The thing about Porzingis...

[3toheadmelo]

KP is good but he falls off in the second half every year and shoots 40% from the field. On top of that he doesn’t rebound and rarely passes the ball. With all those flaws he is also coming off an ACL tear. Drama seems to follow him too. Knicks were wise to move him.

[dirkforpres]

He was putting up absurd numbers as a 22 year old.. to say otherwise is crazy.

If he can stay healthy he’s a top 5 PF in the league

[homecourtloss]

—The players he defended normally shot 62.4% from the field from 6ft and under from the rim. They shot 48.7% against porzingis, 13.6% WORSE than usual. That’s incredible. https://stats.nba.com/player/204001/defense-dash/?Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season

—For those who played at least 40 games and defended 5+ shots per game, Porzingis was the best defender for shots contested 6ft or less from the basket.

https://stats.nba.com/players/defense-dash-lt6/?Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&CF=FGA_LT_06*GE*5:GP*GE*40&sort=PLUSMINUS&dir=-1

—For those who played at least 40 games and defended 5+ shots righnst the rim, Porzingis was by far the best defender in the NBA, allowing less than 50% FG which is crazy.

https://stats.nba.com/players/defensive-impact/?Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&sort=DEF_RIM_FG_PCT&dir=-1&CF=DEF_RIM_FGA*GE*5:GP*GE*40

We have tracking data going back to 2014: only Roy Hibbert (2014–by far the best we have at 44%, a big reason Indy had the best defense in the NBA in 2014),Serge Ibaka (2014 and 015), and Gobert (2015 and 2017) have defended 5+ shots a game and held players to under 50% FG.

[E-Balla]

And was a top 3 rim protector in the league. I love that people completly ignore that he is a game changer on defense.
2.4 blks, league leading DFG% at the rim.
Even if he never gets any better a guy that is among the most impactful defenders in the league and scores 20+ PPG is an allstar.
In a worst case scenario he is the best/only 3&D center in the league. Let him protect the rim and spot up for 3.

He *can be a game changer on defense. In NY he didn't play hard on that end at all after his rookie season and wasn't that good overall. Hopefully he can pick it up on the Mavs.

Also he's not a center. He's the worst rebounder I've seen at the center spot along with Bargnani and he's the worst post defender over 6-10 in the league. He hates contact. I won't forget when he gave up like 20 in a half to Dwight Howard when Jeff refused to put a C next to him against Charlotte. It's like water through toilet paper when an actual C backs into KP.

He's been an extremely effective rim defender as a PF on weak side blocks. Don't assume he'll be as effective as the primary rim defender, that's what people assumed with KAT coming from the NCAA to the NBA and it didn't translate well.

[ellobo]

And was a top 3 rim protector in the league. I love that people completly ignore that he is a game changer on defense.
2.4 blks, league leading DFG% at the rim.
Even if he never gets any better a guy that is among the most impactful defenders in the league and scores 20+ PPG is an allstar.
In a worst case scenario he is the best/only 3&D center in the league. Let him protect the rim and spot up for 3.

He *can be a game changer on defense. In NY he didn't play hard on that end at all after his rookie season and wasn't that good overall. Hopefully he can pick it up on the Mavs.

Also he's not a center. He's the worst rebounder I've seen at the center spot along with Bargnani and he's the worst post defender over 6-10 in the league. He hates contact. I won't forget when he gave up like 20 in a half to Dwight Howard when Jeff refused to put a C next to him against Charlotte. It's like water through toilet paper when an actual C backs into KP.

He's been an extremely effective rim defender as a PF on weak side blocks. Don't assume he'll be as effective as the primary rim defender, that's what people assumed with KAT coming from the NCAA to the NBA and it didn't translate well.

Okay, I realize you are talking specifically about his defense on Dwight in that game, which I can't defend (pun intended).

But the Knicks won that game and Porzingis had 28pts on 10-15 shooting/4-8 from three/4-4 from the line.

As cited in a previous post, his opponents' field goal percentage against him close to the basket is elite, and I disagree that that is only an artifact of role or lineup combinations.

[jinxed]

1. Defense is half of basketball, and arguably even more important than offense for big men
2. He was 21.

[zonedefense]

And was a top 3 rim protector in the league. I love that people completly ignore that he is a game changer on defense.
2.4 blks, league leading DFG% at the rim.
Even if he never gets any better a guy that is among the most impactful defenders in the league and scores 20+ PPG is an allstar.
In a worst case scenario he is the best/only 3&D center in the league. Let him protect the rim and spot up for 3.

He *can be a game changer on defense. In NY he didn't play hard on that end at all after his rookie season and wasn't that good overall. Hopefully he can pick it up on the Mavs.

Also he's not a center. He's the worst rebounder I've seen at the center spot along with Bargnani and he's the worst post defender over 6-10 in the league. He hates contact. I won't forget when he gave up like 20 in a half to Dwight Howard when Jeff refused to put a C next to him against Charlotte. It's like water through toilet paper when an actual C backs into KP.

He's been an extremely effective rim defender as a PF on weak side blocks. Don't assume he'll be as effective as the primary rim defender, that's what people assumed with KAT coming from the NCAA to the NBA and it didn't translate well.

He is among the top 3 in DFG% in the paint since they started tracking the numbers. He also averaged 2+ blocks. Statistically he is one of the best post defenders as well. Even though he isn´t the strongest his length is a big problem for guys that try to post up against him.

I don´t see any of the weaknesses you mentioned. If he can have that much of an defensive impact without playing "hard" he will run away with the DPOY award in the future. I don´t see the soft white euro stereo type.

NY was a lot better on defense with him on the floor. They also rebounded better. If rebounding is his biggest weakness I gladly accept it because overall it doesn´t seem to make an negative impact on his team.
In addition he will have a competent coaching staff and useful teammates for the first time in his career.

The only question that remains is his health. I am not convinced that he is able to make it through an NBA season without missing at least 20 games.

[zimpy27]

And was a top 3 rim protector in the league. I love that people completly ignore that he is a game changer on defense.
2.4 blks, league leading DFG% at the rim.
Even if he never gets any better a guy that is among the most impactful defenders in the league and scores 20+ PPG is an allstar.
In a worst case scenario he is the best/only 3&D center in the league. Let him protect the rim and spot up for 3.

Manute Bol would be proud

[blueNorange]

another thing about porzingis, he hates playing the center position because he hates banging down low.

he's gone on record saying this, that's why he always had rolo and then kanter taking the task of defending the post consistently.

kristaps porizings is a 7 foot 3 small forward.

[The_Hater]

He was putting up absurd numbers as a 22 year old.. to say otherwise is crazy.

If he can stay healthy he’s a top 5 PF in the league

I would think that his ceiling is higher than that. He’s already arguably a top 5 PF. Top 7 at worst.

The thing is, he should be playing Center.

[I_Like_Dirt]

I would think that his ceiling is higher than that. He’s already arguably a top 5 PF. Top 7 at worst.

The thing is, he should be playing Center.

Carlisle has caught on to the defensive advantages of mobility. I'm guessing we'll see Porzingis at C for a significant amount of time this season. I'm particularly curious to see a Doncic/Porzingis PF/C combo as I think that would cause all sorts of problems for opposing teams and while the Mavs don't have any elite guards they have a solid amount of decent ones. He'll play some PF, too, though. He's not totally unlike Serge Ibaka on defense in that sense.

As others mentioned, Porzingis' only real problems are conditioning and health.

[HollowEarth]

And he was what, 21 years old. I am not sure whats the deal with this constant Porzingis downplay as of late.

Same appeal as creative writing. Porzingis could be anything when he comes back; it's been a while since he played. When Durant gets healthy expect the same torrent of speculation.

[HBK_Kliq_33]

People are actually sleeping on him if he returns healthy and didn't lose a step, his peak will be top 10 player easily. 7"3 lights out shooter who can score in different ways and is a very good rim protector.

[Scalabrine]

I'm glad most people have hit the nail on the head here with KP.

I also think his rebounding concerns are a little overblown and his low numbers was mostly scheme based. He played alongside 2 very good rebounding Centers in Kanter and O'Quinn and Melo was also a good rebounding 3. He was mainly tasked for protecting the rim and contesting the shots while those guy grabbed the miss. He put up some really huge rebounding games in his rookie year.

He's a major impact player. We were battling for a playoff spot before he got injured and then went 4-26 or something close to that after he got hurt and Tim Hardaway Jr. and Enes Kanter became our best players. On a team with another legit scorer, plus a nice supporting cast, he should be better. The biggest factor for him will being able to stay healthy and on the court, it's a HUGE gamble that the Mavs took on his health but if it pays off, they're gonna have one of the best 1-2 punches in the NBA for the next decade.

[Texas Chuck]

... is that his All-Star season, 2017-2018, was overrated. He played in 48 games, shot less than 44% from the field, and had fewer than 7 rebounds per game. IMO, people too easily fall in love with players who can break 20 ppg.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying he doesn't have the tools to be great; he does.

Does anyone rate that season all that highly, though? I mean all-star births are what they are. Did it help that he was a Knick? Oh yeah. Did it help that he was seen as a unicorn? Oh yeah. But lots of guys have one-off all-star years but no one thinks they had some special season. See Magloire, Jamal for instance.

Right now he's a lot more potential than he has been production. If he can be happier in Dallas than he seemed to be in New York, and he if can mesh with Luka, well playing for a coach like Carlisle he's going to be in a great situation to maximize what he can be.

But really random to start a thread on his 2018 season. Have people been hyping it up and I've just missed it?

[KG Leonard]

... is that his All-Star season, 2017-2018, was overrated. He played in 48 games, shot less than 44% from the field, and had fewer than 7 rebounds per game. IMO, people too easily fall in love with players who can break 20 ppg.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying he doesn't have the tools to be great; he does.

No people easily fall in love with the potential of 22 year old unicorns. A guy that has handles like a dribbling SF, post moves like a great big man man and shoots like all-time great like Dirk.

All-star season or not a more athletic, faster, better handling version of a player like Dirk that is sixth in all-time scoring list will be liked by most fans...

Skickat från min SM-N950F via Tapatalk

[MrBigShot]

That raw stat production is pales in comparison to what he could be capable of with some guidance and a season where he stays healthy.

[E-Balla]

And was a top 3 rim protector in the league. I love that people completly ignore that he is a game changer on defense.
2.4 blks, league leading DFG% at the rim.
Even if he never gets any better a guy that is among the most impactful defenders in the league and scores 20+ PPG is an allstar.
In a worst case scenario he is the best/only 3&D center in the league. Let him protect the rim and spot up for 3.

He *can be a game changer on defense. In NY he didn't play hard on that end at all after his rookie season and wasn't that good overall. Hopefully he can pick it up on the Mavs.

Also he's not a center. He's the worst rebounder I've seen at the center spot along with Bargnani and he's the worst post defender over 6-10 in the league. He hates contact. I won't forget when he gave up like 20 in a half to Dwight Howard when Jeff refused to put a C next to him against Charlotte. It's like water through toilet paper when an actual C backs into KP.

He's been an extremely effective rim defender as a PF on weak side blocks. Don't assume he'll be as effective as the primary rim defender, that's what people assumed with KAT coming from the NCAA to the NBA and it didn't translate well.

Okay, I realize you are talking specifically about his defense on Dwight in that game, which I can't defend (pun intended).

But the Knicks won that game and Porzingis had 28pts on 10-15 shooting/4-8 from three/4-4 from the line.

As cited in a previous post, his opponents' field goal percentage against him close to the basket is elite, and I disagree that that is only an artifact of role or lineup combinations.

This literally has nothing to do with my post so idk why you felt the need to post this...

[E-Balla]

And was a top 3 rim protector in the league. I love that people completly ignore that he is a game changer on defense.
2.4 blks, league leading DFG% at the rim.
Even if he never gets any better a guy that is among the most impactful defenders in the league and scores 20+ PPG is an allstar.
In a worst case scenario he is the best/only 3&D center in the league. Let him protect the rim and spot up for 3.

He *can be a game changer on defense. In NY he didn't play hard on that end at all after his rookie season and wasn't that good overall. Hopefully he can pick it up on the Mavs.

Also he's not a center. He's the worst rebounder I've seen at the center spot along with Bargnani and he's the worst post defender over 6-10 in the league. He hates contact. I won't forget when he gave up like 20 in a half to Dwight Howard when Jeff refused to put a C next to him against Charlotte. It's like water through toilet paper when an actual C backs into KP.

He's been an extremely effective rim defender as a PF on weak side blocks. Don't assume he'll be as effective as the primary rim defender, that's what people assumed with KAT coming from the NCAA to the NBA and it didn't translate well.

He is among the top 3 in DFG% in the paint since they started tracking the numbers. He also averaged 2+ blocks.

So like I said he's good defending the rim at PF, why move him to C where his biggest weaknesses show?

Statistically he is one of the best post defenders as well. Even though he isn´t the strongest his length is a big problem for guys that try to post up against him.

No he isn't lmao. In 2016 KP was in the 13th percentile of post defenders in PPP allowed. The worst starting big in the league. In 2018 he was in the 51st percentile, still lower than most starting big men and almost dead average for ALL players in the league. You clearly don't watch the Knicks. I do.

I don´t see any of the weaknesses you mentioned.

I mean you haven't watched him play for 4 years and you don't look up numbers so how would you?

If he can have that much of an defensive impact without playing "hard" he will run away with the DPOY award in the future. I don´t see the soft white euro stereo type.

NY was a lot better on defense with him on the floor.

You must be talking about another player. Why not look up his numbers before saying something KNOWING you have no idea what the numbers say? In 2017 he only had a -1.8 defensive on/off which is weak and was under (for example) Willy Hernangomez. Justin Holiday (a clearly better defender that year in my eyes watching games) led the team with a -7.5. in 2018 he had a -3.8 which was decent, but isn't special and was well under the team leader, Frank at -7.6. I never said he was a bad defender at PF (he is at C), he just doesn't give a ****. He was an impact defender as a rookie and to this day that's his best season because he doesn't care about defense or playing hard anymore.

They also rebounded better.

Reading comprehension. They rebounded horribly when he was AT CENTER. KP isn't a center.

[Sark]

He's really good, and the Knicks are going to rue the day they traded him. The only way this works out for NY is if he gets hurt again. If he stays healthy, the trade will be viewed as a complete disaster in the future.