Hot and Heavy with the Hawks (Drummond Trade Rumors go National)

[Manocad]

Quoting just to say fantastic post. Dre has been scapegoated to a level that is pretty puzzling to me; his biggest flaw is that he's not as good as fans want him to be. Well, I suppose maybe his motor problems are a bigger flaw but I feel that the Dre hate has more to do with what he isn't rather than what he is.

Dre is no different than any other player who puts up good numbers that somehow don't translate into team success. It's not about hate; it's about not spending a ton of money on a player who doesn't seem to have that "it" factor. I've said many times before--the Pistons don't win more when Dre plays well or lose more when he doesn't.

[Snakebites]

Eh.

Whatever. I grow tired of being shamed for not having a sufficiently positive opinion of Andre Drummond.

Now, apparently I hate him and am scapegoating him for the teams failures. Whatever. You guys do you.

[Kilo]

Dre's biggest flaw is that he's not as good as he thinks he is.

[MrBigShot]

Eh.

Whatever. I grow tired of being shamed for not having a sufficiently positive opinion of Andre Drummond.

Now, apparently I hate him and am scapegoating him for the teams failures. Whatever. You guys do you.

I've only read a handful of your posts in this thread (and handful of the thread overall in general) & wasn't replying to you so I'm a pretty confused as to why you took it as a direct comment towards you.

For me personally its less about not having a positive opinion of Dre and moreso that the amount of negativity, at least in my opinion, is unwarranted. He's an inconsistent player who had lofty expectations from fans who's contract doesn't match his value. There are lots of those in the league, and with a mere year remaining (which he may opt out of) it feels like at times he's being made out to be a team cancer on par with Josh Smith.

He's just one piece of a puzzle that has resulted in the pistons being where they are today.

[DetroitSho]

Eh.

Whatever. I grow tired of being shamed for not having a sufficiently positive opinion of Andre Drummond.

Now, apparently I hate him and am scapegoating him for the teams failures. Whatever. You guys do you.

I've only read a handful of your posts in this thread (and handful of the thread overall in general) & wasn't replying to you so I'm a pretty confused as to why you took it as a direct comment towards you.

For me personally its less about not having a positive opinion of Dre and moreso that the amount of negativity, at least in my opinion, is unwarranted. He's an inconsistent player who had lofty expectations from fans who's contract doesn't match his value. There are lots of those in the league, and with a mere year remaining (which he may opt out of) it feels like at times he's being made out to be a team cancer on par with Josh Smith.

He's just one piece of a puzzle that has resulted in the pistons being where they are today.

Why this is so hard to comprehend is mindboggling. Mf's replying to my comment with the "woe is me, oh I'm feeling attacked" attitude can kinda stfu. If the shoe fits wear it. If not, then I'm not talking to you. No reason to defend yourself when it doesn't apply to you.

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[ComboGuardCity]

Andre has been scapegoated. I don’t think he’s worth the max but he’s not some sort of scrub. He played great with a healthy Blake. I guarantee you put him on a team with a 3rd star not named Reggie Jackson and he’s an all nba center.

People said Bosh put up empty numbers...until he played on a decent team.

Talent is talent. And Andre is a talent. A Top 5 player? No. But he’s a positive player and hasn’t been a malcontent on this horrible team.

People said Love put up empty numbers before he went to a decent team.

[Snakebites]

Eh.

Whatever. I grow tired of being shamed for not having a sufficiently positive opinion of Andre Drummond.

Now, apparently I hate him and am scapegoating him for the teams failures. Whatever. You guys do you.

I've only read a handful of your posts in this thread (and handful of the thread overall in general) & wasn't replying to you so I'm a pretty confused as to why you took it as a direct comment towards you.

For me personally its less about not having a positive opinion of Dre and moreso that the amount of negativity, at least in my opinion, is unwarranted. He's an inconsistent player who had lofty expectations from fans who's contract doesn't match his value. There are lots of those in the league, and with a mere year remaining (which he may opt out of) it feels like at times he's being made out to be a team cancer on par with Josh Smith.

He's just one piece of a puzzle that has resulted in the pistons being where they are today.

Why this is so hard to comprehend is mindboggling. Mf's replying to my comment with the "woe is me, oh I'm feeling attacked" attitude can kinda stfu. If the shoe fits wear it. If not, then I'm not talking to you. No reason to defend yourself when it doesn't apply to you.

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I guess I'm not seeing the rampant hate you see.

So when I see posts like this, I take them to be in response to people who have a generally negative opinion of Drummond and his place on the team. And that's something I align with.

So there yah go.

[bstein14]

I can give the man some props because Dre has gotten better over the last few years for sure you can tell he has put in some work getting better at the line and offensively, but the fact is, Dre isn't a big enough difference maker to take up 30% of our salary cap and $30 million a year and that is what he wants. He isn't a guy that is a leader and he isn't someone that makes his teammates better.

Sure, you could keep him if you can't find a first round pick from anyone, and hope he ends up signing for much less but that isn't likely. In a good FA class someone like Dre could be screwed and have to take $12 to $15 million per year but this FA class is really weak and he's one of the top guys and few players who has been an all-star that will be a FA this year.

I'm all about getting guys who put winning first and will impact the game in ways beyond what Dre does most nights. High character high IQ guys that play hard every night.

[Pandev]

Hey team,

In my opinon, NBA GM's aren't dumb enough to give Andre $30m per season. No value in bigs who cant shoot in 2020.

If his agent has a brain, he opts in Bre takes his $28m... but I think that is precisely what Ed and our FO are most worried about

[Pharaoh]

Dre is what he is but in his defense it's not like we've found anyone of significance to team with him.

Dre was drafted in 2012. Since then we've picked KCP (2013 8th), SJ (2015 8th), Luke (2017 12th)...

Not home run in sight and considering how mediocre we've been since drafting Dre the fact we didn't have firsts in 2014 & 2016 is on management.

"We" (as a organisation) failed Dre as much as he's failed us.

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[Manocad]

I can give the man some props because Dre has gotten better over the last few years for sure you can tell he has put in some work getting better at the line and offensively, but the fact is, Dre isn't a big enough difference maker to take up 30% of our salary cap and $30 million a year and that is what he wants. He isn't a guy that is a leader and he isn't someone that makes his teammates better.

I'm all about getting guys who put winning first and will impact the game in ways beyond what Dre does most nights. High character high IQ guys that play hard every night.

There it is. That’s my stance with Dre exactly.

I don’t understand why people are so critical of anyone who holds less than some “acceptable” opinion of Dre’s value to this team. Shoot, all you have to do is read this forum and observe what’s actually happening in the NBA. Not only are there no good offers for Dre, there’s not even a significant level of BAD offers. All indications are that no one is really that interested in him. Now, whether that’s solely because of Dre as a player, his supposed salary expectations, or his contract situation at this moment, who knows. Regardless, it certainly appears that at this point in time no one appears to be thinking “Drummond is absolutely the guy we need to go after.”

Be as salty as you want, but damn—when the whole world is telling you that it’s you...maybe it’s you?

[Manocad]

Dre is what he is but in his defense it's not like we've found anyone of significance to team with him.

Dre was drafted in 2012. Since then we've picked KCP (2013 8th), SJ (2015 8th), Luke (2017 12th)...

Not home run in sight and considering how mediocre we've been since drafting Dre the fact we didn't have firsts in 2014 & 2016 is on management.

"We" (as a organisation) failed Dre as much as he's failed us.

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Mea culpa, point conceded, you win. I’ll be happy to jump up and support that conclusion.

And keeping Dre at $20M+ a year doesn’t fix it.

[El Chivo]

salty Drummond fans don't understand that we are "hating" Drummond the supposed >20 million dollars per year player, not Drummond the player at all.

we "hate" Drummond the player who thinks himself as a star, as a ball handler, as an offensive threat.

we "hate" Drummond's lack of awareness of his limits and his qualities, not him.

and we hated that Detroit tried to build around Drummond for years.

[rmfc]

salty Drummond fans don't understand that we are "hating" Drummond the supposed >20 million dollars per year player, not Drummond the player at all.

we "hate" Drummond the player who thinks himself as a star, as a ball handler, as an offensive threat.

we "hate" Drummond's lack of awareness of his limits and his qualities, not him.

and we hated that Detroit tried to build around Drummond for years.

Detroit tried to build around Drummond?
What? Trading for Reggie Jackson was that move?

This current management is horrible. It's probably one of the worst in the league. They didn't try to build around anyone. May be SVG tried for a season or so but he also made god-awful decisions in the draft. Had we gotten those 2 perimeter players in the draft and not overpaid dime-a-dozen FA talents, this team would have been much better shape.

[subbed sub]

salty Drummond fans don't understand that we are "hating" Drummond the supposed >20 million dollars per year player, not Drummond the player at all.

we "hate" Drummond the player who thinks himself as a star, as a ball handler, as an offensive threat.

we "hate" Drummond's lack of awareness of his limits and his qualities, not him.

and we hated that Detroit tried to build around Drummond for years.

Detroit tried to build around Drummond?
What? Trading for Reggie Jackson was that move?

This current management is horrible. It's probably one of the worst in the league. They didn't try to build around anyone. May be SVG tried for a season or so but he also made god-awful decisions in the draft. Had we gotten those 2 perimeter players in the draft and not overpaid dime-a-dozen FA talents, this team would have been much better shape.

To be fair to the "current management", Ed wasn't GM during the truly appalling decision making we've had to put up with. I like his Sekou draft. At the end of this window we'll know more about his competency.

[El Chivo]

the current management is not responsible for the mess inherited.

[Snakebites]

There was never a long term vision for this team.

It was always just “who can we add that might give us a few more wins this season”.

It’s tough to talk about management since that’s exchanged hands multiple times. Dumars and Van Gundy both signed the wrong players to big contracts again and again. Ill advised trades and picks were made. SVG in particular made moves that showed an utter disregard for long term salary structure. He overspent in bad players to fill out his bench rotation.

Maybe Dre was miscast as our star player. Maybe that’s not his fault. But if he’s going to want to seek star money, he’ll hopefully need to do that elsewhere, because a star he’s not.

We’re rebuilding now. At least I hope to all things good and holy that we are. And I don’t think Dre fits that, not anymore. I think moving on is the best thing for all parties concerned.

I haven’t seen any actual Drummond “hate” anywhere. So I still don’t know who the folks who are complaining about that are addressing. That’s why I tend to think those comments are directed at those who think as I do.

[Han Solo]

No one wants Drummond. Lol.

[subbed sub]

No one wants Drummond. Lol.

Not quite so sure about that myself. The best value for a buying team is had on the final day of the trade window. Let's wait it out. I still think he'll be traded.

[Cowology]

Drummond is fantastic as your 3rd/4th starter making about 1/3 of his current salary.

It's probably not fair to place too much ownership for our struggles on Dre. Its not like he was a franchise player who got paid and then decided to mail it in. We knew who he was. We made that choice.

That said, it's also not unreasonable to want more out of a player making the sorta bank he is. Good time to part ways.