Around The NBA: 2019-20 RESTART

[HomoSapien]

Remember when the Wolves and Suns were considered up and comers and the NBA media darlings over the first few weeks of the season?

Since the Wolves 4-1 start and being the darlings of the NBA after 5 games, they have crashed and burned and gone 6-14 in their last 20 games and are now 10-15.

The Suns started 5-2, they have also crashed and burned also going 6-14 in their last 20. They are 11-16 now.

After the Bulls 1-4 start, they have gone 9-15 in their last 24. Bulls actually have a better pt differential (than the Wolves overall and Suns over the last 20 games), a better defense and a better winning percentage than both the Suns and Wolves after their hot starts. You could make a very strong case that right now, the Bulls are actually better than both the Suns and the Timberwolves who were two of the early season media darlings of the NBA.

Can't help but mention how many people were quick to point out that the Wolves were better without Thibs after 5 games.

[samwana]

David Nwaba now playing a solid bench role in Nets and has learned how to shoot (3-pointers). The same energy is still there with some more bbIQ, and with a bargain price of 1.75M. More salt to the Dinwiddie wound. Also TLC has his minutes now. How come Nets get so much more out the ex-Bulls?

Because they have a way better coach, that has clear roles for players to succeed and not roles that are put together on paper by a GM that chose a puppet to sit on the bench and play fake tough guy?

Sent from my POT-LX1 using RealGM mobile app

[johnnyvann840]

If it weren't for the Bulls, the Warriors would've been on a 13-game losing streak. They haven't won any game but against Chicago since Nov 19.

Without us, the Atlanta Hawks would be 4-24 and even worse than the Warriors. Of course that is counting the Warriors win against us. lol. Without the Bulls both the Warriors and the Hawks would be 4-24. They would both be challenging the 98 Nuggets who went 11-71 and are considered the worst team in history.

[TheSuzerain]

RPM standard deviations by position (offense/defense):

2018-2019

2.05/1.73 PG (54.3% O, 45.7% D)
1.62/1.41 wing (53.5% O, 46.5% D)
1.45/1.63 big (47.1% O, 52.9% D)

2013-2014

2.26/1.81 PG (55.5% O, 44.5% D)
2.14/2.08 wing (50.7% O, 49.3% D)
1.73/2.08 big (45.4% O, 54.6% D)

what we can roughly glean from this is that the importance of individual defensive ability has not diminished much over the past 5-6 seasons. and big men are still distinguished in value to their teams more by their defensive abilities than their offensive abilities. what's changed is defensive emphasis, which has become more perimeter-oriented as the number of stretch bigs proliferates

This analysis is faulty due to RPM being very messy.

not on a macro level such as league-wide data. which is why the data ends up being similar across two random seasons. i filtered out all the low minute players, by the way

It’s extremely messy on a league-wise year-to-year basis actually.

[dice]

This analysis is faulty due to RPM being very messy.

not on a macro level such as league-wide data. which is why the data ends up being similar across two random seasons. i filtered out all the low minute players, by the way

It’s extremely messy on a league-wise year-to-year basis actually.

in what regard? it simply doesn't make sense that the data ranges would be markedly different unless something in the way the game is played changed significantly or the calculations were altered or the garbage low minute player data was included

[TheSuzerain]

not on a macro level such as league-wide data. which is why the data ends up being similar across two random seasons. i filtered out all the low minute players, by the way

It’s extremely messy on a league-wise year-to-year basis actually.

in what regard? it simply doesn't make sense that the data ranges would be markedly different unless something in the way the game is played changed significantly or the calculations were altered or the garbage low minute player data was included

The calculations were altered.

[dice]

It’s extremely messy on a league-wise year-to-year basis actually.

in what regard? it simply doesn't make sense that the data ranges would be markedly different unless something in the way the game is played changed significantly or the calculations were altered or the garbage low minute player data was included

The calculations were altered.

says who?

i've read that once he created RPM, the creator went back and changed all his pure RAPM data online to RPM. if he changed his RPM methodology i would think that he would have gone back and made changes to all the data. but even if he didn't, that might just suggest that the changes were minor. and for it to be "extremely messy year-to-year" he would have to make significant changes every season, which i find hard to believe

[Dresden]

David Nwaba now playing a solid bench role in Nets and has learned how to shoot (3-pointers). The same energy is still there with some more bbIQ, and with a bargain price of 1.75M. More salt to the Dinwiddie wound. Also TLC has his minutes now. How come Nets get so much more out the ex-Bulls?

Because they have a way better coach, that has clear roles for players to succeed and not roles that are put together on paper by a GM that chose a puppet to sit on the bench and play fake tough guy?

Sent from my POT-LX1 using RealGM mobile app

Both Nwaba and TLC had their chances here, and just weren't that good. Nwaba had some fun moments, but I don't see how he cracks our rotation much when we're healthy. Otto Porter played much better after he got traded here than he was in WAS. Was that because our coaching was better?

[Dresden]

David Nwaba now playing a solid bench role in Nets and has learned how to shoot (3-pointers). The same energy is still there with some more bbIQ, and with a bargain price of 1.75M. More salt to the Dinwiddie wound. Also TLC has his minutes now. How come Nets get so much more out the ex-Bulls?

Because they have a way better coach, that has clear roles for players to succeed and not roles that are put together on paper by a GM that chose a puppet to sit on the bench and play fake tough guy?

Sent from my POT-LX1 using RealGM mobile app

Both Nwaba and TLC had their chances here, and just weren't that good. Nwaba had some fun moments, but I don't see how he cracks our rotation much when we're healthy. Otto Porter played much better after he got traded here than he was in WAS. Was that because our coaching was better?

To follow up on that, TLC is now playing only 12.4 mpg, while with us, he got 18.8. So how do you figure that "he has his minutes now?" His PER is 5.8. It was 9 when he was with us. He's shooting 42% from the field, but only 14% on 3's.

As for NWaba, his 3 pt % is the main difference between now and when he played with us. Otherwise, his numbers all pretty much in line with his career. And given he's playing only 12 mpg now, I don't know if his sample size is really big enough to say whether he can sustain that all year.

Both players have had chances with multiple teams, and are not playing much better now than they have in any of their other previous stops in the nba. It's such a knee jerk reaction for Bulls fans to blame our coaches or organization for things like this. Dinwiddie was a mistake, sure, but DET had him for a whole year and they missed the boat on him. We just had him for a summer. All teams make mistakes. And sometimes players just blossom in new situations, for a variety of reasons.

[RakimAbdulJabar]

Just got done watching the Heat/Sixers game. Seriously who thought the Heat would be this good? I’d trade our entire roster for Butler, Nunn & Adebayo

[MrFortune3]

If it weren't for the Bulls, the Warriors would've been on a 13-game losing streak. They haven't won any game but against Chicago since Nov 19.

Without us, the Atlanta Hawks would be 4-24 and even worse than the Warriors. Of course that is counting the Warriors win against us. lol. Without the Bulls both the Warriors and the Hawks would be 4-24. They would both be challenging the 98 Nuggets who went 11-71 and are considered the worst team in history.

Don't try to act like you didn't see that nonsense in Charlotte during 2011. 7-59...7 wins, 59 losses.

Gerald Henderson was their franchise player and Kemba Walker was a rookie.

[MrFortune3]

Just got done watching the Heat/Sixers game. Seriously who thought the Heat would be this good? I’d trade our entire roster for Butler, Nunn & Adebayo

Butler is a franchise player, despite what some want to claim. Moreover, when Pat Riley goes in hard on a player, he usually sets that player up for massive success.

[XxMisterFreakXx]

Because they have a way better coach, that has clear roles for players to succeed and not roles that are put together on paper by a GM that chose a puppet to sit on the bench and play fake tough guy?

Sent from my POT-LX1 using RealGM mobile app

Both Nwaba and TLC had their chances here, and just weren't that good. Nwaba had some fun moments, but I don't see how he cracks our rotation much when we're healthy. Otto Porter played much better after he got traded here than he was in WAS. Was that because our coaching was better?

To follow up on that, TLC is now playing only 12.4 mpg, while with us, he got 18.8. So how do you figure that "he has his minutes now?" His PER is 5.8. It was 9 when he was with us. He's shooting 42% from the field, but only 14% on 3's.

As for NWaba, his 3 pt % is the main difference between now and when he played with us. Otherwise, his numbers all pretty much in line with his career. And given he's playing only 12 mpg now, I don't know if his sample size is really big enough to say whether he can sustain that all year.

Both players have had chances with multiple teams, and are not playing much better now than they have in any of their other previous stops in the nba. It's such a knee jerk reaction for Bulls fans to blame our coaches or organization for things like this. Dinwiddie was a mistake, sure, but DET had him for a whole year and they missed the boat on him. We just had him for a summer. All teams make mistakes. And sometimes players just blossom in new situations, for a variety of reasons.

Nwaba is not good at anything besides his defense his offense is a completely liability when he's out on the floor basically he's a discount Tony Allen but not as good.

To clarify he's not even good not sure why people drool over Nwaba he is barely an NBA player.

[MrSparkle]

Both Nwaba and TLC had their chances here, and just weren't that good. Nwaba had some fun moments, but I don't see how he cracks our rotation much when we're healthy. Otto Porter played much better after he got traded here than he was in WAS. Was that because our coaching was better?

To follow up on that, TLC is now playing only 12.4 mpg, while with us, he got 18.8. So how do you figure that "he has his minutes now?" His PER is 5.8. It was 9 when he was with us. He's shooting 42% from the field, but only 14% on 3's.

As for NWaba, his 3 pt % is the main difference between now and when he played with us. Otherwise, his numbers all pretty much in line with his career. And given he's playing only 12 mpg now, I don't know if his sample size is really big enough to say whether he can sustain that all year.

Both players have had chances with multiple teams, and are not playing much better now than they have in any of their other previous stops in the nba. It's such a knee jerk reaction for Bulls fans to blame our coaches or organization for things like this. Dinwiddie was a mistake, sure, but DET had him for a whole year and they missed the boat on him. We just had him for a summer. All teams make mistakes. And sometimes players just blossom in new situations, for a variety of reasons.

Nwaba is not good at anything besides his defense his offense is a completely liability when he's out on the floor basically he's a discount Tony Allen but not as good.

To clarify he's not even good not sure why people drool over Nwaba he is barely an NBA player.

We're talking about minimum contract bench player.

I'll take him over playing 6'1 PGs at SF...

[MrSparkle]

Just got done watching the Heat/Sixers game. Seriously who thought the Heat would be this good? I’d trade our entire roster for Butler, Nunn & Adebayo

Butler is a franchise player, despite what some want to claim. Moreover, when Pat Riley goes in hard on a player, he usually sets that player up for massive success.

Bam is the real deal. High-minutes, high energy, crashes the boards aggressively, hustles for loose-balls, blocks, switches... and then he can pass, post-up and handle really well for a guy his size. All-NBA 3rd team trajectory at this point.. Maybe an overhype, but he can be really, really good the next 3-5 years while he has his athleticism. Right now he can't shoot the 3P but if he develops that range in off-season, he'll be challenging Embiid and Jokic.

But anyway, Riley knows how to build teams, and isn't scared to take risks on guys. Obviously there's a high and low to some of them (Waiters, JJ) , but I like that he "goes for it." You never know what opportunities come up when you have a competitive team, and I do believe that having good players like Jimmy inspires younger guys to play and train harder.

I still find it wack that GarPaxDorf sided with Valentine, Bobby and the rest of the "young crew" over Jimmy in the drama of 2016-17, even if Jimmy was acting like a diva. At least he's consistently backed it up on the court. Yeah yeah, Valentine is the flavor of the month - averaging around 15 mpg. I don't think if anyone considered whether this guy is actually capable of playing 35 mpg.

I appreciate players who can warrant and handle high-minutes. That Heat crew, you've got at least 3 guys who can play 48 minutes no problem. Not that you want to do that, but it's good having the ability to simply rotations into central players.

[MrFortune3]

Just got done watching the Heat/Sixers game. Seriously who thought the Heat would be this good? I’d trade our entire roster for Butler, Nunn & Adebayo

Butler is a franchise player, despite what some want to claim. Moreover, when Pat Riley goes in hard on a player, he usually sets that player up for massive success.

Bam is the real deal. High-minutes, high energy, crashes the boards aggressively, hustles for loose-balls, blocks, switches... and then he can pass, post-up and handle really well for a guy his size. All-NBA 3rd team trajectory at this point.. Maybe an overhype, but he can be really, really good the next 3-5 years while he has his athleticism. Right now he can't shoot the 3P but if he develops that range in off-season, he'll be challenging Embiid and Jokic.

But anyway, Riley knows how to build teams, and isn't scared to take risks on guys. Obviously there's a high and low to some of them (Waiters, JJ) , but I like that he "goes for it." You never know what opportunities come up when you have a competitive team, and I do believe that having good players like Jimmy inspires younger guys to play and train harder.

I still find it wack that GarPaxDorf sided with Valentine, Bobby and the rest of the "young crew" over Jimmy in the drama of 2016-17, even if Jimmy was acting like a diva. At least he's consistently backed it up on the court. Yeah yeah, Valentine is the flavor of the month - averaging around 15 mpg. I don't think if anyone considered whether this guy is actually capable of playing 35 mpg.

I appreciate players who can warrant and handle high-minutes. That Heat crew, you've got at least 3 guys who can play 48 minutes no problem. Not that you want to do that, but it's good having the ability to simply rotations into central players.

Riley is a swing for the fences type. He goes after home runs whenever he can.
Bam is going to be a very good player, may not end up as a superstar but he will be a very good piece on a contending team.

They didn't want to give Jimmy the supermax and have to rely on recruiting FA's to build the team. In their minds he would have anchored down their flexibility.

[Chicago-Bull-E]

Lakers vs Bucks is on.

One thing I think gets overlooked in the NBA is size. It still matters quite a bit. When you look at these two teams, best records in the league, what do you notice. These teams have size, they might be the two biggest teams in the nba.

The Lakers are running a lineup a Bradley, Green, Lebron, Davis, and McGee. That’s massive. That length matters, especially defensively

[MrSparkle]

Lakers vs Bucks is on.

One thing I think gets overlooked in the NBA is size. It still matters quite a bit. When you look at these two teams, best records in the league, what do you notice. These teams have size, they might be the two biggest teams in the nba.

The Lakers are running a lineup a Bradley, Green, Lebron, Davis, and McGee. That’s massive. That length matters, especially defensively

It sure does.

Same with the Warriors - sure they’d play “small” at times at PF/C (if we want to call Durant and Dray small), but they’d have backups who were big at every spot (including Livingston at PG).

The 10-11 Bulls were very good cause we were tall and strong at every position.

[johnnyvann840]

If it weren't for the Bulls, the Warriors would've been on a 13-game losing streak. They haven't won any game but against Chicago since Nov 19.

Without us, the Atlanta Hawks would be 4-24 and even worse than the Warriors. Of course that is counting the Warriors win against us. lol. Without the Bulls both the Warriors and the Hawks would be 4-24. They would both be challenging the 98 Nuggets who went 11-71 and are considered the worst team in history.

Don't try to act like you didn't see that nonsense in Charlotte during 2011. 7-59...7 wins, 59 losses.

Gerald Henderson was their franchise player and Kemba Walker was a rookie.

Well, they only won 7 games but it was a shortened season of only 66. Still equates to a 9 win season, which is technically worse than the 11 win 98 Nugs. That was indeed one of the worst teams ever. But, that Nuggets team was so terrible they couldn't even average 90 PPG for the season. They went through 3 coaches and it was miserable. There are some bad teams historically, so maybe they weren't the worst ever, but they were right up there.

[MrFortune3]

Without us, the Atlanta Hawks would be 4-24 and even worse than the Warriors. Of course that is counting the Warriors win against us. lol. Without the Bulls both the Warriors and the Hawks would be 4-24. They would both be challenging the 98 Nuggets who went 11-71 and are considered the worst team in history.

Don't try to act like you didn't see that nonsense in Charlotte during 2011. 7-59...7 wins, 59 losses.

Gerald Henderson was their franchise player and Kemba Walker was a rookie.

Well, they only won 7 games but it was a shortened season of only 66. Still equates to a 9 win season, which is technically worse than the 11 win 98 Nugs. That was indeed one of the worst teams ever. But, that Nuggets team was so terrible they couldn't even average 90 PPG for the season. They went through 3 coaches and it was miserable. There are some bad teams historically, so maybe they weren't the worst ever, but they were right up there.

I know it was shortened, but that Charlotte team was awful. They set multiple records in futility that season. That's when the LOLcats and LULcats sayings took off.