Game 45: Los Angeles Clippers (31-13) @ Atlanta Hawks (10-34) - 7:30 PM ET

[MartinToVaught]

The story that just came out in the American suggest this team is not together. SMH. Can't win a championship if they're bickering over amenities and being jealous of kawhi

Please see my posts above? I subscribe to The Athletic and excerpted the actual article so everybody could see for themselves. It's a great piece of sports journalism and PLEASE don't believe the "fake news" summaries of it.

If anything, it might explain why Doc gave Trezz free rein last night. True, Zubac sucked ass and was partly or even greatly to blame for that 12-1 run at the beginning of the 3rd quarter that let ATL back into the game. It wasn't about Mann missing shots, it was about missed defensive assignments and rotation, the only reason Zu is out on the floor. Doc was right to yank him after only 4 minutes.

But at the end of the 2nd quarter, with a 20-point lead, Trezz started jerking around too, and Doc said that was the beginning of trouble. I saw it too. Everything Trezz had complained about his teammates, Trezz was guilty of too.

And he copped to it.

“We got real lackadaisical, we took bad shots, all of us, including myself, and like I said we just relied on thinking we were going to coast our way through the game where they were going to lay down. And we should have known that’s not the type of team that they are.”

Doc taught Trezz a lesson. You rocket out to a 20-point lead, you get bored. Even you, Trezz. You're all human.

So blame the coaching if you must. But the coach was sending messages. Zu, keep your head in the game. Trezz, don't be such a dick and slamming your brothers in the press.

That's coaching strategically, not just tactically. The big picture. Both Zu and Trezz needed some serious straightening out. The loss was on THEM.

That's some cool fanfiction, but Doc has been doing this his entire time here. He plays favorites. Certain players (like Trez) can do no wrong, others (like Zu) are benched for the slightest mistake and blamed for things that aren't even their fault.

[NippySudz]

The story that just came out in the American suggest this team is not together. SMH. Can't win a championship if they're bickering over amenities and being jealous of kawhi

Please see my posts above? I subscribe to The Athletic and excerpted the actual article so everybody could see for themselves. It's a great piece of sports journalism and PLEASE don't believe the "fake news" summaries of it.

If anything, it might explain why Doc gave Trezz free rein last night. True, Zubac sucked ass and was partly or even greatly to blame for that 12-1 run at the beginning of the 3rd quarter that let ATL back into the game. It wasn't about Mann missing shots, it was about missed defensive assignments and rotation, the only reason Zu is out on the floor. Doc was right to yank him after only 4 minutes.

But at the end of the 2nd quarter, with a 20-point lead, Trezz started jerking around too, and Doc said that was the beginning of trouble. I saw it too. Everything Trezz had complained about his teammates, Trezz was guilty of too.

And he copped to it.

“We got real lackadaisical, we took bad shots, all of us, including myself, and like I said we just relied on thinking we were going to coast our way through the game where they were going to lay down. And we should have known that’s not the type of team that they are.”

Doc taught Trezz a lesson. You rocket out to a 20-point lead, you get bored. Even you, Trezz. You're all human.

So blame the coaching if you must. But the coach was sending messages. Zu, keep your head in the game. Trezz, don't be such a dick and slamming your brothers in the press.

That's coaching strategically, not just tactically. The big picture. Both Zu and Trezz needed some serious straightening out. The loss was on THEM.

The coaching was bad against the Hawks. He played trez the entire second half of a back to back to avoid giving relief mins to Zu because the Hawks got a 12-1 run.(which he blamed Zu for)

That's on doc. If players can have bad nights, so can coaches. He wasn't being smart.

Harrell was burned out.



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[clipperlover]

The story that just came out in the American suggest this team is not together. SMH. Can't win a championship if they're bickering over amenities and being jealous of kawhi

If anything, it might explain why Doc gave Trezz free rein last night. True, Zubac sucked ass and was partly or even greatly to blame for that 12-1 run at the beginning of the 3rd quarter that let ATL back into the game. It wasn't about Mann missing shots, it was about missed defensive assignments and rotation, the only reason Zu is out on the floor. Doc was right to yank him after only 4 minutes.

I think you are putting way too much blame on Zubac. In the 1st quarter, Atlanta started out on an 11-4 run, but Doc left Zubac in for most of the 1st and we came back. In the 3rd, the Hawks opened with a 3 because Mann did get around the screen. A little later, Lou throws a lazy pass into the post that gets stolen and turned into a fast break layup. A couple of minutes later, we have 3 guys in the paint with the Hawks player near the baseline. When the Hawks players throws the ball out, Harkless doesn't stay near the guy closest to him. Instead, he takes a guy cutting into the paint. When the ball swings to the guy Harkless should have been near, Shamet scambles to get to the guy leaving the player he was guarding alone in the corner and the Hawks swing the ball to the corner. This forces Zu to have to close out from the paint and the Hawks drain the 3. After Doc pulled Zu, Harrell failed to challenge Collins who hit back to back 3s and let the score go from a 14 pt lead to an 8 pt lead.

The fact is that this team had multiple double digit leads with under 7 and a half to go. The Hawks outscored us 19-5 over the last 6 minutes. Lou had gave up 2 3 pts buckets during that span because he failed to close out. The collapse against another bad team down the stretch had nothing to do with Zubac. He is never on the floor for these late game collapses (e.g. Bulls, Hawks).

[playaloc916]

Harrell has a very good point though that cannot be ignored. He makes $7m a year and asked to play heavy minutes on road back to backs, while the guys who get $25-30m take the night off when they wish. That is of course preferential treatment. Even if you know and accept that was going to happen as PG and Kawhi are superstars, after a while you start being uncomfortable with it.
I do not know what extent of PG's injury is, but if he can play he should even for 15 minutes. Kawhi has taken a 3rd of the game nights off so far, he needs to play 80% of the games going forward at least. and more importantly Doc needs to be in change and address any issues.

I don't think anyone here is wrong, it's just a question of approach to the regular season. If you go with the official line, Kawhi is playing despite a chronic injury. PG is out because hammys re-injure like crazy. Pat has a groin pull, and that's prone to constant re-injury as well.

If Trezz says he needs a night off, I don't think anyone will begrudge him. I mean, he expends a lot of energy, but he's still only averaging 29 minutes a game. I think the real problem is that he goes balls-out all game, but maybe he SHOULD learn how to pace himself a bit like Kawhi does, to make sure there's still something in the tank come winning time.

With Trezz, I get where he is coming from. I've felt that way in jobs I've held in the past. Manager just coasts, makes me do their job, and it was quite frustrating, especially given that they get paid a lot more, aren't working as many hours, etc...
But he needs to accept the way things are with Kawhi. The blueprint has been made. The guy did the same thing last year, and ended up having a historic playoff run, and they won the championship. If he gets treated differently, so be it, that's the price you have to pay to have a shot at winning the title. I don't know about everyone else, but if we kept the same roster with Galinari and SGA, I don't think the team would have a realistic shot (of course, might be different if we got some other free agent like Butler). Again, a good playoff run, but probably 2nd round exit at most.

If Trezz doesn't like it, he can either leave for another team (which seems like the most likely scenario), or just play his heart out and help win a title(s). And with Kawhi's load management, it just means he's probably getting more shots. In a twisted way, Kawhi's actually helping Trezz in his contract year, by giving him a bigger role.

[MartinRiggs]

I wouldn't complaint if I was Trez. With Kawhi and PG out he has a chance to show his value in regular season and in playoffs if things go wrong thoose two guys will also be blamed. So win-win for him and he can pump his value up and get monster contract.

[50CalClips]

Media, finally catching up to this Message Board...

Watch on YouTube

[MartinRiggs]

Nick,the biggest Kawhi hater.

[NippySudz]

Media, finally catching up to this Message Board...

Watch on YouTube

You're late to the party. Nick wright is not a fan of kawhi Leonard and hasn't been since he signed with the clippers

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[playaloc916]

NIck Wright has such a punchable face

[esqtvd]

The story that just came out in the American suggest this team is not together. SMH. Can't win a championship if they're bickering over amenities and being jealous of kawhi

Please see my posts above? I subscribe to The Athletic and excerpted the actual article so everybody could see for themselves. It's a great piece of sports journalism and PLEASE don't believe the "fake news" summaries of it.

If anything, it might explain why Doc gave Trezz free rein last night. True, Zubac sucked ass and was partly or even greatly to blame for that 12-1 run at the beginning of the 3rd quarter that let ATL back into the game. It wasn't about Mann missing shots, it was about missed defensive assignments and rotation, the only reason Zu is out on the floor. Doc was right to yank him after only 4 minutes.

But at the end of the 2nd quarter, with a 20-point lead, Trezz started jerking around too, and Doc said that was the beginning of trouble. I saw it too. Everything Trezz had complained about his teammates, Trezz was guilty of too.

And he copped to it.

“We got real lackadaisical, we took bad shots, all of us, including myself, and like I said we just relied on thinking we were going to coast our way through the game where they were going to lay down. And we should have known that’s not the type of team that they are.”

Doc taught Trezz a lesson. You rocket out to a 20-point lead, you get bored. Even you, Trezz. You're all human.

So blame the coaching if you must. But the coach was sending messages. Zu, keep your head in the game. Trezz, don't be such a dick and slamming your brothers in the press.

That's coaching strategically, not just tactically. The big picture. Both Zu and Trezz needed some serious straightening out. The loss was on THEM.

The coaching was bad against the Hawks. He played trez the entire second half of a back to back to avoid giving relief mins to Zu because the Hawks got a 12-1 run.(which he blamed Zu for)

That's on doc. If players can have bad nights, so can coaches. He wasn't being smart.

Harrell was burned out.

We got away with it time after time and almost got away with it again. Trezz has played the entire 4th quarter for pretty much the whole season--we still had the 3rd best record in the NBA--and he only played 33 minutes in this game, not 38.

This controversy will never go away because there's no was to prove Zubac wouldn't have done better--it's the backup quarterback argument. Our team lost, so the backup would have won it. But Zubac can't score on his own and turns the ball over at key times.

The problem was Lou, who went 6-19 and missed all 7 of his 3-point shots. We were particularly struggling for points--Lou was the only other scorer out there besides Trezz and he was missing shot after shot. It's a facile argument but it's far from obvious that yanking Trezz for Zubac was the solution. The arguments for not doing it are just as valid. And Trezz got a bit of a lesson and a big show of faith from Doc, and this hopefully served to repair the riff that we've been discussing above.

[NippySudz]

Please see my posts above? I subscribe to The Athletic and excerpted the actual article so everybody could see for themselves. It's a great piece of sports journalism and PLEASE don't believe the "fake news" summaries of it.

If anything, it might explain why Doc gave Trezz free rein last night. True, Zubac sucked ass and was partly or even greatly to blame for that 12-1 run at the beginning of the 3rd quarter that let ATL back into the game. It wasn't about Mann missing shots, it was about missed defensive assignments and rotation, the only reason Zu is out on the floor. Doc was right to yank him after only 4 minutes.

But at the end of the 2nd quarter, with a 20-point lead, Trezz started jerking around too, and Doc said that was the beginning of trouble. I saw it too. Everything Trezz had complained about his teammates, Trezz was guilty of too.

And he copped to it.

“We got real lackadaisical, we took bad shots, all of us, including myself, and like I said we just relied on thinking we were going to coast our way through the game where they were going to lay down. And we should have known that’s not the type of team that they are.”

Doc taught Trezz a lesson. You rocket out to a 20-point lead, you get bored. Even you, Trezz. You're all human.

So blame the coaching if you must. But the coach was sending messages. Zu, keep your head in the game. Trezz, don't be such a dick and slamming your brothers in the press.

That's coaching strategically, not just tactically. The big picture. Both Zu and Trezz needed some serious straightening out. The loss was on THEM.

The coaching was bad against the Hawks. He played trez the entire second half of a back to back to avoid giving relief mins to Zu because the Hawks got a 12-1 run.(which he blamed Zu for)

That's on doc. If players can have bad nights, so can coaches. He wasn't being smart.

Harrell was burned out.

We got away with it time after time and almost got away with it again. Trezz has played the entire 4th quarter for pretty much the whole season--we still had the 3rd best record in the NBA--and he only played 33 minutes in this game, not 38.

This controversy will never go away because there's no was to prove Zubac wouldn't have done better--it's the backup quarterback argument. Our team lost, so the backup would have won it. But Zubac can't score on his own and turns the ball over at key times.

The problem was Lou, who went 6-19 and missed all 7 of his 3-point shots. We were particularly struggling for points--Lou was the only other scorer out there besides Trezz and he was missing shot after shot. It's a facile argument but it's far from obvious that yanking Trezz for Zubac was the solution. The arguments for not doing it are just as valid. And Trezz got a bit of a lesson and a big show of faith from Doc, and this hopefully served to repair the riff that we've been discussing above.

Tell me when. That's happened this season where zh was yanked for something not his fault btw and trez was forced to play that entre second half. Not quarter. Second half.

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[esqtvd]

The coaching was bad against the Hawks. He played trez the entire second half of a back to back to avoid giving relief mins to Zu because the Hawks got a 12-1 run.(which he blamed Zu for)

That's on doc. If players can have bad nights, so can coaches. He wasn't being smart.

Harrell was burned out.

We got away with it time after time and almost got away with it again. Trezz has played the entire 4th quarter for pretty much the whole season--we still had the 3rd best record in the NBA--and he only played 33 minutes in this game, not 38.

This controversy will never go away because there's no was to prove Zubac wouldn't have done better--it's the backup quarterback argument. Our team lost, so the backup would have won it. But Zubac can't score on his own and turns the ball over at key times.

The problem was Lou, who went 6-19 and missed all 7 of his 3-point shots. We were particularly struggling for points--Lou was the only other scorer out there besides Trezz and he was missing shot after shot. It's a facile argument but it's far from obvious that yanking Trezz for Zubac was the solution. The arguments for not doing it are just as valid. And Trezz got a bit of a lesson and a big show of faith from Doc, and this hopefully served to repair the riff that we've been discussing above.

Tell me when. That's happened this season where zh was yanked for something not his fault btw and trez was forced to play that entre second half. Not quarter. Second half.

Trezz played 3 or 4 extra minutes. That's it. Zubac averages 18 minutes. He still played 15. Doc yanked him at the 8:00 mark instead of his usual 6:00 or 4:00 [when he's doing well]. I think people are feeding the pro-Zubac/anti-Doc narrative a bit too much here. The problem was Lou's fatigue far more than Trezz's.

[NippySudz]

We got away with it time after time and almost got away with it again. Trezz has played the entire 4th quarter for pretty much the whole season--we still had the 3rd best record in the NBA--and he only played 33 minutes in this game, not 38.

This controversy will never go away because there's no was to prove Zubac wouldn't have done better--it's the backup quarterback argument. Our team lost, so the backup would have won it. But Zubac can't score on his own and turns the ball over at key times.

The problem was Lou, who went 6-19 and missed all 7 of his 3-point shots. We were particularly struggling for points--Lou was the only other scorer out there besides Trezz and he was missing shot after shot. It's a facile argument but it's far from obvious that yanking Trezz for Zubac was the solution. The arguments for not doing it are just as valid. And Trezz got a bit of a lesson and a big show of faith from Doc, and this hopefully served to repair the riff that we've been discussing above.

Tell me when. That's happened this season where zh was yanked for something not his fault btw and trez was forced to play that entre second half. Not quarter. Second half.

Trezz played 3 or 4 extra minutes. That's it. Zubac averages 18 minutes. He still played 15. Doc yanked him at the 8:00 mark instead of his usual 6:00 or 4:00 [when he's doing well]. I think people are feeding the pro-Zubac/anti-Doc narrative a bit too much here. The problem was Lou's fatigue far more than Trezz's.

On a back to back.

Trez was on pace for 40.

Trez never plays through consecutive qtrs like that. He was gassed

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[esqtvd]

Tell me when. That's happened this season where zh was yanked for something not his fault btw and trez was forced to play that entre second half. Not quarter. Second half.

Trezz played 3 or 4 extra minutes. That's it. Zubac averages 18 minutes. He still played 15. Doc yanked him at the 8:00 mark instead of his usual 6:00 or 4:00 [when he's doing well]. I think people are feeding the pro-Zubac/anti-Doc narrative a bit too much here. The problem was Lou's fatigue far more than Trezz's.

On a back to back.

Trez was on pace for 40.

Trez never plays through consecutive qtrs like that. He was gassed

Dude, please respond to what I actually wrote. Trezz came in between 2 and 4 minutes earlier than he usually does. That was the only thing different. Zubac played about 3 minutes less than usual.

[NippySudz]

Trezz played 3 or 4 extra minutes. That's it. Zubac averages 18 minutes. He still played 15. Doc yanked him at the 8:00 mark instead of his usual 6:00 or 4:00 [when he's doing well]. I think people are feeding the pro-Zubac/anti-Doc narrative a bit too much here. The problem was Lou's fatigue far more than Trezz's.

On a back to back.

Trez was on pace for 40.

Trez never plays through consecutive qtrs like that. He was gassed

Dude, please respond to what I actually wrote. Trezz came in between 2 and 4 minutes earlier than he usually does. That was the only thing different. Zubac played about 3 minutes less than usual.

Let's not play this game of I'm not responding to ehat you're posting. I am. You just so happen to disagree. I don't care what the standard allotments are. I think fatigue played a factor in it and it showed in the end. Trez was on pace for a 40+ game and only scored 9 points in the second half. Trezz was fatigued. Why are you ignoring that part of the argument? 9pts in the second half. If that's not fatigue, what is it?

You don't need Zu to play the entire second half. But he should at least be there to allow trez some relief mins.

Mentioning Lou Williams is a red herring. Trez was the one leading the charge last night. Maybe with some rest, they push through and win.

Coaches can have off nights too.

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[esqtvd]

On a back to back.

Trez was on pace for 40.

Trez never plays through consecutive qtrs like that. He was gassed

Dude, please respond to what I actually wrote. Trezz came in between 2 and 4 minutes earlier than he usually does. That was the only thing different. Zubac played about 3 minutes less than usual.

Let's not play this game of I'm not responding to ehat you're posting. I am. You just so happen to disagree. I don't care what the standard allotments are. I think fatigue played a factor in it and it showed in the end. Trez was on pace for a 40+ game and only scored 9 points in the second half. Trezz was fatigued. Why are you ignoring that part of the argument? 9pts in the second half. If that's not fatigue, what is it?

You don't need Zu to play the entire second half. But he should at least be there to allow trez some relief mins.

Coaches can have off nights too.

But Trezz wasn't on the way to 40. He was on the way to 4 minutes more than his usual 28-29. All this is about 4 minutes.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion that his fatigue cost us the game. I think it was much more Lou's fatigue, and I doubt whether Zubac would have made the difference. Just questioning the narrative. I'd rather have a tiring Trezz than a fresh Zubac and we've gotten away with it for victory after victory. This time we didn't.

This is why I've been prioritizing getting a 3rd big who can give us those 4 minutes at center and help out at the 4. Unfortunately, J-Myke is not turning out to be that guy. That's where I'm pointing the finger, at the hole Green should be filling up.

[nickhx2]

NIck Wright has such a punchable face

usually i stand by my fellow nicks

but by all means, go for it, with this one.


dude's opinion is garbage, posting that as some kind of confirmation of an internet forum's misguided opinion is not going to track