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Bradley Beal - Part III

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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1121 » by DCZards » Mon Aug 26, 2019 4:44 pm

Nate, the article says Beal had the most dunks by a Wizards “guard” in the last 20 yrs. It doesn’t say he had the most dunks by a Wizards player.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1122 » by Kanyewest » Mon Aug 26, 2019 4:49 pm

Javale McGee had 150+ one season.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1123 » by nate33 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 4:50 pm

DCZards wrote:Nate, the article says Beal had the most dunks by a Wizards “guard” in the last 20 yrs. It doesn’t say he had the most dunks by a Wizards player.

Thanks. That makes a lot of sense.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1124 » by nate33 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 4:53 pm

Kanyewest wrote:Javale McGee had 150+ one season.

:o

162 according to bball reference. I can't believe I forgot to check his numbers.

Interesting how infrequently we've had a guy like that. 150+ dunks isn't too uncommon for legit pick-and-roll finishers like Drummond, Capela, Jordan and McGee. But for most other players it's real hard to get anywhere near that many dunks.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1125 » by nate33 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 5:51 pm

nate33 wrote:
Kanyewest wrote:Javale McGee had 150+ one season.

:o

162 according to bball reference. I can't believe I forgot to check his numbers.

Interesting how infrequently we've had a guy like that. 150+ dunks isn't too uncommon for legit pick-and-roll finishers like Drummond, Capela, Jordan and McGee. But for most other players it's real hard to get anywhere near that many dunks.


I can't find a better way to look up the numbers other than go player by player, season by season. I may have missed someone, but as far as I can tell, Beal still has the second most dunks in a season other than McGee. Not bad for a 6-5 SG.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1126 » by nate33 » Wed Aug 28, 2019 9:25 pm

Scott Brooks on why Beal played the last few games after the Wizards were eliminated from playoff contention:

Scott Brooks wrote:I mean, we were going nowhere at the end of the season pretty fast. And I’m like, ‘Brad, you know what, I appreciate everything you’ve given me the last couple of years. And this year we’re not making the playoffs, we’re out. You want to like chill out the last couple of weeks and rest? And he said, ‘You know what, I signed up to be the leader of this team and do it every night.’ And he wanted to do that, and he wanted to play every game and that’s why he played for two years in a row already too.


Another small tidbit in the article:

Beal has played the full 82 games in the last two regular seasons, and the Wizards offered Beal a three-year, $111 million max extension this summer, as expected. He has not signed it yet, likely waiting to see if he would make All-NBA to up the maximum amount Washington can offer to $250 million.


That's been my assumption all along. Beal isn't refraining from resigning because he wants to move on, he's just waiting to see if he can get the supermax by making All-NBA. Good to hear that NBCSports is of the same belief.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1127 » by Ruzious » Wed Aug 28, 2019 9:38 pm

nate33 wrote:Scott Brooks on why Beal played the last few games after the Wizards were eliminated from playoff contention:

Scott Brooks wrote:I mean, we were going nowhere at the end of the season pretty fast. And I’m like, ‘Brad, you know what, I appreciate everything you’ve given me the last couple of years. And this year we’re not making the playoffs, we’re out. You want to like chill out the last couple of weeks and rest? And he said, ‘You know what, I signed up to be the leader of this team and do it every night.’ And he wanted to do that, and he wanted to play every game and that’s why he played for two years in a row already too.


Another small tidbit in the article:

Beal has played the full 82 games in the last two regular seasons, and the Wizards offered Beal a three-year, $111 million max extension this summer, as expected. He has not signed it yet, likely waiting to see if he would make All-NBA to up the maximum amount Washington can offer to $250 million.


That's been my assumption all along. Beal isn't refraining from resigning because he wants to move on, he's just waiting to see if he can get the supermax by making All-NBA. Good to hear that NBCSports is of the same belief.

The guy is exactly what you want in a star player - he's a leader who holds himself accountable (and relishes being a leader), and he absolutely believes in himself - to the point that he's betting on himself. It's hard not to be proud of the way Beal's developed and is still developing. Tbh, I didn't see it coming. I thought he was a too cool for school guy at times, but Real Deal Bradley Beal has emerged.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1128 » by DCZards » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:38 pm

Wizards Publicly Reiterate Desire To Keep Bradley Beal Long-Term
SEP 11, 2019 4:30 PM


The Washington Wizards have been resistant to trade offers on Bradley Beal.

Beal will become a free agent in 2021 if he doesn't sign an extension before then.

"The way that I look at this is pretty simple: If you were looking to build a team, Brad would be the type of player anyone would want to start with," Tommy Sheppard told CBS Sports. "You look at the character, the talent, the age, just the whole package ... Brad is without a doubt a core player in this league. Every team would love to have him, and we do. So we've never considered anything other than a situation where Brad is with us and leading us forward. We made that clear to him on the first day we could offer him an extension, and we'll continue to make that clear."
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1129 » by tontoz » Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:32 am

It would be pretty strange for them to ask for Beal's input on roster decisions, then turn around and trade him.

In spite of everything Beal seems to like it here. I think you have to at least try to keep him.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1130 » by payitforward » Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:12 pm

Wait, I don't understand. You've got a really good player, still young but already the leader of your team, & he wants to stay with you? Why do you want to keep this guy?

edit: I forgot something -- couldn't you get more by trading down?
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1131 » by nate33 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:35 pm

I get the feeling that Beal has paid attention to the career path of Damian Lillard versus Kevin Durant. Lillard hasn't won a title yet, but he is happy as the heart and soul of a very competitive Portland roster. Durant has 2 rings and is as unhappy as any player in the league.

I think Beal prefers the Damian Lillard path. He will stay as long as he feels the team has a reasonable chance at success going forward. He's not going to try and join a superteam just to win a championship, but he's not willing to toil around indefinitely on a 30-45 win team either.

If the Wizards can be competitive and win 30-35 games this year with Bryant, Brown and Hachimura carrying a substantial load, I think it will demonstrate that the team will easily be back in the 50-win chase the next year when Wall gets back and a solid free agent and high draft pick are added to the mix.

I just hope Beal will make that decision by next summer. I'm real uncomfortable going into the 20-21 season with Beal still not extended. Also, with Beal locked up, it will make it possible to trade Wall in a short term loss for long term gain deal.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1132 » by Wizardspride » Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:54 pm

nate33 wrote:I get the feeling that Beal has paid attention to the career path of Damian Lillard versus Kevin Durant. Lillard hasn't won a title yet, but he is happy as the heart and soul of a very competitive Portland roster. Durant has 2 rings and is as unhappy as any player in the league.

I think Beal prefers the Damian Lillard path. He will stay as long as he feels the team has a reasonable chance at success going forward. He's not going to try and join a superteam just to win a championship, but he's not willing to toil around indefinitely on a 30-45 win team either.

If the Wizards can be competitive and win 30-35 games this year with Bryant, Brown and Hachimura carrying a substantial load, I think it will demonstrate that the team will easily be back in the 50-win chase the next year when Wall gets back and a solid free agent and high draft pick are added to the mix.

I just hope Beal will make that decision by next summer. I'm real uncomfortable going into the 20-21 season with Beal still not extended. Also, with Beal locked up, it will make it possible to trade Wall in a short term loss for long term gain deal.

A question for you Nate:

What if Bradley doesn't actually want John to be traded?

What then?

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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1133 » by nate33 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:10 pm

Wizardspride wrote:
nate33 wrote:I get the feeling that Beal has paid attention to the career path of Damian Lillard versus Kevin Durant. Lillard hasn't won a title yet, but he is happy as the heart and soul of a very competitive Portland roster. Durant has 2 rings and is as unhappy as any player in the league.

I think Beal prefers the Damian Lillard path. He will stay as long as he feels the team has a reasonable chance at success going forward. He's not going to try and join a superteam just to win a championship, but he's not willing to toil around indefinitely on a 30-45 win team either.

If the Wizards can be competitive and win 30-35 games this year with Bryant, Brown and Hachimura carrying a substantial load, I think it will demonstrate that the team will easily be back in the 50-win chase the next year when Wall gets back and a solid free agent and high draft pick are added to the mix.

I just hope Beal will make that decision by next summer. I'm real uncomfortable going into the 20-21 season with Beal still not extended. Also, with Beal locked up, it will make it possible to trade Wall in a short term loss for long term gain deal.

A question for you Nate:

What if Bradley doesn't actually want John to be traded?

What then?

:dontknow:

I'd talk to him and try to get him to understand why a trade is needed. But ultimately, it's important to clarify that Beal is the player, not the GM. Active Players (and active coaches for that matter) make lousy GM's because they are always too focused on the short term.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1134 » by DCZards » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:27 pm

nate33 wrote:
If the Wizards can be competitive and win 30-35 games this year with Bryant, Brown and Hachimura carrying a substantial load, I think it will demonstrate that the team will easily be back in the 50-win chase the next year when Wall gets back and a solid free agent and high draft pick are added to the mix.

I just hope Beal will make that decision by next summer. I'm real uncomfortable going into the 20-21 season with Beal still not extended. Also, with Beal locked up, it will make it possible to trade Wall in a short term loss for long term gain deal.


If Wall comes back and is playing well and the team is in the 50-win chase, I seriously doubt that Beal would be happy trading Wall when he knows that that “short-term loss” could end up being long-term loss rather than long-term gain.

If you trade Wall with the team winning and Wall and Beal playing well together—and you can’t assure Beal that you’re going to be able to use the money saved by trading Wall to sign a top flight free agent or two—then you better be prepared for BB to also want out.

You're right about Beal probably being more like Lillard than Durant but there's only so much sacrifice you can ask of him.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1135 » by doclinkin » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:39 pm

nate33 wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
nate33 wrote:I get the feeling that Beal has paid attention to the career path of Damian Lillard versus Kevin Durant. Lillard hasn't won a title yet, but he is happy as the heart and soul of a very competitive Portland roster. Durant has 2 rings and is as unhappy as any player in the league.

I think Beal prefers the Damian Lillard path. He will stay as long as he feels the team has a reasonable chance at success going forward.

...

Also, with Beal locked up, it will make it possible to trade Wall in a short term loss for long term gain deal.

A question for you Nate:

What if Bradley doesn't actually want John to be traded?

What then?

:dontknow:

I'd talk to him and try to get him to understand why a trade is needed. But ultimately, it's important to clarify that Beal is the player, not the GM. Active Players (and active coaches for that matter) make lousy GM's because they are always too focused on the short term.





Still it speaks against the argument of Beal staying with the team out of loyalty etc. And its not the message they have been sending him or why he would be staying.

The team is trying to change its reputation not just in the win column to recruit free agents etc but as a destination for players AND THEIR FAMILIES to land here. In this era when players have so much influence on where they land and build super teams by recruiting friends, I think we want to use the leverage of good relations with players as a recruiting tool. If we show loyalty to players who respect our front office and vice versa it becomes a selling point. That a well respected FA who had his pick of teams recruiting him shose to build with us, that gets noted league wide.

And in relation to John Wall, that a team like DC stuck with a guy when he had injuries and showed up to care about him and provide the best care in the world and as a team didn't shop him around-- however fickle the fans were-- that too speaks in our favor. Whatever the numbers say about John Wall and the value of his contract PLAYERS respect the hellloutta him. He has influence. The fact that we stick by him and he publicly honors that and says good things about the front office through this whole process, all that builds our rep as a good destination for families who get tired of shopping for new school districts and houses etc.


Beal has a very close family group, from his mom teaching him to shoot to his big brothers protecting him, etc. Every quote about Beal and Wall's relationship has one or the other speaking about each other as 'brothers'. Beal's leadership of the young players tends to speak to this as well, he talks about family and looking out for them and teaching them. Even our PR wing pumps the notion of the Wizards as family. Players could choose anywhere in the world, contracts are short nowadays and guys switch all the time, but if we promote the idea that we look out for our guys thick and thin, win or lose on or off the court we may reap the benefits of long time loyalty, and earn a second look from guys who could choose any team in the league. I think this is a large part of our recruitment pitch to Beal. They want to give Beal and Wall a shot to see what they can do together, not hampered by Ernie, but with a chance to shape the franchise to suit their style and strengths. It's both business and family, they are trying to sell the idea of that double bottom line. Do well by doing good and vice versa. And change the way teams do business. Until either player asks out I think they will try to win with them both. Or at least give it their best shot.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1136 » by nate33 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:27 pm

doclinkin wrote:
nate33 wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:A question for you Nate:

What if Bradley doesn't actually want John to be traded?

What then?

:dontknow:

I'd talk to him and try to get him to understand why a trade is needed. But ultimately, it's important to clarify that Beal is the player, not the GM. Active Players (and active coaches for that matter) make lousy GM's because they are always too focused on the short term.





Still it speaks against the argument of Beal staying with the team out of loyalty etc. And its not the message they have been sending him or why he would be staying.

The team is trying to change its reputation not just in the win column to recruit free agents etc but as a destination for players AND THEIR FAMILIES to land here. In this era when players have so much influence on where they land and build super teams by recruiting friends, I think we want to use the leverage of good relations with players as a recruiting tool. If we show loyalty to players who respect our front office and vice versa it becomes a selling point. That a well respected FA who had his pick of teams recruiting him shose to build with us, that gets noted league wide.

And in relation to John Wall, that a team like DC stuck with a guy when he had injuries and showed up to care about him and provide the best care in the world and as a team didn't shop him around-- however fickle the fans were-- that too speaks in our favor. Whatever the numbers say about John Wall and the value of his contract PLAYERS respect the hellloutta him. He has influence. The fact that we stick by him and he publicly honors that and says good things about the front office through this whole process, all that builds our rep as a good destination for families who get tired of shopping for new school districts and houses etc.


Beal has a very close family group, from his mom teaching him to shoot to his big brothers protecting him, etc. Every quote about Beal and Wall's relationship has one or the other speaking about each other as 'brothers'. Beal's leadership of the young players tends to speak to this as well, he talks about family and looking out for them and teaching them. Even our PR wing pumps the notion of the Wizards as family. Players could choose anywhere in the world, contracts are short nowadays and guys switch all the time, but if we promote the idea that we look out for our guys thick and thin, win or lose on or off the court we may reap the benefits of long time loyalty, and earn a second look from guys who could choose any team in the league. I think this is a large part of our recruitment pitch to Beal. They want to give Beal and Wall a shot to see what they can do together, not hampered by Ernie, but with a chance to shape the franchise to suit their style and strengths. It's both business and family, they are trying to sell the idea of that double bottom line. Do well by doing good and vice versa. And change the way teams do business. Until either player asks out I think they will try to win with them both. Or at least give it their best shot.

I'm not talking about telling Wall to GTFO and unceremoniously kicking him to the curb.

Presumably, any Wall trade would involve some other team thinking John is the final piece to make them a contender. On the Wizards, Wall would toil on a 45-50 win squad for the last 2 years of his prime with no real chance for a title. But by making a trade, Wall gets a legitimate shot at contention before he declines. The point is, the trade wouldn't only be good for the long term outlook for the Wizards, it would be good for Wall too.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1137 » by doclinkin » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:41 pm

nate33 wrote:
doclinkin wrote:
nate33 wrote:I'd talk to him and try to get him to understand why a trade is needed. But ultimately, it's important to clarify that Beal is the player, not the GM. Active Players (and active coaches for that matter) make lousy GM's because they are always too focused on the short term.





Still it speaks against the argument of Beal staying with the team out of loyalty etc. And its not the message they have been sending him or why he would be staying.

The team is trying to change its reputation not just in the win column to recruit free agents etc but as a destination for players AND THEIR FAMILIES to land here. In this era when players have so much influence on where they land and build super teams by recruiting friends, I think we want to use the leverage of good relations with players as a recruiting tool. If we show loyalty to players who respect our front office and vice versa it becomes a selling point. That a well respected FA who had his pick of teams recruiting him shose to build with us, that gets noted league wide.

And in relation to John Wall, that a team like DC stuck with a guy when he had injuries and showed up to care about him and provide the best care in the world and as a team didn't shop him around-- however fickle the fans were-- that too speaks in our favor. Whatever the numbers say about John Wall and the value of his contract PLAYERS respect the hellloutta him. He has influence. The fact that we stick by him and he publicly honors that and says good things about the front office through this whole process, all that builds our rep as a good destination for families who get tired of shopping for new school districts and houses etc.


Beal has a very close family group, from his mom teaching him to shoot to his big brothers protecting him, etc. Every quote about Beal and Wall's relationship has one or the other speaking about each other as 'brothers'. Beal's leadership of the young players tends to speak to this as well, he talks about family and looking out for them and teaching them. Even our PR wing pumps the notion of the Wizards as family. Players could choose anywhere in the world, contracts are short nowadays and guys switch all the time, but if we promote the idea that we look out for our guys thick and thin, win or lose on or off the court we may reap the benefits of long time loyalty, and earn a second look from guys who could choose any team in the league. I think this is a large part of our recruitment pitch to Beal. They want to give Beal and Wall a shot to see what they can do together, not hampered by Ernie, but with a chance to shape the franchise to suit their style and strengths. It's both business and family, they are trying to sell the idea of that double bottom line. Do well by doing good and vice versa. And change the way teams do business. Until either player asks out I think they will try to win with them both. Or at least give it their best shot.

I'm not talking about telling Wall to GTFO and unceremoniously kicking him to the curb.

Presumably, any Wall trade would involve some other team thinking John is the final piece to make them a contender. On the Wizards, Wall would toil on a 45-50 win squad for the last 2 years of his prime with no real chance for a title. But by making a trade, Wall gets a legitimate shot at contention before he declines. The point is, the trade wouldn't only be good for the long term outlook for the Wizards, it would be good for Wall too.


So you think there is no chance a Wall/Beal team could contend for a Championship. Brad and John may think differently, or at least want to be given a real opportunity to make a play at it.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1138 » by payitforward » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:30 pm

Even if Brad & John do think there's a chance to contend for a title together, that doesn't mean John wouldn't be ok with a trade to an established title contender. OTOH, he has consistently repeated his desire to play his whole career for a single franchise.

There are a lot of moving parts here. Easiest thing to forget is that these guys are professionals. They make decisions with their teams of advisors, & - though desires/feelings must play a part - surely those decisions, overall, are driven by economic factors. The kind of $$ they make playing in the NBA they will never again approach. Their goals ought to be -- & I sure hope they are -- to maximize their wealth.

It's easy for fans to say "what's the difference between $100m in the bank &, say, $130m in the bank -- you're rich either way." But, when you make career decisions you can't think that way. The difference is $30m. That's a lot of money.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1139 » by Ruzious » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:45 pm

I don't see Wall getting traded. Remember he just turned 29. He likely won't return this season in time to prove he's all the way back, so he'll be 30/31 before he can really prove he's back, but that's when most players are losing a step. At that point he's getting paid over 40 mil a year. I just don't see anyone wanting to deal with John's situation. Let's hope he comes back strong as a Wizard.
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Re: Bradley Beal - Part III 

Post#1140 » by DCZards » Fri Sep 27, 2019 3:27 am

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