Game 29: Houston Rockets (19-9) @ Phoenix Suns (11-17), Sat, Dec 21, 6pm MST

[grumpysaddle]

Always wonder how in the world is that step back by Harden not a travel ?

Frank did pretty much the same thing and it was an automatic travel (and the shot went in). Refs have a different book of rules for each team. Suns' rulebook is especially thick, or maybe it's thin and just says, "Call them for everything, and don't call the other team for the same ****. P.S. **** Robert Sarver. P.P.S. This is for Brother Donaghy."

[grumpysaddle]

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That was absolutely ridiculous. Booker is legitimately in the act of shooting when he gets fouled multiple times a game and they call it side-out.

[grumpysaddle]

Suns played well overall tonight. I can't be mad at them. Okobo is, IMO, the clear-cut backup PG. He's started to turn the corner, I think. It's getting more and more discouraging to watch the different set of rules refs call Suns games with. I hate having to complain about it, but looking through threads, I'm obviously not the only one. And I know on places like Twitter and Reddit even non-fans have come around to notice something is fishy. It's just completing frustrating and disheartening.

[Saberestar]

Good offensive games from Okobo and Ty Jerome. Oubre played well too.

Booker with a meh game, and Bridges... Bridges played just bad. I understand why dhe oesn't play more minutes, he just doesn't contribute enough on offense and defensively he commits too many mistakes for a player who supposedly is a great wing defender. I am disappointed with his second season so far.

[Ghost of Kleine]

There was a lot of negativity on the team tonight. I noticed Oubre harping at Jerome, as well.

That's really not a good sign. If the teammates are already getting so fustrated by the losses that they're starting to turn on each other this quickly. It's ironic to an extent, As each player is partly to blame ( excluding Rubio, And maybe Oubre) that most everyone on the team is not doing their part in terms of defensive effort and commitment to play as a team. Now I'll say this again, That it's the Coaches ( and asst. Coaches) responsibility to keep the players on engaged and locked into team concepts.

If Monty's personality is just too easygoing and passive to be effective and he isn't capable of reigning in his players, Then things will really be bad for us, As he's likely here for his full 5 year contract. So the only alternative solution would be acquiring more veteran players with dominant leadership qualities and who are really vocal and will absolutely hold fellow players accountable on defense. Kind of like how Garnett, Jordan and the greats would do! And similar to how Butler, and Lebron, etc. Act as in game coaches.

[handsome salary]

This quote to me just says the defense sucked:

I thought we had great energy and fought hard
Houston was just ridiculously hot tonight. almost 60% from the field and 46% from 3.

Teams usually find it much easier to get hot against the Suns than say the Heat.

[WeekapaugGroove]

This quote to me just says the defense sucked:

I thought we had great energy and fought hard
Houston was just ridiculously hot tonight. almost 60% from the field and 46% from 3.

Teams usually find it much easier to get hot against the Suns than say the Heat.

Honestly it's a little of both. Suns d deserves blame but a few teams lately have really shot the **** out of the ball with not much any d could do.

Happens and it tends to balance out over 82 games.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

[lilfishi22]

This quote to me just says the defense sucked:

I thought we had great energy and fought hard
Houston was just ridiculously hot tonight. almost 60% from the field and 46% from 3.

Teams usually find it much easier to get hot against the Suns than say the Heat.

Honestly it's a little of both. Suns d deserves blame but a few teams lately have really shot the **** out of the ball with not much any d could do.

Happens and it tends to balance out over 82 games.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

When a ton of team teams are shooting well against us, it's GENERALLY because we're not playing good enough defense to disturb their offensive rhythm. Against good teams, yeah it's hard to play good defense because they have players that know to expect defensive scheming around their scoring but is there any reason why New Orleans shot 53.4% against us? Is there a reason why Washington Wizards shot 57.3% against us? Is there a reason why Orlando Magic shot 57.4% against us?

Our defense is just not consistent from a game to game basis and from a player to player basis.

[WeekapaugGroove]

This quote to me just says the defense sucked:


Teams usually find it much easier to get hot against the Suns than say the Heat.

Honestly it's a little of both. Suns d deserves blame but a few teams lately have really shot the **** out of the ball with not much any d could do.

Happens and it tends to balance out over 82 games.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

When a ton of team teams are shooting well against us, it's GENERALLY because we're not playing good enough defense to disturb their offensive rhythm. Against good teams, yeah it's hard to play good defense because they have players that know to expect defensive scheming around their scoring but is there any reason why New Orleans shot 53.4% against us? Is there a reason why Washington Wizards shot 57.3% against us? Is there a reason why Orlando Magic shot 57.4% against us?

Our defense is just not consistent from a game to game basis and from a player to player basis.

Yeah there's definitely an issue with letting teams get in a rythm and they really get cooking. But in some of those games you mentioned you had dudes like ish Smith hitting 3s off the bounce, basically the kind of shots from guys you want to have shoot against you and they were simply making them.

There is opponent shooting luck and the suns have had a little go against them in the short term but that will balance out over a full season.

And for the love of God this team needs to learn how to close out on a 3pt shooter without fouling them. Thats been out of hand lately.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

[lilfishi22]

Honestly it's a little of both. Suns d deserves blame but a few teams lately have really shot the **** out of the ball with not much any d could do.

Happens and it tends to balance out over 82 games.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

When a ton of team teams are shooting well against us, it's GENERALLY because we're not playing good enough defense to disturb their offensive rhythm. Against good teams, yeah it's hard to play good defense because they have players that know to expect defensive scheming around their scoring but is there any reason why New Orleans shot 53.4% against us? Is there a reason why Washington Wizards shot 57.3% against us? Is there a reason why Orlando Magic shot 57.4% against us?

Our defense is just not consistent from a game to game basis and from a player to player basis.

Yeah there's definitely an issue with letting teams get in a rythm and they really get cooking. But in some of those games you mentioned you had dudes like ish Smith hitting 3s off the bounce, basically the kind of shots from guys you want to have shoot against you and they were simply making them.

There is opponent shooting luck and the suns have had a little go against them in the short term but that will balance out over a full season.

And for the love of God this team needs to learn how to close out on a 3pt shooter without fouling them. Thats been out of hand lately.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Sure, Ish Smith will hit an off the bounce 3 occasionally but when a team as whole is shooting nearly 60% from the field, that's not luck, it's just poor defense and effort.

100% agree about fouling 3pt shooters. It *used* to be a cardinal sin but we're doing it so often these days it's basically devolved into something to be just frowned up

[PharmD]

I don't go to as many games now that I have two kids under 5 yrs old but got some good free tix and was at this one. Wanted to watch the stuff you don't see on TV like how the players interact and man I could not have been less impressed with how booker caries himself and interacts with teammates. Maybe it was just a bad night but he was a cross between a an aloof teenager and a petulant brat. He really seems to dislike Okobo capped off with him laying into him for that 3 with about 8 minutes left. If this is how he carries himself night to night dude needs to seriously figure out how to be a max player leader.

The game itself was kind of a 'hat tip' game, if Houston shoots that well they beat any team in the league. It is kind of annoying that harden is that damn good and still finds it nessesary to hunt cheap fouls but I guess that's just who he is and why when his career is over people will still rip him, justifiably.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Interesting observations. I wonder if Booker and Okobo not getting along was why Okobo was out of the rotation. Because he looks pretty damn good to me.

[bwgood77]

I don't go to as many games now that I have two kids under 5 yrs old but got some good free tix and was at this one. Wanted to watch the stuff you don't see on TV like how the players interact and man I could not have been less impressed with how booker caries himself and interacts with teammates. Maybe it was just a bad night but he was a cross between a an aloof teenager and a petulant brat. He really seems to dislike Okobo capped off with him laying into him for that 3 with about 8 minutes left. If this is how he carries himself night to night dude needs to seriously figure out how to be a max player leader.

The game itself was kind of a 'hat tip' game, if Houston shoots that well they beat any team in the league. It is kind of annoying that harden is that damn good and still finds it nessesary to hunt cheap fouls but I guess that's just who he is and why when his career is over people will still rip him, justifiably.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Booker has been bothering me for awhile now, the other night in a close game when he was still injured he was actually yawning on the bench and never stood or interacted with anyone that i saw, i think he is pouting for some reason, his body language has been horrible

Maybe its due to Rubio taking over the leadership role and he isnt taking it well, just a guess

Honestly hearing that about Booker doesn't surprise me all that much. He always has seemed to act a little entitled. I was worried about how he would take Rubio handling the ball most of the time. I had thought it was going well. I know Okobo is very close with the guys he was drafted with, Ayton and Bridges.

[Dual]

I don't go to as many games now that I have two kids under 5 yrs old but got some good free tix and was at this one. Wanted to watch the stuff you don't see on TV like how the players interact and man I could not have been less impressed with how booker caries himself and interacts with teammates. Maybe it was just a bad night but he was a cross between a an aloof teenager and a petulant brat. He really seems to dislike Okobo capped off with him laying into him for that 3 with about 8 minutes left. If this is how he carries himself night to night dude needs to seriously figure out how to be a max player leader.

The game itself was kind of a 'hat tip' game, if Houston shoots that well they beat any team in the league. It is kind of annoying that harden is that damn good and still finds it nessesary to hunt cheap fouls but I guess that's just who he is and why when his career is over people will still rip him, justifiably.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Booker has been bothering me for awhile now, the other night in a close game when he was still injured he was actually yawning on the bench and never stood or interacted with anyone that i saw, i think he is pouting for some reason, his body language has been horrible

Maybe its due to Rubio taking over the leadership role and he isnt taking it well, just a guess

Honestly hearing that about Booker doesn't surprise me all that much. He always has seemed to act a little entitled. I was worried about how he would take Rubio handling the ball most of the time. I had thought it was going well. I know Okobo is very close with the guys he was drafted with, Ayton and Bridges.

It has indeed, he has always said good things about Ricky.
About the other stuff, I dont know.

[Revived]

I don't go to as many games now that I have two kids under 5 yrs old but got some good free tix and was at this one. Wanted to watch the stuff you don't see on TV like how the players interact and man I could not have been less impressed with how booker caries himself and interacts with teammates. Maybe it was just a bad night but he was a cross between a an aloof teenager and a petulant brat. He really seems to dislike Okobo capped off with him laying into him for that 3 with about 8 minutes left. If this is how he carries himself night to night dude needs to seriously figure out how to be a max player leader.

The game itself was kind of a 'hat tip' game, if Houston shoots that well they beat any team in the league. It is kind of annoying that harden is that damn good and still finds it nessesary to hunt cheap fouls but I guess that's just who he is and why when his career is over people will still rip him, justifiably.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Booker has been bothering me for awhile now, the other night in a close game when he was still injured he was actually yawning on the bench and never stood or interacted with anyone that i saw, i think he is pouting for some reason, his body language has been horrible

Maybe its due to Rubio taking over the leadership role and he isnt taking it well, just a guess

Honestly hearing that about Booker doesn't surprise me all that much. He always has seemed to act a little entitled. I was worried about how he would take Rubio handling the ball most of the time. I had thought it was going well. I know Okobo is very close with the guys he was drafted with, Ayton and Bridges.

Totally speculating here but a big contract kicking in and officially being an A list celebrity at the age of just 22 could all be getting to his head a bit. His focus could be shifting from basketball to extracurricular stuff.

Someone here mentioned it before but I don’t think kids like Booker, Simmons, Towns and D’Angelo Russel have the same drive that guys like Giannis, Doncic etc do. They seem a lot more entitled and just from the following them on social media, their seem to be looking to leverage as much as they can from their popularity and platform by getting involved in perhaps too many off the court ventures than actual basketball related stuff.

It could be a reason why 3 of those 4 are on absolutely garbage teams and the only one on a winning team is despised by his own fanbase.

[bwgood77]

Booker has been bothering me for awhile now, the other night in a close game when he was still injured he was actually yawning on the bench and never stood or interacted with anyone that i saw, i think he is pouting for some reason, his body language has been horrible

Maybe its due to Rubio taking over the leadership role and he isnt taking it well, just a guess

Honestly hearing that about Booker doesn't surprise me all that much. He always has seemed to act a little entitled. I was worried about how he would take Rubio handling the ball most of the time. I had thought it was going well. I know Okobo is very close with the guys he was drafted with, Ayton and Bridges.

Totally speculating here but a big contract kicking in and officially being an A list celebrity at the age of just 22 could all be getting to his head a bit. His focus could be shifting from basketball to extracurricular stuff.

Someone here mentioned it before but I don’t think kids like Booker, Simmons, Towns and D’Angelo Russel have the same drive that guys like Giannis, Doncic etc do. They seem a lot more entitled and just from the following them on social media, their seem to be looking to leverage as much as they can from their popularity and platform by getting involved in perhaps too many off the court ventures than actual basketball related stuff.

It could be a reason why 3 of those 4 are on absolutely garbage teams and the only one on a winning team is despised by his own fanbase.

Well only people like Giannis and Doncic have drive like they do. That's what will make them perennial MVP candidates. They live and breathe basketball, and players with that kind of talent don't come around often in the entire NBA. But yeah, the others on your list kind of act like the popular high school kids or 90210 kids or something. Want to look the part as much as be the part. They all certainly have tons of talent, at least the first 3 you mention.

I just hope Booker is all about the team and doesn't put himself above the team. He usually says all the right thing though and sounds like he is. Kobe really wanted to win, but he also would blame his teammates and wanted to be "the guy". Most of the greats didn't have that entitlement thing. Not even Jordan, the guy he idolized. Sure, Jordan would yell at teammates, but he was just a fierce competitor...and a pro...most of the rest of the top guys really made their teammates better and lifted their level of play.

[GoodBehavior]

Honestly hearing that about Booker doesn't surprise me all that much. He always has seemed to act a little entitled. I was worried about how he would take Rubio handling the ball most of the time. I had thought it was going well. I know Okobo is very close with the guys he was drafted with, Ayton and Bridges.

Totally speculating here but a big contract kicking in and officially being an A list celebrity at the age of just 22 could all be getting to his head a bit. His focus could be shifting from basketball to extracurricular stuff.

Someone here mentioned it before but I don’t think kids like Booker, Simmons, Towns and D’Angelo Russel have the same drive that guys like Giannis, Doncic etc do. They seem a lot more entitled and just from the following them on social media, their seem to be looking to leverage as much as they can from their popularity and platform by getting involved in perhaps too many off the court ventures than actual basketball related stuff.

It could be a reason why 3 of those 4 are on absolutely garbage teams and the only one on a winning team is despised by his own fanbase.

Well only people like Giannis and Doncic have drive like they do. That's what will make them perennial MVP candidates. They live and breathe basketball, and players with that kind of talent don't come around often in the entire NBA. But yeah, the others on your list kind of act like the popular high school kids or 90210 kids or something. Want to look the part as much as be the part. They all certainly have tons of talent, at least the first 3 you mention.

I just hope Booker is all about the team and doesn't put himself above the team. He usually says all the right thing though and sounds like he is. Kobe really wanted to win, but he also would blame his teammates and wanted to be "the guy". Most of the greats didn't have that entitlement thing. Not even Jordan, the guy he idolized. Sure, Jordan would yell at teammates, but he was just a fierce competitor...and a pro...most of the rest of the top guys really made their teammates better and lifted their level of play.

Hard disagreement here.

Booker has flaws for sure, but his drive is insane. You don't keep making improvement year in and year out if you don't have that kind of drive. Booker has far, far exceeded his pre-draft prediction, and his drive is a big part of that. I would say, his drive is up there with the greats. Same with Ben Simmons. He can't shoot but he's elite in all facets of the game and there's nothing to suggest he doesn't have the drive.

I would not group Simmons and Bookers with KAT and DLo. Kat and Dlo are soft as marshmallows.

[bwgood77]

Totally speculating here but a big contract kicking in and officially being an A list celebrity at the age of just 22 could all be getting to his head a bit. His focus could be shifting from basketball to extracurricular stuff.

Someone here mentioned it before but I don’t think kids like Booker, Simmons, Towns and D’Angelo Russel have the same drive that guys like Giannis, Doncic etc do. They seem a lot more entitled and just from the following them on social media, their seem to be looking to leverage as much as they can from their popularity and platform by getting involved in perhaps too many off the court ventures than actual basketball related stuff.

It could be a reason why 3 of those 4 are on absolutely garbage teams and the only one on a winning team is despised by his own fanbase.

Well only people like Giannis and Doncic have drive like they do. That's what will make them perennial MVP candidates. They live and breathe basketball, and players with that kind of talent don't come around often in the entire NBA. But yeah, the others on your list kind of act like the popular high school kids or 90210 kids or something. Want to look the part as much as be the part. They all certainly have tons of talent, at least the first 3 you mention.

I just hope Booker is all about the team and doesn't put himself above the team. He usually says all the right thing though and sounds like he is. Kobe really wanted to win, but he also would blame his teammates and wanted to be "the guy". Most of the greats didn't have that entitlement thing. Not even Jordan, the guy he idolized. Sure, Jordan would yell at teammates, but he was just a fierce competitor...and a pro...most of the rest of the top guys really made their teammates better and lifted their level of play.

Hard disagreement here.

Booker has flaws for sure, but his drive is insane. You don't keep making improvement year in and year out if you don't have that kind of drive. Booker has far, far exceeded his pre-draft prediction, and his drive is a big part of that. I would say, his drive is up there with the greats. Same with Ben Simmons. He can't shoot but he's elite in all facets of the game and there's nothing to suggest he doesn't have the drive.

I would not group Simmons and Bookers with KAT and DLo. Kat and Dlo are soft as marshmallows.

Not Dlo. KAT is still better, and Booker is soft too. You are soft if you are that bad of a defender. I do think Booker has more drive than most for sure, and probably more than Towns, though Towns just has more innate talent to start with. I just mean with Giannis his work ethic is unparalleled and Doncic has lived and breathed basketball since he was like 13..studied it, has that mentality of winning...you can tell not only works hard with a lot of drive but studies the game, is very smart, and is a total team player. Booker in many ways is a team player but the pouting and yelling at players and crying to refs, etc, sounds a little more like Gambo's anonymous scouting report than who it was on.

But I'm not one that wants to trade Booker either. It's easily his best season on both sides and he finally has a real PG. I was just commenting on WG's post mainly...that stuff has always worried me a little bit.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Drive and leadership are two different things. I don't question Booker's drive at all, he works hard and wants to win. On my original post I was just commenting what I saw, but it's one game and I couldn't hear what was actually being said or know the context. I just didn't love how he carried himself.

People like to romanticize how Kobe and Jordan carried themselves but the reality is being a prick and hard guy to play with only works a small fraction of the time and only if you're a ridiculously good player. I thought Steve Kerr had a really interesting comment when asked about the difference playing with Jordan and Duncan, he said it felt like you were playing 'with' Duncan and 'for' Jordan.

Giannis is an interesting dynamic. Couldn't be a nicer dude off the court but on the court that dude has some serious f-u in his game. He's out there trying to take teams souls.

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[lilfishi22]

Drive and leadership are two different things. I don't question Booker's drive at all, he works hard and wants to win. On my original post I was just commenting what I saw, but it's one game and I couldn't hear what was actually being said or know the context. I just didn't love how he carried himself.

People like to romanticize how Kobe and Jordan carried themselves but the reality is being a prick and hard guy to play with only works a small fraction of the time and only if you're a ridiculously good player. I thought Steve Kerr had a really interesting comment when asked about the difference playing with Jordan and Duncan, he said it felt like you were playing 'with' Duncan and 'for' Jordan.

Giannis is an interesting dynamic. Couldn't be a nicer dude off the court but on the court that dude has some serious f-u in his game. He's out there trying to take teams souls.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

100% agreed about the difference between drive and leadership. Booker has drive but lacks leadership. But he's also young and he could still improve in the leadership category. For what it's worth, it wasn't like for most of his career he had a leader to look up to.

Doncic played with grown men leaders since he was a wee lad and played alongside 1st ballot HOF'er Dirk when he came into the NBA. Booker had....Chandler? Bledsoe? Dudley? Crawford? Some players just have that leadership quailty, Booker doesn't have it and you could argue Doncic might not either if he hadn't played organised basketball with adult leaders since he was young

MVP level guys like Giannis is certainly a special case