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KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything

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KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#1 » by god shammgod » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:47 pm

this article got it all - it's a good read
PORZINGIS FELT ALIENATED within the organization, and Fizdale knew his past Gasol saga loomed over a potential partnership.

Porzingis was rehabilitating his torn left ACL in Europe, with an expectation that he could miss all of Fizdale's first season with the Knicks. Regardless of whether the Knicks ever recruited a superstar free agent, Fizdale believed he had an anchor player who could keep the franchise competitive.

Porzingis felt an initial connection with Fizdale, only to return for the start of training camp and find a new set of frustrations. There were disagreements on everything from windows of time for Porzingis' rehab at the Knicks' facility to whether the franchise considered his presence a positive in its pursuit of Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving in free agency, sources said.

The Knicks began gauging interest in Porzingis early in 2019. According to sources, New York offered the New Orleans Pelicans a package centered around Porzingis in exchange for forward Anthony Davis. But former Pelicans general manager Dell Demps showed little interest in that discussion, and the Knicks took that as an indication that interest in Porzingis might not be as high league-wide.

Porzingis and his brother, Janis, who serves as his agent, had planned to meet with management to discuss his future in January. Once the Porzingis brothers found out that the Knicks were discussing a trade with the Dallas Mavericks, sources said, they hurried a meeting the next morning and asked to be moved to one of four destinations: the Nets, Clippers, Raptors or Heat.

The meeting was brief, and the Knicks agreed to terms with Dallas before the brothers had returned from the suburbs to their Manhattan home.

Even with the ACL injury, Porzingis commanded significant interest around the NBA -- and dozens of teams were confused about why they never had a chance to bid on him.

But the details of the trade -- bringing back marginal players, unloading salaries for cap space and acquiring two first-round draft picks -- suggested one of two things to NBA rivals: The Knicks knew absolutely that they were getting Durant or Irving in free agency, or they knew absolutely nothing about executing a franchise-changing trade.

That's when, in spring 2019, owner James Dolan went on ESPN New York and boasted, "New York is the mecca of basketball. We hear from people, from players, from representatives about who wants to come. From what we've heard, I think we're going to have a very successful offseason when it comes to free agency."

Durant's father, Wayne Pratt, and business partner, Rich Kleiman, were self-professed Knicks fans, and players around the league gossiped about Durant going to New York with the same kind of certainty with which they'd talked about him joining the Warriors in 2016.

The Knicks also had the best odds of any team to win the NBA lottery and the chance to draft Duke star Zion Williamson.

They were well-positioned. But they misread one critical component: Durant's willingness to come without Irving. Initially, the Knicks were an option for both Durant and Irving. But Irving's fondness for the Nets, the team he grew up rooting for in New Jersey, was a critical factor, as was the recruiting effort of Nets guard Spencer Dinwiddie, who befriended Irving in September 2018, when they both took a class with Harvard Business School Professor Anita Elberse.

Since being teammates in the 2016 Olympics in Rio de Janeiro, Irving, Durant and DeAndre Jordan had talked often about playing together one day. The only question was where.

Irving pushed the Nets as a destination, selling his two friends on the Nets' culture, their front-office savvy and the chance to make history with a franchise on the rise.

The Knicks' hopes rested on Durant selling his friends on playing together at the Garden or choosing to play for the Knicks and bringing another star, such as Kawhi Leonard or Kemba Walker, with him.

Although Durant did strongly consider the Knicks, according to sources close to the situation, he never pushed them the way Irving pushed Brooklyn.

"The Knicks players, they're good, young players, but they still need more experience to match where I was in my career," Durant told former teammate Serge Ibaka in October. "It was nothing major against the Knicks. I just think Brooklyn is further along in the process of being a contender."

Perry and Mills advocated for a bold pursuit and contract offer, despite the risks associated with Durant's Achilles tendon rupture. Dolan was leery of that plan, however, after his experiences with players with injury histories, such as Amar'e Stoudemire.

In the end, it was a moot point. Durant decided to go with Irving and Jordan to Brooklyn. Kleiman informed Dolan directly, right as free agency opened.


https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/28261417/lost-stars-lack-leadership-fleeting-hope-knicks
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#2 » by sol537 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:55 pm

Yeah, good read. Hits everything right on the head.

The only way we can salvage the future is if Dolan gives full power to Ujiri or Presti. I don't think there's any other way.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#3 » by BowlRips » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:06 pm

Mills is the worst.
Just the worst
That is all
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#4 » by prophet_of_rage » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:17 pm

So Dolan vetoed going after Durant nonetheless and forced Pills into scramble mode to create what you see today. Cool. And Kevin Durant is soft and a follower.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#5 » by TheGreenArrow » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:18 pm

KP WAS RITE FOLKS!!!

STAY WOKE!!!!!!
NewYorkOrNoWhere!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#6 » by prophet_of_rage » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:18 pm

BowlRips wrote:Mills is the worst.
Just the worst
That is all


Did you read that Dolan vetoed a contract offer for Durant? What was Mills to do? We keep seeing the problem and we keep expecting better results from it.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#7 » by dakomish23 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:22 pm

prophet_of_rage wrote:So Dolan vetoed going after Durant nonetheless and forced Pills into scramble mode to create what you see today. Cool. And Kevin Durant is soft and a follower.


How is that what you took away?

We didn’t even get a chance. They told us right away.

Moot point that Dolan was leery, not a veto.

You’re trying hard to spin this for Mills. My question is, why?
Jimmit79 wrote:Yea RJ played well he was definitely the x factor


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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#8 » by GONYK » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:22 pm

prophet_of_rage wrote:
BowlRips wrote:Mills is the worst.
Just the worst
That is all


Did you read that Dolan vetoed a contract offer for Durant? What was Mills to do? We keep seeing the problem and we keep expecting better results from it.


Not giving a superMAX contract to KD with a torn achilles and no Robin was the right call.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#9 » by Dave DaButcher » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:28 pm

Adam Silver needs to intervene. This is a Donald Sterling-Clippers level fiasco sans the racism.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#10 » by dakomish23 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:29 pm

Even with the ACL injury, Porzingis commanded significant interest around the NBA -- and dozens of teams were confused about why they never had a chance to bid on him.

But the details of the trade -- bringing back marginal players, unloading salaries for cap space and acquiring two first-round draft picks -- suggested one of two things to NBA rivals: The Knicks knew absolutely that they were getting Durant or Irving in free agency, or they knew absolutely nothing about executing a franchise-changing trade.


This is just a thing of beauty.

Between Dolan getting his 1,000 loss in less than 20 seasons and the FO being exposed for their unfathomable futility, it’s been a great 24 hours.

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Jimmit79 wrote:Yea RJ played well he was definitely the x factor


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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#11 » by robillionaire » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:30 pm

I started to read it and realized I don't care anymore. I have no emotion left to give to this team
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#12 » by 2010 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:34 pm

We were previously leak proof under this regime. But now the snitches are refusing the witness protection plan and galavanting in plain view.

Good. This means internally, all loyalties have been fractured and Perry & Mills are toast. Just a matter of time.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#13 » by Deeeez Knicks » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:39 pm

prophet_of_rage wrote:So Dolan vetoed going after Durant nonetheless and forced Pills into scramble mode to create what you see today. Cool. And Kevin Durant is soft and a follower.


Durant was always a long shot. He didn't want to come here anyway. Regardless, Pills should have been prepared with a good backup plan. That they were left scrambling is just another sign of incompetence.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#14 » by BadNewsBarnes » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:43 pm

"But there have been ownership-level discussions about hiring a new coach in-season if the team continues to crater, according to sources."

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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#15 » by Jay10 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:44 pm

2010 wrote:We were previously leak proof under this regime. But now the snitches are refusing the witness protection plan and galavanting in plain view.

Good. This means internally, all loyalties have been fractured and Perry & Mills are toast. Just a matter of time.

How so? Everything in the report was known maybe except for Mills and Perry currently being on contracts that will expire at the end of the season if Dolan doesn't pickup the 2 remaining years.

It's basically the ESPN version of what Howard Beck did, which everything was already known but he took reports from other people's article and created a greatest hits for himself.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#16 » by Knicks Byke » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:45 pm

we never learn.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#17 » by NYKAL » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:51 pm

god shammgod wrote:this article got it all - it's a good read
PORZINGIS FELT ALIENATED within the organization, and Fizdale knew his past Gasol saga loomed over a potential partnership.

Porzingis was rehabilitating his torn left ACL in Europe, with an expectation that he could miss all of Fizdale's first season with the Knicks. Regardless of whether the Knicks ever recruited a superstar free agent, Fizdale believed he had an anchor player who could keep the franchise competitive.

Porzingis felt an initial connection with Fizdale, only to return for the start of training camp and find a new set of frustrations. There were disagreements on everything from windows of time for Porzingis' rehab at the Knicks' facility to whether the franchise considered his presence a positive in its pursuit of Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving in free agency, sources said.

The Knicks began gauging interest in Porzingis early in 2019. According to sources, New York offered the New Orleans Pelicans a package centered around Porzingis in exchange for forward Anthony Davis. But former Pelicans general manager Dell Demps showed little interest in that discussion, and the Knicks took that as an indication that interest in Porzingis might not be as high league-wide.

Porzingis and his brother, Janis, who serves as his agent, had planned to meet with management to discuss his future in January. Once the Porzingis brothers found out that the Knicks were discussing a trade with the Dallas Mavericks, sources said, they hurried a meeting the next morning and asked to be moved to one of four destinations: the Nets, Clippers, Raptors or Heat.

The meeting was brief, and the Knicks agreed to terms with Dallas before the brothers had returned from the suburbs to their Manhattan home.

Even with the ACL injury, Porzingis commanded significant interest around the NBA -- and dozens of teams were confused about why they never had a chance to bid on him.

But the details of the trade -- bringing back marginal players, unloading salaries for cap space and acquiring two first-round draft picks -- suggested one of two things to NBA rivals: The Knicks knew absolutely that they were getting Durant or Irving in free agency, or they knew absolutely nothing about executing a franchise-changing trade.

That's when, in spring 2019, owner James Dolan went on ESPN New York and boasted, "New York is the mecca of basketball. We hear from people, from players, from representatives about who wants to come. From what we've heard, I think we're going to have a very successful offseason when it comes to free agency."

Durant's father, Wayne Pratt, and business partner, Rich Kleiman, were self-professed Knicks fans, and players around the league gossiped about Durant going to New York with the same kind of certainty with which they'd talked about him joining the Warriors in 2016.

The Knicks also had the best odds of any team to win the NBA lottery and the chance to draft Duke star Zion Williamson.

They were well-positioned. But they misread one critical component: Durant's willingness to come without Irving. Initially, the Knicks were an option for both Durant and Irving. But Irving's fondness for the Nets, the team he grew up rooting for in New Jersey, was a critical factor, as was the recruiting effort of Nets guard Spencer Dinwiddie, who befriended Irving in September 2018, when they both took a class with Harvard Business School Professor Anita Elberse.

Since being teammates in the 2016 Olympics in Rio de Janeiro, Irving, Durant and DeAndre Jordan had talked often about playing together one day. The only question was where.

Irving pushed the Nets as a destination, selling his two friends on the Nets' culture, their front-office savvy and the chance to make history with a franchise on the rise.

The Knicks' hopes rested on Durant selling his friends on playing together at the Garden or choosing to play for the Knicks and bringing another star, such as Kawhi Leonard or Kemba Walker, with him.

Although Durant did strongly consider the Knicks, according to sources close to the situation, he never pushed them the way Irving pushed Brooklyn.

"The Knicks players, they're good, young players, but they still need more experience to match where I was in my career," Durant told former teammate Serge Ibaka in October. "It was nothing major against the Knicks. I just think Brooklyn is further along in the process of being a contender."

Perry and Mills advocated for a bold pursuit and contract offer, despite the risks associated with Durant's Achilles tendon rupture. Dolan was leery of that plan, however, after his experiences with players with injury histories, such as Amar'e Stoudemire.

In the end, it was a moot point. Durant decided to go with Irving and Jordan to Brooklyn. Kleiman informed Dolan directly, right as free agency opened.


https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/28261417/lost-stars-lack-leadership-fleeting-hope-knicks



much of that directly contradict what Michael Hahn said on the Air. Said KP went from having the keys to the facilities and loving it. Then he started to become a no-show, communication became iffy and then he decided to go rehab away.

I really don't trust espn to even accurately tell the story anyway. They hate the Knicks.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#18 » by RHODEY » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:52 pm

sol537 wrote:Yeah, good read. Hits everything right on the head.

The only way we can salvage the future is if Dolan gives full power to Ujiri or Presti. I don't think there's any other way.

It hit everything except KD's career altering injury and how that may have affected the Knicks pursuit of him.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#19 » by NYKAL » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:52 pm

from everything I've heard we are going to have a good free agency is NOT the same thing as we're getting Durant which, is what EVERYONE ran with.
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Re: KP, KD, Mills, Fiz, Perry & everything 

Post#20 » by robillionaire » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:53 pm

NYKAL wrote:from everything I've heard we are going to have a good free agency is NOT the same thing as we're getting Durant which, is what EVERYONE ran with.


Even if we accept that, they didn’t have a good free agency.

They turned a 17 win team into a 13-14 win team

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