2020 NBA Draft

[LSandersBong]

Ayayi's got a higher floor, could be a solid bench guard who can do a little bit of everything. Maledon though I prefer due to upside however abit quicker and abit more interesting on offence.

BUT I think if your a team like the Bucks or the Lakers picking at the end of the first looking for a back up point guard , and Maledon was still available you'd probably consider Ayayi .

[karkinos]

Based on your reasoning, if a player attempts 10 shots a game and 5 of that player's shots were threes but in his latest season he averages 25 shots a game and 8 of those shots are threes he's a more willing three point shooter.

yes this is correct. this is how most people would interpret willingness
1. willingness to shoot more regardless of the type of shot
2. willingness to shoot more of a specific type of shot per game or per 40 or per 48 minutes
see the denominator here is PER GAME.

This isn't even how all this works. "The proportion itself is of no significant difference," um yes it is.

no, it is not
2% of 12 or 13 fg attempts per game is less than 1 shot. you cannot make any conclusions of "reluctance" based on that. you have no surveys to support that conclusion and quite frankly you have no historical trends to support your hypothesis either.

Can't you conclude based off 3-point rate that it's more likely that the average distance of Tre's shot attempts have decreased than increased this season compared to last season?

no because the difference in the percentage is worth less than 1 shot per game so it wouldn't translate to an in game change. if you took season stats you would be more likely to find that he shot maybe a few dozen less three pointers per total field goals attempted over the course of the season, but it would not reflect a reluctance to shoot within the course of a single game.

A 2% drop in proportion helps my argument because it's shows that he's increased the % of his shots that are 2-pointers.

by less than an actual shot per game...you can't shoot a quarter of a shot. it is meaningless within the context of a 40 or 48 minute game.

Let's try doing the "opposite". If Tre's 3-point rate increased compared to his last season, but the number of 3s he takes a game are down(by a 3-point attempt), are you going to say that he's even less of a 3-point shooter?

i would judge him by the quantity of 3s he takes per game, so yes. and i think most people would arrive at the same conclusion.

By the way,

volume, rate, and frequency are not the same because tre jones literally cannot be shooting at a lower volume or rate


The NBA's definition of 3P FG frequency.

"The percentage of opponent field goal attempts of the specified criteria that are 3 point attempts"

Well, it looks like you were wrong. Anything you want to say to that? Just because you don't understand a word within the context of a discussion doesn't mean it's being misused

well, no, i'm not wrong.
again, you're not reading carefully.
frequency is the wording you should have used from the beginning
frequency still is not the rate nor the volume
i specifically omitted frequency when i said he cannot literally be shooting at a lower volume or rate.

you really need to read more carefully.

it has nothing to do with me not understanding the context. everyone understands what you're trying to say. but the way you're trying to derive some sort of meaning out of it is kind of ridiculous.

"frequency still is not the rate nor the volume"

Wow, thanks for making my argument for me. I literally just gave you the definition for frequency and you still will not admit that frequency and rate are interchangeable terms in basketball. This is what I'm dealing with here.

See post 1873


"No.

Rate is most commonly used with relation to time
Most people define rate per 48 which most easily translates to per game averages

The most common interpretation of rate in the general public uses games as the common denominator and therefore 3 point attempts per game directly correlates to what is interpreted as the rate.

Your personal definition of rate as a measure of proportion of shots (3pt attempts divided by the total) is a misnomer. Furthermore, the application and interpretation of your self defined stat makes little sense to most people because there simply hasn't been strong evidence to support the claims you're making."

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

[Marcus]

yes this is correct. this is how most people would interpret willingness
1. willingness to shoot more regardless of the type of shot
2. willingness to shoot more of a specific type of shot per game or per 40 or per 48 minutes
see the denominator here is PER GAME.


no, it is not
2% of 12 or 13 fg attempts per game is less than 1 shot. you cannot make any conclusions of "reluctance" based on that. you have no surveys to support that conclusion and quite frankly you have no historical trends to support your hypothesis either.


no because the difference in the percentage is worth less than 1 shot per game so it wouldn't translate to an in game change. if you took season stats you would be more likely to find that he shot maybe a few dozen less three pointers per total field goals attempted over the course of the season, but it would not reflect a reluctance to shoot within the course of a single game.


by less than an actual shot per game...you can't shoot a quarter of a shot. it is meaningless within the context of a 40 or 48 minute game.


i would judge him by the quantity of 3s he takes per game, so yes. and i think most people would arrive at the same conclusion.



well, no, i'm not wrong.
again, you're not reading carefully.
frequency is the wording you should have used from the beginning
frequency still is not the rate nor the volume
i specifically omitted frequency when i said he cannot literally be shooting at a lower volume or rate.

you really need to read more carefully.

it has nothing to do with me not understanding the context. everyone understands what you're trying to say. but the way you're trying to derive some sort of meaning out of it is kind of ridiculous.

"frequency still is not the rate nor the volume"

Wow, thanks for making my argument for me. I literally just gave you the definition for frequency and you still will not admit that frequency and rate are interchangeable terms in basketball. This is what I'm dealing with here.

See post 1873


"No.

Rate is most commonly used with relation to time
Most people define rate per 48 which most easily translates to per game averages

The most common interpretation of rate in the general public uses games as the common denominator and therefore 3 point attempts per game directly correlates to what is interpreted as the rate.

Your personal definition of rate as a measure of proportion of shots (3pt attempts divided by the total) is a misnomer. Furthermore, the application and interpretation of your self defined stat makes little sense to most people because there simply hasn't been strong evidence to support the claims you're making."

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

see post 1892

if you guys wanna further this back and forth do it in PMs.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Would any of this draft go top 5 in a stronger draft? EG 2018 - Ayton/Bagley/Doncic/Jackson/Young

[MemphisX]

Would any of this draft go top 5 in a stronger draft? EG 2018 - Ayton/Bagley/Doncic/Jackson/Young

None

[Roddy B for 3]

Would any of this draft go top 5 in a stronger draft? EG 2018 - Ayton/Bagley/Doncic/Jackson/Young

I liked JJJ alot. I Had him #4.

I had that draft as
Ayton
Luka
Bamba
JJJ
Mikal Bridges
Trae young was 6-10 for me
I had Bagley #8 or #9 if I remember correctly.

That being said I'd take any of the 2018 top 5 over these guy by a long shot. But evaluating them as prospects I'd probably have had Wiseman #3 and Edwards would be a step under JJJ. No one else would be with these guys right now. Maybe I would've had Haliburton over Trae because Trae had such a terrible second half with OU. And Haliburton is very safe (I am very anti drafting busts)

I can see that it's dumb to have Wiseman over JJJ but even though I had JJJ close to #2 than #5 he was still extremely skinny and young with limited playing time comming out of MSU.

Once again though I had him closer to Doncic than #5 overall. He was almost neck and neck with Bamba.

Bamba can still be great in my wrapped mind though lol.

[King Ken]

2018 had the ultimate top 5 in excellent talent.

Hard to find a draft this damn talented again.

This class has two excellent talents but their raw in Edwards and Ball. In that class, Bamba and Young were raw. So Edwards and Ball could go top 5. They are legit excellent talents
Bagley
Bamba
Doncic
Ayton
Trae Young

[King Ken]

Yves Pons has developed into a legit draftable prospect now

The talent was always there but he was extremely raw out of France

[EvanZ]

2018 I had

Luka
JJJ
Miles
Trae
Ayton
MPJ
Bagley
Huerter
Zhaire

I’d probably put Edwards in between Ayton and MPJ back then.

[Cammo101]

Would any of this draft go top 5 in a stronger draft? EG 2018 - Ayton/Bagley/Doncic/Jackson/Young

Probably not. This is a weak draft both at the top and from a depth standpoint.

[PerkinsFor3]

Where would you guys draft a guy like Coby White in this 2020 draft?

[MotownMadness]

Is Tyler Bey gonna be that safe older player that produces good at the next level?

[MotownMadness]

Where would you guys draft a guy like Coby White in this 2020 draft?

Probably like 4 or 5, i think teams would still swing for the not a sure thing upside on Wiseman, Edwards and Lamelo.

[No-Man]

Where would you guys draft a guy like Coby White in this 2020 draft?

late top10

had him mid teens last year

[realEAST]

Is Tyler Bey gonna be that safe older player that produces good at the next level?

I think, and it could be said for most prospects, that it depends on wheteher he becomes somewhat reliable 3pt shooter. Talking about off the catch corner 3s and open 3pt shots, of course. He is shooting high percentage (48%) but on really small volume, less than one attempt per game, and mostly wide open shots. He is decent FT shooter (77%), which is positive indication.

If he develops consistency on his shot, he can be high level role player as starter.- he is good defender, very good rebounder, and is good cutter with nice touch around the rim. If not he is more of a bench energy guy.

Regarding his shooting, I remember his coach saying he doesn't want him to shoot off the pick and pop, only wide open ones - don't remember did he give a reason why, was it because he wanted him to focus on other parts of his game, or because he often plays C for Colorado and should be in paint since he is very good rebounder. Or he knows he isn't great shooter so he wants to prevent his draft stock from falling.

[clyde21]

Is Tyler Bey gonna be that safe older player that produces good at the next level?

yes, elite physical profile that's a ++ rebounder day one, and is actually turning into a pretty reliable spot up shooter too.

Tyler Bey is a top20 guy for me

[King Ken]

Carey Jr is D. Sabonis like

[King Ken]

Where would you guys draft a guy like Coby White in this 2020 draft?

Clearly 3-8 for me. I rather most of the top PGs in this class over him but he's in their tier.

[BostonCouchGM]

Would any of this draft go top 5 in a stronger draft? EG 2018 - Ayton/Bagley/Doncic/Jackson/Young

In almost any other draft besides one of the best in history like 2018, both Wiseman and Edwards would be in the discussion for top 5. It's possible one or both could have gone before Jackson and Trae.

This is a good draft class. If people just stopped comparing it to two of the best draft classes of all time in 2017 and 2018 they'd see it's very solid like most draft classes are. It's a weird year with many of the top guys not playing in the NCAA for one reason or another. I imagine people will get around to my line of thinking once tournament play is in full swing followed by combines and team workouts where measurements and testing occur.

[stormi]

Cole 'Austin Rivers' Anthony is so underwhelming to me as a potential top 5 pick