Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23

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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#141 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Aug 3, 2019 3:49 pm

Jonathan Isaac?
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#142 » by Feel_the_Heat15 » Sat Aug 3, 2019 3:57 pm

twozeroMM wrote:
Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:
twozeroMM wrote:I think it's mostly the eye test, and mostly focused on how skilled he is on the offensive end.
And don't get me wrong, I love Bam and I expect him to be huge for us this year and I think he's going to be a special player.


But he isn't a truly skilled player on the offensive end. Compare Markkanen to Gallinari. Is Gallinari a star? No, but he can facilitate some and is an incredibly efficient shooter. Markkanen's also a negative defender as a big man.

Alright now I know you haven’t really watched him play. He’s a 7 footer who can create off the dribble, a big man with a great shot.


Answer these 2 questions.

Is Markkanen a bad play-maker?

Is it essential for an offensive player to be a good play-maker to be a good player?
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#143 » by twozeroMM » Sat Aug 3, 2019 3:57 pm

The Real Dalic wrote:Jonathan Isaac?

I think Isaac has the potential to be really good, we just haven’t seen enough of what he can do. The Magic need to figure out their big man rotation, because they have too much talent up front and not enough PT for all of them to truly shine.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#144 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Aug 3, 2019 4:31 pm

twozeroMM wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Jonathan Isaac?

I think Isaac has the potential to be really good, we just haven’t seen enough of what he can do. The Magic need to figure out their big man rotation, because they have too much talent up front and not enough PT for all of them to truly shine.

I just don't agree with this. He was the starting SF/PF all year when healthy and was easily the best defender on the Magic. His DPOY potential is unreal. He's at the very least much better than Robinson, Shamet, and I'm forgetting the other guy in the 20's. . . And that's being generous. He should be in the top 10-15.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#145 » by UcanUwill » Sat Aug 3, 2019 4:42 pm

Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:
Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:
But he isn't a truly skilled player on the offensive end. Compare Markkanen to Gallinari. Is Gallinari a star? No, but he can facilitate some and is an incredibly efficient shooter. Markkanen's also a negative defender as a big man.


Hes not skilled? He is 7 feet who can handle the ball, shoot, post up and opposite to contrary belief, plays decent defense. You are so wack on this its crazy, would probably take Tyson Chandler over Dirk because of some advanced stats.



Is Markkanen a better offensive player than Buddy Hield?


He definitely has more potential, Hield is more efficient player right now, I love Hield, he is amazing shooter. But guess what, Markennen is young growing into franchise player status, these type of players need time to catch up efficiently and in some advanced metrics compared to garbage bucket getters who translate well to the league right away, but remain limited in their ability to dynamically help their team. One is Markanenn and one is Bam, I am not arguing that Markannen is ready to lead a team, but his upside and ability to impact the game is much higher than Bams, I think lauri overall is underrated in this list the most.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#146 » by BoogieTime » Sat Aug 3, 2019 5:28 pm

ILikeLollies wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:Simmons not on this list is insanity

Edit NVM


If they stretched it out a couple of months he'd be #1 and will be until he retires.

Nope. LImited player
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#147 » by Feel_the_Heat15 » Sat Aug 3, 2019 5:42 pm

UcanUwill wrote:
Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:
Hes not skilled? He is 7 feet who can handle the ball, shoot, post up and opposite to contrary belief, plays decent defense. You are so wack on this its crazy, would probably take Tyson Chandler over Dirk because of some advanced stats.



Is Markkanen a better offensive player than Buddy Hield?


He definitely has more potential, Hield is more efficient player right now, I love Hield, he is amazing shooter. But guess what, Markennen is young growing into franchise player status, these type of players need time to catch up efficiently and in some advanced metrics compared to garbage bucket getters who translate well to the league right away, but remain limited in their ability to dynamically help their team. One is Markanenn and one is Bam, I am not arguing that Markannen is ready to lead a team, but his upside and ability to impact the game is much higher than Bams, I think lauri overall is underrated in this list the most.


Which players on the Heat's roster last season would you say was a better player than Markkanen?
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#148 » by Johnny Firpo » Sat Aug 3, 2019 5:48 pm

The Real Dalic wrote:Jonathan Isaac?


Isaac has insane potential, if the list would have been about ceiling, I'm sure he would have been on it. His production yet to materialize in any significant way, and you know this. ;)
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#149 » by Tomazan » Sat Aug 3, 2019 6:18 pm

Zion at no.2... What the actual F?
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#150 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Aug 3, 2019 6:26 pm

Johnny Firpo wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Jonathan Isaac?


Isaac has insane potential, if the list would have been about ceiling, I'm sure he would have been on it. His production yet to materialize in any significant way, and you know this. ;)

You might need to turn on a Magic game from time to time. His impact on the defensive end is huge.

Also, if it wasn't about potential, then Zion, Ja Morant, RJ Barrett, etc, wouldn't be on this list.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#151 » by Johnny Firpo » Sat Aug 3, 2019 6:30 pm

The Real Dalic wrote:Also, if it wasn't about potential, then Zion, Ja Morant, RJ Barrett, etc. wouldn't be on this list.


I have watched plenty of Magic games, Isaac is an extremely limited player right now, or at least he as in the previous season. Also, putting those guys on the list is indeed bad, but that doesn't mean they should put Isaac there. Neither should have been on the list. Defense is NOT half of the picture in today's NBA. Again, Isaac is an awesome prospect, but the emphasis is on the prospect. He has a lot of work to do to be offensively good enough to get put on a list like this.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#152 » by PrimeThyme » Sat Aug 3, 2019 7:06 pm

TheFinishSniper wrote:
Feel_the_Heat15 wrote:
TheFinishSniper wrote:If Bulls had Bam over Markkanen and they considered him part of the core I would consider quiting my fandom. And for example Bam could never done what Markkanen already did with Finland (lvl talent) at Eurobasket. Just skill wise to be even in same f stratosphere as not just players but talent wise.


Markkanen could almost never do what Adebayo does defensively at the NBA level. Even when faced with FACTS that show that Adebayo is a better player than Markkanen, you refuse to acknowledge that Markkanen is the inferior player.

Better rebounder, shot-blocker, passer and a more efficient shooter. Only things Markkanen does better than Adebayo is shoot 3s and lose.

This always reminds me on Magic fans when argue that Isaac is better than Lauri. And yet every time Bulls play Magic, Lauri torches not just Isaac but complete Magic. Same goes when Celtics and Tatum come to town. But good luck with Bam the franchise player. :wink:

I think most Magic fans would agree that Lauri is currently the better player. Some just believe that as Isaac continues to develop offensively his ceiling and impact will be higher due to how great of a defender he is. I would still draft Isaac over Lauri today.

There are plenty of Magic fans that would take Lauri though and consider Isaacs ceiling offensively limited. Time will tell.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#153 » by PrimeThyme » Sat Aug 3, 2019 7:08 pm

twozeroMM wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Jonathan Isaac?

I think Isaac has the potential to be really good, we just haven’t seen enough of what he can do. The Magic need to figure out their big man rotation, because they have too much talent up front and not enough PT for all of them to truly shine.

Thats fair, but how do you put a guy like Miles bridges on this list over him though? Isaac not only has a higher ceiling but was a better player in pretty much every aspect than Bridges was last year. Not to mention the fact that Isaac didn't even get put on the 6-7 players that just missed the cut. This list is a complete joke.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#154 » by The Real Dalic » Sat Aug 3, 2019 8:36 pm

Johnny Firpo wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Also, if it wasn't about potential, then Zion, Ja Morant, RJ Barrett, etc. wouldn't be on this list.


I have watched plenty of Magic games, Isaac is an extremely limited player right now, or at least he as in the previous season. Also, putting those guys on the list is indeed bad, but that doesn't mean they should put Isaac there. Neither should have been on the list. Defense is NOT half of the picture in today's NBA. Again, Isaac is an awesome prospect, but the emphasis is on the prospect. He has a lot of work to do to be offensively good enough to get put on a list like this.

Isaac is by far better than Bridges, Robinson, Shamet, etc. Not gonna sell me on him not earning a spot on the list. He's one of the few players under 23 to even make the playoffs as a starter and major contributor to a playoff team. Sorry. This list is trash. Isaac 100% deserves some recognition as a young player.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#155 » by Alatan » Sat Aug 3, 2019 8:36 pm

The_Hater wrote:
youOK wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
Let’s put it this way, if Zion was offered in a trade for Fox, Tatum, Booker or any other player listed behind him, every single one of those teams makes the deal without hesitation. The only team that would hesitate is Dallas.


I disagree. I would not trade Fox, Tatum or Booker for Zion. Maybe Tatum as he regressed this year but Fox has been getting better every year and Booker just came off of a 27/4/7 season...

It wouldn't shock me if Zion ends up better than all of those players but he could also bust. He has an odd body type and relies on freakish athleticism. He doesn't have a consistent jump shot either. If your starting a team from scratch he might go first due to potential but I wouldn't trade those players for him.


You might not, but the 3 GM’s running those teams would in a heart beat and that’s all that matters. Zion is a on extemely highly regarded prospect despite your personal reservations.

As for complaining about his jump shot, what about Booker’s defense and constant losing? Tatum’s shot selection and passing? Fox’s shooting? Doncic’s defense? Let’s not pretend that the league is full of flawless young players.


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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#156 » by GeorgeMarcus » Sat Aug 3, 2019 10:36 pm

Yuri Vaultin wrote:I actually think the biggest crime is not listing Jonathan Isaac at all on this list. He is and will be better than the vast majority.


This 100%
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#157 » by Johnny Firpo » Sat Aug 3, 2019 10:56 pm

The Real Dalic wrote:
Johnny Firpo wrote:
The Real Dalic wrote:Also, if it wasn't about potential, then Zion, Ja Morant, RJ Barrett, etc. wouldn't be on this list.


I have watched plenty of Magic games, Isaac is an extremely limited player right now, or at least he as in the previous season. Also, putting those guys on the list is indeed bad, but that doesn't mean they should put Isaac there. Neither should have been on the list. Defense is NOT half of the picture in today's NBA. Again, Isaac is an awesome prospect, but the emphasis is on the prospect. He has a lot of work to do to be offensively good enough to get put on a list like this.

Isaac is by far better than Bridges, Robinson, Shamet, etc. Not gonna sell me on him not earning a spot on the list. He's one of the few players under 23 to even make the playoffs as a starter and major contributor to a playoff team. Sorry. This list is trash. Isaac 100% deserves some recognition as a young player.


Yeah, I actually agree that he should have been on the list, for some reason I was thinking of him being high on the list, and argued that way. He absolutely should have made the top 23, I agree.
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#158 » by Zerostatic » Sat Aug 3, 2019 11:20 pm

Lonzo at 15 and higher than Morant seems wrong to me.. I wish I could see an alternate reality where the Grizzlies traded Morant to the Pelicans for Lonzo just to see Bleacher Report's take (I'm sure they'd be putting the Grizzlies on blast).
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#159 » by Narco_Cowboy11 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:29 pm

leolozon wrote:
Narco_Cowboy11 wrote:Will Doncic get THAT much better though? I think he's a great player with a high ceiling because of his skill and IQ but I just wonder what his ceiling really is...


How much better does he have to get? He averaged 23/10/7 post all-star. He just has to shoot 36% from 3 and 80% from FT (which are conservative numbers) and he's a 25/8/8 guy on good efficiency, so a top 10 player in the league. All he really needs to improve for that is his conditionning and have a better shot selection (having better player around will help with that).


That all is possible but there could be guys with a higher ceiling, not to mention postseason play
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Re: Bleacher Report top 23 NBA players under 23 

Post#160 » by TerryTate » Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:35 pm

All I'm gonna say in this comment.....

There is a reason why Lauri was drafted higher than Bam. There is a reason why the Bulls management decided to make a draft day trade for Jimmy Buckets. His overall ceiling is higher.

Lauri's ceiling is much much higher. He's better than Bargnani (only using as reference as 3pt mobile big) at his peak coming out of the draft, even Dirk said he's much more polished than he was at that age. Right now, he's horrible defensively. Is that because he's too skinny and will need to bulk up a bit? Will bulking up affect his handles/agility and movement speed?
High ceiling - Dirk / Floor - Ryan Anderson

Bam I see some decent defensive potential, but he's offensive game is still fairly limited till gets a decent jumper out to 10ft. Also his handles aren't even comparable to someone like Lauri. I see his ceiling as Emeka Okafor or Antonio McDyess. I don't know what his floor would be, he's still very raw in a few aspects of his game.

Just as people say, Lauri is defensively challenged.... Bam is offensivelly challenged.

As of right now, I would pick Lauri to build a team around.
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