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OT: Official KP Thread

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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#401 » by duetta » Sat Oct 26, 2019 5:35 pm

EricAnderson wrote:I love how people are pointing out KP’s flaws like only flawless great players are allowed to play for us. He’s not perfect but he’s still damn good at what he does well.

We traded KP for DSJ whos an abomination. So basically we traded him for probably two mid first rounders which anyone being non bias would say that’s malpractice by a gm


Different argument. The jury is out on Perry, and has already handled out the most severe sentence possible for Mills. Mills only has a job because he evidently knows how to stroke Dolan's nuts better than anyone else.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#402 » by Oscirus » Sat Oct 26, 2019 5:41 pm

nedleeds wrote:
Oscirus wrote:
nedleeds wrote:And if salty Knicks fans who blame KP and not Pills actually watched the Mavs they'd see he's busy contesting shots at an elite level and letting Luka and Brunson grab and go instead of stat padding. We'd have gotten Brunson instead of DSJ at least we'd have an NBA pg.

Yes because shotblockers don't rebound. When you as tall as KP 8 a game should be the minimum.


I watched both games he could have easily Deandre / Westbrooked 4 more useless rebounds from Doncic, Brunson and Wright. He just starts running. If that useless dated stat just said 8 he'd all of sudden be fine? GTFO. He is actively challenging every shot inside 15 feet and he's basically top 3 in the world at it. That causes misses that his teammates grab and **** go. Because they have players who aren't turds like Jarret Jack, Derrick Rose, Mudiay, CAlderon and **** Trey Burke surrounding him.

KP is awesome, young and going to get better. We got pumped so hard up the ahh ho on this trade and as it becomes more clear what a road apple DSJ is and how the Mavs picks will be middle end first round it just gets more painful.

This thread will remain a testament to Mills and Perrys complete ineptitude until they are **** fired.


Right which is why Robinson got 1 less rebound in this game then KP did in both combined despite challenging everything and not stealing rebounds and playing in only 19 minutes? Its not useless data, his ass is lazy. There's a reason he got his ass sat down in prime time last night.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#403 » by Rasho Brezec » Sat Oct 26, 2019 5:47 pm

We sold low and got low value in return.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#404 » by frothbrain » Sat Oct 26, 2019 5:49 pm

Rasho Brezec wrote:We sold low and got low value in return.

It's not selling low if there is only one buyer.

Teams weren't giving up **** for an injured KP.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#405 » by ozwizard8 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:08 pm

duetta wrote:
EricAnderson wrote:I love how people are pointing out KP’s flaws like only flawless great players are allowed to play for us. He’s not perfect but he’s still damn good at what he does well.

We traded KP for DSJ whos an abomination. So basically we traded him for probably two mid first rounders which anyone being non bias would say that’s malpractice by a gm


Different argument. The jury is out on Perry, and has already handled out the most severe sentence possible for Mills. Mills only has a job because he evidently knows how to stroke Dolan's nuts better than anyone else.

Perry has a record as an accomplice of the NBA's worst FO. Jury should've given their verdict on Perry after Kings/Magic days of the Perry.
Personally, I don't like the idea of judging FO with the results. For a mid 1st round pick you might pick the new Giannis or you can get a Ginobili/Dray.Green for late 2nd rounder. I am not going to go 3-4 years back and say hey we got the new Giannis for KP. Judge the average value of the pick.
After Harden's trade, he could've suffered from a career-ending injury. That wouldn't mean Morey **** up.

*Mavs wanted to trade their 2nd-year player desperately. DSJ looked really bad, playing out of the system, inefficient and selfish. He could've turned around the things. So maybe Knicks had 10% chance to get sth out of DSJ.
*Salary unloading. That was the dumbest thing. Perry promoted that as if they're going to sign Durant or such but nothing come out. I tried to explain that it doesn't give Knicks more chance but most believed we're getting KD etc.
Just check sign n trade deals of D'Russell and J.Butler. Knicks could've showcase KP for 10 games and then they'd be able to sign&trade him for salary offload to create 2nd max slot. Mavs give that 5 year max without watching him live in NBA game. There'd be many teams willing to take the risk for KP just for some salary.
*No-one knows where would picks end up. We don't know what happens to Mavs. Pick in lottery could become a #1 or Mavs can win title and Knick can get 30th pick. Then again in some draft classes even top 5 guys are trash and for some of them you have great prospects even in late lottery. On average, it is fair to say those picks have average value of 15-25th pick region. Thats not bad but not that great either.
*Not drafting DSJ and giving that THJ contracts done by Mills just 1.5 years before KP trade. I wouldn't accept that trade without Mills resignation.

KP has injury risks but other than ACL he was less injury-prone than A.Davis. Even for knee health, I think he has similar level of concern with J.Embiid.
He has some slight on-court and off-court personality issues. I mean he's not Tim Duncan-Dirk. He has more ego for sure. But then again its managable. Most NBA stars have similar flaws. Do you think Kyrie-KD has a great mental state? Do you think Lebron throwing people under the bus is nice for other players? Do you think is it easy to deal with CP3 or WB for players or coaches?
Kawhi went against the most respected coach of NBA. Huge red flag if you ask me. But Toronto managed that and now Clippers is next. If you find next Tim Duncan/Dirk with the same skillset and character let me know. If those are not available I'll take my chances with players with flawed characters.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#406 » by xNewYorkMadex » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:09 pm

Knicks did an awful job with the trade.

Should’ve just hung onto him. He was still under contract. The taking the QO was a bluff, especially coming off an injury. He wanted the max and Knicks probably didn’t wanna give it to him so he wanted to be traded. And like idiots the Knicks obliged and got jack shyt in return.

Knicks right now could’ve had KP, RJ, Mitch, Knox, Frank. But nope, we trade him because he’s unhappy. If RJ is unhappy in a couple years, are we going to bend over and trade him too?

That trade package we got was crap. Cap space turned into Randle and a bunch of replacement level bigs. Randle looks like he’s going to be inconsistent as hell. Dennis Smith Jr can’t even beat out Eldrid Payton for a starter spot and his jumper is as broke as ever. The 1st round picks are question marks at the moment.

If the Knicks didn’t like what was being offered, you don’t need to trade the man. He wasn’t a free agent. If they were hell bent on trading KP, you could’ve traded him 1-2 months into this current season and start the bidding war while he’s healthy.

KP at his age with his ability to hit 3s, defend the rim is very valuable. The man can’t rebound for shyt, but I’d rather have someone who can play defense than someone who just grabs boards ala Randle/Kanter.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#407 » by Rasho Brezec » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:16 pm

frothbrain wrote:
Rasho Brezec wrote:We sold low and got low value in return.

It's not selling low if there is only one buyer.

Teams weren't giving up **** for an injured KP.

That's selling low.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#408 » by duetta » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:43 pm

xNewYorkMadex wrote:That trade package we got was crap. Cap space turned into Randle and a bunch of replacement level bigs. Randle looks like he’s going to be inconsistent as hell. Dennis Smith Jr can’t even beat out Eldrid Payton for a starter spot and his jumper is as broke as ever. The 1st round picks are question marks at the moment.


They evidently saw the cap space as being part of the pitch to Durant - which I always saw as a fool's errand, but they evidently didn't (until he wrecked his Achilles).

It kills me that we brought back less in that trade because we had to dump Hardway, whom everyone with a brain knew was a gross overpay from the get-go.

Perry apparently shopped KP extensively before the trade and this was the best offer.

Should we have called KP's bluff, and hoped to entice him by what we might have been able to get done during the summer? Maybe. I would have preferred that. But then there is the rape accusation - and the fact he wanted his idiot brother to become more heavily involved with the management of the team.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#409 » by GONYK » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:45 pm

duetta wrote:
xNewYorkMadex wrote:That trade package we got was crap. Cap space turned into Randle and a bunch of replacement level bigs. Randle looks like he’s going to be inconsistent as hell. Dennis Smith Jr can’t even beat out Eldrid Payton for a starter spot and his jumper is as broke as ever. The 1st round picks are question marks at the moment.


They evidently saw the cap space as being part of the pitch to Durant - which I always saw as a fool's errand, but they evidently didn't (until he wrecked his knee).

It kills me that we brought back less in that trade because we had to dump Hardway, whom everyone with a brain knew was a gross overpay from the get-go.

Perry apparently shopped KP extensively before the trade and this was the best offer.

Should we have called KP's bluff, and hoped to entice him by what we might have been able to get done during the summer? Maybe. I would have preferred that. But then there is the rape accusation - and the fact he wanted his idiot brother to become more heavily involved with the management of the team.


...and the fact that KP has damage to his own knee
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#410 » by Spandau » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:02 pm

duetta wrote:Should we have called KP's bluff, and hoped to entice him by what we might have been able to get done during the summer?


We really should have, yes.

The cap space thing was strategy, so I don't fault giving that a shot. That isn't my problem with the trade.

Accumulating first round picks, even when they're total unknown entities, is also a sound strategy. Again, they may amount to NOTHING of value, but on each respective draft nights, there's always a guy at ANY point in the First Round that you want to snag. Again, that's not my problem with the trade.

Dennis Smith Jr. is a player I wanted no part of leading into his draft, and that didn't change after his rookie season. He was a bad acquisition. He showed little reason to think he'd be more than a marginal rotation player. He's my FIRST problem with the trade.

My main problem? Even when demanding a trade, even with the rape accusations, even with the ACL, even with Janis, Kristaps was still an incredibly valuable asset. His TRADE value had never been lower, but management should have had the foresight to realize that you don't sell low - you DON'T SELL AT ALL if selling low is your only option.

I love the concept of maintaining a team with guys who are of good character, that's fun to root for. But the more we've learned, the less of a reason we've had to call Kristaps a "low-character" guy. He was just as frustrated about the pieces being put alongside him and wanted out, and that's when good managers (in ANY sport or ANY industry, for that matter) put their management acumen to use to try to fix it. It's probably a tall order, and I hate to oversimplify it, but that's part of the job. You try to keep your star player happy, especially when you literally hold ALL OF THE LEVERAGE.

Bad decision. It's tough to watch Dallas, knowing this, especially when we see such great promise from guys like RJ, Mitch, and Julius. This could have been a winning formula. Finally. But it wasn't.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#411 » by iLLmatic860 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:02 pm

xNewYorkMadex wrote:Knicks did an awful job with the trade.

Should’ve just hung onto him. He was still under contract. The taking the QO was a bluff, especially coming off an injury. He wanted the max and Knicks probably didn’t wanna give it to him so he wanted to be traded. And like idiots the Knicks obliged and got jack shyt in return.

Knicks right now could’ve had KP, RJ, Mitch, Knox, Frank. But nope, we trade him because he’s unhappy. If RJ is unhappy in a couple years, are we going to bend over and trade him too?

That trade package we got was crap. Cap space turned into Randle and a bunch of replacement level bigs. Randle looks like he’s going to be inconsistent as hell. Dennis Smith Jr can’t even beat out Eldrid Payton for a starter spot and his jumper is as broke as ever. The 1st round picks are question marks at the moment.

If the Knicks didn’t like what was being offered, you don’t need to trade the man. He wasn’t a free agent. If they were hell bent on trading KP, you could’ve traded him 1-2 months into this current season and start the bidding war while he’s healthy.

KP at his age with his ability to hit 3s, defend the rim is very valuable. The man can’t rebound for shyt, but I’d rather have someone who can play defense than someone who just grabs boards ala Randle/Kanter.


Luckily for us this is where RJ wants to be

Atleast we not surrounding him with players like Jarret Jack or have a dysfunctional GM like Dolan or Pjax handling Basketball operations

As long as we treat RJ well. He will be happy.

KP had no stability
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#412 » by EricAnderson » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:05 pm

duetta wrote:
xNewYorkMadex wrote:That trade package we got was crap. Cap space turned into Randle and a bunch of replacement level bigs. Randle looks like he’s going to be inconsistent as hell. Dennis Smith Jr can’t even beat out Eldrid Payton for a starter spot and his jumper is as broke as ever. The 1st round picks are question marks at the moment.


They evidently saw the cap space as being part of the pitch to Durant - which I always saw as a fool's errand, but they evidently didn't (until he wrecked his knee).

It kills me that we brought back less in that trade because we had to dump Hardway, whom everyone with a brain knew was a gross overpay from the get-go.

Perry apparently shopped KP extensively before the trade and this was the best offer.

Should we have called KP's bluff, and hoped to entice him by what we might have been able to get done during the summer? Maybe. I would have preferred that. But then there is the rape accusation - and the fact he wanted his idiot brother to become more heavily involved with the management of the team.


You call his bluff and take the chance on a guy in his early 20’s with that type of ability that’s is pretty rare . Chances we get anything close to him in what we traded him for is slim to none.

He could have been part of the rebuilding process and a great piece to have moving forward instead of searching in the draft for another player like that and we gave him up for what might turn out to be literally nothing.

A potential great player in his early 20’s traded for essentially a salary dump is unprecedented
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#413 » by mpharris36 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:19 pm

frothbrain wrote:
Rasho Brezec wrote:We sold low and got low value in return.

It's not selling low if there is only one buyer.

Teams weren't giving up **** for an injured KP.


from what perry said is that they had multiple offers and he choose this one...not a great look with how this one turned out
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#414 » by xNewYorkMadex » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:20 pm

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:
xNewYorkMadex wrote:Knicks did an awful job with the trade.

Should’ve just hung onto him. He was still under contract. The taking the QO was a bluff, especially coming off an injury. He wanted the max and Knicks probably didn’t wanna give it to him so he wanted to be traded. And like idiots the Knicks obliged and got jack shyt in return.

Knicks right now could’ve had KP, RJ, Mitch, Knox, Frank. But nope, we trade him because he’s unhappy. If RJ is unhappy in a couple years, are we going to bend over and trade him too?

That trade package we got was crap. Cap space turned into Randle and a bunch of replacement level bigs. Randle looks like he’s going to be inconsistent as hell. Dennis Smith Jr can’t even beat out Eldrid Payton for a starter spot and his jumper is as broke as ever. The 1st round picks are question marks at the moment.

If the Knicks didn’t like what was being offered, you don’t need to trade the man. He wasn’t a free agent. If they were hell bent on trading KP, you could’ve traded him 1-2 months into this current season and start the bidding war while he’s healthy.

KP at his age with his ability to hit 3s, defend the rim is very valuable. The man can’t rebound for shyt, but I’d rather have someone who can play defense than someone who just grabs boards ala Randle/Kanter.


Luckily for us this is where RJ wants to be

Atleast we not surrounding him with players like Jarret Jack or have a dysfunctional GM like Dolan or Pjax handling Basketball operations

As long as we treat RJ well. He will be happy.

KP had no stability

KP said the exact same thing before he was even drafted by the Knicks. He wanted to be here as well.

Mills is part of this dysfunctional organization though, and has been for a very long time.

Whose to say RJ doesn’t like what’s going on behind the scenes in a couple of years, and we don’t treat him well. Hell let’s say he suffers a torn ACL as well. Are we going to give up on him or try to remedy the situation? I’m telling you right now, if RJ tears his ACL, I will have confidence and him and our training staff to get him back to where he was rather than trading him for what we got for KP.

Star players have been unhappy spanning decades across this league. You either trade him while his value is high or fix the situation and keep the player. The Knicks did neither.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#415 » by 2010 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:44 pm

He shot more efficiently but pulled down a gargantuan total of 4 rebs :lol:
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#416 » by xNewYorkMadex » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:45 pm

I’ve never been so frustrated as a fan until this moment. I’ve honestly have talked very little Knicks on here or in real life. I’ve just talked baseball in the Yankee thread cause I wanted to wait and see how the KP trade would pan out.

Yes, we do have nice pieces in RJ and Mitch. RJ is the only true star we have. Mitch can be a Capela type of player, but he needs to learn how to play the game. It’ll take him a couple years until he knows how to play like a vet and avoid foul trouble. I like Knox, but I honestly view him as a solid. rotational player & nothing more. Trier is a 7-8th man. Frank is a question mark until I see if he can hit the 3 ball at an above average rate.

But this KP trade was horrific in my eyes. Hated it initially, but I was okay with it as long as we got both Kyrie and KD, hell I was okay with it if we got KD only. But that was a whiff. & DSjr is ass right now. Nothing has worked out in our favor in that trade.

It’s just infuriating as a fan knowing we could’ve had RJ and KP, with Mitch Knox Frank Trier all surrounding them. That 1-2 punch is what we were missing and was something to build on and actually attract future star FA’s to play with. If KP wanted to be out of here by any means, his value would’ve been higher if we held onto him and traded him a month from now.

I just needed to vent about this shyt since I’ve haven’t said anything Knick related since essentially the trade. Just hate the way our organization makes moves. It’s just a bunch of BS. Only decent at drafting guys, but we can’t ever keep our own guys we draft and then make moronic FA signings.

I guess I’ve said what I had to say about this and won’t speak much about it again. Some will agree & disagree, but that’s life.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#417 » by Jalen Bluntson » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:47 pm

KP had been going through BS in Europe for years before he came here. Then Phil talked about trading him. He wanted out. Period. The trade package isn't looking too good with DSJ falling flat on his face so far this season. It is what it is. Hope DSJ is just in a funk. Hoping those picks net us talent going forward. That's all you can do. The team is in perfect position to build now. That's all that matters. Too bad KP can't be a part of it. Moving on.
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#418 » by NY 567 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:55 pm

Porzingis has been extremely impactful for the Mavs and will continue to get better as time goes on. It's unlikely he has the stamina issues in Dallas that he had here, as the Mavs are a competent franchise and don't have him guarding the 4 for most of the game. Porzingis is already extremely good and has unlimited upside, the trade was dumb, we got nothing, and its going to be pathetic when salty types nitpick every little flaw the kid has when he's likely going to be out there dominating on both sides of the floor
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#419 » by nedleeds » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:55 pm

frothbrain wrote:
Rasho Brezec wrote:We sold low and got low value in return.

It's not selling low if there is only one buyer.

Teams weren't giving up **** for an injured KP.


Then why take **** as a return? He's not going anywhere and neither was this turd roster. So you rehab him, show some balls as a front office and take control of the asset. We got almost nothing of value unless the 20th pick 2 years from now is Giannis. What's worse than getting nothing?
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Re: KP's A Maverick And I Spoke It Into Existence 

Post#420 » by Rasho Brezec » Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:02 pm

It wasn't a good deal but people felt personally insulted because he wanted to leave and were willing to abandon any rational thought when it came to his skill set or actual trade value.
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