Shams: The season is suspended / Coronavirus Thread

[EAS Law]

I really don't see how "PC culture" has anything to do with being precautionary. If I hear about snowflakes and the coronavirus I will roll my eyes so far in the back my head. It's just reckless to spread something to players and fans if they know one of their own has it and there's a two week period where you have no idea if you have it or not... regardless if isn't going to kill 90% of the people that has it, it's still something that should be taken seriously.

PC culture in the sense of a bunch of Karens that need to speak to the manager would demand that the NBA shut it down. I’m not going into snowflakes and whatnot.

Again, I think this is ridiculous because cases of TB or Measles or something are far more contagious but because this is new, everyone is losing their minds. COVID 19 is more lethal than the common flu, but not by much

Plus we can narrow down who is most at risk. It isn’t like this is going to wipe out a bunch of otherwise very healthy people. Remember swine flu? Same thing.

Your stance here is not going to age well. That is all I'll say, I'm not looking to change your mind.

Well hive-minded opinions always age well so enjoy your team I suppose. I’m not really concerned about what an armchair physician thinks about things they couldn’t comprehend with all of the data in front of them due to lack of critical thinking and analysis of numbers.

[tiderulz]

lol, and someone talked about my arrogance

[EAS Law]

lol, and someone talked about my arrogance

And your incessant need to search for fights and arguments with snide contrarian posts. Yes dude, you’re as arrogant as they come and inject yourself into everything you can to disagree for the sake of disagreeing. Prime example here.

[tiderulz]

lol, and someone talked about my arrogance

And your incessant need to search for fights and arguments with snide contrarian posts. Yes dude, you’re as arrogant as they come and inject yourself into everything you can to disagree for the sake of disagreeing. Prime example here.

maybe i do come into conversations. I do not believe I am always looking for a fight, but maybe it is something to consider.

but you seriously need to look in the mirror yourself. Your comments on this topic are prime examples.

this is not business as usual. There is no vaccine or cure for this. this is going to affect the entire globe, we will all be exposed to it within 6-9 months. that isnt panic, that isnt exaggeration, its just logic and facts. not saying people should panic, but they need to take it seriously. From your views, it doesnt sound like you have a family of your own. Maybe i am wrong and if so, i apologize. The last thing i want to happen is not take this seriously and then have to visit a hospital later because i didnt take it seriously and brought it home to my family, my kids and wife.

[pepe1991]

Swine influenza happend to my class during our highschool graduation trip in 2009 to Spain. It was not fabricated by media.
From bus of 60 of us, 45 people got it. I was lucky enough to be among 15 healthy. I always wonder why it was a case. I had antibiotics few weeks before trip and during first night of 7 days trip i felt like crap and instad of going out, i elected to sleep it over. Others got wasted first day, second day and by third whole situation become serious.

Within next 3,4 days class members with 40 degree celsius (104 degrees Fahrenheit) started to pop . They were not just sick from normal flue, it was incredibly bad, as they had basically yellow- white skin and one was delusional and mentally complete out of his element.


We were school bus of healthy 17 years old kids. Now, what would happen if that bus was mixed with group of elder, 70 years old people? Could they pull it through 3-4-5 days of super high body temperature?

[EAS Law]

lol, and someone talked about my arrogance

And your incessant need to search for fights and arguments with snide contrarian posts. Yes dude, you’re as arrogant as they come and inject yourself into everything you can to disagree for the sake of disagreeing. Prime example here.

maybe i do come into conversations. I do not believe I am always looking for a fight, but maybe it is something to consider.

but you seriously need to look in the mirror yourself. Your comments on this topic are prime examples.

As soon as someone here presented me with credible source information, I read through it and respectfully responded—I even learned something and stated the same.

My point this entire time has been that while this situation isn’t “nothing”, shutting down entire countries, cities, market crashes, shutting down sports leagues, etc. seems a bit much in response to something that is marginally more dangerous than something that frankly is not dangerous to most people in society as we know it now.

I don’t want anyone to lose loved ones or be harmed, nor am I denying the importance of understanding COVID 19 and developing ways to combat it—I’m saying that people are treating this like it’s the apocalypse and I recall this same or a similar reaction to Swine Flu, H1N1, a while back. I respond to people the way they approach me here honestly—and in retrospect, I don’t want friction with you man, so I apologize for being aggressive myself. We have enough of there here just talking sports.

I am not an MD, but I am with one and she and I talk about these things often. From what I understand, we do not know enough about infection versus mortality rates, demographics, etc. to make a firm determination about much. What I hear from her and her colleagues is that the panic has had a detrimental impact on healthcare providers due to panicked responses by the public.

[tiderulz]

And your incessant need to search for fights and arguments with snide contrarian posts. Yes dude, you’re as arrogant as they come and inject yourself into everything you can to disagree for the sake of disagreeing. Prime example here.

maybe i do come into conversations. I do not believe I am always looking for a fight, but maybe it is something to consider.

but you seriously need to look in the mirror yourself. Your comments on this topic are prime examples.

As soon as someone here presented me with credible source information, I read through it and respectfully responded—I even learned something and stated the same.

My point this entire time has been that while this situation isn’t “nothing”, shutting down entire countries, cities, market crashes, shutting down sports leagues, etc. seems a bit much in response to something that is marginally more dangerous than something that frankly is not dangerous to most people in society as we know it now.

I don’t want anyone to lose loved ones or be harmed, nor am I denying the importance of understanding COVID 19 and developing ways to combat it—I’m saying that people are treating this like it’s the apocalypse and I recall this same or a similar reaction to Swine Flu, H1N1, a while back. I respond to people the way they approach me here honestly.

so what people do you respect their opinions of? How about Anthony Fauci, the head of National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.

“I mean, people always say, well, the flu does this, the flu does that,” Fauci said. “The flu has a mortality of 0.1 percent. This has a mortality rate of 10 times that. That’s the reason I want to emphasize we have to stay ahead of the game in preventing this."

Fauci returned to the comparison at another point, noting that even when mortality rates are factored in, the problem with the novel coronavirus is in the number of people who could be afflicted. He again noted that the novel coronavirus “is 10 times more lethal than the seasonal flu.”

At another point, he was asked whether the worst was yet to come. He said directly, “Yes, yes it is.”

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/anthony-fauci-undercuts-trump-on-the-flu-and-other-coronavirus-assertions/ar-BB113lLV?li=BBnbcA1

[MagicFan101]

Here in Spain, like in Italy, we reacted too slowly to the initial cases of the virus. Now the growth is exponential. We're at 2.6 further infections per person infected, which needs to be under 1 for the health system not to collapse. The only way to achieve that is social distancing and improved personal hygiene.
A little too late, all public events, sporting events and now schools are suspended until further notice. As a company owner, we're beginning work from home procedures from Monday.

In the US, this will spread quickly and cause a lot of deaths without similar measures ASAP. i don't know how the lack of universal healthcare and tests/treatments possibly not being free to all will affect the spread, but I imagine it can't help.

This virus won't be beaten until a vaccine or very good antiviral is found. Until then, it's a case of keeping the rate of infection down so the health system can cope.

Incredibly well said. I’m disappointed there aren’t more and-1’s for this.

[spinedoc]

That was good information.

I was surprised to see that the highest number of cases were in those aged 30-65. That does affect a lot of people that I wouldn’t have suspected. I suppose that also incorporates those that are most commonly in contact with others and those are cases of not deaths caused by.

Because it’s so new, I do see the reason to take precautions and be aware of it generally. I think Bensational summarized it best in his post here.

I’m still not seeing anything that I think is especially alarming, and I think that the statistics are being viewed in a light most favorable to panic because that’s what the media would like to do to keep you glued to their 24/7 coverage, but that was a good source with good info.

I couldn't read anymore without commenting after this. This mindset is so dangerous right now. Not being able to believe in the media or discern truth is reckless. The same goes for anti-government views that I keep hearing consistently. Instead of discounting information from others, you could take this time to go educate yourself on the facts. Even when presented with more information, you have to take a shot at the media. Maybe you shouldn't avoid information based on some illogical inherent bias. The problem is, someone else may be persuaded by your lazy argument and not check the facts as well. This is what I fear of spreading, ignorance. This coronavirus is brand new to mankind and none of us have been exposed to it. None of us have built up antigens, not to mention that it is highly contagious. Its not super deadly like Ebola, but many will get it if exposed. It is 10 times more deadly than Influenza and much more contagious. Thank goodness that it doesn't effect children as much, but the elderly is at serious risk. Its not panic, its rational fear and human nature. I have to combat this attitude all day in my practice, I suppose it wouldn't be much different on a basketball website. Quit cursing the darkness people, and please simply light a candle.

Thank you for your holier than thou approach and your input as an ortho.

Skepticism about the media is reckless? Really? Did you even read the information provided? Because it’s a general overview of what’s mostly known already with some additional information—nothing that supports an idea that this is some death sentence virus or something to be terrified about. I’m simply looking at data to “educate myself” and coming to the conclusion that it does not warrant the widespread panic that’s occurring.

You’re right that we don’t yet have vaccines and antivirals to combat this one yet, but the facts also indicate that it’s possible for natural immune responses to prevail. This virus isn’t “nothing” but it does not warrant the panic. Get over yourself please. FWIW your response seems pretty lazy to me as well.

Projection isn't going to get you out of this one. Its your response that is knee jerk and reactionary, not the other way around. Its not the media trying to sell more soda here. Its an inherent bias that has you discounting the "media" like its all the same. There is a big chasm in that one word that you so loosely throw out. I am a big believer in the fact that inherent immunity is a big factor here. My profession is predicated on that philosophy actually. There is a reason why not everyone in a room gets an illness when someone opens a vial from the lab. Pasteur himself said on his death bed that it wasn't the virus, but rather the medium on which it grows as being the most important factor. My holier than though attitude, as you put it, comes from years of education and experience. Its probably why you have such issues with portals of information. because like too many, you think you know more than you actually do. Now, you have a nice day.

[sChOlaRlY_Magi]

I'll go with the infectious disease MDs opinion over your girlfriend's. Ask her next time how many different specific fields of medicine there are and what particular field they are in. I'm not going to take advice from a lawnmower or small engine mechanic on how to work on my airplane, and then act like a smug a-hole about it in a public forum, but sure, you do you...

[EAS Law]

maybe i do come into conversations. I do not believe I am always looking for a fight, but maybe it is something to consider.

but you seriously need to look in the mirror yourself. Your comments on this topic are prime examples.

As soon as someone here presented me with credible source information, I read through it and respectfully responded—I even learned something and stated the same.

My point this entire time has been that while this situation isn’t “nothing”, shutting down entire countries, cities, market crashes, shutting down sports leagues, etc. seems a bit much in response to something that is marginally more dangerous than something that frankly is not dangerous to most people in society as we know it now.

I don’t want anyone to lose loved ones or be harmed, nor am I denying the importance of understanding COVID 19 and developing ways to combat it—I’m saying that people are treating this like it’s the apocalypse and I recall this same or a similar reaction to Swine Flu, H1N1, a while back. I respond to people the way they approach me here honestly.

so what people do you respect their opinions of? How about Anthony Fauci, the head of National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.

“I mean, people always say, well, the flu does this, the flu does that,” Fauci said. “The flu has a mortality of 0.1 percent. This has a mortality rate of 10 times that. That’s the reason I want to emphasize we have to stay ahead of the game in preventing this."

Fauci returned to the comparison at another point, noting that even when mortality rates are factored in, the problem with the novel coronavirus is in the number of people who could be afflicted. He again noted that the novel coronavirus “is 10 times more lethal than the seasonal flu.”

At another point, he was asked whether the worst was yet to come. He said directly, “Yes, yes it is.”

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/anthony-fauci-undercuts-trump-on-the-flu-and-other-coronavirus-assertions/ar-BB113lLV?li=BBnbcA1

I edited my last so I’ll say it here too—

I don’t mean for there to be friction and I apologize for coming across aggressively too.

Yes, 10x mortality rate sounds bad, but when you consider that’s 1% (according to the quote) I question what that really means for most of society and everyday life.

I respect people’s opinions on things without them being the head of X or director of Y, it’s when you’re sort of being attacked based on echoes of prevailing narratives rather than analyzing data and asking questions to be sure the data is in context.

[sChOlaRlY_Magi]

If you analyzed the data you'd be scared... My trade is analyzing data so...

[EAS Law]

I'll go with the infectious disease MDs opinion over your girlfriends. Ask her next time how many different specific fields of medicine there are and what particular field they are in. I'm not going to use a lawnmower or small engine mechanic to work on my airplane, and then act like a smug a-hole about it in a public forum, but sure, you do you...

You keep letting people know what will and will not age well with your advanced knowledge

[sChOlaRlY_Magi]

Mmmkay

[Optimus_Steel]

Here in Spain, like in Italy, we reacted too slowly to the initial cases of the virus. Now the growth is exponential. We're at 2.6 further infections per person infected, which needs to be under 1 for the health system not to collapse. The only way to achieve that is social distancing and improved personal hygiene.
A little too late, all public events, sporting events and now schools are suspended until further notice. As a company owner, we're beginning work from home procedures from Monday.

In the US, this will spread quickly and cause a lot of deaths without similar measures ASAP. i don't know how the lack of universal healthcare and tests/treatments possibly not being free to all will affect the spread, but I imagine it can't help.

This virus won't be beaten until a vaccine or very good antiviral is found. Until then, it's a case of keeping the rate of infection down so the health system can cope.

Interesting point about the lack of universal healthcare in the US, it has the potential to be major a disaster going forward and extrapolate the infections. Think about this, business are already getting hit and are cutting hours or laying off people, this is happening right now as I've heard of several companies locally already doing this and it hasn't even been that long. All those people that have healthcare thru their employer and now lost their jobs also lost their healthcare coverage for not just themselves but potentially they spouses and children. Not only that but 10's of millions are uninsured or have deductibles so high before insurance starts paying that they would be terrified to seek treatment or testing for lack of funds and with most living paycheck to paycheck that's a major problem. And people have the temerity to say that single payer healthcare system would take away freedoms and is too expensive (on average other countries with universal healthcare pay half as much per person as us in the US do and they are able to cover every single person unlike here)...sad it may take a pandemic like this for US citizens to realize that the US needs a single payer system. May we be able to weather this virus with the least amount of death and damage as possible.

Edit: to add, I just heard people who have health insurance who were proactive in trying to get tested for the virus because they felt sick and their insurance company refused to pay for the test........you think some people would think twice about getting tested if their health insurance is not covering??? What an insane healthcare system we have.

[EAS Law]

I couldn't read anymore without commenting after this. This mindset is so dangerous right now. Not being able to believe in the media or discern truth is reckless. The same goes for anti-government views that I keep hearing consistently. Instead of discounting information from others, you could take this time to go educate yourself on the facts. Even when presented with more information, you have to take a shot at the media. Maybe you shouldn't avoid information based on some illogical inherent bias. The problem is, someone else may be persuaded by your lazy argument and not check the facts as well. This is what I fear of spreading, ignorance. This coronavirus is brand new to mankind and none of us have been exposed to it. None of us have built up antigens, not to mention that it is highly contagious. Its not super deadly like Ebola, but many will get it if exposed. It is 10 times more deadly than Influenza and much more contagious. Thank goodness that it doesn't effect children as much, but the elderly is at serious risk. Its not panic, its rational fear and human nature. I have to combat this attitude all day in my practice, I suppose it wouldn't be much different on a basketball website. Quit cursing the darkness people, and please simply light a candle.

Thank you for your holier than thou approach and your input as an ortho.

Skepticism about the media is reckless? Really? Did you even read the information provided? Because it’s a general overview of what’s mostly known already with some additional information—nothing that supports an idea that this is some death sentence virus or something to be terrified about. I’m simply looking at data to “educate myself” and coming to the conclusion that it does not warrant the widespread panic that’s occurring.

You’re right that we don’t yet have vaccines and antivirals to combat this one yet, but the facts also indicate that it’s possible for natural immune responses to prevail. This virus isn’t “nothing” but it does not warrant the panic. Get over yourself please. FWIW your response seems pretty lazy to me as well.

Projection isn't going to get you out of this one. Its your response that is knee jerk and reactionary, not the other way around. Its not the media trying to sell more soda here. Its an inherent bias that has you discounting the "media" like its all the same. There is a big chasm in that one word that you so loosely throw out. I am a big believer in the fact that inherent immunization is a big factor here. My profession is predicated on that philosophy actually. There is a reason why not everyone in a room gets an illness when someone opens a vial from the lab. Pasteur himself said on his death bed that it wasn't the virus, but rather the medium on which it grows as being the most important factor. My holier than though attitude, as you put it, comes from years of education and experience. Its probably why you have such issues with portals of information. because like too many, you think you know more than you actually do. Now, you have a nice day.

I’m actually pretty receptive to information when presented from credible sources and when looking at things in context. In the interest of self-preservation, why would I deny fact that something is dangerous?

Forgive my lack of clarity here, but are you saying that the people that have survived infection simply have an inherent immune response to this virus? Can you explain what you mean by inherent immunity?

My years of experience tend to focus on analyzing information to best put things in context before making decisions or drawing conclusions. I know that you have exposure to many disciplines throughout your career—I’m trying to understand why I’m apparently so off on this.

[MagicFan101]

If you analyzed the data you'd be scared... My trade is analyzing data so...

Same.

Always scout the credentials of Medium authors but this one isn’t bad and the article itself is both well written and informative. ... although it might already be out of date after being published 2 days ago.

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca


This points to some of the first cities / counties hit and shows why arguments like “few are being impacted so don’t do anything” are simply the wrong way to think about this if we want to avoid being the next disaster state.

[sChOlaRlY_Magi]

Here in Spain, like in Italy, we reacted too slowly to the initial cases of the virus. Now the growth is exponential. We're at 2.6 further infections per person infected, which needs to be under 1 for the health system not to collapse. The only way to achieve that is social distancing and improved personal hygiene.
A little too late, all public events, sporting events and now schools are suspended until further notice. As a company owner, we're beginning work from home procedures from Monday.

In the US, this will spread quickly and cause a lot of deaths without similar measures ASAP. i don't know how the lack of universal healthcare and tests/treatments possibly not being free to all will affect the spread, but I imagine it can't help.

This virus won't be beaten until a vaccine or very good antiviral is found. Until then, it's a case of keeping the rate of infection down so the health system can cope.

Interesting point about the lack of universal healthcare in the US, it has the potential to be major a disaster going forward and extrapolate the infections. Think about this, business are already getting hit and are cutting hours or laying off people, this is happening right now as I've heard of several companies locally already doing this and it hasn't even been that long. All those people that have healthcare thru their employer and now lost their jobs also lost their healthcare coverage for not just themselves but potentially they spouses and children. Not only that but 10's of millions are uninsured or have deductibles so high before insurance starts paying that they would be terrified to seek treatment or testing for lack of funds and with most living paycheck to paycheck that's a major problem. And people have the temerity to say that single payer healthcare system would take away freedoms and is too expensive (on average other countries with universal healthcare pay half as much per person as us in the US do and they are able to cover every single person unlike here)...sad it may take a pandemic like this for US citizens to realize that the US needs a single payer system. May we be able to weather this virus with the least amount of death and damage as possible.

Not to mention the supply chains from China already being 6-8 weeks behind. It's not just panic buying... Its companies not being able to get more product out of China.

The fact that people don't realize how reliant we are to China, not just debt wise, but most importantly now - production of goods.

This will be an absolute nightmare if our administration continues to oversee this. Hopefully more and more companies will do the right thing. I doubt it though, especially in "Right to Work" states like TN and FL...

[nymets1]

I feel like when I had a cold or flu and I take medicine that it barely helps with the symptoms if at all. What I think helps me the most is getting all the vitamins and minerals and especially take a lot of (Vitamin C) which is the one for the immune system.

[spinedoc]

Thank you for your holier than thou approach and your input as an ortho.

Skepticism about the media is reckless? Really? Did you even read the information provided? Because it’s a general overview of what’s mostly known already with some additional information—nothing that supports an idea that this is some death sentence virus or something to be terrified about. I’m simply looking at data to “educate myself” and coming to the conclusion that it does not warrant the widespread panic that’s occurring.

You’re right that we don’t yet have vaccines and antivirals to combat this one yet, but the facts also indicate that it’s possible for natural immune responses to prevail. This virus isn’t “nothing” but it does not warrant the panic. Get over yourself please. FWIW your response seems pretty lazy to me as well.

Projection isn't going to get you out of this one. Its your response that is knee jerk and reactionary, not the other way around. Its not the media trying to sell more soda here. Its an inherent bias that has you discounting the "media" like its all the same. There is a big chasm in that one word that you so loosely throw out. I am a big believer in the fact that inherent immunization is a big factor here. My profession is predicated on that philosophy actually. There is a reason why not everyone in a room gets an illness when someone opens a vial from the lab. Pasteur himself said on his death bed that it wasn't the virus, but rather the medium on which it grows as being the most important factor. My holier than though attitude, as you put it, comes from years of education and experience. Its probably why you have such issues with portals of information. because like too many, you think you know more than you actually do. Now, you have a nice day.

I’m actually pretty receptive to information when presented from credible sources and when looking at things in context. In the interest of self-preservation, why would I deny fact that something is dangerous?

Forgive my lack of clarity here, but are you saying that the people that have survived infection simply have an inherent immune response to this virus? Can you explain what you mean by inherent immunity?

My years of experience tend to focus on analyzing information to best put things in context before making decisions or drawing conclusions. I know that you have exposure to many disciplines throughout your career—I’m trying to understand why I’m apparently so off on this.

Sure, a normal, healthy, functioning body can make an antigen when exposed to something foreign than itself. That antigen is a marker on the cell that allows your cells to attack and destroy it. Now, people with compromised immune systems can't do this very well for a variety of reasons. No one has ever been exposed to this before so we don't have what is called herd immunity. Its how a vaccine works as well. They give you a small dosage of whatever it is, and then your body will build up antibodies to it so it can fight the bug more successfully. Of course not getting the bug in the first place like washing your hands works so well, but being a healthy host also has a tremendous effect. Things like eating well, proper sleep, exercise, and even positive mental attitude can have a big effect on the margins. The virulence is one side of the equation, the medium being the other. For those of us that have had basic chemistry class, remember E-Coli for example. It will only grow on a certain type of agar, I think it was EMB if not mistaken. That's what Pasteur was saying when he revised his germ theory.