2020 Offseason Speculation, free agency, summer trades (keep draft prospect talk in draft thread)

[Fo-Real]

Oh so now y'all aboard the Wood train. Y'all can get in the caboose, cuz I don't remember any And-1's when I was posting to nobody about Wood over a month ago. (sorry for the salt, it's rare that I vocalize it)

BUT I ultimately concluded (as you all will in time...) that Wood's a fool's hope. DET (and their fans) love him and expect to roll out the red carpet this summer. They have more cap space than us, as well as a premier role for him. Because of our record, we can't even really offer him a better chance to win.

This is why you don't waste roster spaces on guys like Jared Harper. It's why you don't draft guys like Bender, Chriss and Jackson at the top of the lotto. How much better off would we have been giving their spots to Derrick Jones Jr., Danuel House, Christian Wood and Seth Curry? The Heat have built their rotation on undrafted players. I don't know why we haven't tried to fill out our bench doing the same.

I mentioned him A LOT in the past months. Honestly he disappointed me when we played them last though.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Oh so now y'all aboard the Wood train. Y'all can get in the caboose, cuz I don't remember any And-1's when I was posting to nobody about Wood over a month ago. (sorry for the salt, it's rare that I vocalize it)

BUT I ultimately concluded (as you all will in time...) that Wood's a fool's hope. DET (and their fans) love him and expect to roll out the red carpet this summer. They have more cap space than us, as well as a premier role for him. Because of our record, we can't even really offer him a better chance to win.

This is why you don't waste roster spaces on guys like Jared Harper. It's why you don't draft guys like Bender, Chriss and Jackson at the top of the lotto. How much better off would we have been giving their spots to Derrick Jones Jr., Danuel House, Christian Wood and Seth Curry? The Heat have built their rotation on undrafted players. I don't know why we haven't tried to fill out our bench doing the same.

I mentioned him A LOT in the past months. Honestly he disappointed me when we played them last though.

Disappointed you? How? Don't you recall that he was one of the three reasons the Pistons beat us (despite a monster first half from Ayton), with Derrick Rose and Brandon Knight being the others?

[lilfishi22]

He'd be the man in Detroit. He'd be 2nd at most with the Suns and more likely 3rd behind Book and Ayton.

A semi healthy Blake Griffin playing the same posistion making a **** ton of money begs to differ.

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

[Wilber85]

He'd be the man in Detroit. He'd be 2nd at most with the Suns and more likely 3rd behind Book and Ayton.

A semi healthy Blake Griffin playing the same posistion making a **** ton of money begs to differ.

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

Christian Wood wont move the needle. He isnt doing anything in Detroit but putting up empty stats.

Give me Mirotic for half the price of wood.

[ATTL]

NBA isn't drug testing while play is suspended. How long does it take to flush roids out of your system? Asking for a friend.

[sunskerr]

He'd be the man in Detroit. He'd be 2nd at most with the Suns and more likely 3rd behind Book and Ayton.

A semi healthy Blake Griffin playing the same posistion making a **** ton of money begs to differ.

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

Wood right now is definitely a better offensive player than Ayton. Maybe that changes after Ayton gets another offseason, but right now Wood is knocking down 3s and scoring off his teammates very efficiently. I also don't think Ayton has improved as much as people think on offense this past season; rather, it's his defense and rebounding that have improved.

[Cutter]

NBA isn't drug testing while play is suspended. How long does it take to flush roids out of your system? Asking for a friend.

We should ask Ayton, him being the resident expert and all.

[Wilber85]

A semi healthy Blake Griffin playing the same posistion making a **** ton of money begs to differ.

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

Wood right now is definitely a better offensive player than Ayton. Maybe that changes after Ayton gets another offseason, but right now Wood is knocking down 3s and scoring off his teammates very efficiently. I also don't think Ayton has improved as much as people think on offense this past season; rather, it's his defense and rebounding that have improved.

I would take Ayton over wood any day of the week. Ayton is more efficient offensively, more rebounds, better defense.

Wood at $20 mill for a 4 would be a waste, he won't move the needle. Someone has to score on that crappy pistons team.

[sunskerr]

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

Wood right now is definitely a better offensive player than Ayton. Maybe that changes after Ayton gets another offseason, but right now Wood is knocking down 3s and scoring off his teammates very efficiently. I also don't think Ayton has improved as much as people think on offense this past season; rather, it's his defense and rebounding that have improved.

I would take Ayton over wood any day of the week. Ayton is more efficient offensively, more rebounds, better defense.

Wood at $20 mill for a 4 would be a waste, he won't move the needle. Someone has to score on that crappy pistons team.

Lol ok whatever you say

[AtheJ415]

I know there aren't games on right now but some of this discussion is wack. Wood over Ayton? There isn't a person who works in the NBA who would choose him over Ayton. Not a one. $20+ mil for Wood is also insane. It could happen because this FA class is TERRIBLE, but he isn't worth that. Right now he's a dude putting up okay (not even high) volume numbers on a terrible team. You know who else did that? Marquise Chriss and countless other former Suns. Wood is okay, unlike Chriss, but he isn't some franchise cornerstone and shouldn't be paid one imo. He's a bottom tier starter right now at best, which is good for his age, but he isn't more than that. Not to mention the Knicks, who just love PFs, are targetting him. Let them overpay. You can't hand out a huge contract just because somebody is shooting well from 3 suddenly. It's just WAY too small a sample size.

He's averaging 13 and 6. His starter splits are -2.4 for Net Rtg. He hasn't proven he can even keep up his production with starter's minutes. His similarity scores are below:


Thru 3 Years Win Shares (Best to Worst)
Player Sim 1 2 3
Christian Wood 0.8 0.3 0.3
Michael Smith 88.9 0.7 0.3 0.3
Jamie Watson 81.8 0.8 0.3 0.1
Jerrod Mustaf 79.7 0.8 0.5 0.4
Cartier Martin 78.6 0.8 0.4 0.1
Bob Peterson 78.6 0.9 0.4 0.2
Scott Roth 77.1 0.7 0.3 0.1
Gene Guarilia 75.1 0.7 0.5 0.3
Brian Skinner 72.3 0.9 0.3 0.1
Bill Curley 71.8 0.7 0.5 0.2
Jeff Adrien 71.2 1.0 0.2 0.1


If we're picking where we are I expect us to target Toppin and get him. I'm fine opening up the draft by addressing PF in FA instead, but the odds of getting a PG we want at our spot are also small (Killian Hayes, Haliburton, LaMelo) unless we win the lottery.

Wood is somebody to keep an eye on, but let's not get carried away here. His numbers are no better than Dario's were in Philly overall. Any projection for this year is based on his hot shooting and the odds of him suddenly having become one of the best shooters in the league just aren't that high, and there just aren't that many guys who bounce around 5 teams in 4 seasons and turn into major players in this league. If you're paying $20 Mil the dude has to be an all-star caliber or close to it type of guy. So you'd have to be CERTAIN his hot shooting continues. I just don't think we should gamble our cap space on it unless FA and the draft fall to where we only need a PF and he's the best available.

[RedIndian]

Wood is fool's gold. Good stats on a very bad team, and on a very small sample size. Add his well reported character issues, and we should stay well away.

The surest indication that he won't be good value on a big contract is the fact that the Knicks are now interested in him.

[RedIndian]

I wonder if the Spurs would entertain a Cam Johnson for Derrick White trade?

They could with some young talent on the wings, and Cam is exactly the sort of player they'd develop well.

White is someone they might consider moving considering that they already have Dejounte and Lonnie Walker, and the fact that White is up for an extension next year.

White would be a massive upgrade for our bench, and someone we can consider as a long term PG after Rubio.

I like him a lot. Smart, efficient player who plays excellent defense. I think there's more development in him as a scorer too.

[nevetsov]

Oubre & Kaminsky (PO picked up) for Kleber, Delon Wright and Justin Jackson?

Fixes our godawful bench, with money left to retain Baynes and sign Kennard.

Rubio, Wright
Booker, Kennard
Bridges, Jackson
Kleber, Johnson
Ayton, Baynes

Dallas get the dynamic wing they need, and a balanced roster:

Luka, Brunson
Curry, Hardaway Jr
Oubre, Finney-S
Powell, Kaminsky
Portzingis, Boban

[alamin330]

A semi healthy Blake Griffin playing the same posistion making a **** ton of money begs to differ.

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

Wood right now is definitely a better offensive player than Ayton. Maybe that changes after Ayton gets another offseason, but right now Wood is knocking down 3s and scoring off his teammates very efficiently. I also don't think Ayton has improved as much as people think on offense this past season; rather, it's his defense and rebounding that have improved.

You wildin’

Wood is a product of being on a team that opponents don’t care about and defenses don’t game plan for. He’s trash. Pure and solid trash.

[Wilber85]

He'd be 2nd in Detroit I suppose

But he'd almost definitely be #2 in Phoenix and probably #3 given Ayton's profile as former #1 pick with the production, improvement and potential he has.

Wood right now is definitely a better offensive player than Ayton. Maybe that changes after Ayton gets another offseason, but right now Wood is knocking down 3s and scoring off his teammates very efficiently. I also don't think Ayton has improved as much as people think on offense this past season; rather, it's his defense and rebounding that have improved.

You wildin’

Wood is a product of being on a team that opponents don’t care about and defenses don’t game plan for. He’s trash. Pure and solid trash.

SUNSKERR would really take wood over Ayton. lol. I am wondering if he is part of this front office.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I know there aren't games on right now but some of this discussion is wack. Wood over Ayton? There isn't a person who works in the NBA who would choose him over Ayton. Not a one. $20+ mil for Wood is also insane. It could happen because this FA class is TERRIBLE, but he isn't worth that. Right now he's a dude putting up okay (not even high) volume numbers on a terrible team. You know who else did that? Marquise Chriss and countless other former Suns. Wood is okay, unlike Chriss, but he isn't some franchise cornerstone and shouldn't be paid one imo. He's a bottom tier starter right now at best, which is good for his age, but he isn't more than that. Not to mention the Knicks, who just love PFs, are targetting him. Let them overpay. You can't hand out a huge contract just because somebody is shooting well from 3 suddenly. It's just WAY too small a sample size.

He's averaging 13 and 6. His starter splits are -2.4 for Net Rtg. He hasn't proven he can even keep up his production with starter's minutes. His similarity scores are below:


Thru 3 Years Win Shares (Best to Worst)
Player Sim 1 2 3
Christian Wood 0.8 0.3 0.3
Michael Smith 88.9 0.7 0.3 0.3
Jamie Watson 81.8 0.8 0.3 0.1
Jerrod Mustaf 79.7 0.8 0.5 0.4
Cartier Martin 78.6 0.8 0.4 0.1
Bob Peterson 78.6 0.9 0.4 0.2
Scott Roth 77.1 0.7 0.3 0.1
Gene Guarilia 75.1 0.7 0.5 0.3
Brian Skinner 72.3 0.9 0.3 0.1
Bill Curley 71.8 0.7 0.5 0.2
Jeff Adrien 71.2 1.0 0.2 0.1


If we're picking where we are I expect us to target Toppin and get him. I'm fine opening up the draft by addressing PF in FA instead, but the odds of getting a PG we want at our spot are also small (Killian Hayes, Haliburton, LaMelo) unless we win the lottery.

Wood is somebody to keep an eye on, but let's not get carried away here. His numbers are no better than Dario's were in Philly overall. Any projection for this year is based on his hot shooting and the odds of him suddenly having become one of the best shooters in the league just aren't that high, and there just aren't that many guys who bounce around 5 teams in 4 seasons and turn into major players in this league. If you're paying $20 Mil the dude has to be an all-star caliber or close to it type of guy. So you'd have to be CERTAIN his hot shooting continues. I just don't think we should gamble our cap space on it unless FA and the draft fall to where we only need a PF and he's the best available.

I admit that I have not examined Wood's advanced stats this season. I just know what I've seen, and what I've seen this season is great play, and advanced stats can't dissuade from noticing all the traditional metrics, by which measure he's been great. I beg you to consider the fact that the people who've watched him all season - DET fans - are eager to re-sign him and view him as a long-term cornerstone. Doesn't really matter. Reportedly, the Knicks are enamored with him, too. I don't think it's likely we'll be able to win a bidding war.

I also don't think it's likely Toppin falls to us. If he does - amazing. Great. I'll take a poor man's Amare, just like I'd take a poor man's Marion (Bey).

[alamin330]

You know things are bad when people are talking about other teams' trash players as a hopeful free agent signing. Some of you have extremely low expectations. Christian Wood is a fringe NBA player. He's averaging 13 ppg because no one guards him. I don't think anyone plays any defense when they play the Pistons. Come on man let's get it together.

[MrMiyagi]

You know things are bad when people are talking about other teams' trash players as a hopeful free agent signing. Some of you have extremely low expectations. Christian Wood is a fringe NBA player. He's averaging 13 ppg because no one guards him. I don't think anyone plays any defense when they play the Pistons. Come on man let's get it together.

Welcome to the Suns board - it's what we do.

[ATTL]

Oh so now y'all aboard the Wood train. Y'all can get in the caboose, cuz I don't remember any And-1's when I was posting to nobody about Wood over a month ago. (sorry for the salt, it's rare that I vocalize it)

BUT I ultimately concluded (as you all will in time...) that Wood's a fool's hope. DET (and their fans) love him and expect to roll out the red carpet this summer. They have more cap space than us, as well as a premier role for him. Because of our record, we can't even really offer him a better chance to win.

This is why you don't waste roster spaces on guys like Jared Harper. It's why you don't draft guys like Bender, Chriss and Jackson at the top of the lotto. How much better off would we have been giving their spots to Derrick Jones Jr., Danuel House, Christian Wood and Seth Curry? The Heat have built their rotation on undrafted players. I don't know why we haven't tried to fill out our bench doing the same.

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1374017&p=43435609&hilit=Wood#p43435609


I was trying to find old posts of mine about christian wood to show that I liked him for years but couldn't find any.

[sunskerr]

I said Wood is better than Ayton offensively, and in my longer Christian Wood post I provided good evidence for that. If you want to take that and run with "I'll take Wood over Ayton in general", why did you join the board in the first place? Certainly not for constructive conversation, apparently.