 4 last season, and I dont want to see that again. This is really season one of the rebuild, and putting your core players (and yes at this point Cedi is in that category) in a position of assured failure is a very bad idea. This team will be bad enough defensively without playing young guys out of position as is. And as the roster is currently constructed there are more than enough players that can play the 4 without Cedi that I just cant see even considering playing him there.
If the idea is to tank and keep the frp that Atl currently has, that should be easy enough to do just by giving the young guys plenty of run anyway, so playing guys out of position is just a bad idea any way you look at it imo.

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