RealGM Top 25 Player Poll-#25 2019-20

[AbeVigodaLive]

Its not only RPM though. A guy who scores high in all impact stats, year over year and continuously leads his team to +50 wins every year as the best player is somehow not considered top 25 by a lot of guys here. Thats crazy to me, imo. If this is a projection of where people will be next year, thats fine, i dont mind people believing in their guys or other guys more. But going back over the years, to me, there's almost no genuine argument you can make on a BBAll forum full of avid fans that he wasnt consistently top 25 (some years top 15).

Toronto was sub 50 wins for each of Lowry's first 3 seasons in Toronto. So your post isn't completely accurate.

I already stated he'd make the top 25 in the '16 and '17 seasons. You could quibble whether he was top 15 or not. That's another discussion for those seasons. I'd throw in 2018 as well because of the Raps' 59 wins and Lowry's two-way value.

So all that being said... that's 3 locks in 7 seasons...

In 2019, the Raptors went 17-5 with Lowry and without Kawhi compared to 11-6 with Kawhi and without Lowry. In the playoffs Lowry had an on/off on +11.5 which was closer to Kawhi’s team leading mark than it was to 3rd. In the biggest game of the season to clinch Toronto’s only championship, he put up 26/7/10 on .697 TS%. I’d say he was a top 12 player personally, but at the very least he’s a lock for top 25.

Top 12?

Whoa.

Ummmm... ok.

[zimpy27]

Should be established a new rule here, to prevent ANTI-VOTING. If some player twice finished as #2, he is automatically chosen for the next spot!

For example, Donovan Mitchell was #2 in poll#20, than 2nd best in poll#21, so Mitchell is automatically #22 and instead of poll#22 should be opened poll#23 already!

That just rewards fan voting.

The people who vote for the winner in poll #20 may not choose Mitchell, they may choose someone else, which is what happened here.

Can someone point to an impact metric that shows Mitchell is better than anyone in the top 25?

He's better than Doncic, Ben Simmons and Bradley Beal by RPM.

He's better than Doncic and Simmons by PIPM.

He's better than Doncic and SImmons by multi-year PIPM.

He's better than Gobert, Draymond, CP3, Kemba, AD, Jokic, Butler, Kawhi, Westbrook, Beal, Simmons, Doncic by RAPM

He's better than Jokic, Siakam, KAT, CP3, Kemba, Butler, Griffin. Doncic, Simmons... by luck-adjusted RAPM

Thank you, yes I'd say Mitchell deserves to be above Luka, I imagine that's a fan vote. I'd put Mitchell equal to Simmons (because of his defense) but could see him above. I'd put Mitchell ahead of Beal as well.

PIPM and RPM are a bit better than RAPM.
There are also a number of players that are above Mitchell in these stats but aren't going to go ahead of him in rankings. But it's about role as well I guess.

[zimpy27]

You don't need projections, just use his 2019 stats only (2nd half of last season) and he was 25-5-5 player in the team with 3rd best record since January.

What happened in the first half of the season? What changed to allow him to play better? Was something restricting him?

Did that restriction come back in the playoffs? Is that how you explain his horrible performance?

I'm asking because I genuinely don't know if he was injured or if the offense wasn't giving him good looks or something else.

He had a foot injury in the off-season that kept him in a boot and nagged into the season. Around January was when he said he was finally 100 percent. Per the playoffs, Houston keyed in on him and the rest of the team outside of Rudy and Derrick was trash, so he had no help. I'm not sure how much can or can't be extrapolated from that series.

A foot injury could explain it, his shooting could have suffered be from that.

[Bob8]

That just rewards fan voting.

The people who vote for the winner in poll #20 may not choose Mitchell, they may choose someone else, which is what happened here.

Can someone point to an impact metric that shows Mitchell is better than anyone in the top 25?

He's better than Doncic, Ben Simmons and Bradley Beal by RPM.

He's better than Doncic and Simmons by PIPM.

He's better than Doncic and SImmons by multi-year PIPM.

He's better than Gobert, Draymond, CP3, Kemba, AD, Jokic, Butler, Kawhi, Westbrook, Beal, Simmons, Doncic by RAPM

He's better than Jokic, Siakam, KAT, CP3, Kemba, Butler, Griffin. Doncic, Simmons... by luck-adjusted RAPM

Thank you, yes I'd say Mitchell deserves to be above Luka, I imagine that's a fan vote. I'd put Mitchell equal to Simmons (because of his defense) but could see him above. I'd put Mitchell ahead of Beal as well.

PIPM and RPM are a bit better than RAPM.
There are also a number of players that are above Mitchell in these stats but aren't going to go ahead of him in rankings. But it's about role as well I guess.

Aren’t we voting season 19/20? It’s about expectations not current stats. Mitchell and Simmons are almost 3 years older than Luka, it would be very strange that rookie is better than them. Next season is much more open, if Luka comes with better conditioning and team build around him.

[scrabbarista]

Well, this was an exercise in frustration trying to get Vucevic up there, and last year's list ended up being horribly wrong, but now that I look at it, it looks pretty reasonable! Maybe we did an okay job. I'm sure I'd have a few gripes if I had the time and energy to point 'em out, though.

[Gooner]

Well, this was an exercise in frustration trying to get Vucevic up there, and last year's list ended up being horribly wrong, but now that I look at it, it looks pretty reasonable! Maybe we did an okay job. I'm sure I'd have a few gripes if I had the time and energy to point 'em out, though.

Yeah, you failed to get Vucevic in, despite great effort.

[50CalClips]

Your favorite offseason debate is back by popular demand!
Thanks to everyone who voted last go around Im excited to see where the 2nd annual edition ends up.

Here's the Rules:
-Vote ONE player per poll. You'll be able to change your vote just like last year for those indecisive folks.
-The criteria of ranking the players is YOUR OWN. The whole point of bringing this to the GB is to attract the widest amount of votes/perspectives on the game as possible to form a true consensus. Some people value shooting over defense, team success over indivdual prowess etc. I want to bake all that in to this poll set no matter how chaotic.
-Each poll a player will win and then be taken out of the field. There will be 25 polls in all.
-There are only 10 possible poll options so I will start with the 10 guys who I personally believe will round out the top 10 in most people's eyes.
-As each poll commences I ask you to COMMENT IN THE THREAD your vote for who should be added in the next poll. There will be a large list of players yet to be added to the field below that you can look over to make your vote. I will tally up the votes in the comments at the end of each poll and add the winner accordingly. For example, if you want Marc Gasol added in the next poll just comment "Marc Gasol" or "Gasol".
-If a poll is overwhelmingly skewed towards one guy I will try, time willing, to edit it early and move on to the next one.
-If there is a tie in the poll. There will be a run-off poll created with just the tying parties to determine a winner. The losers of the runoff will then be added back into the field of 10 for the next poll.
-Feel free to ask any questions via pm or comment
-Feel Free to comment on your reasoning for a pick and why

THANKS AGAIN TO EVERYONE FOR PARTICIPATING!!!!...

Thanks for doing these polls, good stuff, but as others have suggested...
You should really get rid of "KEVIN DURANT" as a choice for 2019-20 season.

Whatever Ranking that KD ends up getting, it'll be meaningless, at this point.
It would serve this RealGM Ranking better to eliminate Durant as a choice.