Kings Trade Thread

[bleeds_purple]

I'm two hands behind trading away Bogdanovic near deadline.
We can't pay Barnes, Baddy and Bogi 70-75 millions per year being borderline PO team.

If we remain a borderline playoff team in the long-term that means Bagley and Fox are not getting max deals in which case we can easily afford that payroll. If they do get max deals, then we are a contender and the payroll is justified.

There is no possible way we can replace what he brings to the table. Trading him for a pick and rolling the dice is not really appealing given where we are in the building process. Trading him for another playmaker doesn't change anything in terms of roster costs. End of the day, we have to resign Bogdan.

I think it's pretty much a certainty that Fox gets the max, if not from us then we'll match the max offer he gets from whoever gives it to him, regardless if we're a borderline playoff team or solid playoff team/contender.

Bagley probably has a better chance of not getting the max but that's also very unlikely in my opinion.

I'm not 100% sure on Fox. It's more likely than not but it really depends on if he raises his level of play over the course of the rest of his rookie deal. He projects to be highly paid but he would need to improve his play to receive a max. Bagley it's way too soon to tell but his current play is obviously no where near a max deal level.

That wasn't really my point though. My point is if both of them earn a max deal we are solidly in contention so a higher payroll should be expected.

[jazanetti]

I'm two hands behind trading away Bogdanovic near deadline.
We can't pay Barnes, Baddy and Bogi 70-75 millions per year being borderline PO team.

If we remain a borderline playoff team in the long-term that means Bagley and Fox are not getting max deals in which case we can easily afford that payroll. If they do get max deals, then we are a contender and the payroll is justified.

There is no possible way we can replace what he brings to the table. Trading him for a pick and rolling the dice is not really appealing given where we are in the building process. Trading him for another playmaker doesn't change anything in terms of roster costs. End of the day, we have to resign Bogdan.

Wel, some thoughts:
1. Bogi wants starter role, but we do not have that slot for him.
2. Price. He'll probably ask for Brogdon's level deal or more and he can find it. I hate the idea of paying 20-25 millions for a 6-th man and off the bench playmaker unless we are not a legit contender.
3. Contract year factor. He's doing his best this year and I don't see the room for improvement. Bu he easily can go down to his last year performance.

Summarize, I really don't want Vlade to match something like 80-90/4 at summer and at the same time I hate the way we scatter our assets. So, we really need to think about the trade when Fox returns.

[bleeds_purple]

If a bench role doesn't work long-term then resign him in the off-season and work out a trade. But that's the only reason I'd look to move him.

[BoogieTime]

I'm two hands behind trading away Bogdanovic near deadline.
We can't pay Barnes, Baddy and Bogi 70-75 millions per year being borderline PO team.

If we remain a borderline playoff team in the long-term that means Bagley and Fox are not getting max deals in which case we can easily afford that payroll. If they do get max deals, then we are a contender and the payroll is justified.

There is no possible way we can replace what he brings to the table. Trading him for a pick and rolling the dice is not really appealing given where we are in the building process. Trading him for another playmaker doesn't change anything in terms of roster costs. End of the day, we have to resign Bogdan.

I think it's pretty much a certainty that Fox gets the max, if not from us then we'll match the max offer he gets from whoever gives it to him, regardless if we're a borderline playoff team or solid playoff team/contender.

Bagley probably has a better chance of not getting the max but that's also very unlikely in my opinion.

I don’t think so at all. I think we throw around the notion of the max too easily

It’s designated for players who definitely propel their teams to the next level

Now, I can’t tell if the team would be better signing Fred Van Vleet this offseason and another solid couple role players, to round out a pesky team who brings it overnight, while trading Fox for a bevy of assets. He has holes, notably consistency/motor, and I can’t tell yet if the team is much worse with Joseph this year

Bagley is a prospect. He had negative advanced stats last year. Max deal players is a lofty lofty goal

At this point the team would like to keep

Buddy
Bogdan
Barnes
Holmes
JAMes
Bjelica

In addition to them. Money is tight

[nzahir]

Who do you guys even want for Bogdan? What position or who are some names?

This is why I threw Kuzma's name out there. 2 years left on 2M a year and his cap hold for 2021 is cheap.

Or do you guys want picks?

[kalenclayton]

Who do you guys even want for Bogdan? What position or who are some names?

This is why I threw Kuzma's name out there. 2 years left on 2M a year and his cap hold for 2021 is cheap.

Or do you guys want picks?

The fallacy is thinking that we want to move Bogi in the first place. That one rumor McMahon and Windhorst started was based off of a “might”. It was never definite. Even if it turns out to be true, the Kings do not want to move him. He’s a very good player who fits well with the team. The Kings also need him because they don’t have very many avenues to get better.

IF (that’s a BIG if) the Kings were to move Bogi, it would be for a similar caliber player who fits with the core. That player needs to be a core fit, not a win-now or prospect player. This makes trading him a tough task. It’s hard to pinpoint who that player is, but Kuzma certainly is not that guy. He’s a scorer who happens to play the same position as one of the two guys who’s supposed to lead us. There is also Bjelica (which I know has been argued about in the Bogi to the Lakers thread). He is a better fit with the team than Kuzma. Kuz may be a better player long term, but Bjelica is the stabilizing vet that the team needs right now. He does the little things that Kuz doesn’t.

[nzahir]

Who do you guys even want for Bogdan? What position or who are some names?

This is why I threw Kuzma's name out there. 2 years left on 2M a year and his cap hold for 2021 is cheap.

Or do you guys want picks?

The fallacy is thinking that we want to move Bogi in the first place. That one rumor McMahon and Windhorst started was based off of a “might”. It was never definite. Even if it turns out to be true, the Kings do not want to move him. He’s a very good player who fits well with the team. The Kings also need him because they don’t have very many avenues to get better.

IF (that’s a BIG if) the Kings were to move Bogi, it would be for a similar caliber player who fits with the core. That player needs to be a core fit, not a win-now or prospect player. This makes trading him a tough task. It’s hard to pinpoint who that player is, but Kuzma certainly is not that guy. He’s a scorer who happens to play the same position as one of the two guys who’s supposed to lead us. There is also Bjelica (which I know has been argued about in the Bogi to the Lakers thread). He is a better fit with the team than Kuzma. Kuz may be a better player long term, but Bjelica is the stabilizing vet that the team needs right now. He does the little things that Kuz doesn’t.

Who is the player or who are some players you feel like makes sense though?

Obviously the team needs upgrades. Likely missing the playoffs this year. Your 1 and 2 are set. The 4 should be set with Bagley. So there can be upgrades at the 3 or the 5. Yet you guys just paid Barnes all that money and Dedmon has these 2 years left. No clue why you guys paid Cory Jo 13M a year.

[kalenclayton]

Who do you guys even want for Bogdan? What position or who are some names?

This is why I threw Kuzma's name out there. 2 years left on 2M a year and his cap hold for 2021 is cheap.

Or do you guys want picks?

The fallacy is thinking that we want to move Bogi in the first place. That one rumor McMahon and Windhorst started was based off of a “might”. It was never definite. Even if it turns out to be true, the Kings do not want to move him. He’s a very good player who fits well with the team. The Kings also need him because they don’t have very many avenues to get better.

IF (that’s a BIG if) the Kings were to move Bogi, it would be for a similar caliber player who fits with the core. That player needs to be a core fit, not a win-now or prospect player. This makes trading him a tough task. It’s hard to pinpoint who that player is, but Kuzma certainly is not that guy. He’s a scorer who happens to play the same position as one of the two guys who’s supposed to lead us. There is also Bjelica (which I know has been argued about in the Bogi to the Lakers thread). He is a better fit with the team than Kuzma. Kuz may be a better player long term, but Bjelica is the stabilizing vet that the team needs right now. He does the little things that Kuz doesn’t.

Who is the player or who are some players you feel like makes sense though?

Obviously the team needs upgrades. Likely missing the playoffs this year. Your 1 and 2 are set. The 4 should be set with Bagley. So there can be upgrades at the 3 or the 5. Yet you guys just paid Barnes all that money and Dedmon has these 2 years left. No clue why you guys paid Cory Jo 13M a year.

It’s not time to make a move. I get that it looks like they need to move Bogi, but the team just has no real incentive to move him, especially right now. The team has been hit with major injuries to Bagley and Fox and are currently winning, so there is no incentive to make any moves at all.

A major move like trading Bogi would most likely hurt the team now and in the future. We haven’t seen the core play together enough to make a real decision. The true core is Fox, Buddy, Bogi, Barnes, and Bagley. It is likely that one of these guys comes off the bench and it’s probably Bogi because he’s good at it. Out of the 4 leftover players, the only position left to fill is a 4 or a 5. We cannot make that determination yet because we haven’t seen Bagley’s development from the summer in play yet. He’s currently a 4, but he could be a fantastic 5 if he can learn to guard large bigs. We just don’t know that yet, so it’s hard to make any decisions.

Also, the Barnes signing may have looked bad on the outside, but that guys has been a rock! He’s been the most consistently good player on the team. He’s smart, skilled, and fits very well with the team. It just seems like he doesn’t have a bad game. If his shot isn’t falling, he affects the game in many other ways. I didn’t like the number he signed for at first, but it has surprisingly turned out very well.

The Dedmon and Joseph signings we were heavy on money. I’ll give you that. Vlade was looking to improve perimeter defense and increase stability and he got exactly that with Joseph. The Dedmon signing looked like a great move at first, but he just hasn’t returned value. There is hope that he turns it around, but that could end up being a bad signing. It’s ok though because we got Richaun, who has been tremendous.

I didn’t name a player to trade for because we simply don’t need to make a move and we don’t have enough data to understand our biggest need without Bogi. If we move him, our bench will suffer greatly and the team will fall right back to the bottom.

Edit: I wouldn’t go so far to say the team will likely miss the playoffs. They are a half game out of 8th place right now and they don’t even have Bagley and Fox.

[SmellingColors]

The reality is that we need Fox to make another jump to an All Star caliber player. To start this year, he has not looked especially good to me. Part of it is motor (especially defensively), but part of it may also be that development isn't linear. He may need another year before he takes that next step if he ever does. Bagley also didn't look very good. I'm very hesitant to move a guy that has been one of our rocks, who is a RFA, because the potential that Fox/Bagley are going to command something that we haven't seen yet. Personally, I believe in Fox and to a lesser degree Bagley, but we certainly don't need to panic over money, yet. As kalenclayton said, there's no real incentive to make a move until we've seen what we have as a collective unit. That will at least take us up to the trade deadline if not into next year.

[SacKingZZZ]

The fallacy is thinking that we want to move Bogi in the first place. That one rumor McMahon and Windhorst started was based off of a “might”. It was never definite. Even if it turns out to be true, the Kings do not want to move him. He’s a very good player who fits well with the team. The Kings also need him because they don’t have very many avenues to get better.

IF (that’s a BIG if) the Kings were to move Bogi, it would be for a similar caliber player who fits with the core. That player needs to be a core fit, not a win-now or prospect player. This makes trading him a tough task. It’s hard to pinpoint who that player is, but Kuzma certainly is not that guy. He’s a scorer who happens to play the same position as one of the two guys who’s supposed to lead us. There is also Bjelica (which I know has been argued about in the Bogi to the Lakers thread). He is a better fit with the team than Kuzma. Kuz may be a better player long term, but Bjelica is the stabilizing vet that the team needs right now. He does the little things that Kuz doesn’t.

Who is the player or who are some players you feel like makes sense though?

Obviously the team needs upgrades. Likely missing the playoffs this year. Your 1 and 2 are set. The 4 should be set with Bagley. So there can be upgrades at the 3 or the 5. Yet you guys just paid Barnes all that money and Dedmon has these 2 years left. No clue why you guys paid Cory Jo 13M a year.

It’s not time to make a move. I get that it looks like they need to move Bogi, but the team just has no real incentive to move him, especially right now. The team has been hit with major injuries to Bagley and Fox and are currently winning, so there is no incentive to make any moves at all.

A major move like trading Bogi would most likely hurt the team now and in the future. We haven’t seen the core play together enough to make a real decision. The true core is Fox, Buddy, Bogi, Barnes, and Bagley. It is likely that one of these guys comes off the bench and it’s probably Bogi because he’s good at it. Out of the 4 leftover players, the only position left to fill is a 4 or a 5. We cannot make that determination yet because we haven’t seen Bagley’s development from the summer in play yet. He’s currently a 4, but he could be a fantastic 5 if he can learn to guard large bigs. We just don’t know that yet, so it’s hard to make any decisions.

Also, the Barnes signing may have looked bad on the outside, but that guys has been a rock! He’s been the most consistently good player on the team. He’s smart, skilled, and fits very well with the team. It just seems like he doesn’t have a bad game. If his shot isn’t falling, he affects the game in many other ways. I didn’t like the number he signed for at first, but it has surprisingly turned out very well.

The Dedmon and Joseph signings we were heavy on money. I’ll give you that. Vlade was looking to improve perimeter defense and increase stability and he got exactly that with Joseph. The Dedmon signing looked like a great move at first, but he just hasn’t returned value. There is hope that he turns it around, but that could end up being a bad signing. It’s ok though because we got Richaun, who has been tremendous.

I didn’t name a player to trade for because we simply don’t need to make a move and we don’t have enough data to understand our biggest need without Bogi. If we move him, our bench will suffer greatly and the team will fall right back to the bottom.

Edit: I wouldn’t go so far to say the team will likely miss the playoffs. They are a half game out of 8th place right now and they don’t even have Bagley and Fox.

That's the key. They have to see what Fox and Bagley look like with the team when they come back. There are a ton of ways it can work but they have to see what it looks like before they make any moves. If Bogdan disappears when they come back because his role is reduced then they need to consider moving him sooner than later because now teams have seen what he looks like running a team. I do think Vlade is in a position to overpay then figure it out later when it comes to Bogdan. There is plenty of time before Bagley becomes a cap crusher.

[dckingsfan]

It’s not time to make a move...

That's the key. They have to see what Fox and Bagley look like with the team when they come back.

This - you guys both hit it... It isn't time to make a trade yet. Vlade needs to see what he has and what he needs.

He may want a player(s) or picks for either Hield or Bogdan (if he doesn't feel like he can keep them or they would bust the cap). But it has to figure out what his core is (his big 3 or 4 if you will).

If he asked me (LOL), I would tell him to continue to add assets while continuing to figure out what his core is going to be - we have no outgoing picks right now and coming in we have (we should build on this):

2020 second round draft pick from Detroit
Detroit's 2020 2nd round pick to Sacramento (via Phoenix) [Detroit-Phoenix, 7/9/2015; Phoenix-Sacramento, 6/23/2016]

2020 second round draft pick from Golden State or Houston
Dallas will receive the more favorable of Golden State's 2020 2nd round pick and Houston's 2020 2nd round pick protected for selections 31-39 and Sacramento will receive the less favorable of the two (via Dallas' right to swap Golden State for Houston); if the Houston pick falls within its protected range of 31-39, then Dallas will instead receive the Golden State pick and Sacramento will instead receive the Houston pick (via Houston's 2020 2nd round pick to Sacramento protected for selections 40-60) (Houston's obligation to Dallas or Sacramento will thereafter be extinguished) [Dallas-Golden State, 7/7/2016; Dallas-Houston, 8/2/2018; Cleveland-Houston-Sacramento, 2/7/2019]

2020 second round draft pick from Miami
Miami's 2020 2nd round pick to Sacramento (via Boston to Cleveland) [Boston-Miami, 7/27/2015; Boston-Cleveland, 8/22/2017; Cleveland-Sacramento-Utah, 2/8/2018]

2021 second round draft pick from Memphis
Memphis' 2021 2nd round pick to Sacramento [Memphis-Sacramento, 7/17/2018]

2021 second round draft pick from Miami
Miami's 2021 2nd round pick to Sacramento (via Portland) [Miami-Portland, 2/18/2016; Portland-Sacramento, 6/21/2018]

[bleeds_purple]

You guys are all spot on. There is no reason to make a trade right now. Especially when it comes to Bogi. If you engage in the thought exercise of "who should we trade Bogi for" you quickly start thinking of players who can come off the bench and be a playmaker i.e. what he already does. That should tell you all you need to know.

That being said, I'd much prefer to move Buddy as compared to Bogi. Justin James looks like he can be a real player and may very well bring more of what we need out of the SG position if he develops. I could easy a world 1-2 years down the line where he's starting and Buddy can be a scorer off the bench.

[SacKingZZZ]

You guys are all spot on. There is no reason to make a trade right now. Especially when it comes to Bogi. If you engage in the thought exercise of "who should we trade Bogi for" you quickly start thinking of players who can come off the bench and be a playmaker i.e. what he already does. That should tell you all you need to know.

That being said, I'd much prefer to move Buddy as compared to Bogi. Justin James looks like he can be a real player and may very well bring more of what we need out of the SG position if he develops. I could easy a world 1-2 years down the line where he's starting and Buddy can be a scorer off the bench.

If it comes down to Buddy vs. Bogdan it depends on how they fit next to Fox. We've seen both and so far that battle has Buddy coming out on top. Bogdan for this team is your back up point and/or a play making SF when they go small. Bogdan off the ball isn't the same player Buddy is. Bogdan running point is an entirely different impact player than Bogdan on the wing. He's solid on the wing but on the ball is where he's going to get paid. As for Justin James. He's plugged into a decent, scrappy two way player role who you call on when necessary. Him becoming a starter is unlikely unless he's the best fit or something major goes wrong and in the best case he continues to be that player you can plug in to put pressure on someone defensively. They are making the most out of the fact that James is a full 4 year college player. He was ready out of the box. There might be some upside left but what he's doing now is what will keep him at the end of a teams rotation for years to come.

[bleeds_purple]

You guys are all spot on. There is no reason to make a trade right now. Especially when it comes to Bogi. If you engage in the thought exercise of "who should we trade Bogi for" you quickly start thinking of players who can come off the bench and be a playmaker i.e. what he already does. That should tell you all you need to know.

That being said, I'd much prefer to move Buddy as compared to Bogi. Justin James looks like he can be a real player and may very well bring more of what we need out of the SG position if he develops. I could easy a world 1-2 years down the line where he's starting and Buddy can be a scorer off the bench.

If it comes down to Buddy vs. Bogdan it depends on how they fit next to Fox. We've seen both and so far that battle has Buddy coming out on top. Bogdan for this team is your back up point and/or a play making SF when they go small. Bogdan off the ball isn't the same player Buddy is. Bogdan running point is an entirely different impact player than Bogdan on the wing. He's solid on the wing but on the ball is where he's going to get paid. As for Justin James. He's plugged into a decent, scrappy two way player role who you call on when necessary. Him becoming a starter is unlikely unless he's the best fit or something major goes wrong and in the best case he continues to be that player you can plug in to put pressure on someone defensively. They are making the most out of the fact that James is a full 4 year college player. He was ready out of the box. There might be some upside left but what he's doing now is what will keep him at the end of a teams rotation for years to come.

That's a fair assessment. Personally, I value a second ball handler over a streak shooter with questionable shot selection, plays outside of his skillset, and is a liability on defense. Hopefully this improves once Fox is back because he is playing lost right now.

James looks to be an athletic 3&D wing who can make a play off a swing of the ball dribble drive. The ideal role player in today's game. He also plays with a lot of heart. I'm really high on this guy right now.

[KF10]

Buddy can explode at any night but does have some quiet games when his shot doesn’t fall.

Bogdan has a higher floor than Buddy but doesn’t have the potential explosive output Buddy has, IMO.

[dckingsfan]

Yeah - on the one hand it stinks that Vlade will have to make a choice between Bogdan and Buddy. On the other hand - I am guessing he is going to get some really good offers at the trade deadline. Of course if the offers are bad then it will stink even more.

Looking at the offseason - Holmes and Barnes have turned out to be very solid and solid extensions respectively.

Joseph, Ariza and Dedmon not so much. I am especially puzzled by Dedmon's regression (I do think he will bounceback). And really wish Vlade had been a bit more patient and could have pulled in the Andre Iguodala trade instead of taking Ariza (I think Ariza is done). I never thought much of Joseph in the first place and thought we should have stuck with Ferrell (who is not exactly playing that much better) (and played Bogdan more at backup PG).

[bleeds_purple]

Ariza looks washed and his minutes should go to James. Cojo is serviceable but overpaid; I like his defense but its such a liability to have a non-shooter at PG. Dedmon started out playing at an F rating and now worked his way up to a C- but he ultimately looks like a backup.

[SacKingZZZ]

You guys are all spot on. There is no reason to make a trade right now. Especially when it comes to Bogi. If you engage in the thought exercise of "who should we trade Bogi for" you quickly start thinking of players who can come off the bench and be a playmaker i.e. what he already does. That should tell you all you need to know.

That being said, I'd much prefer to move Buddy as compared to Bogi. Justin James looks like he can be a real player and may very well bring more of what we need out of the SG position if he develops. I could easy a world 1-2 years down the line where he's starting and Buddy can be a scorer off the bench.

If it comes down to Buddy vs. Bogdan it depends on how they fit next to Fox. We've seen both and so far that battle has Buddy coming out on top. Bogdan for this team is your back up point and/or a play making SF when they go small. Bogdan off the ball isn't the same player Buddy is. Bogdan running point is an entirely different impact player than Bogdan on the wing. He's solid on the wing but on the ball is where he's going to get paid. As for Justin James. He's plugged into a decent, scrappy two way player role who you call on when necessary. Him becoming a starter is unlikely unless he's the best fit or something major goes wrong and in the best case he continues to be that player you can plug in to put pressure on someone defensively. They are making the most out of the fact that James is a full 4 year college player. He was ready out of the box. There might be some upside left but what he's doing now is what will keep him at the end of a teams rotation for years to come.

That's a fair assessment. Personally, I value a second ball handler over a streak shooter with questionable shot selection, plays outside of his skillset, and is a liability on defense. Hopefully this improves once Fox is back because he is playing lost right now.

James looks to be an athletic 3&D wing who can make a play off a swing of the ball dribble drive. The ideal role player in today's game. He also plays with a lot of heart. I'm really high on this guy right now.

Normally I would agree but when your coach wants to run a team concept it won't be utilized to the extent it could be. And Buddy for most of his career hasn't been streaky. This year he's being forced into the primary offensive role and teams are making it tough on him. He's also not found his fit with Walton yet. It's kind of been a reset for him so far this year.

[SacKingZZZ]

Buddy can explode at any night but does have some quiet games when his shot doesn’t fall.

Bogdan has a higher floor than Buddy but doesn’t have the potential explosive output Buddy has, IMO.

I will say Buddy has been busting his butt on defense when the shot isn't falling. He has lapses but I'm impressed with his effort when his shot isn't falling.

[NYG]

Not a Spurs fan, but would DeRozan and/or Aldridge make sense for the Kings?

Does Dedmon, Barnes, Joseph and Conditional Kings 1st make sense or does that just make things messier?