Orlando Magic Offensive Ranks so far

[PrimeThyme]

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Easily the worst offense in the league so far. We have yet to score over 100 points and while I obviously expect things to get better it is hard to see a path for this team to be better than a bottom 7 offense in the league when you factor in regression from guys like DJ, Ross, and Vuc (to a lesser extent). When Ross isn't Ross of last year our bench unit is so inept offensively.

Aminu has been as dreadful as I thought he would be offensively without playing next to a playmaker like Lillard or CJ and Bamba outside of hitting the occasional 3/midrange shot is pretty much incapable of doing anything else well on offense at this stage. Maybe DJ can help to space out that second unit and provide some spark but I'm still not seeing many signs of life yet.

[I Rasharted]

Spoiler:

[ezzzp]

• Ross isn't going to shoot .185 from 3PT range for the season. He's been a high volume above average 3PT shooter for most of his NBA career. The second unit has been abysmal on offense. Ross has been the biggest issue because of how much volume he takes. Once that reverts to the mean, that unit's offense will stabilize considerably.

• DJ isn't going to shoot .250 from 3PT range for the season. He's been a high volume elite tier (+.400) 3PT shooter for 4 out the past 6 years. His role, minutes and rotation patterns have been awkward because of Markelle. All that is starting to clarify. DJ/Ross off the bench should be a very good injection of offense once they start clicking and getting back to their career norms.

• Aminu will take a bit to figure out how to be most effective. Personally I think that Aminu is playing at a different level of aggressiveness in-transition than the rest of the guys on the floor. I don't necessarily think this is a bad thing.

Aminu has been playing on excellent transition teams. This is something the Magic have not been good at for a while. Right now, guys aren't attacking as hard as him, nor are they finding the right lanes or spot up locations in transition when he does. I think Aminu's aggressiveness in transition is good for others to learn how to make themselves (and find) clear and visible options on those breaks. My hopes are that transition play is where Clifford allows some wildness into the system. I can live with those Aminu TOV's if it gives license and confidence for the rest of the team to attack in transition as aggressively as he does.

• Fultz I think will be a slow gradual improvement. But I'm also expecting some bad lows once teams begin to game plan for him. He definitely needs to be more aggressively looking for his shot in the paint and midrange.

[pepe1991]

On bright side, it's not like they can go anywhere but up , being ranked dead last in every single category.

As for individual performance, imo worst thing is with Ross and Aminu.

Ross is career 10 ppg, last year was probably fluke.

Aminu really does not offer much to Orlando . He is great individual defender and rebounder but complete no treat as shooter and scorer.

[GelbeWand09]

• Ross isn't going to shoot .185 from 3PT range for the season. He's been a high volume above average 3PT shooter for most of his NBA career. The second unit has been abysmal on offense. Ross has been the biggest issue because of how much volume he takes. Once that reverts to the mean, that unit's offense will stabilize considerably.

• DJ isn't going to shoot .250 from 3PT range for the season. He's been a high volume elite tier (+.400) 3PT shooter for 4 out the past 6 years. His role, minutes and rotation patterns have been awkward because of Markelle. All that is starting to clarify. DJ/Ross off the bench should be a very good injection of offense once they start clicking and getting back to their career norms.

• Aminu will take a bit to figure out how to be most effective. Personally I think that Aminu is playing at a different level of aggressiveness in-transition than the rest of the guys on the floor. I don't necessarily think this is a bad thing.

Aminu has been playing on excellent transition teams. This is something the Magic have not been good at for a while. Right now, guys aren't attacking as hard as him, nor are they finding the right lanes or spot up locations in transition when he does. I think Aminu's aggressiveness in transition is good for others to learn how to make themselves (and find) clear and visible options on those breaks. My hopes are that transition play is where Clifford allows some wildness into the system. I can live with those Aminu TOV's if it gives license and confidence for the rest of the team to attack in transition as aggressively as he does.

• Fultz I think will be a slow gradual improvement. But I'm also expecting some bad lows once teams begin to game plan for him. He definitely needs to be more aggressively looking for his shot in the paint and midrange.

But you can't 100% expect Ross gettin back to the mean. Teams now gameplan for him like never before & Ross is guarded like a star offensive player now in that second unit. So i don't think his former stats matter as much as you think. Sure he's gonna be better, but how much is the question, if he remains the only option in the bench unit.
This team got a really low margin of error to make the playoffs. Ross was the 2nd most important player last year.

[Bensational]

Our shooting numbers will improve in general and we'll start hitting more of those wide open 3's we've been getting. The season will probably be stretches of hot and cold shooting, but hopefully the entire team doesn't go cold all at once like we have right now.

And as the season progresses and Fultz is given more control I suspect the offense to improve in areas we've not been good at before, like transition and fast breaks.

Our numbers have been terrible, but it is highly unlikely they remain so. We'll never be an offensive juggernaut, but we shouldn't be this bad.

[NavalAviator94]

Do we really need a thread about how bad our offense is right now? As Pepe noted, we have no place to go but up.


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[ezzzp]

But you can't 100% expect Ross gettin back to the mean. Teams now gameplan for him like never before & Ross is guarded like a star offensive player now in that second unit. So i don't think his former stats matter as much as you think. Sure he's gonna be better, but how much is the question, if he remains the only option in the bench unit.
This team got a really low margin of error to make the playoffs. Ross was the 2nd most important player last year.

Sure you can.

The Magic can game plan a counter for Ross doubles too. Adjustments go two ways. The DJ/Fultz swap is the first adjustment addressing those spacing issues Ross was facing.

If teams are sending 2 guys at Ross, that means someone else is wide open. I guarantee you that Clifford and the Magic's analytics guys have already showed him that he needs to swing the ball instead of jacking up a bad shot. You could see it in the Denver game.

Clifford has also been experimenting with rotations, but you can see that he's starting to stagger the starters more each game. This will trim out some of the really bad spacing minutes.

The Magic play in the East + their defense is looking very good already and that looks sustainable. They are 2-1 vs teams they should have beat, and 0-3 vs teams that should have beat them. I see absolutely no reason to panic about missing the playoffs.

[Def Swami]

It's the East so the Magic are probably never really out of the playoffs. The shooting will get better than this, but the competition in the East is better and even the slightest regression from our team could see us fall out.

[PrimeThyme]

Do we really need a thread about how bad our offense is right now? As Pepe noted, we have no place to go but up.


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Just an interesting tweet I saw and thought it was worth discussing with how relevant offense is in today's NBA. For those who think this is just a fluke start and that we will revert back to the offense we saw last year maybe not so much, but for people who were expecting offensive struggles coming into the season and believe it will be an ongoing issue, I think it is.

Not sure why somebody creating a thread on it effects you in any way.

[NavalAviator94]

Do we really need a thread about how bad our offense is right now? As Pepe noted, we have no place to go but up.


Sent from my iPad using RealGM Forums

Just an interesting tweet I saw and thought it was worth discussing with how relevant offense is in today's NBA. For those who think this is just a fluke start and that we will revert back to the offense we saw last year maybe not so much, but for people who were expecting offensive struggles coming into the season and believe it will be an ongoing issue, I think it is.

Not sure why somebody creating a thread on it effects you in any way.

My apologies. Just a little depressed our offense sucks so incredibly bad and I hate being reminded of it.

[GelbeWand09]

But you can't 100% expect Ross gettin back to the mean. Teams now gameplan for him like never before & Ross is guarded like a star offensive player now in that second unit. So i don't think his former stats matter as much as you think. Sure he's gonna be better, but how much is the question, if he remains the only option in the bench unit.
This team got a really low margin of error to make the playoffs. Ross was the 2nd most important player last year.

Sure you can.

The Magic can game plan a counter for Ross doubles too. Adjustments go two ways. The DJ/Fultz swap is the first adjustment addressing those spacing issues Ross was facing.

If teams are sending 2 guys at Ross, that means someone else is wide open. I guarantee you that Clifford and the Magic's analytics guys have already showed him that he needs to swing the ball instead of jacking up a bad shot. You could see it in the Denver game.

Clifford has also been experimenting with rotations, but you can see that he's starting to stagger the starters more each game. This will trim out some of the really bad spacing minutes.

The Magic play in the East + their defense is looking very good already and that looks sustainable. They are 2-1 vs teams they should have beat, and 0-3 vs teams that should have beat them. I see absolutely no reason to panic about missing the playoffs.

I agree the solution is probably playing some starters more with the bench unit. Just swing the ball better with the current unit, i'm not really sure it helps much, because the open players are not guarded for a reason. Most of them can't shoot. I hope with DJ now the spacing gets better.

Another thing. We are 0:3 against better teams, but its not that easy. Last year we had the 3rd best winning pct vs. playoff teams in the east and we still barely made the playoffs. We have to start winning against those teams too.

As long as Griffin & Trae are injured we are gonna hang around the 8th place even with our current offense anyway, just not sure if the 8th place while winning 38-40 games is really a success or a step backwards.

[Knightro]

The Magic right now are...

5th in DTRG
4th in DREB%
5th in TO%

If they maintain those numbers the entire season, it will be virtually impossible for them to miss the East playoffs. Shots are going to it fall at a better clip eventually. It would be unprecedented for them not to start dropping with more regularity.

[Knightro]

Like even if you 100% expected the Magic to *regress* offensively, this really isn't that.

This has been a full blown crash landing thus far. The offense has been SO uniquely bad that it seems unsustainable given the career numbers of basically every single player on the roster.

You legitimately have multiple guys shooting 10-15% *worse* than the previous *worst* seasons of their careers.

It simply won't continue.

[rcklsscognition]

Last year we were the nearly the opposite. Or it might have been the year before that, can't remember. The media were dubbing us the Warriors of the East at one point we were so hot from 3.

[GelbeWand09]

The Magic right now are...

5th in DTRG
4th in DREB%
5th in TO%

If they maintain those numbers the entire season, it will be virtually impossible for them to miss the East playoffs. Shots are going to it fall at a better clip eventually. It would be unprecedented for them not to start dropping with more regularity.

I think i've seen somewhere the last days, that 94 of the last 100 teams with a top 5 defense made the playoffs.

Problem is, when you are so outmatched on offense, your defensive intensity gonna struggle too, like we've seen against the Bucks.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

This might be a blessing in disguise. Force management to figure something out instead of trading or signing another non-shooting forward.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

The Magic right now are...

5th in DTRG
4th in DREB%
5th in TO%

If they maintain those numbers the entire season, it will be virtually impossible for them to miss the East playoffs. Shots are going to it fall at a better clip eventually. It would be unprecedented for them not to start dropping with more regularity.

They will not be able to maintain their defense if they offensive does not improve. I cannot see us being a top 5 defensive team but lose every game because we cannot shoot.

[OrlandO]

Last year we were the nearly the opposite. Or it might have been the year before that, can't remember. The media were dubbing us the Warriors of the East at one point we were so hot from 3.

I think that was 17-18 When Vuc and Gordon were dropping 40 and everyone was shooting out of their minds and we got a bunch of early wins before getting hit with the injury bug. So far our season mirrors last season's win/loss pattern with a W-L-L-W-L-L start... hopefully we don't lose 4 in a row like at this point last season.

[Knightro]

They will not be able to maintain their defense if they offensive does not improve. I cannot see us being a top 5 defensive team but lose every game because we cannot shoot.

Fair point.

My counter would be that given their personnel, I'm much more confident the Magic will be able to maintain a top 5 DTRG and DREB team than I am confident they will remain the worst offensive team in the league by a wide margin.

They don't even have to make massive gains either. The Magic only need to improve the offense to around 20th in the league to be a sure fire playoff team with a top 5 defense and rebounding squad.