MVP Discussion [19/20] [part II] - voting opened

[Packbuckman]

The thing with Giannis he’s getting better as the season is going. Adding more to his game to get ready for the playoffs. He looks so much more comfortable taking those mid range shots and little hooks around the basket. His free throws are looking way better too now. He willed this team to a win today! He should be a unanimous choice!

[scrabbarista]

Giannis has now 13 games with at least 30 points 15 rebounds and 5 assists this season. The rest of the league combined has 10. No player has more than one.

Giannis 13
Jokic 1
AD 1
Lebron 1
KAT 1
Ingram 1
Randle 1
Luka 1
Harden 1
Siakam 1
Vucevic 1

Source: https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=season&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=30&c2stat=trb&c2comp=gt&c2val=15&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&order_by=pts

Not quite as good, but here's 40 pts, 5 rebs, 5 asts, 2 stls. One difference is that your list only has two guys who aren't a PF or C (Harden and Luka - and I guess LeBron is debatable), whereas this one includes all five positions.

Harden 8
Beal 2
Antetokounmpo 1
Booker 1
Davis 1
Doncic 1
George 1
Ingram 1
Jokic 1
Lillard 1
Middleton 1
Russell 1
Westbrook 1

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=career&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=40&c2stat=stl&c2comp=gt&c2val=2&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&c4stat=trb&c4comp=gt&c4val=5&order_by=pts

[SeniorWalker]

You guys would be a lot better off if you stopped paying attention to those morons.

Giannis is a mortal lock. There's zero chance he doesn't win it again.

I mean sure, its not like their analysis is to be taken seriously, especially by the RealGM crowd. The problem is some of these people are actually MVP award voters. And they are deciding ahead of time who they want to win the award and trying to push that narrative around the media world despite reality. I think if LeBron does anything great in the remaining games they are going to try as hard as they can to push the sympathy vote and that is really disgusting as a diehard basketball fan.

I can't even imagine the chatter if the Lakers beat the Bucks Friday. Can guarantee most of the media will try to argue LeBron as the MVP frontrunner.

[Sedale Threatt]

You guys would be a lot better off if you stopped paying attention to those morons.

Giannis is a mortal lock. There's zero chance he doesn't win it again.

I mean sure, its not like their analysis is to be taken seriously, especially by the RealGM crowd. The problem is some of these people are actually MVP award voters. And they are deciding ahead of time who they want to win the award and trying to push that narrative around the media world despite reality. I think if LeBron does anything great in the remaining games they are going to try as hard as they can to push the sympathy vote and that is really disgusting as a diehard basketball fan.

I can't even imagine the chatter if the Lakers beat the Bucks Friday. Can guarantee most of the media will try to argue LeBron as the MVP frontrunner.

"Most" of the media? Hot take artists, maybe, but otherwise I don't believe that at all. Giannis is going to win by a landslide.

[SeniorWalker]

You guys would be a lot better off if you stopped paying attention to those morons.

Giannis is a mortal lock. There's zero chance he doesn't win it again.

I mean sure, its not like their analysis is to be taken seriously, especially by the RealGM crowd. The problem is some of these people are actually MVP award voters. And they are deciding ahead of time who they want to win the award and trying to push that narrative around the media world despite reality. I think if LeBron does anything great in the remaining games they are going to try as hard as they can to push the sympathy vote and that is really disgusting as a diehard basketball fan.

I can't even imagine the chatter if the Lakers beat the Bucks Friday. Can guarantee most of the media will try to argue LeBron as the MVP frontrunner.

"Most" of the media? Hot take artists, maybe, but otherwise I don't believe that at all. Giannis is going to win by a landslide.

I'm not saying I think LeBron is going to win. Giannis will. I'm saying that the media is pushing the narrative as hard as they possibly can. That alone is what is disgusting to me, because I've seen it on most major NBA shows recently. Giannis should go unanimous and if he doesn't get like 99% of the votes it will be irritating for me.

[Sedale Threatt]

I mean sure, its not like their analysis is to be taken seriously, especially by the RealGM crowd. The problem is some of these people are actually MVP award voters. And they are deciding ahead of time who they want to win the award and trying to push that narrative around the media world despite reality. I think if LeBron does anything great in the remaining games they are going to try as hard as they can to push the sympathy vote and that is really disgusting as a diehard basketball fan.

I can't even imagine the chatter if the Lakers beat the Bucks Friday. Can guarantee most of the media will try to argue LeBron as the MVP frontrunner.

"Most" of the media? Hot take artists, maybe, but otherwise I don't believe that at all. Giannis is going to win by a landslide.

I'm not saying I think LeBron is going to win. Giannis will. I'm saying that the media is pushing the narrative as hard as they possibly can. That alone is what is disgusting to me, because I've seen it on most major NBA shows recently. Giannis should go unanimous and if he doesn't get like 99% of the votes it will be irritating for me.

I guess. I was watching NBA TV today and both B-Shaw and Van Gundy were saying Giannis is a lock. Virtually everything I've read so far is along the same lines. You can't use a handful of dipsh*t hot take artists to speak for "the media."

[The Lazy Potato]

Giannis has now 13 games with at least 30 points 15 rebounds and 5 assists this season. The rest of the league combined has 10. No player has more than one.

Giannis 13
Jokic 1
AD 1
Lebron 1
KAT 1
Ingram 1
Randle 1
Luka 1
Harden 1
Siakam 1
Vucevic 1

Source: https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=season&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=30&c2stat=trb&c2comp=gt&c2val=15&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&order_by=pts

Not quite as good, but here's 40 pts, 5 rebs, 5 asts, 2 stls. One difference is that your list only has two guys who aren't a PF or C (Harden and Luka - and I guess LeBron is debatable), whereas this one includes all five positions.

Harden 8
Beal 2
Antetokounmpo 1
Booker 1
Davis 1
Doncic 1
George 1
Ingram 1
Jokic 1
Lillard 1
Middleton 1
Russell 1
Westbrook 1

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=career&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=40&c2stat=stl&c2comp=gt&c2val=2&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&c4stat=trb&c4comp=gt&c4val=5&order_by=pts

In my opinion 30-15-5 is more impressive stat line than 40-5-5. Also let's not ignore the fact that Giannis is average just 30 minutes play time. That's 5-6 minutes less than most of the other star players.

[scrabbarista]

Giannis has now 13 games with at least 30 points 15 rebounds and 5 assists this season. The rest of the league combined has 10. No player has more than one.

Giannis 13
Jokic 1
AD 1
Lebron 1
KAT 1
Ingram 1
Randle 1
Luka 1
Harden 1
Siakam 1
Vucevic 1

Source: https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=season&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=30&c2stat=trb&c2comp=gt&c2val=15&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&order_by=pts

Not quite as good, but here's 40 pts, 5 rebs, 5 asts, 2 stls. One difference is that your list only has two guys who aren't a PF or C (Harden and Luka - and I guess LeBron is debatable), whereas this one includes all five positions.

Harden 8
Beal 2
Antetokounmpo 1
Booker 1
Davis 1
Doncic 1
George 1
Ingram 1
Jokic 1
Lillard 1
Middleton 1
Russell 1
Westbrook 1

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=career&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=40&c2stat=stl&c2comp=gt&c2val=2&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&c4stat=trb&c4comp=gt&c4val=5&order_by=pts

In my opinion 30-15-5 is more impressive stat line than 40-5-5. Also let's not ignore the fact that Giannis is average just 30 minutes play time. That's 5-6 minutes less than most of the other star players.

If there's one thing no one in this thread is in danger of forgetting, it's that Giannis averages just 30 minutes per game. It's been mentioned about once every two pages for like the last 150 pages.

30-15-5 versus 40-5-5 is debatable and probably just a question of preference (it might also depend on efficiency, for example), but when you add the fact that I had to include 2 steals to get my results, even I admitted (it's right there! read it! "not quite as good") that your Antetokounmpo list is better than my Harden list. I was just wanting to get in on the fun and post an impressive Harden list. I wasn't saying it was better than your list.

[The Lazy Potato]

Not quite as good, but here's 40 pts, 5 rebs, 5 asts, 2 stls. One difference is that your list only has two guys who aren't a PF or C (Harden and Luka - and I guess LeBron is debatable), whereas this one includes all five positions.

Harden 8
Beal 2
Antetokounmpo 1
Booker 1
Davis 1
Doncic 1
George 1
Ingram 1
Jokic 1
Lillard 1
Middleton 1
Russell 1
Westbrook 1

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=career&year_min=2020&year_max=2020&is_playoffs=N&age_min=0&age_max=99&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts&c1comp=gt&c1val=40&c2stat=stl&c2comp=gt&c2val=2&c3stat=ast&c3comp=gt&c3val=5&c4stat=trb&c4comp=gt&c4val=5&order_by=pts

In my opinion 30-15-5 is more impressive stat line than 40-5-5. Also let's not ignore the fact that Giannis is average just 30 minutes play time. That's 5-6 minutes less than most of the other star players.

If there's one thing no one in this thread is in danger of forgetting, it's that Giannis averages just 30 minutes per game. It's been mentioned about once every two pages for like the last 150 pages.

30-15-5 versus 40-5-5 is debatable and probably just a question of preference (it might also depend on efficiency, for example), but when you add the fact that I had to include 2 steals to get my results, even I admitted (it's right there! read it! "not quite as good") that your Antetokounmpo list is better than my Harden list. I was just wanting to get in on the fun and post an impressive Harden list. I wasn't saying it was better than your list.

Sure, i understand. Fair enough..

[Ballerhogger]

Lebron with another triple double , no AD . Looked great today .

[greekbuck34]

Lebron just passed the "even more clearly second" Harden again.

[NyKnicks1714]

At this point LeBron is as clearly in 2nd as Giannis is in 1st.

[scrabbarista]

James Harden is beating LeBron James in 12 out of the top 14 advanced metrics and leads the league in 6 of them while LeBron's highest in any of them is third place.

LeBron has a great game.

RealGM: "LeBron's clearly higher than Harden."



Thanks, guys, for reminding me again why I don't participate in this thread anymore except to post my weekly rankings.

See y'all next Friday morning!

[KGtabake]

Siakam 3 last games: 21/7/4 in 39mins. 15/58 from the field.
3 defeats.
If he isn't shooting well, the Raps can't win. Something to keep an eye on in the postseason.
He ain't ready to be the A option yet, imo.

[truly]

Siakam 3 last games: 21/7/4 in 39mins. 15/58 from the field.
3 defeats.
If he isn't shooting well, the Raps can't win. Something to keep an eye on in the postseason.
He ain't ready to be the A option yet, imo.

This is what has happened to him all season.Took a bigger role(more usg and shots) and his %s are way down.Last time i checked his ts% was below league average.

[Homer38]

James Harden is beating LeBron James in 12 out of the top 14 advanced metrics and leads the league in 6 of them while LeBron's highest in any of them is third place.

LeBron has a great game.

RealGM: "LeBron's clearly higher than Harden."



Thanks, guys, for reminding me again why I don't participate in this thread anymore except to post my weekly rankings.

See y'all next Friday morning!

I don't even know if Harden is the best player of the Rockets right now!

[scrabbarista]

James Harden is beating LeBron James in 12 out of the top 14 advanced metrics and leads the league in 6 of them while LeBron's highest in any of them is third place.

LeBron has a great game.

RealGM: "LeBron's clearly higher than Harden."



Thanks, guys, for reminding me again why I don't participate in this thread anymore except to post my weekly rankings.

See y'all next Friday morning!

I don't even know if Harden is the best player of the Rockets right now!

Not my fault!

[scrabbarista]

Players to average 34.8 or better on .620 TS% or better in NBA history:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&per_minute_base=36&per_poss_base=100&type=advanced&season_start=1&season_end=-1&lg_id=NBA&age_min=0&age_max=99&is_playoffs=N&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&as_comp=gt&as_val=0&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts_per_g&c1comp=gt&c1val=34.8&c2stat=ts_pct&c2comp=gt&c2val=.620&order_by=ws

Spoiler:

It's Just 2020 Harden. And before you say, "It's only scoring!" that's the point: the more stats you add, the easier it is to exclude other players from your list. He's the single best combo of PPG and TS% in NBA history... and "who's the best player on the team?" is getting And1's.

[Homer38]

Players to average 34.8 or better on .620 TS% or better in NBA history:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&per_minute_base=36&per_poss_base=100&type=advanced&season_start=1&season_end=-1&lg_id=NBA&age_min=0&age_max=99&is_playoffs=N&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&as_comp=gt&as_val=0&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&pos_is_f=Y&pos_is_fg=Y&pos_is_fc=Y&pos_is_c=Y&pos_is_cf=Y&c1stat=pts_per_g&c1comp=gt&c1val=34.8&c2stat=ts_pct&c2comp=gt&c2val=.620&order_by=ws

Spoiler:

It's Just 2020 Harden. And before you say, "It's only scoring!" that's the point: the more stats you add, the easier it is to exclude other players from your list. He's the single best combo of PPG and TS% in NBA history... and "who's the best player on the team?" is getting And1's.

Problem is that Harden has never been great (for a superstars standard) in the playoffs.Harden can have the numbers he wants in the regular season, but if he doesn't dominate in the playoffs, his numbers in the regular season mean nothing

I'm not asking Harden to win the title, but just being dominant when it matter the most.

[scrabbarista]

James Harden is beating LeBron James in 12 out of the top 14 advanced metrics and leads the league in 6 of them while LeBron's highest in any of them is third place.

LeBron has a great game.

RealGM: "LeBron's clearly higher than Harden."



Thanks, guys, for reminding me again why I don't participate in this thread anymore except to post my weekly rankings.

See y'all next Friday morning!

I don't even know if Harden is the best player of the Rockets right now!

Not my fault!

Okay, I'll help you out.

I'll leave out stats where they're tied. For this season:

PPG - Harden
3P% - Harden
FT% - Harden
2P% - Harden
APG - Harden
BPG - Harden
ORtg - Harden
PER - Harden
TS% - Harden
WS - Harden
WS/48 - Harden
OWS - Harden
DWS - Harden
DBPM - Harden
OBPM - Harden
BPM - Harden
VORP - Harden
PIPM - Harden
PIPM WINS - Harden
RPM - Harden
ORPM - Harden
DRPM - Harden
RPM WINS - Harden
RAPTOR - Harden
RAPTOR WAR - Harden
PIE - Harden
OnCourt - Harden
On-Off - Harden

FG% - Westbrook
RPG - Westbrook

PS Only one of these guys has been getting double teamed every other game all season.