Official Yankees Thread II (Alex Cora & AJ Hinch fired)

[thebuzzardman]

Even the Braves got to the World Series several times in the 90s.

They never won. Because they didn't take that quite next extra step, in their case on offense, to go over the top with historic level pitching.

Yanks never invest in quite enough pitching. Starting pitching, to be specific.

Braves won in 95. Then they ran into George's Yankees the rest of the decade.

Yanks eked some stuff out there, with Leyritz etc. That was a great team but hardly unbeatable teams. Braves never had enough offense. Looking BACK on those Yankee teams makes it seem inevitable.

[thebuzzardman]

They never won. Because they didn't take that quite next extra step, in their case on offense, to go over the top with historic level pitching.

Yanks never invest in quite enough pitching. Starting pitching, to be specific.

Braves won in 95. Then they ran into Gene Michael's Yankees the rest of the decade.

That's why Smoltz is a bitter man.

True. Also, fixed that for Rich Rane.

That team turned over a LOT of players. It had it's core, but was really good about finding other guys, at 3B, starting pitching, 2nd base, the bullpen set up men etc. Everyone remembers Jeter, Mo, Bernie, Posada, Petite,
O'Neil and Tino, but their SP kind of fluxed but they always found enough quality starters, plus, handled 3b with Hayes->Boggs->Brosius

[Rich Rane]

Braves won in 95. Then they ran into Gene Michael's Yankees the rest of the decade.

That's why Smoltz is a bitter man.

True. Also, fixed that for Rich Rane.

That team turned over a LOT of players. It had it's core, but was really good about finding other guys, at 3B, starting pitching, 2nd base, the bullpen set up men etc. Everyone remembers Jeter, Mo, Bernie, Posada, Petite,
O'Neil and Tino, but their SP kind of fluxed but they always found enough quality starters, plus, handled 3b with Hayes->Boggs->Brosius

I'm just saying, right now the Yankees can't even get to a World Series to win a World Series. Those 90s Braves had more success than the current Yankees have so far.

[thebuzzardman]

That's why Smoltz is a bitter man.

True. Also, fixed that for Rich Rane.

That team turned over a LOT of players. It had it's core, but was really good about finding other guys, at 3B, starting pitching, 2nd base, the bullpen set up men etc. Everyone remembers Jeter, Mo, Bernie, Posada, Petite,
O'Neil and Tino, but their SP kind of fluxed but they always found enough quality starters, plus, handled 3b with Hayes->Boggs->Brosius

I'm just saying, right now the Yankees can't even get to a World Series to win a World Series. Those 90s Braves had more success than the current Yankees have so far.

There's an extra round of playoffs now too. So, we're measuring on WS victories? My point is about teams that make the playoffs over long periods of time but don't really have top end success. I mean, the Orioles won in 83. They were constantly in and around the playoffs from like 66 (prior win) to 83 their next win, and last win. They were decent after 83, not not like the 60's and 70's and early 80's. The Braves wound up kind of similar. Yanks are much like that. A lot of first/2nd place finishes.

But ok, the one WS victory is the gigantic marker of difference. It was more about being competitive but not really getting it done, over a long period of time.

[Rich Rane]

True. Also, fixed that for Rich Rane.

That team turned over a LOT of players. It had it's core, but was really good about finding other guys, at 3B, starting pitching, 2nd base, the bullpen set up men etc. Everyone remembers Jeter, Mo, Bernie, Posada, Petite,
O'Neil and Tino, but their SP kind of fluxed but they always found enough quality starters, plus, handled 3b with Hayes->Boggs->Brosius

I'm just saying, right now the Yankees can't even get to a World Series to win a World Series. Those 90s Braves had more success than the current Yankees have so far.

There's an extra round of playoffs now too. So, we're measuring on WS victories? My point is about teams that make the playoffs over long periods of time but don't really have top end success. I mean, the Orioles won in 83. They were constantly in and around the playoffs from like 66 (prior win) to 83 their next win, and last win. They were decent after 83, not not like the 60's and 70's and early 80's. The Braves wound up kind of similar. Yanks are much like that. A lot of first/2nd place finishes.

But ok, the one WS victory is the gigantic marker of difference. It was more about being competitive but not really getting it done, over a long period of time.

Can we at least agree that without Hal opening up the checkbook or some serious damage in free agency to the Astros (and the Red Sox because they seem to pull some magic out of their asses some years), this team isn't quite getting over the hump just yet?

[thebuzzardman]

I'm just saying, right now the Yankees can't even get to a World Series to win a World Series. Those 90s Braves had more success than the current Yankees have so far.

There's an extra round of playoffs now too. So, we're measuring on WS victories? My point is about teams that make the playoffs over long periods of time but don't really have top end success. I mean, the Orioles won in 83. They were constantly in and around the playoffs from like 66 (prior win) to 83 their next win, and last win. They were decent after 83, not not like the 60's and 70's and early 80's. The Braves wound up kind of similar. Yanks are much like that. A lot of first/2nd place finishes.

But ok, the one WS victory is the gigantic marker of difference. It was more about being competitive but not really getting it done, over a long period of time.

Can we at least agree that without Hal opening up the checkbook or some serious damage in free agency to the Astros (and the Red Sox because they seem to pull some magic out of their asses some years), this team isn't quite getting over the hump just yet?

Yeah. I think Cashman has been a good GM, but pitching is so (properly valued) - really good starting pitching, that it's expensive, and I think Hal holds them back here.

On the other hand, the Yanks pretty obviously decided to retool a few years ago and it wound up in the playoffs one year later and the next? I mean, that's pretty good. I think the team needs to recognize it's a contender again and dig a little deeper for that starting pitching. I mean, last year too, it's obvious now.

[DOLPHIN2020]

Bean counter Hal seems happy with the starting rotation. Looks unlikely we will be in contention for Cole or any of the top pitchers

[Rich Rane]

Bean counter Hal seems happy with the starting rotation. Looks unlikely we will be in contention for Cole or any of the top pitchers

Tanaka
Paxton
Severino
Happ?
German (probably suspended to start the season)
Montgomery

That's what we're looking at to start next season.

[Rich Rane]

Read on Twitter

[Grover]

Bean counter Hal seems happy with the starting rotation. Looks unlikely we will be in contention for Cole or any of the top pitchers

I'm uncertain if the evolution of the game to home run or bust on the offensive side and starters continuing to pitch fewer innings along with openers moving from a rarity to the postseason doesn't begin to change the metrics on the valuation of seven year contracts for any pitcher despite the appearance of Sherzer in the World Series who is one of few to live up to his contract. The game has shifted precipitously toward holding spots for playing the Scranton shuttle with pitching to fill in the gaps in coverage and overuse. I'd like to have Cole but the opportunity cost may no longer point in that direction and be a part of the process. Perhaps at the top end of the market where Cole resides and the decrease in expected bullpen usage alters the equation. Perhaps factoring in the postseason improvement in the top three or four starters pushes the viability up enough to justify the commitment. There's a algorithm somewhere that looks at it and I'm hoping Cashman's programmer captured accurate data.

[isiah_thomas]

Read on Twitter

?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


No surprise adds another elite pitcher to the market

[Papi_swav]

We need to go hard after both Strasburg and Cole period. I don't care how much or how long it is, get it done. 2 elite pitchers without giving up any prospects in a trade and 2 pitchers that prove they can be dominate in the post season, this is a no brainer. Then package German with others and go after Lindor.

We just extended Chapman 3/48. I mean I guess, he still is a top closer in this league and for 16M per I can't really complain, at least we didn't overspend on him like I thought someone would.

[GEOLINK]

I'm not holding my breath this year.

[Rich Rane]

Read on Twitter

Wonder what the Yanks do with Didi this offseason. His qualifying offer is $17.8 million. If you cut him, that moves DJ back to short and Voit at first, who isn't exactly a Gold Glove candidate. Didi could also have a bounce back season as he doesn't have to recover from Tommy John surgery this offseason. DJ's defense is much better utilized at short though. Would be amazing if Andujar magically learned to play at first. Even so, cutting Didi makes the lineup even more righty dominant.

[Rich Rane]

I also think we all need to give up hope on Cole or Strasburg.

On Thursday, Steinbrenner said the Yankees have a “very good rotation’’ moving forward.

“For the most part, I think our starting pitching was good this year,’’ Steinbrenner said. “Even missing [Luis] Severino and [Jordan] Montgomery [for most or all of the season due to injuries].”

And Steinbrenner already likes how the rotation looks for next season.

“If the 2020 season was to start tomorrow, I would feel considerably more confident than I did a year ago at this time,’’ Steinbrenner said. “We will have both Severino and Montgomery back. We now know that [Domingo] German can pitch effectively at this level. And we know [James] Paxton can be the guy that we were hoping for when we made that trade. We have [Masahiro] Tanaka, [J.A.] Happ, [Jonathan] Loaisiga, and perhaps [Deivi] Garcia at some point. A very good rotation.’’
https://nypost.com/2019/11/01/hal-steinbrenner-discusses-where-yankees-go-from-here/

[Rich Rane]

Read on Twitter

[bishnykfan]

Read on Twitter

Wonder what the Yanks do with Didi this offseason. His qualifying offer is $17.8 million. If you cut him, that moves DJ back to short and Voit at first, who isn't exactly a Gold Glove candidate. Didi could also have a bounce back season as he doesn't have to recover from Tommy John surgery this offseason. DJ's defense is much better utilized at short though. Would be amazing if Andujar magically learned to play at first. Even so, cutting Didi makes the lineup even more righty dominant.

Don't see the Yankees resigining Didi as much as I like and respect him after he replaced Jeter. They just have other needs and areas they can spend that money rather then on a 30+ year old middle infielder coming off an injury and a subpar year. If he gives them a 1-2 year team friendly deal then maybe but considering they have Torres ready to step in every day at SS and can just slide DJ to 2B, my guess is that Didi is gone. Next years infield will be Voit-DJ-Torres-Urshela IMO.

I still believe that Cole will be offered a contract. Maybe they won't blow him away and he chooses to go somewhere else but I think Cashman has been after him for to long to just not make even an attempt. If and when he turns them down, the Yanks will move Andujar and Frazier with a pitching prospect for a #1-#2 type starter and just add another depth piece to the rotation. If they are all healthy and German is able to pitch, their rotation is still missing that ace, but it isn't terrible.

Unless they pull off something big and move Stanton's contract (Dodgers, Cardinals...unlikely but who knows?), then all bets are off.

[ccvle]

Against quality pitching, I would rather have didi at the plate than gardner, stanton and sanchez.

[Jump Shot]

I want them to bring back Maybin for depth.

[thebuzzardman]

Yanks will fail to sign a top level pitcher. You heard it here first.