MVP Discussion [19/20] [part II] - voting opened

Vlade Divac · Post #1261 » by **Vlade Divac** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:01 pm

Hey ESPN why not use argument for "LeBron is MVP" that he is very good husband and never cheated on his wife. Also when he was really young he helped older neighbours cross the street.

Wooderson · Post #1262 » by **Wooderson** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:07 pm

What's interesting is how the on/off numbers have changed in 2020.

Since Jan 1st:

Giannis on: +16.3, off: -0.6: on/off diff = +16.9.
LeBron on: +10.7, off: +0.6 on/off diff = +10.1

Since Feb 1st:

Giannis on: +21.7, off = -5.1: on/off diff = +26.8 (13 points higher than any other players differential)
LeBron on: +10.3, off: +4.8: on/off diff = +5.8

Bucks have been medicore to bad without Giannis for awhile now after being really good without him the first two months. Despite that Giannis on court numbers have actually increased.

Homer38 · Post #1263 » by **Homer38** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:02 pm

Read on Twitter

mademan · Post #1264 » by **mademan** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:17 pm

AussieCeltic wrote:I suggest we got back and look at the month to month voting as most people seemed to have forgotten what happened before the weekend.

November
Giannis - 32%
Lebron - 24%
Doncic - 22%
Harden - 7%

December
Giannis - 51%
Doncic - 24%
Lebron - 11%
Harden - 5%

Jan
Giannis - 53%
Doncic - 17%
Lebron - 12%
Harden - 11%

Feb
Giannis - 62%
Harden - 12%
Lebron - 10%
Davis 6%

According to the posters on here, Giannis has this on lock

Lets not act like nothing has changed since then. Giannis was on pace for 70 wins and the best PER ever. The Bucks were also about to finish like 5 games ahead of the Lakers. Now theres a real chance Lakers end up with the best record. Like it or not, but if Lebron and the Lakers end up ahead of Giannis and the Bucks, thats gonna change some votes.

Ron Swanson · Post #1265 » by **Ron Swanson** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:28 pm

Giannis basically needing to have arguably the greatest regular season ever (break the PER record + 70-wins) for him to be a "lock" is proving how desperate people are for this to become a "debate". Quoting moron ESPN casuals like Nick Wright is only making it more clear.

mademan · Post #1266 » by **mademan** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:38 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:Giannis basically needing to have arguably the greatest regular season ever (break the PER record + 70-wins) for him to be a "lock" is proving how desperate people are for this to become a "debate". Quoting moron ESPN casuals like Nick Wright is only making it more clear.

He doesnt need to win 70. He needs the best record. The better player who's had the better RS has lost many times to the best player on the best team in the league. It's very far from unheard of.

The High Cyde · Post #1267 » by **The High Cyde** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:12 pm

It's still Giannis for now. All bets are off if the Lakers finish with a better record. Both players are deserving of the award, and they are both dominating the league in their own ways. Still, to me what LBJ is doing is much more impressive, and maybe the people with actual votes might feel the same way.

And LOL at all the salty Bron haters, living in your head rent free huh? Thought he'd be dead in the water by now at this point in his career? FOH

clyde21 · Post #1268 » by **clyde21** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:16 pm

why the **** is Nick Wright being referenced in this thread? that clown has his head so far up LeBron's ass he can't even see his own big ass nose.

Dupp · Post #1269 » by **Dupp** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:15 pm

It’s gonna be hilarious if lebron wins. So many people having meltdowns already and he’s only just got a very small chance.

Dupp · Post #1270 » by **Dupp** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:20 pm

Lebron has been a clear number two for at least two months now. Realistically he’s been clearly second all year but early on people were ignoring team record thinking it might even out. But harden and donics team have never come close.

limbo · Post #1271 » by **limbo** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:32 pm

I wonder if LeBron senses blood and will go gunning for it. When he's locked in like he has been this week the Lakers are very hard to beat. I think he'll try to carry this momentum into the next two weeks of games, which feature probably the toughest stretch of games for the Lakers to close out this year, and go from there... It depends also on how well Milwaukee does.

Ainosterhaspie · Post #1272 » by **Ainosterhaspie** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:51 pm

Listen everyone. It's time to shut this thread down and ban any future attempts at similar threads until the season is over. Giannis has won the MVP award fair and square by playing 75% of the season. This is not an award for the full season, just the first 50-75% of it, so further discussion serves no purpose.

As I said, Giannis has clearly won this already. Any statements to the contrary are merely stanning and trolling. Now since I've stated an irrefutable fact, that Giannis has already irrevocably earned this award, and supported it with the unassailable logic of labeling anyone who has the temerity to suggest otherwise a "stan" (i.e. a murderous obsessive stalker) there is no point in further discussion and certainly no reason to address anything that the stans actually say especially since mischaracterizing their arguments and attributing fictitious statements or statements made by others to them is so much easier. Since everyone agreeing with me that Giannis is the MVP doesnt make for particularly interesting discussion, and since saying anything else is stanning and trolling, it's time as I said above to shut down this thread as it's clearly outlived its usefulness.

scrabbarista · Post #1273 » by **scrabbarista** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:05 pm

clyde21 wrote:why the **** is Nick Wright being referenced in this thread? that clown has his head so far up LeBron's ass he can't even see his own big ass nose.

Point taken, but quoting the poll results from this thread is even worse.

Post #1274 » by **ken6199** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:23 pm

Your performance on final 1/4 of the season outweights the previous 3/4. By how much?
Your performance on late season national TV outweights the earlier, non national TV games. Again by how much?

If I have to put numbers, I say 2:1 and 4:1. Not something I agree with, it's something I think it is happening from years of experience. It's been that way for so many years on so many other things.

We have to accept that as a reality that recency bias and kneejerk is an integral part of this MVP race whether you like it or not.

scrabbarista · Post #1275 » by **scrabbarista** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:42 pm

ken6199 wrote:Your performance on final 1/4 of the season outweights the previous 3/4. By how much?
Your performance on late season national TV outweights the earlier, non national TV games. Again by how much?

If I have to put numbers, I say 2:1 and 4:1. Not something I agree with, it's something I think it is happening from years of experience. It's been that way for so many years on so many other things.

We have to accept that as a reality that recency bias and kneejerk is an integral part of this MVP race whether you like it or not.

AussieCeltic · Post #1276 » by **AussieCeltic** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:40 pm

Serious question here.

Has a player ever won MVP while not being the leader of the major stats for his own team?

AD is leading in PER, TS, WS, WS/48, ORTG, DRTG, as well as PPG, RPG, and BPG.

mademan · Post #1277 » by **mademan** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:50 pm

AussieCeltic wrote:Serious question here.

Has a player ever won MVP while not being the leader of the major stats for his own team?

AD is leading in PER, TS, WS, WS/48, ORTG, DRTG, as well as PPG, RPG, and BPG.

Nash-Amare

Homer38 · Post #1278 » by **Homer38** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:51 pm

AussieCeltic wrote:Serious question here.

Has a player ever won MVP while not being the leader of the major stats for his own team?

AD is leading in PER, TS, WS, WS/48, ORTG, DRTG, as well as PPG, RPG, and BPG.

Most of his stats are close except for the assist per game...

Dupp · Post #1279 » by **Dupp** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:57 pm

Homer38 wrote:
AussieCeltic wrote:Serious question here.

Has a player ever won MVP while not being the leader of the major stats for his own team?

AD is leading in PER, TS, WS, WS/48, ORTG, DRTG, as well as PPG, RPG, and BPG.

Most of his stats are close except for the assist per game...

And how the team and nearly every single player performs with AD compared to lebron.

AD is great and legit his best teammate ever but lebrons clearly the better player. Which is no slight to AD

Ainosterhaspie · Post #1280 » by **Ainosterhaspie** » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:38 pm

ken6199 wrote:Your performance on final 1/4 of the season outweights the previous 3/4. By how much?
Your performance on late season national TV outweights the earlier, non national TV games. Again by how much?

If I have to put numbers, I say 2:1 and 4:1. Not something I agree with, it's something I think it is happening from years of experience. It's been that way for so many years on so many other things.

We have to accept that as a reality that recency bias and kneejerk is an integral part of this MVP race whether you like it or not.

It's not just that though. Let's say you give a guy to 10 MVP points per game for his performance. Player A plays 65 games and gets a perfect 10 every single game. He's earned 650 MVP points. Impressive. Player B earns 9 points every single game and plays 75 games. He may not seem as impressive each game, but by showing up more consistently he earns 675 MVP points and deserves the award. As the cliche goes, "the most important ability is availability".

Voters should be careful not to overly weight laye season surges, but they also shouldn't determine a winner before the races cross the finish line. Early leads can be lost. And not just because of injury. Someone may come out hot, but not pace properly and run out of steam while another racer comes out at a controlled pace and finishes stronger.

Giannis has a sizable lead, but there are starting to be questions about how well he can maintain the pace.

Who is your pick for the 2019-20 MVP?