The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part IV

[Kobblehead]

I think all this talk of lesser players with more ideal tools and better fits is overthinking it. Get the best players, regardless of fit and tools and you're more likely to beat the other team.

Ballers show up in the playoffs, not role players (especially on the road).

[JoeZeke]

It's a lot more popular these days to be down on Ben Simmons, but Embiid has been the bigger disappointment to me this year. After last years loss to the Raptors and his subsequent breakdown; Embiid was supposed to come back a more dedicated player. He's still the same player though, he's still not in great shape, he's still a turnover machine, he still can't pass out a double team, he still struggles against physical defenders. I never thought I'd be at this point, but if I'm breaking up the Embiid/ Simmons duo, for me Joel is the one to go if I had to make the choice right now.

[Mik317]

recency bias is such a bitch lol.

Embiid has been a bit of a letdown this year due to his still poor shape BUT he has been passing out of double teams much better lately and the team's turnovers as a whole has been down for a while now WITH Embiid. I really hate that I can't enjoy Ben's recent surge without the TRADE EMBIID brigade rushing in with hot takes lol.

this is exactly why we can't have nice things

[XDevilBoiX]

It’s been like that for a few years now how guys jump back and forth on who the best player on this team is. We already know who is except for a few guys.

[PLO]

John Hollinger has listed Simmons as a starting pick for his East All-Stars in the Athletic:

"Ben Simmons, Philadelphia – One refreshing thing about Embiid’s recent absence is that it reacquainted everyone to how good Simmons is. While the Sixers’ weird lineup arrangement doesn’t optimize his skillset, Simmons is one of the rarer players in basketball — an absolute terror on the defensive end who can also start the league’s fastest fast breaks, overwhelm little guards on the block, or play as a rim-rolling big when he sets screens.

It’s a weird skillset that doesn’t mesh well with a low-post behemoth, and the Sixers do him no favors by often having him roll right into places where Embiid or Al Hoford are already standing.

Nonetheless, Simmons actually scores at a decent rate despite the complete lack of a jump shot (21.5 points per 100 on 57.6 percent shooting), throws in 8.5 assist and 7.8 boards per game, and is an All-Defense shoo-in who is leading the league in steals.

The availability argument above also applies to Simmons. While the Sixers nurse Embiid through the regular season, Simmons is second in the Eastern Conference in minutes while averaging 36.0 minutes per game; he’s missed only two contests. Listed as a backcourt player on the All-Star ballot because “freak” wasn’t one of the options, he is the one obvious selection in the group."

[Bum Adebayo]

Embiid is our best player, but Simmons is the most talented player, this has been known for a long time.

[Mik317]

if Ben starts then he will never even think about shooting again lol

[Kobblehead]

Embiid is our best player, but Simmons is the most talented player, this has been known for a long time.

I'm not even sure if this is accurate. There's a shelf-life on the assumed talent of teenagers. Once they get into the league, production is all that matters. Guys that show themselves to be insta-stars are just flatout more talented than everyone else. Joel Embiid, Donovan Mitchell and Luka Doncic prove this.

[nurseryc]

Watch on YouTube

[nurseryc]

Embiid is our best player, but Simmons is the most talented player, this has been known for a long time.

I'm not even sure if this is accurate. There's a shelf-life on the assumed talent of teenagers. Once they get into the league, production is all that matters. Guys that show themselves to be insta-stars are just flatout more talented than everyone else. Joel Embiid, Donovan Mitchell and Luka Doncic prove this.

It’s accurate however I’d be more inclined after this stretch to say Simmons is also our best player. We must never go back to our old style of play again once Joel returns. I’d like to see Joel and Ben at a minimum each taking around the same amount of shots per game, maybe Ben taking a few more than Joel. Our current style of play is deadly. If Joel wants to be part of it, he must get fit and learn to run and gun. He must also become a better passer and learn to move the basketball on offence and instead of always looking to score , put his head up and look for Ben. Works both ways.

[Kobblehead]

Everyone wants Simmons increasing his FGAs. That's something he needs to figure out internally. How to stay aggressive for long periods.

[AI_Efficiency]

Embiid is our best player, but Simmons is the most talented player, this has been known for a long time.

I'm not even sure if this is accurate. There's a shelf-life on the assumed talent of teenagers. Once they get into the league, production is all that matters. Guys that show themselves to be insta-stars are just flatout more talented than everyone else. Joel Embiid, Donovan Mitchell and Luka Doncic prove this.

It’s accurate however I’d be more inclined after this stretch to say Simmons is also our best player. We must never go back to our old style of play again once Joel returns. I’d like to see Joel and Ben at a minimum each taking around the same amount of shots per game, maybe Ben taking a few more than Joel. Our current style of play is deadly. If Joel wants to be part of it, he must get fit and learn to run and gun. He must also become a better passer and learn to move the basketball on offence and instead of always looking to score , put his head up and look for Ben. Works both ways.

I agree that we should stay with this style, but I think there are two issues I foresee us having. First, it becomes tougher to have Simmons be the roll man when Horford and Embiid are both on the court. They are both mediocre shooters so they make it much easier to pack the paint when Simmons rolls. I do not think there is an easy solution to this, since management is unlikely to trade Horford after just signing him, and I doubt Horford will be content to only play backup minutes. That said, ideally they will continue to stagger Horford and Embiid as much as possible, and if Horford needs to play less minutes in the playoffs, so be it.

Second, I think we may run into a Dwight Howard type problem with Embiid. Guy wants to be MVP and has been used to getting post touches for the last few years. It may be tough to get him to be okay spending more time on the perimeter. Ideally he would use the energy he saves on offense to help on defense and we could still get him some post touches when he gets a mis-match.

None of the above issues are to say we should not continue to try running a pick and roll offense with Ben as the roll man and focal point, but they do make it more complicated.

[michaelm]

Embiid is our best player, but Simmons is the most talented player, this has been known for a long time.

I'm not even sure if this is accurate. There's a shelf-life on the assumed talent of teenagers. Once they get into the league, production is all that matters. Guys that show themselves to be insta-stars are just flatout more talented than everyone else. Joel Embiid, Donovan Mitchell and Luka Doncic prove this.

It’s accurate however I’d be more inclined after this stretch to say Simmons is also our best player. We must never go back to our old style of play again once Joel returns. I’d like to see Joel and Ben at a minimum each taking around the same amount of shots per game, maybe Ben taking a few more than Joel. Our current style of play is deadly. If Joel wants to be part of it, he must get fit and learn to run and gun. He must also become a better passer and learn to move the basketball on offence and instead of always looking to score , put his head up and look for Ben. Works both ways.

So the recent games have totally changed your mind about Simmons ?.

“We” need to see how this style of play works against some actual good teams first, and consider whether it will work in the play-offs against good teams. Embiid looked pretty good in that game against the Bucks, and will look to put that kind of effort in against good teams in the play-offs. I do think what this stretch has shown is that Horford and Simmons can work well together, so a fairly definite conclusion from Embiid’s absence is to stagger the minutes so Embiid, Simmons and Horford spend little time on the court together, as others have said.

As far as Embiid in general, the real thing for which he can be criticised imo Is on the weight/fitness front. If Tim Duncan could lose weight to preserve his knees at age 35, I can’t see why Embiid can’t do so at age 25.

[Bum Adebayo]

Yeah Embiid doesn't seem too dedicated conditioning wise, what I mean by this is that he probably likes to eat all sorts of things and it is very hard for him to stop eating unhealthy stuff.

[phillynative]

We have to get him off the ball and get a PG. He kills us in the halfcourt everytime. We will continue to be a nite and day team with him running the show.

[Chris76]

Everyone wants Simmons increasing his FGAs. That's something he needs to figure out internally. How to stay aggressive for long periods.

It seems Simmons has taken a step forward when finishing. Which is a huge improvement.

Hopefully, he and Embiid should be much better when Simmons finishes as he has lately. Embiid missed a lot of opportunities to feed Simmons for easy dunks in the past.

[76ciology]

Watch on YouTube

- Attacked Danny Green’s defense. Most evident was asking Tobi for the screen then attacking DG for an and 1.
- Used Horford as a screener, AD needs to step out due to Horford’s ability to shoot. Ben has a step advantage after the screen.
- Lakers eventually opted to put AD on Ben. One possession, Ben able to make the shot off a euro step and banked a floater. The other one, AD sagged off an Al-Ben PnP, but Al was able to make AD pay.

[kingerzz]

I think we should trial Horford off the bench, He could play the back up 5 then some minutes at the 4 instead of Mike Scott with Embiid. We need to avoid playing all three of Embiid, Horford and Simmons at the same time.

[WestGOAT]

I think we should trial Horford off the bench, He could play the back up 5 then some minutes at the 4 instead of Mike Scott with Embiid. We need to avoid playing all three of Embiid, Horford and Simmons at the same time.

Horford comes off the bench and then stagger Embiid and Simmons as much as possible.

Embiid should be limited to a maximum of 30 min/game with his health concerns/conditioning anyway, and have Simmons play around 36.

[76ciology]

I think we should trial Horford off the bench, He could play the back up 5 then some minutes at the 4 instead of Mike Scott with Embiid. We need to avoid playing all three of Embiid, Horford and Simmons at the same time.

Then Ben defends 4s. Then 4s would sag off Ben to clog the paint. This doesnt solve the problem we’ve had for the last two seasons.

What we need to do is to keep running a 4 out offense at all times. And this can be done if Biid will post up less when Ben is on the court.

P.S. our starting unit has 15.7 NetRtg on 118ORtg in the 4th quarter.