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I love our YUTES...

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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#141 » by RHODEY » Wed Aug 7, 2019 4:28 am

K-DOT wrote:
RHODEY wrote:
K-DOT wrote:Because Randle isn't here long term if we want to sign max guys (aka actual all stars, not fringe all stars), then of DSJ and Knox, the likelihood they both pan out is relatively low, so realistically they just end up as starting caliber guys. Then RJ has to develop properly which knowing us he won't, and Fiz turning him into the next THJ is just as if not more likely, and Mitch is a defensive all star, not offensive, meaning he's not a player you build around but a player you use to build around other guys. Plus again, no superstar potential.

We have good youth, but not great youth. Plus I'm not too thrilled about Randle because he's pointless considering he's pretty much guaranteed to not be here when we're actually competing, so his potential is irrelevant


Three years of prime Randle is anything but irrelevant IMO. Maybe he's a keeper and stays. If he leaves that he will get us something even better in a trade if he continues to improve. Or he leaves us with cap space. But by then some of our YUTES will be young vets.

Speaking of the YUTES nobody knows fully what we have... why put the ceiling at just good? Mitch could be great - . Trier too, DSJ if he matures and that new shot is for real. Iggy could stun folks... But lets just say we have a squad of good YUTES and then add one or two maxes ...what more do you really need?

Young teams like the nuggets more than get by with one Superstar and a fleet of good /very good players. Why cant that be us in 3 years?

If you're seriously gonna argue that Randle leaving for nothing is good for us because "he leaves us with cap space," then I can't take you seriously.

And speaking of young guys, everyone always overvalues theirs. Wolves had the best young core in the league a few years ago, everyone knew they were gonna be contending for championships, now they have one good player to show for it. Y'all just assume Mitch is gonna develop elite offensive skills, but likely he's a DJ type, which is more than fine. Trier is going to be a career 6th man which again is fine, but he's not good enough to be great. Iggy is a 2nd rounder, so adding him to a young core is super premature. And we still need to add two maxes before we count our chickens, I seem to recall people being convinced that we were for sure signing KD and Kyrie, or Kawhi, or Butler, Kemba, whoever. What makes you sure 2021 is going to be different?

And for the Nuggets, they have a superstar. We don't. RJ could be, but he's not a surefire stud so it's a very slim chance, and is an unknown right now. Our entire future hinges on us signing superstars in 2021. If we miss, we become a mediocre playoff team for the next 5 years until we're forced to rebuild again because our current YUTES leave after becoming UFAs. So we should at least try and get an insurance YUTE in case RJ doesn't become lefty Kobe like you're positive he'll be.


Im not here to argue but If Randle leaves we'll have cap space to sign someone else. By that time we should have improved aour overall standing among players in the league ...so yeah I think someone good could sign with us. Its funny but you seem to imply that our superstar has to come from the current YUTES ..even though we set things up to have the flexibility to trade or sign one (or 2?) outright.

Our entire future is pretty damn bright ,with massive internal growth potential, trade potential and FO potential. Im going to enjoy the ride.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#142 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Aug 7, 2019 4:30 am

K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
K-DOT wrote:I don't view Randle as part of the young core. He's on a 2 year deal (cause we're not picking up his 3rd year option), so when we're trying to compete, he won't be here. Putting him in the young core category is the same as putting Tim in the young core category 2 years ago. And I said I couldn't take him seriously cause he said "If Randle leaves in FA, he leaves us with cap space." Seriously defend that statement, that makes no sense in any regard.

And I downplay Mitch because way too many people think he's the next AD. He's a great defensive prospect, but has shown nothing on offense outside of dunks yet. Which is perfectly fine, that's basically Dwight's career, but he hasn't shown star potential, and he's not untradeable by any stretch

Seems like you have a mentality of "if you're not 100% with me, you're 100% against me."


Seems like you have a mentality that you can see the future and that your opinion on players is gospel. You seem to have the mentality of a battered fan. You have no idea who will be here. It's a 3 yr deal until the option is declined....period. Mitch has shown enough to be considered a potential star in this league.You are downplaying that. You're afraid to enjoy this and your trying to tell others to pump the breaks. That's all it is. You do you.

My guy, I literally said I don't know who will turn out to be what. That's why I'm advising caution cause saying we're all done with getting top end prospects when we still don't know if any of them will pan out is absurd.

I don't know who's going to be here, but I can make educated guesses based off past decisions made by the FO. We will be declining Randle's 3rd year option in any scenario. Our pitch for 2021 is having 2 max slots for guys to pick who they'll team up with (aka, what Brooklyn did this offseason), and we have to make a decision on Randle before the offseason starts. So, we're declining it. We signed and traded for a bunch of young guys on short term deals last year. None of them are on the roster this year. So likely none of the expirings this year will be back either

Mitch's main value at this point comes with his price tag. If he doesn't develop his offense at all, which he really hasn't even flashed potential of, he has Rudy Gobert potential. Rudy Gobert is not a star. You cannot build a team around Rudy Gobert. I watched games at the end of the year pretty much exclusively for Mitch. Don't tell me I'm afraid to enjoy sh*t, cause I do enjoy watching our kids grow and develop

I'm telling y'all to pump the brakes cause y'all are setting yourselves up for disappointment again. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised that our kids are better than expected than disappointed they haven't lived up to my unrealistic expectations. If you think I'm being negative, I don't know how you function in daily life.


I think just saying you don't expect Randle to stick and even to go so far as to predict his option won't be picked up is probably an example of over-Nostradamusing your projections. I understand you have a different way of saying you support the rebuild, but when you say dubious stuff like that it muddies your overall message. I think you're just being cautious in general about predicting how far any player will go which is fine, but also why you may be undercutting that message with statements like you made about Randle.

I don't think we know what the intent will be with Randle, because the Knicks don't know either. They are betting on his solid production with fingers crossed on the upside. Let's not outfox ourselves here. It is not possible to predict things like this or say team options are made only to be declined. That's not a solid or defensible statement

Mostly though, we have youth with lots of upside and plenty of question marks. I think most can back that statement however you approach it
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#143 » by RHODEY » Wed Aug 7, 2019 4:34 am

K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
K-DOT wrote:I don't view Randle as part of the young core. He's on a 2 year deal (cause we're not picking up his 3rd year option), so when we're trying to compete, he won't be here. Putting him in the young core category is the same as putting Tim in the young core category 2 years ago. And I said I couldn't take him seriously cause he said "If Randle leaves in FA, he leaves us with cap space." Seriously defend that statement, that makes no sense in any regard.

And I downplay Mitch because way too many people think he's the next AD. He's a great defensive prospect, but has shown nothing on offense outside of dunks yet. Which is perfectly fine, that's basically Dwight's career, but he hasn't shown star potential, and he's not untradeable by any stretch

Seems like you have a mentality of "if you're not 100% with me, you're 100% against me."


Seems like you have a mentality that you can see the future and that your opinion on players is gospel. You seem to have the mentality of a battered fan. You have no idea who will be here. It's a 3 yr deal until the option is declined....period. Mitch has shown enough to be considered a potential star in this league.You are downplaying that. You're afraid to enjoy this and your trying to tell others to pump the breaks. That's all it is. You do you.

My guy, I literally said I don't know who will turn out to be what. That's why I'm advising caution cause saying we're all done with getting top end prospects when we still don't know if any of them will pan out is absurd.

I don't know who's going to be here, but I can make educated guesses based off past decisions made by the FO. We will be declining Randle's 3rd year option in any scenario. Our pitch for 2021 is having 2 max slots for guys to pick who they'll team up with (aka, what Brooklyn did this offseason), and we have to make a decision on Randle before the offseason starts. So, we're declining it. We signed and traded for a bunch of young guys on short term deals last year. None of them are on the roster this year. So likely none of the expirings this year will be back either

A star is someone who you can build a team around. If Mitch doesn't develop his offense at all, which he really hasn't even flashed potential of, he has Rudy Gobert potential. Rudy Gobert is not a star. You cannot build a team around Rudy Gobert, but he is a player most teams would love to have. I watched games at the end of the year pretty much exclusively for Mitch. Don't tell me I'm afraid to enjoy sh*t, cause I do enjoy watching our kids grow and develop

I'm telling y'all to pump the brakes cause y'all are setting yourselves up for disappointment again. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised that our kids are better than expected than disappointed they haven't lived up to my unrealistic expectations. If you think I'm being negative, I don't know how you function in daily life.


You can pump the breaks I prefer to enjoy life and floor it.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#144 » by malik959 » Wed Aug 7, 2019 4:42 am

K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
K-DOT wrote:This is literally what I'm saying

Our guys are no different than other young guys. They have flaws that need to be fixed, and acting like they're for sure things is pretty ridiculous. Which is why I didn't confine it to our team, cause it's universal

I'm just saying pump the brakes on the hype train a bit. Our main piece hasn't played a minute in the NBA yet, so he's an entire unknown right now and one of our other main guys was literally the worst player in the league last year. Kids take time to develop I know, but the odds they all develop perfectly is slim, and I don't think we should count on things going perfect.


Ummm...I agree with this but...your words are not saying this. You're basically shytting on every kid we have and acting like no one has reason to be excited about the team. That's all you've really said in the few posts I'm reading and responding too.

If this is your point...:lol:...you could have just said that. You went above and beyond.

For all anyone knows....all these guys could suck. No kidding. We could also have much more talent than anyone knows. That's a rebuild with youth. The whole idea as a fan should be to sit back and enjoy the potential until proven otherwise. It's that simple. Why sit here and pick every nit on a bunch of kids barely old enough to drink...and some who aren't. Enjoy the ride.

My thinking is, we always go into the season with super high expectations for the kids, and pretty much they fall short. Cause they're, y'know, kids, and kids need time to develop

There's no way to tell at this point if our kids are good enough is all I'm saying. Like I said to begin with, I think DSJ and Knox both have fringe all star potential, RJ has clear all star potential, and Mitch has all-D team potential

But it's still just potential at this point. If the kids show out this year and we win 35 games, that means they're good enough of a core. If we win 20 something games, that could mean we're not good, or it could mean we're not good yet, either way, still a good idea to add another high potential talent

I don't know where you got the idea that I was sh*tting on the kids and telling people not to be excited from. I've been pretty consistently positive about the outlook of the team, just not as positive it'll be as quick as y'all think it is.


I give kids a 4 year window to see if they can either show their star potential, or become role players, I expect flaws and don't put in high expectations on them. From day one we know the type of kids we are getting (Defender, Offensive player, or both) and what their good and bad at. I don't expect full corrections within just one year. They're like criminals before going to jail, they were top dogs where ever they came from, but once they reach the big boy jail that's when they find out they really aren't $h!+ and have to grind their way to the top. some make it and the others become women......... Um OK yeah maybe a little to strong, but you get my point. :lol:
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#145 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Aug 7, 2019 4:46 am

malik959 wrote:
K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
Ummm...I agree with this but...your words are not saying this. You're basically shytting on every kid we have and acting like no one has reason to be excited about the team. That's all you've really said in the few posts I'm reading and responding too.

If this is your point...:lol:...you could have just said that. You went above and beyond.

For all anyone knows....all these guys could suck. No kidding. We could also have much more talent than anyone knows. That's a rebuild with youth. The whole idea as a fan should be to sit back and enjoy the potential until proven otherwise. It's that simple. Why sit here and pick every nit on a bunch of kids barely old enough to drink...and some who aren't. Enjoy the ride.

My thinking is, we always go into the season with super high expectations for the kids, and pretty much they fall short. Cause they're, y'know, kids, and kids need time to develop

There's no way to tell at this point if our kids are good enough is all I'm saying. Like I said to begin with, I think DSJ and Knox both have fringe all star potential, RJ has clear all star potential, and Mitch has all-D team potential

But it's still just potential at this point. If the kids show out this year and we win 35 games, that means they're good enough of a core. If we win 20 something games, that could mean we're not good, or it could mean we're not good yet, either way, still a good idea to add another high potential talent

I don't know where you got the idea that I was sh*tting on the kids and telling people not to be excited from. I've been pretty consistently positive about the outlook of the team, just not as positive it'll be as quick as y'all think it is.


I give kids a 4 year window to see if they can either show their star potential, or become role players, I expect flaws and don't put in high expectations on them. From day one we know the type of kids we are getting (Defender, Offensive player, or both) and what their good and bad at. I don't expect full corrections within just one year. They're like criminals before going to jail, they were top dogs where ever they came from, but once they reach the big boy jail that's when they find out they really aren't $h!+ and have to grind their way to the top. some make it and the others become women......... Um OK yeah maybe a little to strong, but you get my point. :lol:


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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#146 » by RHODEY » Wed Aug 7, 2019 4:53 am

malik959 wrote:
K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
Ummm...I agree with this but...your words are not saying this. You're basically shytting on every kid we have and acting like no one has reason to be excited about the team. That's all you've really said in the few posts I'm reading and responding too.

If this is your point...:lol:...you could have just said that. You went above and beyond.

For all anyone knows....all these guys could suck. No kidding. We could also have much more talent than anyone knows. That's a rebuild with youth. The whole idea as a fan should be to sit back and enjoy the potential until proven otherwise. It's that simple. Why sit here and pick every nit on a bunch of kids barely old enough to drink...and some who aren't. Enjoy the ride.

My thinking is, we always go into the season with super high expectations for the kids, and pretty much they fall short. Cause they're, y'know, kids, and kids need time to develop

There's no way to tell at this point if our kids are good enough is all I'm saying. Like I said to begin with, I think DSJ and Knox both have fringe all star potential, RJ has clear all star potential, and Mitch has all-D team potential

But it's still just potential at this point. If the kids show out this year and we win 35 games, that means they're good enough of a core. If we win 20 something games, that could mean we're not good, or it could mean we're not good yet, either way, still a good idea to add another high potential talent

I don't know where you got the idea that I was sh*tting on the kids and telling people not to be excited from. I've been pretty consistently positive about the outlook of the team, just not as positive it'll be as quick as y'all think it is.


I give kids a 4 year window to see if they can either show their star potential, or become role players, I expect flaws and don't put in high expectations on them. From day one we know the type of kids we are getting (Defender, Offensive player, or both) and what their good and bad at. I don't expect full corrections within just one year. They're like criminals before going to jail, they were top dogs where ever they came from, but once they reach the big boy jail that's when they find out they really aren't $h!+ and have to grind their way to the top. some make it and the others become women......... Um OK yeah maybe a little to strong, but you get my point. :lol:

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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#147 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Aug 7, 2019 11:40 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
Seems like you have a mentality that you can see the future and that your opinion on players is gospel. You seem to have the mentality of a battered fan. You have no idea who will be here. It's a 3 yr deal until the option is declined....period. Mitch has shown enough to be considered a potential star in this league.You are downplaying that. You're afraid to enjoy this and your trying to tell others to pump the breaks. That's all it is. You do you.

My guy, I literally said I don't know who will turn out to be what. That's why I'm advising caution cause saying we're all done with getting top end prospects when we still don't know if any of them will pan out is absurd.

I don't know who's going to be here, but I can make educated guesses based off past decisions made by the FO. We will be declining Randle's 3rd year option in any scenario. Our pitch for 2021 is having 2 max slots for guys to pick who they'll team up with (aka, what Brooklyn did this offseason), and we have to make a decision on Randle before the offseason starts. So, we're declining it. We signed and traded for a bunch of young guys on short term deals last year. None of them are on the roster this year. So likely none of the expirings this year will be back either

Mitch's main value at this point comes with his price tag. If he doesn't develop his offense at all, which he really hasn't even flashed potential of, he has Rudy Gobert potential. Rudy Gobert is not a star. You cannot build a team around Rudy Gobert. I watched games at the end of the year pretty much exclusively for Mitch. Don't tell me I'm afraid to enjoy sh*t, cause I do enjoy watching our kids grow and develop

I'm telling y'all to pump the brakes cause y'all are setting yourselves up for disappointment again. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised that our kids are better than expected than disappointed they haven't lived up to my unrealistic expectations. If you think I'm being negative, I don't know how you function in daily life.


I think just saying you don't expect Randle to stick and even to go so far as to predict his option won't be picked up is probably an example of over-Nostradamusing your projections. I understand you have a different way of saying you support the rebuild, but when you say dubious stuff like that it muddies your overall message. I think you're just being cautious in general about predicting how far any player will go which is fine, but also why you may be undercutting that message with statements like you made about Randle.

I don't think we know what the intent will be with Randle, because the Knicks don't know either. They are betting on his solid production with fingers crossed on the upside. Let's not outfox ourselves here. It is not possible to predict things like this or say team options are made only to be declined. That's not a solid or defensible statement

Mostly though, we have youth with lots of upside and plenty of question marks. I think most can back that statement however you approach it


I'd say Clyde has it right, regarding Knicks don't have a complete decision mapped out with Randle.

He sort of splits the difference between "guy here who's ok for a year" and "future piece".

I agree in theory with K-Dot, that so far the Knicks have been "two max cat hunters". Randle might present a bit of a conundrum after two years - or not.

The two easiest scenarios are if Randle sort of sucks (unlikely) or Randle turns superstar-ish. Then the Knicks will probably treat him as one of their "max cats". This also feels unlikely, but less unlikely than Randle stinking it up.

What will be rough is if Randle is good, and better than now, but then is able to be paid around 30 million per year, and maybe wants those 5 years. Then they have a decision of "he's really good, but is he 30 million+ 5 years good?" - perhaps a variation on the KP decision - if productions vs $ is what drove the decision to trade KP.

I don't know. Seems to me to be a good situation all the way around. Pretty good player at least around for 2 years, some flexibility to sign and trade him if he wants $ but the Knicks want something else, or he's part of a core moving forward.

Any advantage to when they pick up his team option and how that relates to cap space timing and other max cats? What if they wanted to sign two guys put then go over the cap for Randles option? Actually, I'd assume it doesn't go that way, as an option isn't a contract. Obviously I'm thinking out loud here.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#148 » by iStudyTheGame » Wed Aug 7, 2019 5:28 pm

Sports is entertainment, let people enjoy it. I dont mind always looking for the silver lining because it's just a game. People who are always slandering our players or other fans for being excited about them must have their entire lives in perfect order for them to be so critical of everyone else. Enjoy our youth! Upside, flaws, and all. You want negativity then watch the news channel.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#149 » by Are We Ther Yet » Fri Aug 9, 2019 12:07 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
K-DOT wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
Seems like you have a mentality that you can see the future and that your opinion on players is gospel. You seem to have the mentality of a battered fan. You have no idea who will be here. It's a 3 yr deal until the option is declined....period. Mitch has shown enough to be considered a potential star in this league.You are downplaying that. You're afraid to enjoy this and your trying to tell others to pump the breaks. That's all it is. You do you.

My guy, I literally said I don't know who will turn out to be what. That's why I'm advising caution cause saying we're all done with getting top end prospects when we still don't know if any of them will pan out is absurd.

I don't know who's going to be here, but I can make educated guesses based off past decisions made by the FO. We will be declining Randle's 3rd year option in any scenario. Our pitch for 2021 is having 2 max slots for guys to pick who they'll team up with (aka, what Brooklyn did this offseason), and we have to make a decision on Randle before the offseason starts. So, we're declining it. We signed and traded for a bunch of young guys on short term deals last year. None of them are on the roster this year. So likely none of the expirings this year will be back either

Mitch's main value at this point comes with his price tag. If he doesn't develop his offense at all, which he really hasn't even flashed potential of, he has Rudy Gobert potential. Rudy Gobert is not a star. You cannot build a team around Rudy Gobert. I watched games at the end of the year pretty much exclusively for Mitch. Don't tell me I'm afraid to enjoy sh*t, cause I do enjoy watching our kids grow and develop

I'm telling y'all to pump the brakes cause y'all are setting yourselves up for disappointment again. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised that our kids are better than expected than disappointed they haven't lived up to my unrealistic expectations. If you think I'm being negative, I don't know how you function in daily life.


I think just saying you don't expect Randle to stick and even to go so far as to predict his option won't be picked up is probably an example of over-Nostradamusing your projections. I understand you have a different way of saying you support the rebuild, but when you say dubious stuff like that it muddies your overall message. I think you're just being cautious in general about predicting how far any player will go which is fine, but also why you may be undercutting that message with statements like you made about Randle.

I don't think we know what the intent will be with Randle, because the Knicks don't know either. They are betting on his solid production with fingers crossed on the upside. Let's not outfox ourselves here. It is not possible to predict things like this or say team options are made only to be declined. That's not a solid or defensible statement

Mostly though, we have youth with lots of upside and plenty of question marks. I think most can back that statement however you approach it


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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#150 » by RHODEY » Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:03 pm

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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#151 » by KnicksGod » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:14 am

Knox can box.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#152 » by stuporman » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:57 am

Something to consider.... Olapido was on his third team when he broke out to became an allstar. So we shouldn't allow ourselves to create an imagined ceiling on Randle because the Knicks are his third team.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#153 » by melo4three » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:25 am

stuporman wrote:Something to consider.... Olapido was on his third team when he broke out to became an allstar. So we shouldn't allow ourselves to create an imagined ceiling on Randle because the Knicks are his third team.



I mean heck, Steve Nash didn't truly breakout until age 30 was kind of a bum until age 26, lets not put limits on these guys because of age. Randle seems to have the work ethic and the drive to improve himself every year and that is what it takes to be great in this league.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#154 » by DrCoach » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:37 am

Randle is gonna be LeBron - Lite

There, I said it.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#155 » by aq_ua » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:44 am

KnicksGod wrote:Knox can box.

Knox can box with a fox.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#156 » by BLACKFEET 2010 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:25 am

DrCoach wrote:Randle is gonna be LeBron - Lite

There, I said it.

Our answer to Ben Simmons and Giannis.
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#157 » by Ray Williams » Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:57 am

aq_ua wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:Knox can box.

Knox can box with a fox.


Knox can box
With a fox
With shoes and no socks
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Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#158 » by aq_ua » Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:53 pm

Ray Williams wrote:
aq_ua wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:Knox can box.

Knox can box with a fox.


Knox can box
With a fox
With shoes and no socks

Knox can box with a Fox
With shoes and no socks
We follow him like flocks
And hang on dearly to jocks
HerSports85
Head Coach
Posts: 7,449
And1: 5,368
Joined: Dec 22, 2011
 

Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#159 » by HerSports85 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:00 pm

DrCoach wrote:Randle is gonna be LeBron - Lite

There, I said it.


Not that far fetched. I actually agree
blumatic
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,090
And1: 711
Joined: Dec 03, 2011

Re: I love our YUTES... 

Post#160 » by blumatic » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:34 pm

aq_ua wrote:
Ray Williams wrote:
aq_ua wrote:Knox can box with a fox.


Knox can box
With a fox
With shoes and no socks

Knox can box with a Fox
With shoes and no socks
We follow him like flocks
And hang on dearly to jocks


Knox can box with a Fox
With shoes and no socks
We follow him like flocks
And hang on dearly to jocks
In hopes to be a triple threat like the LOX
Support Knox or kick rocks

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