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Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#141 » by god shammgod » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:30 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
god shammgod wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Evil?

No, he's just exceedingly bad at playing team ball.

And that's a psychological problem, not a talent one.


team ball has absolutely nothing to do with why melo isn't in the league now. at all. he barely got the ball once he left here to do anything with. he didn't even have the opportunity to be selfish. he was mostly a catch and shoot 3 point player and he just didn't hit enough 3s. it's not his mentality or anything like that. he has to be a stretch 4 now and he's just not efficient enough in that role. everyone talks about olympic melo but that was only a few games where he was hot from 3. he's older now and he couldn't do that for a whole season.


All he did was not hit enough threes, otherwise he was eager to do whatever the team wanted in OKC, is that right?

OK man


yes, i watched them quite a bit. did you ? here's a guy who covers the thunder for a living. maybe you'll believe him.

As we try to figure out how Melo fits in Houston, I guess we should start with this question: Why didn't it work in OKC?

Young: There's a lot to unpack when it comes to Melo's adjustment with the Thunder, but the simple answer is this: He didn't shoot the ball well. The "why" is the question, whether that was comfort, teammates, role, system or something else.

But one thing that always needs to be mentioned as a baseline: He effectively chose the Thunder. He waived his no-trade clause to join them, so it's not as if he was traded into a situation he wanted no part of. He understood up front he would be changing positions full-time to power forward and he knew he would have to approach the game at least slightly different.

He came to Oklahoma City with somewhat of the expectation that combining with Russell Westbrook and Paul George would form a superstar triad where shots were evenly distributed and scoring averages stable all around. They spent the entire training camp and first month of the season repeating to each other "you be you," but probably through gritted teeth, Anthony realized the Thunder didn't need him to be him anymore.

With the Rockets, Melo entered with a different mindset from the outset, being willing to come off the bench. It doesn't seem like he sees himself on equal footing with Harden and Paul, but more of the complementary piece OKC envisioned.

Like the Thunder, the Rockets are hoping to unlock "Olympic Melo," the near-mythical catch-and-shoot stretch 4 monster who feasts on open looks. He tried to be that guy in OKC, but just wasn't very good at it.

He took and made more 3s than in any year in his career: 42 percent of his shots were catch-and-shoot, up from 29 percent his last season with the New York Knicks. He was taking half the number of pull-up jumpers, fewer midrange shots and few isolation jab-stepping jumpers. Fifty percent of his shots came off of no dribbles, compared to 39.8 percent the season before.

But here's the striking number: On open 3s, he shot only 30.5 percent, and 37.8 percent on catch-and-shoot 3s. Most of those numbers align with how it has gone in Houston so far, and obviously the Rockets feel that in their system, with their players and possibly a better chemistry recipe, he can do better.


https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25209229/why-carmelo-anthony-fit-oklahoma-city-different-houston-nba

what's funny is, this is even a worse indictment of melo. as just not good enough at shooting the basketball to be in the league anymore. but this doesn't fit your narrative so you just don't want to believe it.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#142 » by Clyde_Style » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:35 am

god shammgod wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
god shammgod wrote:
team ball has absolutely nothing to do with why melo isn't in the league now. at all. he barely got the ball once he left here to do anything with. he didn't even have the opportunity to be selfish. he was mostly a catch and shoot 3 point player and he just didn't hit enough 3s. it's not his mentality or anything like that. he has to be a stretch 4 now and he's just not efficient enough in that role. everyone talks about olympic melo but that was only a few games where he was hot from 3. he's older now and he couldn't do that for a whole season.


All he did was not hit enough threes, otherwise he was eager to do whatever the team wanted in OKC, is that right?

OK man


yes, i watched them quite a bit. did you ? here's a guy who covers the thunder for a living. maybe you'll believe him.

As we try to figure out how Melo fits in Houston, I guess we should start with this question: Why didn't it work in OKC?

Young: There's a lot to unpack when it comes to Melo's adjustment with the Thunder, but the simple answer is this: He didn't shoot the ball well. The "why" is the question, whether that was comfort, teammates, role, system or something else.

But one thing that always needs to be mentioned as a baseline: He effectively chose the Thunder. He waived his no-trade clause to join them, so it's not as if he was traded into a situation he wanted no part of. He understood up front he would be changing positions full-time to power forward and he knew he would have to approach the game at least slightly different.

He came to Oklahoma City with somewhat of the expectation that combining with Russell Westbrook and Paul George would form a superstar triad where shots were evenly distributed and scoring averages stable all around. They spent the entire training camp and first month of the season repeating to each other "you be you," but probably through gritted teeth, Anthony realized the Thunder didn't need him to be him anymore.

With the Rockets, Melo entered with a different mindset from the outset, being willing to come off the bench. It doesn't seem like he sees himself on equal footing with Harden and Paul, but more of the complementary piece OKC envisioned.

Like the Thunder, the Rockets are hoping to unlock "Olympic Melo," the near-mythical catch-and-shoot stretch 4 monster who feasts on open looks. He tried to be that guy in OKC, but just wasn't very good at it.

He took and made more 3s than in any year in his career: 42 percent of his shots were catch-and-shoot, up from 29 percent his last season with the New York Knicks. He was taking half the number of pull-up jumpers, fewer midrange shots and few isolation jab-stepping jumpers. Fifty percent of his shots came off of no dribbles, compared to 39.8 percent the season before.

But here's the striking number: On open 3s, he shot only 30.5 percent, and 37.8 percent on catch-and-shoot 3s. Most of those numbers align with how it has gone in Houston so far, and obviously the Rockets feel that in their system, with their players and possibly a better chemistry recipe, he can do better.


https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25209229/why-carmelo-anthony-fit-oklahoma-city-different-houston-nba

what's funny is, this is even a worse indictment of melo. as just not good enough at shooting the basketball to be in the league anymore. but this doesn't fit your narrative so you just don't want to believe it.


My narrative?

I watched him for many years on my damn team.

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#143 » by blueNorange » Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:36 am

god shammgod wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
god shammgod wrote:i believe he was an all-star 3 years ago at 32

you mean the popularity contest that's fan voting and not actual production?


actually the coaches voted him in. the fans only pick the starters. they're not you, but they probably know a little something about basketball.

look, melo wasn't perfect at all. he could have done a lot of things better. he also wasn't the force of the evil in the universe that some of you make him out be. but i understand, realgm is not about nuance.

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#144 » by NYKAL » Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:56 pm

Capn'O wrote:
Nazrmohamed wrote:But make no mistake......nobody in current NBA circles appreciates that ****. If cloned prime Jordan himself walked into a game today somebody's gonna tell that dude. " hey look, it's obvious you're the most skilled and athletic player here but nobody wants to watch you post up guards at 18 ft for 10 seconds of the shot clock while taking 23 shots....it just ain't gonna happen dude"..and heres a player whose skill level is infallable


I agreed with a ton in your post in terms of preference for what to watch but one thing about Mike I've noticed when I go back and watch his tape is how quickly he attacks. Not a lot of wasted time or motion before whatever's about to happen to you happens. It wasn't that Mark Jackson backdown crap.



yeah, IF Jordan was holding the ball, he was waiting for people to get into place, otherwise he made pretty quick decisions. I would not call Jordan a ball stopper. As for Melo, a lot of players in the league still play the isolation game so, why is Melo treated like a dinosaur and they are not.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#145 » by Fat Kat » Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:58 pm

NYKAL wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Nazrmohamed wrote:But make no mistake......nobody in current NBA circles appreciates that ****. If cloned prime Jordan himself walked into a game today somebody's gonna tell that dude. " hey look, it's obvious you're the most skilled and athletic player here but nobody wants to watch you post up guards at 18 ft for 10 seconds of the shot clock while taking 23 shots....it just ain't gonna happen dude"..and heres a player whose skill level is infallable


I agreed with a ton in your post in terms of preference for what to watch but one thing about Mike I've noticed when I go back and watch his tape is how quickly he attacks. Not a lot of wasted time or motion before whatever's about to happen to you happens. It wasn't that Mark Jackson backdown crap.



yeah, IF Jordan was holding the ball, he was waiting for people to get into place, otherwise he made pretty quick decisions. I would not call Jordan a ball stopper. As for Melo, a lot of players in the league still play the isolation game so, why is Melo treated like a dinosaur and they are not.


He’s not efficient, doesn’t play defense, and doesn’t win.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#146 » by aq_ua » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:49 pm

br7knicks wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
god shammgod wrote:
actually the coaches voted him in. the fans only pick the starters. they're not you, but they probably know a little something about basketball.

look, melo wasn't perfect at all. he could have done a lot of things better. he also wasn't the force of the evil in the universe that some of you make him out be. but i understand, realgm is not about nuance.


Evil?

No, he's just exceedingly bad at playing team ball.

And that's a psychological problem, not a talent one.


he just never should have played in the NBA. he should've been the big name to make that Big 3 league years ago. i think melo would've been a legend in that league.

i feel i would've liked him and rooted for him in that league, because his inability to play as a team or pass the ball would've been perfect for that style. just can't stand that **** style basketball on my favorite team. rose wasn't much better, but i have yet to see a player reach as bad as melo when it comes to team basketball.

I mean, Amare was defensive player of the year...Melo surely still has a chance at greatness.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#147 » by Billy Goat » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:57 pm

NYKAL wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Nazrmohamed wrote:But make no mistake......nobody in current NBA circles appreciates that ****. If cloned prime Jordan himself walked into a game today somebody's gonna tell that dude. " hey look, it's obvious you're the most skilled and athletic player here but nobody wants to watch you post up guards at 18 ft for 10 seconds of the shot clock while taking 23 shots....it just ain't gonna happen dude"..and heres a player whose skill level is infallable


I agreed with a ton in your post in terms of preference for what to watch but one thing about Mike I've noticed when I go back and watch his tape is how quickly he attacks. Not a lot of wasted time or motion before whatever's about to happen to you happens. It wasn't that Mark Jackson backdown crap.



yeah, IF Jordan was holding the ball, he was waiting for people to get into place, otherwise he made pretty quick decisions. I would not call Jordan a ball stopper. As for Melo, a lot of players in the league still play the isolation game so, why is Melo treated like a dinosaur and they are not.


Because they can facilitate too.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#148 » by 3toheadmelo » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:00 pm

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#149 » by NYKAL » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:05 pm

Fat Kat wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
I agreed with a ton in your post in terms of preference for what to watch but one thing about Mike I've noticed when I go back and watch his tape is how quickly he attacks. Not a lot of wasted time or motion before whatever's about to happen to you happens. It wasn't that Mark Jackson backdown crap.



yeah, IF Jordan was holding the ball, he was waiting for people to get into place, otherwise he made pretty quick decisions. I would not call Jordan a ball stopper. As for Melo, a lot of players in the league still play the isolation game so, why is Melo treated like a dinosaur and they are not.


He’s not efficient, doesn’t play defense, and doesn’t win.


you are describing half the nba regarding inefficiency and only about 10% of the players know how to play defense
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#150 » by Jeff Van Gully » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:26 pm

prophet_of_rage wrote:
Jeff Van Gully wrote:
prophet_of_rage wrote:
What if he is about pro-Black sentiment (not pandering) and he has walked it while what has Derrick Rose done except buy sex toys?


didn't ssay mills isn't walking the walk. i'm talking about the humor i find in derrick rose's take and subsequent attack.

you can be pro-black, walk the walk, and still not connect to someone properly on a personal level. i thought that to be rose's problem.
Rose is saying Mills was fake. How do you miss that? Talking that Black dude ****.
Just be yourself.

He isn't saying they didn't connect. He thought Mills was fake.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk


being pro-black frfr and being fake aren't mutually exclusive concepts. i don't think we are necessarily in disagreement here.

i can talk to d rose about pro black stuff i believe in, and feign caring about d rose as a person... but not really care about dude. that would count as fake.

but it could also mean exactly what you're saying... that rose thinks mills is a fake woke or something.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#151 » by Stannis » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:29 pm

NYKAL wrote:
Fat Kat wrote:
NYKAL wrote:

yeah, IF Jordan was holding the ball, he was waiting for people to get into place, otherwise he made pretty quick decisions. I would not call Jordan a ball stopper. As for Melo, a lot of players in the league still play the isolation game so, why is Melo treated like a dinosaur and they are not.


He’s not efficient, doesn’t play defense, and doesn’t win.


you are describing half the nba regarding inefficiency and only about 10% of the players know how to play defense


And that was the issue. Melo was always treated like a player in that "10%".
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#152 » by Nazrmohamed » Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:15 pm

NYKAL wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Nazrmohamed wrote:But make no mistake......nobody in current NBA circles appreciates that ****. If cloned prime Jordan himself walked into a game today somebody's gonna tell that dude. " hey look, it's obvious you're the most skilled and athletic player here but nobody wants to watch you post up guards at 18 ft for 10 seconds of the shot clock while taking 23 shots....it just ain't gonna happen dude"..and heres a player whose skill level is infallable


I agreed with a ton in your post in terms of preference for what to watch but one thing about Mike I've noticed when I go back and watch his tape is how quickly he attacks. Not a lot of wasted time or motion before whatever's about to happen to you happens. It wasn't that Mark Jackson backdown crap.



yeah, IF Jordan was holding the ball, he was waiting for people to get into place, otherwise he made pretty quick decisions. I would not call Jordan a ball stopper. As for Melo, a lot of players in the league still play the isolation game so, why is Melo treated like a dinosaur and they are not.


For this response I'm not judging what's right or not, just stating possible reasons. But the difference might be that coaches and game plans dont mind dribble drive isolation as much as they do post up isolation. Why? Because most ball handlers are good passers out of the dribble drive (PGs, SGs, elite point forwards), whereas playmaking out of the post is limited and gets less of the team involved.

Truth is it doesnt have to and I've argued this when defending Melo. I noticed that Melo actually made some pretty timely passes when others move without the ball but when he posts up players seemingly always spread out. That's not gonna give a post player a ton of options unless he wants his passes intercepted. But part of that is on Melo for not passing enough to train his guys to expect a pass but it's also on coaches for not really having what I believe are advanced offenses with moving parts. Today I see very few teams that pass in the ways I'm talking about. Denver is one of them. They get the ball to Jokic in the post and he looks like the Sun with everyone else orbiting him in constant motion. It's not a PG dribble drive and kick offense. It's a post up offense with guards and wings that move. To me that's how you couldve maximized Melo but timing is everything, fads are all the rage and most coaches grew up today thinking every play must start out of the pick and roll between a PG and big with everyone else spread out and I suppose advanced stats support this.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#153 » by br7knicks » Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:15 pm

aq_ua wrote:
br7knicks wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Evil?

No, he's just exceedingly bad at playing team ball.

And that's a psychological problem, not a talent one.


he just never should have played in the NBA. he should've been the big name to make that Big 3 league years ago. i think melo would've been a legend in that league.

i feel i would've liked him and rooted for him in that league, because his inability to play as a team or pass the ball would've been perfect for that style. just can't stand that **** style basketball on my favorite team. rose wasn't much better, but i have yet to see a player reach as bad as melo when it comes to team basketball.

I mean, Amare was defensive player of the year...Melo surely still has a chance at greatness.


He still can. I'm sure he can Ball.

But I get it for Amar'e too. Big 3 isnt team basketball, and amare sucked at team defense because he was never taught it correctly - didn't go to college either.

Big 3 is all about individual play, so I can actually see amare doing **** like that. And melo doing well, too.

He should just have never done NBA, just create a big 3 league years ago...or at least prior to joining the Knicks to save us 7 years of **** basketball
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#154 » by dakomish23 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:31 pm

blueNorange wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:because what he said about melo is the very reason gm's refuse to sign him, coaches don't want to bother coaching him.


So you ignore the obvious delusion of the source to take the part that matches your beliefs?

Very on brand for you

what team is carmelo anthony currently on??


He's not potent enough offensively to cover for his unbelievably bad defense.

Also, the only guy from his draft class who's still in the NBA is one of the top 10 (at the minimum) greatest players of all time, Zaza & Korver

https://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/NBA_2003.html

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#155 » by dakomish23 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:34 pm

god shammgod wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
god shammgod wrote:i believe he was an all-star 3 years ago at 32

you mean the popularity contest that's fan voting and not actual production?


actually the coaches voted him in. the fans only pick the starters. they're not you, but they probably know a little something about basketball.

look, melo wasn't perfect at all. he could have done a lot of things better. he also wasn't the force of the evil in the universe that some of you make him out be. but i understand, realgm is not about nuance.


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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#156 » by blueNorange » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:51 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
So you ignore the obvious delusion of the source to take the part that matches your beliefs?

Very on brand for you

what team is carmelo anthony currently on??


He's not potent enough offensively to cover for his unbelievably bad defense.

Also, the only guy from his draft class who's still in the NBA is one of the top 10 (at the minimum) greatest players of all time, Zaza & Korver

https://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/NBA_2003.html

Pick a better argument

so the answer is no team right?

because he's not a team player, can't be coached, refuses to be coached, wants to chuck and duck like his entire career.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#157 » by dakomish23 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:01 pm

blueNorange wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:what team is carmelo anthony currently on??


He's not potent enough offensively to cover for his unbelievably bad defense.

Also, the only guy from his draft class who's still in the NBA is one of the top 10 (at the minimum) greatest players of all time, Zaza & Korver

https://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/NBA_2003.html

Pick a better argument

so the answer is no team right?

because he's not a team player, can't be coached, refuses to be coached, wants to chuck and duck like his entire career.


I answered the question and you proved yet again why you will take anything as validation of your beliefs.




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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#158 » by blueNorange » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:10 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
He's not potent enough offensively to cover for his unbelievably bad defense.

Also, the only guy from his draft class who's still in the NBA is one of the top 10 (at the minimum) greatest players of all time, Zaza & Korver

https://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/NBA_2003.html

Pick a better argument

so the answer is no team right?

because he's not a team player, can't be coached, refuses to be coached, wants to chuck and duck like his entire career.


I answered the question and you proved yet again why you will take anything as validation of your beliefs.

2019-20 - nobody wants melo
2018-19 - rockets got rid of melo
2017-18 - thunder got rid of melo
2016-17 - knicks got rid of melo
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#159 » by dakomish23 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:43 pm

blueNorange wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:so the answer is no team right?

because he's not a team player, can't be coached, refuses to be coached, wants to chuck and duck like his entire career.


I answered the question and you proved yet again why you will take anything as validation of your beliefs.

2019-20 - nobody wants melo
2018-19 - rockets got rid of melo
2017-18 - thunder got rid of melo
2016-17 - knicks got rid of melo


Keep proving my point.




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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#160 » by prophet_of_rage » Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:20 pm

Jeff Van Gully wrote:
prophet_of_rage wrote:
Jeff Van Gully wrote:
didn't ssay mills isn't walking the walk. i'm talking about the humor i find in derrick rose's take and subsequent attack.

you can be pro-black, walk the walk, and still not connect to someone properly on a personal level. i thought that to be rose's problem.
Rose is saying Mills was fake. How do you miss that? Talking that Black dude ****.
Just be yourself.

He isn't saying they didn't connect. He thought Mills was fake.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk


being pro-black frfr and being fake aren't mutually exclusive concepts. i don't think we are necessarily in disagreement here.

i can talk to d rose about pro black stuff i believe in, and feign caring about d rose as a person... but not really care about dude. that would count as fake.

but it could also mean exactly what you're saying... that rose thinks mills is a fake woke or something.
That isn't at all what he said, though. He said 'Always talking that Black dude ****. Just be yourself.' He said nothing about Mills pretending to care about him. The just bebyouself was directly related to the Black dude talk.

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