Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report

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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#241 » by 70sFan » Thu Oct 3, 2019 2:23 pm

SpreeS wrote:Hakeem's PO opponents at C position on championship run in 94

1st rnd Chris Dudley, Mark Bryant
2nd rnd Oliver Miller, Joe Klein, Mark West
3rd rnd Felton Spencer
Finals P.Ewing

It could be the weakest opponents list on championship run for ATG player.


Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#242 » by dhsilv2 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 2:43 pm

70sFan wrote:
SpreeS wrote:Hakeem's PO opponents at C position on championship run in 94

1st rnd Chris Dudley, Mark Bryant
2nd rnd Oliver Miller, Joe Klein, Mark West
3rd rnd Felton Spencer
Finals P.Ewing

It could be the weakest opponents list on championship run for ATG player.


Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova


Will never get this idea that we should judge players in a team sport by who might be the person who gets them as a defensive assignment. Doesn't make sense with Hakeem, Curry, Wilt, MJ...or anyone else. If basketball were that simple, every team would just go to their best matchup and play iso and win every game.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#243 » by SpreeS » Thu Oct 3, 2019 2:45 pm

70sFan wrote:
SpreeS wrote:Hakeem's PO opponents at C position on championship run in 94

1st rnd Chris Dudley, Mark Bryant
2nd rnd Oliver Miller, Joe Klein, Mark West
3rd rnd Felton Spencer
Finals P.Ewing

It could be the weakest opponents list on championship run for ATG player.


Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova


in reality

1st Evans/Holiday
2nd Conley
3rd 37y Terry
Finals Irving/Delly
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#244 » by WarriorGM » Thu Oct 3, 2019 3:05 pm

70sFan wrote:
SpreeS wrote:Hakeem's PO opponents at C position on championship run in 94

1st rnd Chris Dudley, Mark Bryant
2nd rnd Oliver Miller, Joe Klein, Mark West
3rd rnd Felton Spencer
Finals P.Ewing

It could be the weakest opponents list on championship run for ATG player.


Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova


Hakeem never faced Jordan in the playoffs. Curry faced previous MVP Durant and succeeding MVP Westbrook simultaneously.

Curry's 2015 opponents could also be described as follows:

1st round Anthony Davis (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
2nd round Marc Gasol (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
3rd round James Harden (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
Finals LeBron James (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#245 » by michaelm » Thu Oct 3, 2019 3:05 pm

dhsilv2 wrote:
70sFan wrote:
SpreeS wrote:Hakeem's PO opponents at C position on championship run in 94

1st rnd Chris Dudley, Mark Bryant
2nd rnd Oliver Miller, Joe Klein, Mark West
3rd rnd Felton Spencer
Finals P.Ewing

It could be the weakest opponents list on championship run for ATG player.


Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova


Will never get this idea that we should judge players in a team sport by who might be the person who gets them as a defensive assignment. Doesn't make sense with Hakeem, Curry, Wilt, MJ...or anyone else. If basketball were that simple, every team would just go to their best matchup and play iso and win every game.

Exactly. Hakeem is certainly a better Center than Curry is. I didn’t follow the NBA as closely then, but I gather Hakeem wasn’t all that bad at dishing assists for that matter. I do recall that Hakeem’s titles were somewhat ascribed to the MJ interregnum, probably unfairly, evidence that all sorts of shade is thrown even at some of the best end most successful players, Hakeem and Curry included.

I think it is hard to argue against both players being very influential for successful teams, and being among the very best ever in their respective positions, I am sure both can live with that as a legacy. As you have said perhaps Curry in addition has changed the league as much as any player has, but that can be better evaluated when he is 10 or 20 years retired.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#246 » by rtiff68 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 3:20 pm

WarriorGM wrote:
70sFan wrote:
SpreeS wrote:Hakeem's PO opponents at C position on championship run in 94

1st rnd Chris Dudley, Mark Bryant
2nd rnd Oliver Miller, Joe Klein, Mark West
3rd rnd Felton Spencer
Finals P.Ewing

It could be the weakest opponents list on championship run for ATG player.


Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova


Hakeem never faced Jordan in the playoffs. Curry faced previous MVP Durant and succeeding MVP Westbrook simultaneously.

Curry's 2015 opponents could also be described as follows:

1st round Anthony Davis (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
2nd round Marc Gasol (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
3rd round James Harden (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
Finals LeBron James (2015 1st Team All-NBA)


That was the only time in history that a member of the All NBA 1st team went through every other member of the All NBA 1st team en route to a title...and it was in the notoriously more difficult Conference...

...but let’s keep up the narrative that 2015 was “lucky because the field was weak due to injuries.”

Want some historical context? The 1987 Lakers only faced one team with a winning record— the 42-40 Warriors in the 2nd round— before reaching the Finals.

Their path, and the paths of every other champion, was WAY more difficult than GSW’s in 2015, though.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#247 » by BayWarrior » Thu Oct 3, 2019 4:17 pm

I have Curry around 15 right now but do think top 10 is not out of the question. For all this talk about the Centers being better basketball players cause of defense, not many of them would be able to even bring the ball up the court 90 ft. Wilt, Kareem, Duncan, Russel, Shaq and Robinson need a player like Curry more than Curry would need them to be an all time great. He will never break into the top 5 ahead of MJ, LBJ, Kobe, Magic and Bird who could do everything (other players like KD could be in this too) but with a few more great seasons he could break the top 10.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#248 » by Hoopstar23 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:07 pm

BayWarrior wrote:I have Curry around 15 right now but do think top 10 is not out of the question. For all this talk about the Centers being better basketball players cause of defense, not many of them would be able to even bring the ball up the court 90 ft. Wilt, Kareem, Duncan, Russel, Shaq and Robinson need a player like Curry more than Curry would need them to be an all time great. He will never break into the top 5 ahead of MJ, LBJ, Kobe, Magic and Bird who could do everything (other players like KD could be in this too) but with a few more great seasons he could break the top 10.


a couple great seasons along with titles and i can see him get in the Top 5 ofc add some finals MVPs too
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#249 » by TheDoors24 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:11 pm

Yeah Curry being top ten over Kobe is pretty silly.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#250 » by clyde21 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:13 pm

TheDoors24 wrote:Yeah Curry being top ten over Kobe is pretty silly.


Curry 6 year peak > any Kobe 6 year peak, quite comfortably

so not really that silly depending on how much you value longevity, and Steph's still 31.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#251 » by TheDoors24 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:16 pm

clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:Yeah Curry being top ten over Kobe is pretty silly.


Curry 6 year peak > any Kobe 6 year peak, quite comfortably

so not really that silly depending on how much you value longevity, and Steph's still 31.


You know Basketball is more than just offense right? Kobes offense, defense, accolades and longevity along with a billion other reasons clearly shows he should be above curry.

I know you're a warriors fan so of course you're view is biased and thats fine it's absolutely natural plus you're also in the mist of watching Curry in his prime right now but most would agree that Kobe should be ahead of him. Honestly i would put Durant ahead of him as well.

When i was in the middle of watching Kobe in his prime i was like "omg this has to be the best player ever the stuff he's doing is stunning blah blah" but once you see things objectively and then you'll realize that current Curry over Kobe is silly.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#252 » by AMW27 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:18 pm

BayWarrior wrote:I have Curry around 15 right now but do think top 10 is not out of the question. For all this talk about the Centers being better basketball players cause of defense, not many of them would be able to even bring the ball up the court 90 ft. Wilt, Kareem, Duncan, Russel, Shaq and Robinson need a player like Curry more than Curry would need them to be an all time great. He will never break into the top 5 ahead of MJ, LBJ, Kobe, Magic and Bird who could do everything (other players like KD could be in this too) but with a few more great seasons he could break the top 10.
Duncand and Roninson never had a player like Curry.

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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#253 » by clyde21 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:18 pm

TheDoors24 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:Yeah Curry being top ten over Kobe is pretty silly.


Curry 6 year peak > any Kobe 6 year peak, quite comfortably

so not really that silly depending on how much you value longevity, and Steph's still 31.


You know Basketball is more than just offense right? Kobes offense, defense, accolades and longevity along with a billion other reasons clearly shows he should be above curry.


yes, and even when Kobe was a 'better' defender than Steph, he still wasn't nearly as impactful. Steph's raw and impact metrics ALL dwarf Kobe's...so that variance on defense obviously doesn't tip the scales for Kobe

and what accolades? Steph has 1 more MVP already than Kobe, won just as many rings in any 6 year peak you use for Kobe, better box score #s, better impact and advanced metrics, a better winning %...

'BUT REASONS'...lol
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#254 » by TheDoors24 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:20 pm

clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
Curry 6 year peak > any Kobe 6 year peak, quite comfortably

so not really that silly depending on how much you value longevity, and Steph's still 31.


You know Basketball is more than just offense right? Kobes offense, defense, accolades and longevity along with a billion other reasons clearly shows he should be above curry.


yes, and even when Kobe was a 'better' defender than Steph, he still wasn't nearly as impactful. Steph's raw and impact metrics ALL dwarf Kobe's...so that variance on defense obviously doesn't tip the scales for Kobe

and what accolades? Steph has 1 more MVP already than Kobe, won just as many rings in any 6 year pick you use for Kobe, better box score #s, better impact and advanced metrics, a better winning %...

'BUT REASONS'...lol


1 more MVP wow. Ok cool. You win.

Agree to disagree.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#255 » by clyde21 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:22 pm

TheDoors24 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:
You know Basketball is more than just offense right? Kobes offense, defense, accolades and longevity along with a billion other reasons clearly shows he should be above curry.


yes, and even when Kobe was a 'better' defender than Steph, he still wasn't nearly as impactful. Steph's raw and impact metrics ALL dwarf Kobe's...so that variance on defense obviously doesn't tip the scales for Kobe

and what accolades? Steph has 1 more MVP already than Kobe, won just as many rings in any 6 year pick you use for Kobe, better box score #s, better impact and advanced metrics, a better winning %...

'BUT REASONS'...lol


1 more MVP wow. Ok cool. You win.

Agree to disagree.


really? that's the only thing u got from my post?
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#256 » by TheDoors24 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:24 pm

clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
yes, and even when Kobe was a 'better' defender than Steph, he still wasn't nearly as impactful. Steph's raw and impact metrics ALL dwarf Kobe's...so that variance on defense obviously doesn't tip the scales for Kobe

and what accolades? Steph has 1 more MVP already than Kobe, won just as many rings in any 6 year pick you use for Kobe, better box score #s, better impact and advanced metrics, a better winning %...

'BUT REASONS'...lol


1 more MVP wow. Ok cool. You win.

Agree to disagree.


really? that's the only thing u got from my post?


No is just you're dead set on your opinion and so am I so instead of arguing this back and forth i decided to move on. I already gave you my opinion and i've read yours. We good.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#257 » by clyde21 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:32 pm

TheDoors24 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:
1 more MVP wow. Ok cool. You win.

Agree to disagree.


really? that's the only thing u got from my post?


No is just you're dead set on your opinion and so am I so instead of arguing this back and forth i decided to move on. I already gave you my opinion and i've read yours. We good.


you said that putting Curry over Kobe is 'silly', I explained to you why it's not depending on what is valued...I personally don't even have Steph over Kobe at this point, so you're wrong on that too
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#258 » by TheDoors24 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 5:58 pm

clyde21 wrote:
TheDoors24 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:
really? that's the only thing u got from my post?


No is just you're dead set on your opinion and so am I so instead of arguing this back and forth i decided to move on. I already gave you my opinion and i've read yours. We good.


you said that putting Curry over Kobe is 'silly', I explained to you why it's not depending on what is valued...I personally don't even have Steph over Kobe at this point, so you're wrong on that too


Yes you did explain it and i read it and i disagree with it and i'm moving on.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#259 » by WarriorGM » Thu Oct 3, 2019 6:03 pm

TheDoors24 wrote:You know Basketball is more than just offense right? Kobes offense, defense, accolades and longevity along with a billion other reasons clearly shows he should be above curry.

I know you're a warriors fan so of course you're view is biased and thats fine it's absolutely natural plus you're also in the mist of watching Curry in his prime right now but most would agree that Kobe should be ahead of him. Honestly i would put Durant ahead of him as well.

When i was in the middle of watching Kobe in his prime i was like "omg this has to be the best player ever the stuff he's doing is stunning blah blah" but once you see things objectively and then you'll realize that current Curry over Kobe is silly.


Sure basketball is more than offense. It's more than just defense. It's also more than just offense and defense of a single player. It's a team game. Kobe had two seasons where his team ranked in the top 3 in defense. Curry has had three such seasons. People will claim that Curry's teammates are more responsible for the defense and that is probably true, but it is also true those teams wouldn't have had the same success defensively and overall without the offense Curry provided. Curry's offense allowed his teams to be great defensively.

What the billion other reasons that show Kobe should be ahead of Curry elude me. Feel free to start enumerating.

You may feel that Kobe is ahead and that Durant is ahead too but at least one analysis of their scoring, which is the calling card of both Kobe and Durant, based mainly on cold hard numbers actually concluded Curry was a better scorer than both. Invoking objectivity here is likely to help Curry not hurt him.

It's understandable if you have an attachment to Kobe and felt when watching him that "omg this has to be the best player ever the stuff he's doing is stunning blah blah" but you have to realize Curry has inspired the same awe for performances that were quite unlike anything seen before.
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Re: Steph Top 10 All Time - According to Bleacher report 

Post#260 » by mademan » Thu Oct 3, 2019 6:07 pm

rtiff68 wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
70sFan wrote:
Yeah and next year he faced Robinson and Shaq, he proved himself more than enough. Of course he still faced Ewing in 1994.

Not even mentioning that this logic doesn't make sense. Let's laugh at Curry's 2015 opponents:

1st round Norris Cole
2nd round injured Mike Conley
3rd round 40 years old Jason Terry
Finals Matthew Dellavedova


Hakeem never faced Jordan in the playoffs. Curry faced previous MVP Durant and succeeding MVP Westbrook simultaneously.

Curry's 2015 opponents could also be described as follows:

1st round Anthony Davis (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
2nd round Marc Gasol (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
3rd round James Harden (2015 1st Team All-NBA)
Finals LeBron James (2015 1st Team All-NBA)


That was the only time in history that a member of the All NBA 1st team went through every other member of the All NBA 1st team en route to a title...and it was in the notoriously more difficult Conference...

...but let’s keep up the narrative that 2015 was “lucky because the field was weak due to injuries.”

Want some historical context? The 1987 Lakers only faced one team with a winning record— the 42-40 Warriors in the 2nd round— before reaching the Finals.

Their path, and the paths of every other champion, was WAY more difficult than GSW’s in 2015, though.


Dude, this was 4 years ago. You cant rewrite history that fast. Every team the W's faced in 2015 had major injuries. That was not a difficult run; their finals opponent trotted out Matthew freakin Delladova as it's 2nd best player

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