Sam Vecenie's Top 25 players aged 23 and under.

[Yogatti]

lmao nevermind

[KqWIN]

Well, with Fox at 6 and Bagley at 11 it’s more credible (what was that garbage Fox at 14, Bagley at 39 the other day).

I’d still quibble with the list. What has Booker shown in terms of winning? Simmons is a flawed player. Tatum ISO SF, better defending/efficient Rudy Gay

Is a better defending and more efficient version of Rudy Gay not an all star player? I mean that was basically the knock on Gay and he was still a pretty solid player.

Saw that and thought the same thing. We're pretty hard on certain young players. If they were who some people expect them to be, they would already be the best players in the league. Gotta have some perspective

[Nazrmohamed]

I wonder if in Lebron’s rookie year people made such arguments? If so those arguments probably aged quite quickly like this one no doubt will.

I just dont think Zion is anywhere near as good a prospect as Lebron was.

Well there you go. He’s the best prospect since Lebron and there’s good reason for that.

If enough people keep saying that I guess it's true considering we are indeed talking about potential here. What I do know is that he wasnt the best prospect coming out of HS in his own class which in and of itself doesnt mean much. But you tell me, where was the next best bigman drafted. This was a weak year for big men and he was a pretty dominant player. See there, I admit he was dominant. I just dont think hes at all generational. I think AD was a better prospect.

I feel like AD looked like he would do more against NBA big men then Zion does against NBA bigmen. You know how many aspects of the game hed have to dominate to be a generational talent? I see more of a Blake Griffin trajectory and I'd take that anyday of the week but it's not Lebron. I dont even know if that's Wade. I look at him as a finisher who may develop the ability to hit jump shots down the line. But again, Blake Griffin does that.

[Nazrmohamed]

Yeah. But they have him at number 1. I agree you can have an opinion on his and even project but number 1? I dont even think he projects that high and would probably dispute this idea that he is some once per generation player. I guess we'll see but hes a rim attacker whose 6'7 and cant shoot. The shooting part I'm not concerned with but itll take a couple years. He'll be good, no doubt. I just have an issue with the number 1 projection, especially when looking at this list.

I wonder if in Lebron’s rookie year people made such arguments? If so those arguments probably aged quite quickly like this one no doubt will.

LOL Zion is not Lebron coming into this league. Not even close. Lebron was a man coming in and already professional. Zion looks like he is more excited about eating at Popeye's.

But yes that is my exact point. Those arguments will age WHEN he starts playing... and that's when he can maybe be ranked. Up until now he is a kid whose body broke down 15 mins into a summer league game because he turned up out of shape.

They may have already addressed that some. Couldve sworn I saw a video or picture of him more chiselled after SL. It's not impossible. One case I remember was Kevin Love. I felt like he was drafted pudgy and then had the fastest chisel up that I'd ever seen. Actually looked different. And then he took it a step further in Cleveland.

Speaking of chicken though I'll never forget Charles Barkley admitting to eating a bucket of KFC before games. Blew my mind

[Nazrmohamed]

Yeah. But they have him at number 1. I agree you can have an opinion on his and even project but number 1? I dont even think he projects that high and would probably dispute this idea that he is some once per generation player. I guess we'll see but hes a rim attacker whose 6'7 and cant shoot. The shooting part I'm not concerned with but itll take a couple years. He'll be good, no doubt. I just have an issue with the number 1 projection, especially when looking at this list.

I wonder if in Lebron’s rookie year people made such arguments? If so those arguments probably aged quite quickly like this one no doubt will.

LOL Zion is not Lebron coming into this league. Not even close. Lebron was a man coming in and already professional. Zion looks like he is more excited about eating at Popeye's.

But yes that is my exact point. Those arguments will age WHEN he starts playing... and that's when he can maybe be ranked. Up until now he is a kid whose body broke down 15 mins into a summer league game because he turned up out of shape.

They may have already addressed that some. Couldve sworn I saw a video or picture of him more chiselled after SL. It's not impossible. One case I remember was Kevin Love. I felt like he was drafted pudgy and then had the fastest chisel up that I'd ever seen. Actually looked different. And then he took it a step further in Cleveland.

Speaking of chicken though I'll never forget Charles Barkley admitting to eating a bucket of KFC before games. Blew my mind

[DreamTeam09]

As a fellow Canadian, Shai is severaly overrated. No way he's better than Ingram or lonzo going forward

[mtron929]

I don't see how Zion is #1 unless you pretty much ignore all worse-case scenarios for him. Compared to Zion, guys like Doncic and Simmons have such a higher floor that this comparison is pretty insulting. Not sure if Zion should be ranked but it is certainly #2 or lower.

[dk1115]

Domantas Sabonis is not even in the top 25?

[rugbyrugger23]

It's a dead point in the summer, forgive me. Checkout Sam on twitter @Sam_Vecenie.

Future projection was taken into account, it is not for next season only.

25) MIA - Bam Adebayo

24) ATL - Kevin Huerter

23) CHI - Wendell Carter, Jr.

22) BOS - Jaylen Brown

21) NOP – Brandon Ingram

20) NOP – Lonzo Ball

19) OKC - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

18) NYK - RJ Barrett

17) MEM – Ja Morant

16) CHI - Lauri Markkanen

15) DEN – Jamal Murray

14) ATL – John Collins

13) GSW - D'Angelo Russell

12) IND - Myles Turner

11) SAC - Marvin Bagley III

10) MEM - Jaren Jackson Jr.

9) BOS - Jayson Tatum

8) PHX - DeAndre Ayton

7) ATL – Trae Young

6) SAC - De'Aaron Fox

5) UTA – Donovan Mitchell

4) PHX – Devin Booker

3) PHI – Ben Simmons

2) DAL – Luka Dončić

1) NOP – Zion Williamson

Honorable Mentions were Mitchell Robinson, Jarrett Allen, and Domantas Sabonis.

I’m a big Sam fan, listened to each episode of the podcast that covered the list, he’s a big reason why I subscribe to the Athletic.

I was pretty shocked when I saw him rank Bam 25th. I need to revisit his reasoning but that one really took me aback.

I think it’s weird that when he got heat from Bulls fans earlier this offseason for suggesting a pretty crappy return for Lauri, he came back at the haters with the take Wendell>Lauri in the long game, and he made it clear then that he thought Lauri best position and a what team should be striving for is him at the 5 (he softened a bit on that a little in the last podcast). Now he’s got them flipped on a list that includes projected future.

My big question from this exercise is where Derrick White would rank among the other young point guards if he was eligible.

Also, can we please, for the entire basketball community, get Ben Simmons out of Philly? The world could be so much more fun.




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White is 25.

Towns is 23, where is he? (He is younger than Simmons).

[basketballRob]

I think Aaron Gordon should be up there.

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[kio80]

It's a dead point in the summer, forgive me. Checkout Sam on twitter @Sam_Vecenie.

Future projection was taken into account, it is not for next season only.

25) MIA - Bam Adebayo

24) ATL - Kevin Huerter

23) CHI - Wendell Carter, Jr.

22) BOS - Jaylen Brown

21) NOP – Brandon Ingram

20) NOP – Lonzo Ball

19) OKC - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

18) NYK - RJ Barrett

17) MEM – Ja Morant

16) CHI - Lauri Markkanen

15) DEN – Jamal Murray

14) ATL – John Collins

13) GSW - D'Angelo Russell

12) IND - Myles Turner

11) SAC - Marvin Bagley III

10) MEM - Jaren Jackson Jr.

9) BOS - Jayson Tatum

8) PHX - DeAndre Ayton

7) ATL – Trae Young

6) SAC - De'Aaron Fox

5) UTA – Donovan Mitchell

4) PHX – Devin Booker

3) PHI – Ben Simmons

2) DAL – Luka Dončić

1) NOP – Zion Williamson

Honorable Mentions were Mitchell Robinson, Jarrett Allen, and Domantas Sabonis.

I’m a big Sam fan, listened to each episode of the podcast that covered the list, he’s a big reason why I subscribe to the Athletic.

I was pretty shocked when I saw him rank Bam 25th. I need to revisit his reasoning but that one really took me aback.

I think it’s weird that when he got heat from Bulls fans earlier this offseason for suggesting a pretty crappy return for Lauri, he came back at the haters with the take Wendell>Lauri in the long game, and he made it clear then that he thought Lauri best position and a what team should be striving for is him at the 5 (he softened a bit on that a little in the last podcast). Now he’s got them flipped on a list that includes projected future.

My big question from this exercise is where Derrick White would rank among the other young point guards if he was eligible.

Also, can we please, for the entire basketball community, get Ben Simmons out of Philly? The world could be so much more fun.




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White is 25.

Towns is 23, where is he? (He is younger than Simmons).

Towns was born in 95, Simmons was born in 96.
However, if Ayton is like 8th, Towns should be top 5....



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[Jalexjsmithj]

It's a dead point in the summer, forgive me. Checkout Sam on twitter @Sam_Vecenie.

Future projection was taken into account, it is not for next season only.

25) MIA - Bam Adebayo

24) ATL - Kevin Huerter

23) CHI - Wendell Carter, Jr.

22) BOS - Jaylen Brown

21) NOP – Brandon Ingram

20) NOP – Lonzo Ball

19) OKC - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

18) NYK - RJ Barrett

17) MEM – Ja Morant

16) CHI - Lauri Markkanen

15) DEN – Jamal Murray

14) ATL – John Collins

13) GSW - D'Angelo Russell

12) IND - Myles Turner

11) SAC - Marvin Bagley III

10) MEM - Jaren Jackson Jr.

9) BOS - Jayson Tatum

8) PHX - DeAndre Ayton

7) ATL – Trae Young

6) SAC - De'Aaron Fox

5) UTA – Donovan Mitchell

4) PHX – Devin Booker

3) PHI – Ben Simmons

2) DAL – Luka Dončić

1) NOP – Zion Williamson

Honorable Mentions were Mitchell Robinson, Jarrett Allen, and Domantas Sabonis.

I’m a big Sam fan, listened to each episode of the podcast that covered the list, he’s a big reason why I subscribe to the Athletic.

I was pretty shocked when I saw him rank Bam 25th. I need to revisit his reasoning but that one really took me aback.

I think it’s weird that when he got heat from Bulls fans earlier this offseason for suggesting a pretty crappy return for Lauri, he came back at the haters with the take Wendell>Lauri in the long game, and he made it clear then that he thought Lauri best position and a what team should be striving for is him at the 5 (he softened a bit on that a little in the last podcast). Now he’s got them flipped on a list that includes projected future.

My big question from this exercise is where Derrick White would rank among the other young point guards if he was eligible.

Also, can we please, for the entire basketball community, get Ben Simmons out of Philly? The world could be so much more fun.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

White is 25.

Towns is 23, where is he? (He is younger than Simmons).

My big question from this exercise is where Derrick White would rank among the other young point guards if he was eligible.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Jalexjsmithj]

It's a dead point in the summer, forgive me. Checkout Sam on twitter @Sam_Vecenie.

Future projection was taken into account, it is not for next season only.

25) MIA - Bam Adebayo

24) ATL - Kevin Huerter

23) CHI - Wendell Carter, Jr.

22) BOS - Jaylen Brown

21) NOP – Brandon Ingram

20) NOP – Lonzo Ball

19) OKC - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

18) NYK - RJ Barrett

17) MEM – Ja Morant

16) CHI - Lauri Markkanen

15) DEN – Jamal Murray

14) ATL – John Collins

13) GSW - D'Angelo Russell

12) IND - Myles Turner

11) SAC - Marvin Bagley III

10) MEM - Jaren Jackson Jr.

9) BOS - Jayson Tatum

8) PHX - DeAndre Ayton

7) ATL – Trae Young

6) SAC - De'Aaron Fox

5) UTA – Donovan Mitchell

4) PHX – Devin Booker

3) PHI – Ben Simmons

2) DAL – Luka Dončić

1) NOP – Zion Williamson

Honorable Mentions were Mitchell Robinson, Jarrett Allen, and Domantas Sabonis.

I’m a big Sam fan, listened to each episode of the podcast that covered the list, he’s a big reason why I subscribe to the Athletic.

I was pretty shocked when I saw him rank Bam 25th. I need to revisit his reasoning but that one really took me aback.

I think it’s weird that when he got heat from Bulls fans earlier this offseason for suggesting a pretty crappy return for Lauri, he came back at the haters with the take Wendell>Lauri in the long game, and he made it clear then that he thought Lauri best position and a what team should be striving for is him at the 5 (he softened a bit on that a little in the last podcast). Now he’s got them flipped on a list that includes projected future.

My big question from this exercise is where Derrick White would rank among the other young point guards if he was eligible.

Also, can we please, for the entire basketball community, get Ben Simmons out of Philly? The world could be so much more fun.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

White is 25.

Towns is 23, where is he? (He is younger than Simmons).

KAT is not younger than Simmons. Hes November 1995 and Simmons is July 1996. The cut off for this list it Jan 1 1996. KAT was on the list last year and aged out.

So between this and not actually reading what I said about Derrick White, your comment was a complete waste of time.


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[Jalexjsmithj]

I’m a big Sam fan, listened to each episode of the podcast that covered the list, he’s a big reason why I subscribe to the Athletic.

I was pretty shocked when I saw him rank Bam 25th. I need to revisit his reasoning but that one really took me aback.

I think it’s weird that when he got heat from Bulls fans earlier this offseason for suggesting a pretty crappy return for Lauri, he came back at the haters with the take Wendell>Lauri in the long game, and he made it clear then that he thought Lauri best position and a what team should be striving for is him at the 5 (he softened a bit on that a little in the last podcast). Now he’s got them flipped on a list that includes projected future.

My big question from this exercise is where Derrick White would rank among the other young point guards if he was eligible.

Also, can we please, for the entire basketball community, get Ben Simmons out of Philly? The world could be so much more fun.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

White is 25.

Towns is 23, where is he? (He is younger than Simmons).

Towns was born in 95, Simmons was born in 96.
However, if Ayton is like 8th, Towns should be top 5....



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Everybody agrees KAT would be top 4 if he qualifies but he doesn’t. Easy as that.


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[NotACat]

I think Aaron Gordon should be up there.

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I agree, but he's turning 24 very soon. He may have crossed their dob threshold

[Jalexjsmithj]

I think Aaron Gordon should be up there.

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I agree, but he's turning 24 very soon. He may have crossed their dob threshold

Must of been born in or after 1996.


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[ballup]

Those who are mad about their favorite player's ranking should listen to the Game Theory podcast where Sam backs up his rankings. He actually is on point and highly detailed with his critiques. He and his guest even acknowledge peoples' potential qualms about the rankings. Sam is not 100% right, but he did his homework

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[JHTruth]

I want to believe in guys like Booker and Ayton. Heck a lot of these guys, but the reality is most of them have never played in a single playoff game, and might not until their prime is done. Does it matter if you're a good young player when you play for awful teams?

[Crives]

I want to believe in guys like Booker and Ayton. Heck a lot of these guys, but the reality is most of them have never played in a single playoff game, and might not until their prime is done. Does it matter if you're a good young player when you play for awful teams?

What?
You do realize for the most part the bad teams have the good pre-prime star prospects?

[JHTruth]

I feel like Ben should be #1 considering he's only 1 of a handful listed that are actually key components to a championship contending team and has been that important since his rookie season.

he's also one of only 2 all stars in that list, with the other all star being d'angelo russell whom ben single handedly shut down in the playoffs this past season.

after ben, dlo, donovan and maybe murray, the rest of these dudes are just young players on bad teams that haven't achieved anything of note yet and/or just 3rd/4th options and are of very little significance unless proven otherwise. the 'yeah man, that guy is a fun young player to watch' type that are in teams fighting for a 30-52 record

This argument cuts both ways though. Thus far Tatum and Brown have been more successful in the playoffs than Simmons and Embiid. Should we automatically place them ahead?