Magic Exercising 20-21 Option on Fultz

[GeorgeMarcus]

Some of your Sixers fans are cracked out. Time to get outside and get some air. This guy doesn't have "yips" for god sakes. He was a star in college and I doubt the "pressure of the nba" caused him to change his shot and become a shell of himself. He is a young guy making 12 million a year to play a game, that he loves. Could you ask for anything more?

Seriously, this manure of a narrative you guys are pushing to make yourselves feel better is just shameful.

The guy was diagnosed with a nerve injury, that isn't easy to spot. He is rehabbing in hopes of keeping his dream alive.

Please Sixer fans, stop being so salty at the prospect of him coming back, just because it isn't in your window. Just wish him luck and move on (preferably outside to get some air)

I liked your post in defense of Markelle, but I also gotta defend my people. Hating on Fultz was perpetuated first and foremost by non Sixers fans. The conclusion of his Philly saga left a bitter taste in our mouths, some more than others, but it wasn’t Philly fans diagnosing him with the yips, sexual impotence, and whatever else he’s accused of. Lloyd was always an exception to the rule.

I followed much of the debate on the Sixers forum but saw even Lloyd’s schtick mostly being about the misuse of a high draft pick by the Sixers and much “I told you so”ing because he had predicted the outcome.

This needn’t involve moral turpitude on Fultz’s part nor mean He doesn’t/didn’t have a genuine potentially resolvable physical problem, and if he does/did I don’t see why anyone should wish Him other than the best.

We certainly agree on the bolded, which is what I find so bizarre/saddening about the Fultz narrative. People don't like being the object of judgement or scrutiny, but we sure like to scrutinize and impose judgement.

[EAS Law]

What I find incredible is the vitriolic mockery and insistence that anyone that supports or believes in Markelle Fultz is an idiot because they have no medical grounds upon which to base their thoughts, however, the same rabid detractors have zero medical education and zero evidence to support their position either. It’s really great especially when you combine the clear and evident “I hope he never works out” bias from Sixers fans that seems to cause them to viciously attack both Fultz and anyone who dares to say he has a chance to meet his potential.

Shoot, now we’re arguing that he “fooled” every NBA scout and prospect reporting site and that he isn’t even an NBA level athlete. Seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

This is nonsense. The Sixers fans that are viciously attacking him now are the same guys who were viciously attacking him when he was a Sixer. Most Sixers fans wish the kid the best and at most just caution Magic fans to not get too invested in every positive "update" as we regrettably did.

I’d agree with you if any of the posts I can recall said anything about being cautious because of X reason. Unfortunately, most of what I’ve ever seen are posts mocking and chastising anyone that believes whatever issues Fultz has can be addressed.

A couple of your guys have been cool, but most have made it a point to be far less than agreeable.

[HotelVitale]

Fultz was 20-21 years old. He was already an above average "point guard defender", as you pointed out rebounder, he was killing it in transition, and yes he was a darn good athlete. His passing was ok at best but given his age, promising. He had an awful pull up shot (no clue who said he had one), was horrible and I mean horrible off ball on offense. The reality is he was a legit rotation player all be it not a good one. He wasn't a starter. . But not a player? Again given his age he was clearly a 6-10 year player in the league on athletics alone.

You're confusing me a little here so maybe let's use simpler terms: during his time with the Sixers Fultz played in the NBA but he was a bad player, and he was definitely worse than other meh options that the team could've used. He was worse than TJ McConnell, who was a league minimum guy; and he was easily worse than Trey Burke or Raul Neto were last year, the two guys the Sixers picked up for nothing this offseason to take McConnell/Fultz's spot as the backup PG.

We're also getting a little stuck on the semantics of 'athlete': if you watched him without knowing anything about his story, you wouldn't have said he was particularly good in transition or at defense, and you definitely wouldn't say 'wow what an athlete!'. Those were the things he did so maybe you would have said, 'he's got some promise in transition and rebounding and he uses his length well.' He looked like a guy with some sort of promise who wasn't close to ready and was extremely far from having a spot guaranteed for him in the NBA. Anything more than that doesn't seem fair, just let him be a guy fighting hard for his NBA life (who has a legit chance if he develops well).

[dhsilv2]

Fultz was 20-21 years old. He was already an above average "point guard defender", as you pointed out rebounder, he was killing it in transition, and yes he was a darn good athlete. His passing was ok at best but given his age, promising. He had an awful pull up shot (no clue who said he had one), was horrible and I mean horrible off ball on offense. The reality is he was a legit rotation player all be it not a good one. He wasn't a starter. . But not a player? Again given his age he was clearly a 6-10 year player in the league on athletics alone.

You're confusing me a little here so maybe let's use simpler terms: during his time with the Sixers Fultz played in the NBA but he was a bad player, and he was definitely worse than other meh options that the team could've used. He was worse than TJ McConnell, who was a league minimum guy; and he was easily worse than Trey Burke or Raul Neto were last year, the two guys the Sixers picked up for nothing this offseason to take McConnell/Fultz's spot as the backup PG.

We're also getting a little stuck on the semantics of 'athlete': if you watched him without knowing anything about his story, you wouldn't have said he was particularly good in transition or at defense, and you definitely wouldn't say 'wow what an athlete!'. Those were the things he did so maybe you would have said, 'he's got some promise in transition and rebounding and he uses his length well.' He looked like a guy with some sort of promise who wasn't close to ready and was extremely far from having a spot guaranteed for him in the NBA. Anything more than that doesn't seem fair, just let him be a guy fighting hard for his NBA life (who has a legit chance if he develops well).

You would say "wow he's smooth out there, that guy's one hell of an athlete." Again this guy went first in the draft for a reason. He is a top 10% guard level athlete.

[Creativetran]

I'm so glad Elton Brand had the sense to see through this Fultz nonsense. The kid can't play and wasn't anything at Washington either. He's successfully parlayed a good FIBA Under-18 tournament into fooling one bad GM into trading up to #1 to get him and fooling another bad GM into paying him his remaining 22 million in extensions. Fultz' handlers should get medals.

Talk about revisionist over here, Fultz the number guy for most of the year in a stacked draft.

[Creativetran]

I'm not sure I've ever wanted a guy to success more than Fultz with all the countless garbage hate he's gotten for no reason.

It's easy to see why Philli fans hate him, but wonder why so many other people do as well.

I don't see any reason for a philly fan to hate the guy. I'm not aware of him doing ANYTHING to justify such a strong reaction. All I've seen is a guy who seems to work hard, keep his mouth shut, and who's clearly had a run of bad luck. Maybe he never pans out but there's no reason to hate a guy for failing.

Because he was a huge bust FOR THEM

[Tanks1]

It's easy to see why Philli fans hate him, but wonder why so many other people do as well.

I don't see any reason for a philly fan to hate the guy. I'm not aware of him doing ANYTHING to justify such a strong reaction. All I've seen is a guy who seems to work hard, keep his mouth shut, and who's clearly had a run of bad luck. Maybe he never pans out but there's no reason to hate a guy for failing.

Because he was a huge bust FOR THEM

Sixers fan here. Can i speak? We do not hate Fultz. Very disappointed that it didn't work out. He was viewed as the final piece to
the process. Wish his well and hope he gets better. So stop speaking for us please.

You don't like us, you don't like us....but we don't care...........


10, 9, 8, 76ers !!!!

[dhsilv2]

It's easy to see why Philli fans hate him, but wonder why so many other people do as well.

I don't see any reason for a philly fan to hate the guy. I'm not aware of him doing ANYTHING to justify such a strong reaction. All I've seen is a guy who seems to work hard, keep his mouth shut, and who's clearly had a run of bad luck. Maybe he never pans out but there's no reason to hate a guy for failing.

Because he was a huge bust FOR THEM

Hate

feel intense or passionate dislike for (someone).

If that justifies hate, one's fandom is messing with the life in a very negative and scary way.

[Creativetran]

He has had a shoulder injury that should have been cleared up by now. Yet a year later we still don't know when he will be ready. But how bad could the injury have been if it did not require surgery?

If he really does have TOS or another nerve issue this is a HUGE **** injury, Landry Fields was a killer shooter before his nerve damage now hes out of the league at a young age.

[Creativetran]

lol...I swear anyone who thinks Fultz isn't elite athletically simply should just stop talking about basketball.

Seriously!!!! You can talk crap about the kid all you want and his mental state but just watching him play, hes a damnnnnn good athlete. I wouldn't call him elite like Westbrook, but more smooth like a Harden.

[Creativetran]

Even if he indeed had a good deceleration ( and i have no idea where you got that) it would nt make him an elite athlete. Harden is also not an elite athlete, although he is probably underrated in that regard.

Guys like Harden and more recently Doncic get called none athletic because they aren't traditionally explosive but there are all sorts of aspects to athleticism.

[VDT]

Even if he indeed had a good deceleration ( and i have no idea where you got that) it would nt make him an elite athlete. Harden is also not an elite athlete, although he is probably underrated in that regard.

Guys like Harden and more recently Doncic get called none athletic because they aren't traditionally explosive but there are all sorts of aspects to athleticism.

I didnt call him unathletic, i even said that he is underrated as an athlete. But he is not an elite nba athlete.

[VDT]

I saw him play last year and I would say he's a pretty elite athlete and is certainly a killer in transition. Without his jumpshot and whilst doing all the weird free throw stuff, he actually was playing pretty well. Nobody actually cares to notice that or give it credit. 8.2ppg on 42% shooting 3.7 rebounds and 3.1 assists. Put someone like that on the Raptors or Knicks for a season and we'd be hearing about the next big thing, not about a kid who fooled his way into the league. And that's whilst in the midst of these huge problems. Hate him all you want but he has huge potential.

If he were an elite athlete he would still be playing for the Sixers. He still had a pull up mid range jumper and he had decent court vision. You dont lose your job to TJ or tail to bring any value in a trade if you are all of the above.

The truth is, as i said, that Fultz is not an explosive athlete, which is part of the reason he was often getting blocked at the rim, and cannot create separation from the defender by himself. His size is an advantage as a pg but his not particularly arhletic for his size or for a pg. If he were to have any success in the NBA it would be through skill and craftiness, not through athleticism. Which is the reason why his shooting issues are such a problem. It is almost impossible to be even a starting pg when you are neither very athletic nor a good shooter.

Yeah if we're talking specifically and only about vertical leap, he's not an "explosive athlete", but I said he was elite, considering size, speed, change of direction etc.

He didn't lose his spot to TJ McConnell. He got shelved because of the focus on the shooting issues. He was playing at an OK level. But it was a call to stop and fix the issue (looking forward into his career) instead of maintaining this "average/ (injured)" level. He could've played on without any semblance of a jumpshot and maintained his spot in the rotation (as he did).

Your forcing a narrative that isn't there. I doubt you watched him play.

It is not just that he is not vertically explosive. Perhaps more important is that he cant create separation from the defender. His quickness and first step is not elite. He does have some size and length though.

He did lose his job to TJ who is also not shooting 3s so it was not just a shooting issue.

Also he was not shelved. His agent literally didnt allow him to play any more to save face ( it worked, his option was picked up). I highly doubt he was injured, he was fine all summer supposedly shooting thousands of 3s, and he only discovered that he is injured when his third year option was picked up and he was moved to the bench. He is either lying or he was injured all along from his first year until now which is probably more concerning.

[dhsilv2]

His agent literally didnt allow him to play any more to save face

Please cite a source showing this is a fact or stop posting it.

[michaelm]

If he were an elite athlete he would still be playing for the Sixers. He still had a pull up mid range jumper and he had decent court vision. You dont lose your job to TJ or tail to bring any value in a trade if you are all of the above.

The truth is, as i said, that Fultz is not an explosive athlete, which is part of the reason he was often getting blocked at the rim, and cannot create separation from the defender by himself. His size is an advantage as a pg but his not particularly arhletic for his size or for a pg. If he were to have any success in the NBA it would be through skill and craftiness, not through athleticism. Which is the reason why his shooting issues are such a problem. It is almost impossible to be even a starting pg when you are neither very athletic nor a good shooter.

Yeah if we're talking specifically and only about vertical leap, he's not an "explosive athlete", but I said he was elite, considering size, speed, change of direction etc.

He didn't lose his spot to TJ McConnell. He got shelved because of the focus on the shooting issues. He was playing at an OK level. But it was a call to stop and fix the issue (looking forward into his career) instead of maintaining this "average/ (injured)" level. He could've played on without any semblance of a jumpshot and maintained his spot in the rotation (as he did).

Your forcing a narrative that isn't there. I doubt you watched him play.

It is not just that he is not vertically explosive. Perhaps more important is that he cant create separation from the defender. His quickness and first step is not elite. He does have some size and length though.

He did lose his job to TJ who is also not shooting 3s so it was not just a shooting issue.

Also he was not shelved. His agent literally didnt allow him to play any more to save face ( it worked, his option was picked up). I highly doubt he was injured, he was fine all summer supposedly shooting thousands of 3s, and he only discovered that he is injured when his third year option was picked up and he was moved to the bench. He is either lying or he was injured all along from his first year until now which is probably more concerning.

So they paid off Hanlen his shooting coach, who eventually concluded that Fultz had an injury after quite strenuous efforts to fix his shot, as well did they ?. The whole chain of events is consistent with Fultz having an unusual and difficult to diagnose injury which interfered with a genuine attempt to fix his shot, and him being as mystified about what ailed him as everyone else. If he has the yips he has the yips, but that condition which would not be his fault either is I gather unusual in basketball and would be unusual in general at his age/stage in a sporting career, but according to you and others of your ilk it is possible for him to unusually have that condition but not for him to have a different unusual condition.

You seem to be at odds with yourself in what you argue, and to be essentially arguing simultaneously that he is unlikely to have an injury because several doctors couldn’t diagnose it with your alternative hypothesis being that he does have an injury and has successfully and wilfully hidden it from the same doctors.

It is indeed an intricate and devious scam if it is one given it involved him being sufficiently convincing as a scam artist to become the consensus number 1 draft pick in the first place.