PG: That was way too difficult

[RSP83]

Our 2 supposedly franchise guys are still sub-par. I haven't seen again that "it" factor that I saw in Lauri in that breakout Euro FIBA tournament performance couple of years ago. He's much more mellow on the court now than earlier in his NBA career. While Zach this is THE season where I expect him to make that Jimmy Butler / Victor Oladipo jump into that top tier star, so far I don't see anything close to that becoming reality. I've always questioned his BBall IQ, but he's so talented offensively I thought it's enough to push him over the top despite BBall IQ not on the same level. He seems like a hardworker as well. He's closer to a poor man's Devin Booker right now... Far from a guy you want leading your team.

I'm happy with Wendell and Coby. I don't know what they'll turn into, but I like that they seem like tough guys. I feel like I can trust them.

[DorO]

Zach scored like 10 of last 13 points with good efficiency, I don’t know what people expect of him but he is gradually coming good and will be the most important player in this Bulls team this season. And Thad Young is much better option in tight situations than Lauri. Bulls really would need better 2nd string option for Otto and maybe there’s now time to let Gafford play instead of Kornet.

[coldfish]

As everyone is noting, Detroit basically outplayed Chicago. Just bad 3p shooting by them lead to the loss.

Wendell looks solid and tries but he passed up multiple good offensive opportunities. He really isn't going to be a top player. The more I see him the more I think "Taj Gibson". Not exactly the same stylistically but generally the same effectiveness and type.

Coby's lack of burst is noticeable and the fact that he can't just blow by people lets people guard him tight. I like his attitude but he also looks limited.

Lauri and Zach just look like flubs at this point. Zach wants to be the man soooo badly but he just isn't good enough for it and as a result, he does more damage than good when he tries to take over.

I thought Sato's low usage would be a good thing. I didn't realize he gets it by actively passing up good shots.

Otto showed up, which is nice.

The offense noticeably had a bunch more wrinkles in it. They ran multiple sets. Apparently Boylen realizes that giving these guys complete freedom is a mistake.

[sco]

A win is the best medicine for what ails us. Confidence and trust is very important at this stage of the season. Watching Rose, I saw a key change to his game that I think helps him to be more effective and stay healthy - he stopped doing all of his east-west juking and went back to going north-south and attacking the rim. Also, gotta say that Drummond is a freaking stud...he is so coordinated and strong...it's amazing to watch him. He used to be so stupid, but he's gotten more BBIQ now.

Not sure if Kingpin changed anything to run more offense through Otto, but it was great to see him come alive! Now we just need him to show up more than once every 6 games. He was the Otto that we loved last season.

Carter is playing nicely. Even in a zero-block game he tied for our biggest +/- at +13. His passing is pretty. It seems like the thumb if impacting his game. I'm not a fan of him shooting this season, but it fell (after bouncing around for 5 minutes), so - I'm cool. I also really LOVE that he out there actually making contact when he sets picks...something so few of our bigs have done (other than Rolo).

Lauri, while playing sub-par generally, at least started looking a little better from 3. I'll be optimistic that he's starting to find his range.

I do like that Sato does a good job of setting up the offense and advancing the ball. Like most of you, I don't know where FIBA Sato went to...I get that there are a lot of mouths to feed with the starters, but he's gotta be shooting more than 6 shots a game.

I sound like a broken record, but Arci needs to be out there more. Dude is such a positive force during games.

I'm not sure Hutch is the answer for our SF woes, but sitting Dunn will be a be lift to my game viewing experience. I can't wait.

Also, I have been majorly disappointed in Kornet's inability to shoot 3's and be such a defensive liability. I'm guessing his leash is shortening and we'll see Gafford soon. I'm not super high on Gafford as being a good fit alongside Thad, but I think if Kingpin shifts Lauri's minutes a bit, I think he and Gafford would work well.

[Hugi Mancura]

Our 2 supposedly franchise guys are still sub-par. I haven't seen again that "it" factor that I saw in Lauri in that breakout Euro FIBA tournament performance couple of years ago. He's much more mellow on the court now than earlier in his NBA career. While Zach this is THE season where I expect him to make that Jimmy Butler / Victor Oladipo jump into that top tier star, so far I don't see anything close to that becoming reality. I've always questioned his BBall IQ, but he's so talented offensively I thought it's enough to push him over the top despite BBall IQ not on the same level. He seems like a hardworker as well. He's closer to a poor man's Devin Booker right now... Far from a guy you want leading your team.

I'm happy with Wendell and Coby. I don't know what they'll turn into, but I like that they seem like tough guys. I feel like I can trust them.

On Lauri's case. How Bulls use Lauri is completely different compared to Finnish national team. In FNT they use Lauri lot in pick&pop situations, while Bulls rather use centers forcing Lauri to stand in the corner to stretch the floor. And in ISO situations Lauri catched the ball at mid range facing the basket. He rarely played back to the basket. Same way this years World championships Sato was top3 point guard, but now he suddenly is playing much worse. His role changed. He had much more freedom in Czech national team.

All players have their favorite roles where they are the best version of themselves. If you forced to do something else then they are always lousier. Reason player is forced to play in different roles than the one where he shines are different. In some cases it is better to have your superstar to do his thing and rest of the players just move away (Lebron & Harden example). There might be a better player to your top role, so team is trying if you can play the other role. Or the main reason in today's basketball is that your coach is just bad. Coach might only know one way of playing offense (D'Antoni example), so if your strength's don't suit that offense then it's bad luck. Or coach just is bad at reading players strength's and are blindly following what is hip right now (NBA is a copy cat league). Good example is stretch 4's in modern basketball. Every one is forced to become corner standing 3 point shooter, no matter what your skill set was before.

There are only few coaches who somehow bring the best out of almost every one who they coach. Popovitch is a good example, but even he doesn't get along with everyone and even he can't make stars out of everyone.

[Red Larrivee]

If Young keeps playing like this, it's going to be hard to sit him in the 4th quarter.

Bulls have the luxury of playing two two-way bigs in Young and Carter down the stretch. It wasn't plausible before the season, but Young adding a high volume three-point shot is beneficial. He's on pace for 369 3PAs.

It's basically the "Markkanen is playing like **** and we need to win this game by getting stops and maintaining spacing" lineup.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[coldfish]

Our 2 supposedly franchise guys are still sub-par. I haven't seen again that "it" factor that I saw in Lauri in that breakout Euro FIBA tournament performance couple of years ago. He's much more mellow on the court now than earlier in his NBA career. While Zach this is THE season where I expect him to make that Jimmy Butler / Victor Oladipo jump into that top tier star, so far I don't see anything close to that becoming reality. I've always questioned his BBall IQ, but he's so talented offensively I thought it's enough to push him over the top despite BBall IQ not on the same level. He seems like a hardworker as well. He's closer to a poor man's Devin Booker right now... Far from a guy you want leading your team.

I'm happy with Wendell and Coby. I don't know what they'll turn into, but I like that they seem like tough guys. I feel like I can trust them.

On Lauri's case. How Bulls use Lauri is completely different compared to Finnish national team. In FNT they use Lauri lot in pick&pop situations, while Bulls rather use centers forcing Lauri to stand in the corner to stretch the floor. And in ISO situations Lauri catched the ball at mid range facing the basket. He rarely played back to the basket. Same way this years World championships Sato was top3 point guard, but now he suddenly is playing much worse. His role changed. He had much more freedom in Czech national team.

All players have their favorite roles where they are the best version of themselves. If you forced to do something else then they are always lousier. Reason player is forced to play in different roles than the one where he shines are different. In some cases it is better to have your superstar to do his thing and rest of the players just move away (Lebron & Harden example). There might be a better player to your top role, so team is trying if you can play the other role. Or the main reason in today's basketball is that your coach is just bad. Coach might only know one way of playing offense (D'Antoni example), so if your strength's don't suit that offense then it's bad luck. Or coach just is bad at reading players strength's and are blindly following what is hip right now (NBA is a copy cat league). Good example is stretch 4's in modern basketball. Every one is forced to become corner standing 3 point shooter, no matter what your skill set was before.

There are only few coaches who somehow bring the best out of almost every one who they coach. Popovitch is a good example, but even he doesn't get along with everyone and even he can't make stars out of everyone.

I feel I have to point out again that the entire country of Finland has a population that is roughly half that of the Chicago metro area. International basketball is largely a joke where the majority of international teams wouldn't beat good NCAA division I teams. Lauri playing with inferior talent against inferior talent is going to look good regardless of what the coach does.

Lauri gets countless pick and pop opportunities in this offense. He also gets the opportunity to effectively play a perimeter creator and drive, call for a pick or shoot once he has the ball. Everything Zach does in this offense, Lauri can do but he chooses not to.

[FriedRise]

What do you guys think about Lauri being benched for two straight games? I know there was some injury talk, but that was just a convenience that Boylen could use last night. Without that injury, I still don't think Boylen would've played him either.

I personally think he deserves it. His play has been less than stellar lately, and Thad Young has just been outplaying him on both ends of the court. But man, it does suck when one of your supposed franchise players can't even see the court during crunch time because he's not jiving offensively with your other supposed best player (Zach) and he's below average soft defensively. No entitlement minutes until you figure out how to play better.

Also, I'm done with the Luke Kornet experiment. We immediately blow our lead whenever he checks in.

[Red Larrivee]

I feel I have to point out again that the entire country of Finland has a population that is roughly half that of the Chicago metro area. International basketball is largely a joke where the majority of international teams wouldn't beat good NCAA division I teams. Lauri playing with inferior talent against inferior talent is going to look good regardless of what the coach does.

Lauri gets countless pick and pop opportunities in this offense. He also gets the opportunity to effectively play a perimeter creator and drive, call for a pick or shoot once he has the ball. Everything Zach does in this offense, Lauri can do but he chooses not to.

The Charlotte game is the only game where I noticed Lauri actively calilng his number and being engaged in the offense. Otherwise (and in this game particular) he was just standing around and settling when he did get the ball.

It's funny, because despite not shooting the ball well, Markkanen has an 18.9 PER on the season. His usage is about the same as last year (25.1 to 25.3), but he's increased his FTA to 6.4/P36, he's rebounding the ball at his highest level, and his assist percentage has almost doubled (7.2 to 13.6). If he actually starts making his threes and being engaged in the offense, his PER is probably going to jump in the 20+ range. It's why I'm not throwing in the towel in on Lauri right now. I don't think he's that far off from having a good offensive season. It's simple stuff that he can fix.

[Red Larrivee]

What do you guys think about Lauri being benched for two straight games? I know there was some injury talk, but that was just a convenience that Boylen could use last night. Without that injury, I still don't think Boylen would've played him either.

I personally think he deserves it. His play has been less than stellar lately, and Thad Young has just been outplaying him on both ends of the court. But man, it does suck when one of your supposed franchise players can't even see the court during crunch time because he's not jiving offensively with your other supposed best player (Zach) and he's below average soft defensively. No entitlement minutes until you figure out how to play better.

Also, I'm done with the Luke Kornet experiment. We immediately blow our lead whenever he checks in.

If Markkanen is making defensive mistakes and settling on offense, then he's going to sit. Plus, Zach won't get benched in the 4th because he's the only player that can consistently get his shot.

We're seeing why Thaddeus Young is one of the league's most underappreciated two-way players; he's playing very good basketball. So far, the Sato/LaVine/Porter/Young/Carter lineup has a +17.4 Net Rating in the 4th quarter this season. Relative to the minutes played, this has been the Bulls best 4Q lineup by far.

It's going to be a choice Boylen has to make each night. Young is the highest floor option, but if Lauri is playing well, then you can't sit him. In a way, it's similar to benching Boozer for Taj in the 4th. You have to ride the hot hand, or simply bench the cold hand.

[chitowndish]

I am getting really irritated with Lauri he was benched when it mattered for the second night in a row and he was joking around on the bench. It really bugged me because it should bother the guy that he's playing so bad that his team is better off without him and he was laughing it up just happy to be here. I think if I sift through my thoughts on the beginning of the season this is the most disappointing thing to me is I don't think Lauri cares enough to fulfill his potential I think he may be content.

Overall the team is playing better and I thought the ball was moving well for the most part. They were trying to trap the hell out of us at the end and I thought we handled it well and punished them for it with quick ball movement. I liked seeing more of Arci and I thought he played great, I like how he runs the team and his shot keeps the defense honest. The saving grace this season is watching Carter and Coby I think they are both gamers and I like their feel for the game. I want to see more of Gafford I think we need toughness and athleticism and size so he'd really help. Nice to see Porter have a good game but he's been pretty rough so far.

It was really cool to see Rose go off again those were some beautiful moves and he seems to be in a good place playing within himself and he was getting guys involved and making good reads. They seemed to be a different team when he was attacking so that was pretty cool to see.

[League Circles]

I like Lauri but in his third year he no longer needs to be coddled or get entitlement minutes. If he's playing poorly and we have a very solid Thad available, play him. It will either make Lauri inspired and improve, or it will expose him sooner rather than later and help us decide on him before it's too late.

It can't be overstated how important it is that Porter stepped up. He can be a leader.

[Michael Jackson]

I feel I have to point out again that the entire country of Finland has a population that is roughly half that of the Chicago metro area. International basketball is largely a joke where the majority of international teams wouldn't beat good NCAA division I teams. Lauri playing with inferior talent against inferior talent is going to look good regardless of what the coach does.

Lauri gets countless pick and pop opportunities in this offense. He also gets the opportunity to effectively play a perimeter creator and drive, call for a pick or shoot once he has the ball. Everything Zach does in this offense, Lauri can do but he chooses not to.

The Charlotte game is the only game where I noticed Lauri actively calilng his number and being engaged in the offense. Otherwise (and in this game particular) he was just standing around and settling when he did get the ball.

It's funny, because despite not shooting the ball well, Markkanen has an 18.9 PER on the season. His usage is about the same as last year (25.1 to 25.3), but he's increased his FTA to 6.4/P36, he's rebounding the ball at his highest level, and his assist percentage has almost doubled (7.2 to 13.6). If he actually starts making his threes and being engaged in the offense, his PER is probably going to jump in the 20+ range. It's why I'm not throwing in the towel in on Lauri right now. I don't think he's that far off from having a good offensive season. It's simple stuff that he can fix.

So he will turn into Kevin Love on Minnesota?

[OnePointSeven]

About the Lauri-Thad thing.

Can't we just be glad to actually have a choice? Compared to the trash we've had on the bench the last couple of years, this is what an NBA roster should look like. And we need more of it. You have to compete to get playing time, it's as simple as that.

[Indomitable]

I like Lauri but in his third year he no longer needs to be coddled or get entitlement minutes. If he's playing poorly and we have a very solid Thad available, play him. It will either make Lauri inspired and improve, or it will expose him sooner rather than later and help us decide on him before it's too late.

It can't be overstated how important it is that Porter stepped up. He can be a leader.

Thad use to bench Sabonis in the 4th.

Porter is regarded by his team.

[MrSparkle]

Well I think it’s smart to close with Thad. Lauri is a sieve. Zach is a sieve. Together in the 4th? How can they possibly get stops?

Like I said, it’d be smart to start with Thad. I don’t think Lauri needs entitlement minutes. He can play a killer role off the bench. It’d be more natural to me.

They didn’t sign a 35yo player in Thad. He’s in his late prime and far more accomplished than Lauri. He doesn’t “deserve” to sit behind a struggling Lauri. If 35pt Lauri shows up, then you max his minutes. But otherwise, Thad makes the game simpler on both ends (besides when he posts up too long, but atleast he manufactures more points than Lauri with his back-to-basket).

Otherwise, Lauri is playing OK despite struggles. He’s playing in bad line-up combinations. He plays well with Arci. I’d like to see that pair with a more defensive 2-3-5 line-up (Gafford/Hutchinson?).

I still don’t like Sato starting. The foot-speed is killing me, especially since Coby and Arci are sitting there and forced to run together in the mini line-up with Dunn (wtf). Atleast give the 3-PG line-up some size and more spacing edge with Sato.

****ing Boylen...

[weneeda2guard]

The team is just too young and inexperienced to close the game with 5 young and inexperienced players. You do that you will continue to blow games at the end. Its alarming that we have had double digit leads in all of these games sans the Raptors game and we 2-4 behind the fact we couldnt execute down the stretch of games. We need veteran presence. Young helps with that.

[erlim]

What do you guys think about Lauri being benched for two straight games? I know there was some injury talk, but that was just a convenience that Boylen could use last night. Without that injury, I still don't think Boylen would've played him either.

I personally think he deserves it. His play has been less than stellar lately, and Thad Young has just been outplaying him on both ends of the court. But man, it does suck when one of your supposed franchise players can't even see the court during crunch time because he's not jiving offensively with your other supposed best player (Zach) and he's below average soft defensively. No entitlement minutes until you figure out how to play better.

Also, I'm done with the Luke Kornet experiment. We immediately blow our lead whenever he checks in.

If Markkanen is making defensive mistakes and settling on offense, then he's going to sit. Plus, Zach won't get benched in the 4th because he's the only player that can consistently get his shot.

We're seeing why Thaddeus Young is one of the league's most underappreciated two-way players; he's playing very good basketball. So far, the Sato/LaVine/Porter/Young/Carter lineup has a +17.4 Net Rating in the 4th quarter this season. Relative to the minutes played, this has been the Bulls best 4Q lineup by far.

It's going to be a choice Boylen has to make each night. Young is the highest floor option, but if Lauri is playing well, then you can't sit him. In a way, it's similar to benching Boozer for Taj in the 4th. You have to ride the hot hand, or simply bench the cold hand.

Makes sense, our perimeter guys usually get blown by, so having two ok defenders behind them instead of one is the better fourth quarter option.

[RSP83]

Our 2 supposedly franchise guys are still sub-par. I haven't seen again that "it" factor that I saw in Lauri in that breakout Euro FIBA tournament performance couple of years ago. He's much more mellow on the court now than earlier in his NBA career. While Zach this is THE season where I expect him to make that Jimmy Butler / Victor Oladipo jump into that top tier star, so far I don't see anything close to that becoming reality. I've always questioned his BBall IQ, but he's so talented offensively I thought it's enough to push him over the top despite BBall IQ not on the same level. He seems like a hardworker as well. He's closer to a poor man's Devin Booker right now... Far from a guy you want leading your team.

I'm happy with Wendell and Coby. I don't know what they'll turn into, but I like that they seem like tough guys. I feel like I can trust them.

On Lauri's case. How Bulls use Lauri is completely different compared to Finnish national team. In FNT they use Lauri lot in pick&pop situations, while Bulls rather use centers forcing Lauri to stand in the corner to stretch the floor. And in ISO situations Lauri catched the ball at mid range facing the basket. He rarely played back to the basket. Same way this years World championships Sato was top3 point guard, but now he suddenly is playing much worse. His role changed. He had much more freedom in Czech national team.

All players have their favorite roles where they are the best version of themselves. If you forced to do something else then they are always lousier. Reason player is forced to play in different roles than the one where he shines are different. In some cases it is better to have your superstar to do his thing and rest of the players just move away (Lebron & Harden example). There might be a better player to your top role, so team is trying if you can play the other role. Or the main reason in today's basketball is that your coach is just bad. Coach might only know one way of playing offense (D'Antoni example), so if your strength's don't suit that offense then it's bad luck. Or coach just is bad at reading players strength's and are blindly following what is hip right now (NBA is a copy cat league). Good example is stretch 4's in modern basketball. Every one is forced to become corner standing 3 point shooter, no matter what your skill set was before.

There are only few coaches who somehow bring the best out of almost every one who they coach. Popovitch is a good example, but even he doesn't get along with everyone and even he can't make stars out of everyone.

I feel I have to point out again that the entire country of Finland has a population that is roughly half that of the Chicago metro area. International basketball is largely a joke where the majority of international teams wouldn't beat good NCAA division I teams. Lauri playing with inferior talent against inferior talent is going to look good regardless of what the coach does.

Lauri gets countless pick and pop opportunities in this offense. He also gets the opportunity to effectively play a perimeter creator and drive, call for a pick or shoot once he has the ball. Everything Zach does in this offense, Lauri can do but he chooses not to.

There are some very weak International teams, but I think the level of International teams is already much much much better than where it used to be 10-20 years ago. I mean the third tier USA team got their ass kicked, and it consisted of NBA players who used to be top players in their respective NCAA division 1 team. I know this has nothing to do with Lauri, but just saying, there are many very good international teams as well.

Going back to Lauri in that FIBA Eurobasket, I don't think it's fair to say he was bum-slaying in that tournament. Finland beat France and Greece, beat and lose a close game with Slovenia (Doncic, and the event champ). Those three teams were pretty good. And it was clear that Lauri carried that Finland team to finish runner up below champ Slovenia in their group, to make it to the Sweet 16. My point is, that performance turned a lot of heads.. including me. I hated the Lauri pick, thought he's another tall Euro stiff. But Lauri was truly awesome in that tournament, and I thought his rookie season with the Bulls he still showed that same tenacity he showed during the FIBA Eurobasket.

[RSP83]

I feel I have to point out again that the entire country of Finland has a population that is roughly half that of the Chicago metro area. International basketball is largely a joke where the majority of international teams wouldn't beat good NCAA division I teams. Lauri playing with inferior talent against inferior talent is going to look good regardless of what the coach does.

Lauri gets countless pick and pop opportunities in this offense. He also gets the opportunity to effectively play a perimeter creator and drive, call for a pick or shoot once he has the ball. Everything Zach does in this offense, Lauri can do but he chooses not to.

The Charlotte game is the only game where I noticed Lauri actively calilng his number and being engaged in the offense. Otherwise (and in this game particular) he was just standing around and settling when he did get the ball.

It's funny, because despite not shooting the ball well, Markkanen has an 18.9 PER on the season. His usage is about the same as last year (25.1 to 25.3), but he's increased his FTA to 6.4/P36, he's rebounding the ball at his highest level, and his assist percentage has almost doubled (7.2 to 13.6). If he actually starts making his threes and being engaged in the offense, his PER is probably going to jump in the 20+ range. It's why I'm not throwing in the towel in on Lauri right now. I don't think he's that far off from having a good offensive season. It's simple stuff that he can fix.

good catch. I guess that gives me reason to be more optimistic about Lauri.