Training Camp Thread, 2019-20 -- Strus, Gates & Maten Waived

[Homerclease]

Kemba-Brown-Hayward-Tatum-Theis
Smart-Edwards-Semi-Kanter are the locked in 9 with Grant Williams & Bob Williams pushing for minutes.

Kanter needs to get it together in a hurry. He’s been thoroughly outplayed by Theis and Williams so far

[cloverleaf]

Kemba-Brown-Hayward-Tatum-Theis
Smart-Edwards-Semi-Kanter are the locked in 9 with Grant Williams & Bob Williams pushing for minutes.

Kanter needs to get it together in a hurry. He’s been thoroughly outplayed by Theis and Williams so far

Brad plays most of his roster, especially early in the year. Neither RW nor EK is at risk of sitting this season. Both will be good enough for minutes. Theis can probably start against the smaller, second-tier centers, but Enes and/or Rob or, even in Brad's weird lineup changes, where he pulls a third-fourth stringer to start, Poirier will need to fill in there against the big guys. The hope of course is that Rob can develop to be a consistent starter by the end of the year, since it is first-tier centers that they'll largely be facing in the playoffs, but both he and Poirier would have to come on strong for Danny to trade Kanter, as one of their few vets, during the year.

[FeedReed]

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

[zoyathedestroya]

Kanter has had one season (out of 8 years in the league) where he had a positive on/off net rating (per BBRef). So I don't really expect much from him other than to fight for boards and get easy putbacks as a 20-min bench player. I'm leaning towards a David Lee-esque or Monroe-ish impact when it comes to him. Hope he proves me wrong. Seems like a good locker room dude though who gets along with everyone.

I wouldn't mind a possibly inconsequential minor trade such as Semi + Kanter for Meyers Leonard and a 2nd by mid-December if we're still in need of big man help. Opens up a roster spot. Like Tatum and Embiid, Leonard has trained with Hanlen. Can stroke the three. Doesn't back down against physical guys. Can piss opponents off. Played really well against the Warriors in their recent WCF.

Side-note: With a bit of maneuvering, we could've traded for Leonard last summer and still held on to the MLE which went to Kanter.

[Parliament10]

Kemba-Brown-Hayward-Tatum-Theis
Smart-Edwards-Semi-Kanter are the locked in 9 with Grant Williams & Bob Williams pushing for minutes.

Kanter needs to get it together in a hurry. He’s been thoroughly outplayed by Theis and Williams so far

Brad plays most of his roster, especially early in the year. Neither RW nor EK is at risk of sitting this season. Both will be good enough for minutes. Theis can probably start against the smaller, second-tier centers, but Enes and/or Rob or, even in Brad's weird lineup changes, where he pulls a third-fourth stringer to start, Poirier will need to fill in there against the big guys. The hope of course is that Rob can develop to be a consistent starter by the end of the year, since it is first-tier centers that they'll largely be facing in the playoffs, but both he and Poirier would have to come on strong for Danny to trade Kanter, as one of their few vets, during the year.

Agreed. -- Semi and Wanamaker are on short leashes though.

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

I expect Edwards and G.Will to have a good chance of being in the Rotation.

[cloverleaf]

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

Agreed re: Semi and also Carsen--though not quite to that extreme. Still, a great early showing. He's a piece they need and should get plenty of time from the start.

[cloverleaf]

Kanter needs to get it together in a hurry. He’s been thoroughly outplayed by Theis and Williams so far

Brad plays most of his roster, especially early in the year. Neither RW nor EK is at risk of sitting this season. Both will be good enough for minutes. Theis can probably start against the smaller, second-tier centers, but Enes and/or Rob or, even in Brad's weird lineup changes, where he pulls a third-fourth stringer to start, Poirier will need to fill in there against the big guys. The hope of course is that Rob can develop to be a consistent starter by the end of the year, since it is first-tier centers that they'll largely be facing in the playoffs, but both he and Poirier would have to come on strong for Danny to trade Kanter, as one of their few vets, during the year.

Agreed. -- Semi and Wanamaker are on short leashes though.

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

I expect Edwards and G.Will to have a good chance of being in the Rotation.

They're the two I expect to stick with the C's all season, with Carsen coming in ahead of Grant re: time earned. But I expect Grant will get somewhat regular minutes as well. My hope is that Carsen and Tremont can play the point well enough for Wanamaker to get a nice handoff to another team. Semi provides some defensive depth against the big "swings" in the league, but he's pretty hard to watch (and like Yabu last season, really hasn't seemed to have progressed much at all).

[Half-Full]

Brad plays most of his roster, especially early in the year. Neither RW nor EK is at risk of sitting this season. Both will be good enough for minutes. Theis can probably start against the smaller, second-tier centers, but Enes and/or Rob or, even in Brad's weird lineup changes, where he pulls a third-fourth stringer to start, Poirier will need to fill in there against the big guys. The hope of course is that Rob can develop to be a consistent starter by the end of the year, since it is first-tier centers that they'll largely be facing in the playoffs, but both he and Poirier would have to come on strong for Danny to trade Kanter, as one of their few vets, during the year.

Agreed. -- Semi and Wanamaker are on short leashes though.

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

I expect Edwards and G.Will to have a good chance of being in the Rotation.

They're the two I expect to stick with the C's all season, with Carsen coming in ahead of Grant re: time earned. But I expect Grant will get somewhat regular minutes as well. My hope is that Carsen and Tremont can play the point well enough for Wanamaker to get a nice handoff to another team. Semi provides some defensive depth against the big "swings" in the league, but he's pretty hard to watch (and like Yabu last season, really hasn't seemed to have progressed much at all).

The comparison with Guerschon Yabusele is an apt one. Semi is well liked by teammates and coaching staff (as was Guerschon), but where is the progress? Semi is not showing it. With Strus and Green fighting for the 15th roster spot, why not waive or trade Semi (if someone is willing to take him), and sign both Strus and Green?

[sam_I_am]

Kanter has had one season (out of 8 years in the league) where he had a positive on/off net rating (per BBRef). So I don't really expect much from him other than to fight for boards and get easy putbacks as a 20-min bench player. I'm leaning towards a David Lee-esque or Monroe-ish impact when it comes to him. Hope he proves me wrong. Seems like a good locker room dude though who gets along with everyone.

I wouldn't mind a possibly inconsequential minor trade such as Semi + Kanter for Meyers Leonard and a 2nd by mid-December if we're still in need of big man help. Opens up a roster spot. Like Tatum and Embiid, Leonard has trained with Hanlen. Can stroke the three. Doesn't back down against physical guys. Can piss opponents off. Played really well against the Warriors in their recent WCF.

Side-note: With a bit of maneuvering, we could've traded for Leonard last summer and still held on to the MLE which went to Kanter.

Kanter was starting Center on WCF team and faced down Adams and Jokic. I’m not trying to overate him or ignore his flaws.....but he is a guy you can run with in the playoffs. He’s still a solid asset. No other center on this team can make that claim....not even Theis who played limited minutes as third string back up in C’s run to ECF. We can’t expect Kanter to carry our team like Al did. However, if Hayward, Tatum, Brown and Kemba together can bring it like Lillard and McCollum did .... Kanter can help.

[Celts17Pride]

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

Ojeleye needs to get out of the weight room and onto the basketball court.

Semi may but a champion weightlifter but he sucks at basketball

[zoyathedestroya]

Kanter has had one season (out of 8 years in the league) where he had a positive on/off net rating (per BBRef). So I don't really expect much from him other than to fight for boards and get easy putbacks as a 20-min bench player. I'm leaning towards a David Lee-esque or Monroe-ish impact when it comes to him. Hope he proves me wrong. Seems like a good locker room dude though who gets along with everyone.

I wouldn't mind a possibly inconsequential minor trade such as Semi + Kanter for Meyers Leonard and a 2nd by mid-December if we're still in need of big man help. Opens up a roster spot. Like Tatum and Embiid, Leonard has trained with Hanlen. Can stroke the three. Doesn't back down against physical guys. Can piss opponents off. Played really well against the Warriors in their recent WCF.

Side-note: With a bit of maneuvering, we could've traded for Leonard last summer and still held on to the MLE which went to Kanter.

Kanter was starting Center on WCF team and faced down Adams and Jokic. I’m not trying to overate him or ignore his flaws.....but he is a guy you can run with in the playoffs. He’s still a solid asset. No other center on this team can make that claim....not even Theis who played limited minutes as third string back up in C’s run to ECF. We can’t expect Kanter to carry our team like Al did. However, if Hayward, Tatum, Brown and Kemba together can bring it like Lillard and McCollum did .... Kanter can help.

I'd still want to upgrade from Kanter via trade if there's an opportunity. We primarily need defense from our bigs esp. considering we have Kemba and Edwards as PG defenders. None of our bigs are ideal centers in a tough playoff environment, but I think both Poirier and Theis (potentially R.Williams too) can help more on defense than Kanter, who is not improving there at this point. In terms of sizable salary, it's either him or Theis that's dispensable, without including Brown/Smart/Hayward.

Celtics have at least two months and up to 3.5 months to evaluate our bigs. Kanter isn't eligible to be traded until mid-December anyway.

[PtruthP34]

Let's say hypothetically Waters dominates the G-League as he should and we do pull off small trade to free up a permanent roster spot for him. Barring injuries, there really aren't many minutes left over at guard for Tremont after Kemba, Jaylen, Smart, and Edwards. With that said, Brad loves his 3 guard lineups so I would be fine with one of Kemba or Waters being on the floor at almost all times and Smart and Jaylen finding minutes at the 3.

Another option is to move Smart to the starting unit and roll out Kemba, Smart, Brown, Tatum (Team USA Squad) + whichever big based on matchups (hopefully TL is ready because that lineup would be incredible in the lanes and on the break). Leaving a bench unit of Waters, Edwards, Hayward, GWill, +bigs.

I realize I'm suggesting we send our highest paid player to the bench to accommodate a rookie 2nd rounder, but this may be one way to maximize the talent on the floor. Everything about Waters screams special to me, and if that holds up, I don't want to wait a whole year before integrating him into the rotation.

[GuyClinch]

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

Ojeleye needs to get out of the weight room and onto the basketball court.

Semi may but a champion weightlifter but he sucks at basketball

No one in the NBA sucks at basketball come on. Semi would dominate pretty much anyone in hoops outside of pros. Reminds me of that video of J. Brown some amateur guy (who was actually pretty good). Made him look like he was just learning..

Semi of course is playing pros.. So he is certainly borderline. Personally I think Green is the better talent - and I'd cut Semi who gets less out of his athleticism then he should..

Some guys are great athletes but their skill level is just not that high compared to guys like Green so their athleticism doesn't shine through. Semi should be like Tony Allen - but instead he is just Semi.

Wanamaker is another try hard AAA type that I'd have no issues moving on from with our new rookies. He is good enough to contribute to most NBA teams but you don't seem him becoming a big time player.. Waters lacks size but skill wise is better and he moves more fluidly to boot.

Truth is just because you are on an NBA roster doesn't mean you are better then some guy who got paid in Euroleague or some second round pick I think Green is straight up better then Semi. Smarter player with better basketball skill and equivalent athleticism - though not as strong clearly.. Waters is better then Wanamaker. Danny should just move on..

[100proof]

Let's say hypothetically Waters dominates the G-League as he should and we do pull off small trade to free up a permanent roster spot for him. Barring injuries, there really aren't many minutes left over at guard for Tremont after Kemba, Jaylen, Smart, and Edwards. With that said, Brad loves his 3 guard lineups so I would be fine with one of Kemba or Waters being on the floor at almost all times and Smart and Jaylen finding minutes at the 3.

Another option is to move Smart to the starting unit and roll out Kemba, Smart, Brown, Tatum (Team USA Squad) + whichever big based on matchups (hopefully TL is ready because that lineup would be incredible in the lanes and on the break). Leaving a bench unit of Waters, Edwards, Hayward, GWill, +bigs.

I realize I'm suggesting we send our highest paid player to the bench to accommodate a rookie 2nd rounder, but this may be one way to maximize the talent on the floor. Everything about Waters screams special to me, and if that holds up, I don't want to wait a whole year before integrating him into the rotation.

I have been beating the team USA to start and hayward to the bench drum for some time.

Only not convinced I have Edward's at the 2 guard on that unit. I think Edward's is first backup to pg and then you have to look at 1 of green/langford/semi to be that missing piece there.
Water is back and forth but ends season as 3rd pg.

Kemba/smart/brown/tatum/Williams
Edwards/hayward/green/grant or theis/kanter
Waters/langford/semi/grant or theis/poirier

Of course barring any trades , of which I expect a couple to happen by time trade restrictions on recent signees are lifted

[100proof]

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

Ojeleye needs to get out of the weight room and onto the basketball court.

Semi may but a champion weightlifter but he sucks at basketball

No one in the NBA sucks at basketball come on. Semi would dominate pretty much anyone in hoops outside of pros. Reminds me of that video of J. Brown some amateur guy (who was actually pretty good). Made him look like he was just learning..

Semi of course is playing pros.. So he is certainly borderline. Personally I think Green is the better talent - and I'd cut Semi who gets less out of his athleticism then he should..

Some guys are great athletes but their skill level is just not that high compared to guys like Green so their athleticism doesn't shine through. Semi should be like Tony Allen - but instead he is just Semi.

Wanamaker is another try hard AAA type that I'd have no issues moving on from with our new rookies. He is good enough to contribute to most NBA teams but you don't seem him becoming a big time player.. Waters lacks size but skill wise is better and he moves more fluidly to boot.

Truth is just because you are on an NBA roster doesn't mean you are better then some guy who got paid in Euroleague or some second round pick I think Green is straight up better then Semi. Smarter player with better basketball skill and equivalent athleticism - though not as strong clearly.. Waters is better then Wanamaker. Danny should just move on..

You don't cut semi. Trade him. He is a good contract that someone will gamble on.

Semi and maten for thon makur or Christian wood.

Detroit gets wing depth and defense and frees up a glut of pfs. Boston adds a potential starting pf.

Also boston frees a roster spot

[sam_I_am]

semi being a lock is just lol. being able to benchpress 10000 pounds doesn’t translate to basketball talent, hasn’t in his case anyway. i do like that edwards has already carved out his spot in the rotation. other than brown, and walker, he’s looked like the best player on the team.

Ojeleye needs to get out of the weight room and onto the basketball court.

Semi may but a champion weightlifter but he sucks at basketball

No one in the NBA sucks at basketball come on. Semi would dominate pretty much anyone in hoops outside of pros. Reminds me of that video of J. Brown some amateur guy (who was actually pretty good). Made him look like he was just learning..

Semi of course is playing pros.. So he is certainly borderline. Personally I think Green is the better talent - and I'd cut Semi who gets less out of his athleticism then he should..

Some guys are great athletes but their skill level is just not that high compared to guys like Green so their athleticism doesn't shine through. Semi should be like Tony Allen - but instead he is just Semi.

Wanamaker is another try hard AAA type that I'd have no issues moving on from with our new rookies. He is good enough to contribute to most NBA teams but you don't seem him becoming a big time player.. Waters lacks size but skill wise is better and he moves more fluidly to boot.

Truth is just because you are on an NBA roster doesn't mean you are better then some guy who got paid in Euroleague or some second round pick I think Green is straight up better then Semi. Smarter player with better basketball skill and equivalent athleticism - though not as strong clearly.. Waters is better then Wanamaker. Danny should just move on..

I agree with everything you said here. I think Semi is fortunate in that he is only proven guy on roster that fills the role of wing with strength to guard PFs and some C. Green is squarely behind Tatum, Hayward, Brown, Smart and Edwards for minutes at SG or SF. He will never play whereas Brad will use Semi situationally. I personally feel pain watching Semi play....he really looks like a ball and chain dragging down the entire team offense every time he is out there. And is defense his incredibly overrated. That said, Brad is the coach and Semi is his guy.

Wannamaker is a solid 1 year option. His size and veteran savvy make him a good third string PG. I like Waters better but it isn’t a bad idea to let him play in Maine while he reworks his body and then bring him back next year with 4 year rookie deal. He isn’t going to impact this team that much this year so the 45 games he gets to play as a 2 way player is plenty.

[thomas1897]

Training camp has given Brad Stevens a measurement of what this team can do and depth that this team has. One area the team does not have a strong all purpose power forward at position four. Last year the Celtics had Al Horford, Marcus Morris and Daniel Theis were the occupants. However, Brad Stevens can experiment using Enes Kanter and Daniel Theis at the four with Robert Williams and Vincent Poirier and Tacko Fall at the five. This gives the Celtics more depth and an upgrade all these players are under 29 years of age and have potential to improve. The importance of the bench to have 10 or 11 solid players to carry the starters when injuries, foul trouble, fatigue and suspensions occur. Brad Stevens is a very good coach on development and he knows how to produce good players. The last game with Cleveland Cavaliers is a good example of how he has provided good coaching skills and confidence to his bench players and rookies to win without his starters. Give much thanks to Danny Ainge providing the talent that is necessary to be competitive and possibly win a championship.

[zoyathedestroya]

Dear mods, kindly merge. Thanks.

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[Parliament10]

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Kemba, Marcus, JB, Tatum, Hayward?