Semi-OT: Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread III (Info. Post 1)

[DingleJerry]

Before rushing to rip on dumb young people. I'll add that literally every single older person I've spoken with(that's not hyperbole) have all said "it's just the flu and the media is overreacting, this is no big deal". Most recent one was about 3 hours ago.

[Dirk]

Guys,

anyone can read the topic.

The pattern is always the same:

A user shows up, "it's just flu bro". Attacks follow. Topic goes down the toilet.

Good info posted by some users gets lost.

I know it's very hard to resist attacking it or mocking it. But it's just not productive to have pages filled with garbage.

This topic is for those who take this thing seriously and that doesn't mean we're panicking and staying in bunkers. We're just trusting that countries around the world haven't all gone crazy, from the most advanced democracies, to the worst dictatorships. All the countries are basically telling everyone the same.

Please report/ignore the "it's just flu" posts.

I think we will have to go full Xi Jinping and censor the 1% who minimize death and are in a world of their own.

For clarity: posts will be moved out to the "garbage" section of the topic.

Why? No one learns anything by reading the same exchanges over and over again. And believe me, if you leave garbage out in the open, there will always be a user or two who will revive it.

Temporarily locked to move posts.

Topic re-opened.

Bookmark this link if you want to have more heated debates.
https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewforum.php?f=69
No one is actually censoring anyone.

[LKN]

Apparently there were 80,000 flu deaths during the 17/18 flu season (2 years ago).

https://www.webmd.com/cold-and-flu/news/20180927/80000-americans-died-from-flu-last-year

Looks like the number of deaths annually in US are anywhere from 12000-60000. Still, 400 deaths a day is enough for alarm imo.

This is hugely wrong and misleading (by no fault of your own). TRUE flu deaths (based on death certificates) may actually be more like 200-300 in a bad year. The CDC's method of tracking "flu deaths" is literally anyone admitted with ILI (influenza like illness) that dies. They infamously pair pneumonia deaths with flu.

https://aspe.hhs.gov/cdc-%E2%80%94-influenza-deaths-request-correction-rfc


US data on influenza deaths are false and misleading. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) acknowledges a difference between flu death and flu associated death yet uses the terms interchangeably. Additionally, there are significant statistical incompatibilities between official estimates and national vital statistics data. Compounding these problems is a marketing of fear—a CDC communications strategy in which medical experts "predict dire outcomes" during flu seasons.

The CDC website states what has become commonly accepted and widely reported in the lay and scientific press: annually "about 36 000 [Americans] die from flu" (www.cdc.gov/flu/about/disease.htm) and "influenza/pneumonia" is the seventh leading cause of death in the United States (www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lcod.htm). But why are flu and pneumonia bundled together? Is the relationship so strong or unique to warrant characterizing them as a single cause of death? David Rosenthal, director of Harvard University Health Services, said, "People don't necessarily die, per se, of the [flu] virus—the viraemia. What they die of is a secondary pneumonia. So many of these pneumonias are not viral pneumonias but secondary [pneumonias]."

But Dr Rosenthal agreed that the flu/pneumonia relationship was not unique. For instance, a recent study (JAMA 2004;292: 1955-60[Abstract/Free Full Text]) found that stomach acid suppressing drugs are associated with a higher risk of community acquired pneumonia, but such drugs and pneumonia are not compiled as a single statistic. CDC states that the historic 1968-9 "Hong Kong flu" pandemic killed 34 000 Americans. At the same time, CDC claims 36 000 Americans annually die from flu. What is going on?


https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/lawrence-solomon/death-by-influenza_b_4661442.html

FYI - My buddy who is an ER Doc said that this is actually probably wrong and the CDC is mostly right.

[LKN]

Before rushing to rip on dumb young people. I'll add that literally every single older person I've spoken with(that's not hyperbole) have all said "it's just the flu and the media is overreacting, this is no big deal". Most recent one was about 3 hours ago.

There are going to be A LOT of dead people in the villages in Florida.

If you know what that is, you know it's all old people

[BladeDaywalker]

Read on Twitter

[SF_Warriors]

Were you born stupid or did you become?

That's well over 20% more deaths per day! That's a gigantic increase!!!!!!

I was responding to someone saying 300 deaths are insane. I took it as a total of 300 deaths is insane when Italy averages 1700 any day of the year. If it was in fact 300 deaths only talking of the coronavirus then I apologize. But like I said I read it as he was shocked at 300 deaths for a country overall is insane


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Yes, I was referring to 300+ deaths for a single disease per day, not in totality for a nation.

[basketballRob]

That's well over 20% more deaths per day! That's a gigantic increase!!!!!!

I was responding to someone saying 300 deaths are insane. I took it as a total of 300 deaths is insane when Italy averages 1700 any day of the year. If it was in fact 300 deaths only talking of the coronavirus then I apologize. But like I said I read it as he was shocked at 300 deaths for a country overall is insane


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Yes, I was referring to 300+ deaths for a single disease per day, not in totality for a nation.

Will probably be over 1000 a day in a couple weeks

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[Ainosterhaspie]

The city where I work, Fresno, just ordered shelter in place, all businesses to close unless essential which is a very expansive list. As far as I know, there have only been a handful of confirmed local cases. Seems like they are ahead of the curve as far as treating the matter seriously.

I work in Court and that's essential, though I suspect my office will move to limited staffing in the next day or two since the Court is working on shutting down most hearings until April 1 when it will reevaluate.

Even places that stay open are required, to the extent possible, to enforce social distancing (6 feet).

[SF_Warriors]

Before rushing to rip on dumb young people. I'll add that literally every single older person I've spoken with(that's not hyperbole) have all said "it's just the flu and the media is overreacting, this is no big deal". Most recent one was about 3 hours ago.

There are going to be A LOT of dead people in the villages in Florida.

If you know what that is, you know it's all old people

I wonder how bad it is in florida. They have disney and that attracts tons of people (I know disneyworld is closed now but it was open just a few days ago)

I only really hear about NY, seattle, Bay area right now.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Looks like the number of deaths annually in US are anywhere from 12000-60000. Still, 400 deaths a day is enough for alarm imo.

This is hugely wrong and misleading (by no fault of your own). TRUE flu deaths (based on death certificates) may actually be more like 200-300 in a bad year. The CDC's method of tracking "flu deaths" is literally anyone admitted with ILI (influenza like illness) that dies. They infamously pair pneumonia deaths with flu.

https://aspe.hhs.gov/cdc-%E2%80%94-influenza-deaths-request-correction-rfc


US data on influenza deaths are false and misleading. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) acknowledges a difference between flu death and flu associated death yet uses the terms interchangeably. Additionally, there are significant statistical incompatibilities between official estimates and national vital statistics data. Compounding these problems is a marketing of fear—a CDC communications strategy in which medical experts "predict dire outcomes" during flu seasons.

The CDC website states what has become commonly accepted and widely reported in the lay and scientific press: annually "about 36 000 [Americans] die from flu" (www.cdc.gov/flu/about/disease.htm) and "influenza/pneumonia" is the seventh leading cause of death in the United States (www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lcod.htm). But why are flu and pneumonia bundled together? Is the relationship so strong or unique to warrant characterizing them as a single cause of death? David Rosenthal, director of Harvard University Health Services, said, "People don't necessarily die, per se, of the [flu] virus—the viraemia. What they die of is a secondary pneumonia. So many of these pneumonias are not viral pneumonias but secondary [pneumonias]."

But Dr Rosenthal agreed that the flu/pneumonia relationship was not unique. For instance, a recent study (JAMA 2004;292: 1955-60[Abstract/Free Full Text]) found that stomach acid suppressing drugs are associated with a higher risk of community acquired pneumonia, but such drugs and pneumonia are not compiled as a single statistic. CDC states that the historic 1968-9 "Hong Kong flu" pandemic killed 34 000 Americans. At the same time, CDC claims 36 000 Americans annually die from flu. What is going on?


https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/lawrence-solomon/death-by-influenza_b_4661442.html

FYI - My buddy who is an ER Doc said that this is actually probably wrong and the CDC is mostly right.

Appreciate feedback, but this isn't an opinion at all. They group Pneumonia deaths. Almost no death certificates are actually from the flu. Read the study and the Huff post article and make your own judgment. While I respect the hell out of Dr's, they are wrong about things too. You have to remember the data they receive via certain organizations is treated like the bible for them. They are trained to go with a specific school of thought. It's why you have a lot of outdated dietary recommendations still being taught to young Dr's etc. This article speaks for itself with EXACTLY why the CDC is incorrect in it's tracking. It's based on flimsy data and by aggregating things that aren't related. It would be like you dying from a stroke while in the hospital for a bad car accident in critical condition due to a sliced artery in your neck, and you end up dying from a random stroke... and they label your death as being from the slash wound. It's just a bad medical practice.

[SirCharles3434]

Sadly, this is not going anywhere because idiots are not taking this serious.

[dhsilv2]

I'm trying to comprehend the stupidity of these teenagers.[/quote]

Drink 6 beers. Surround yourself with 18-22 year old drunk girls in bikini's and see how you're feeling when you're told to go home. Come on man...we were all there once. Some of us were smarter, but I'd hope we can all at least somewhat relate and understand the stupidity of youth.

[basketballRob]

Good news, in a few days we'll have tests!

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[LKN]

This is hugely wrong and misleading (by no fault of your own). TRUE flu deaths (based on death certificates) may actually be more like 200-300 in a bad year. The CDC's method of tracking "flu deaths" is literally anyone admitted with ILI (influenza like illness) that dies. They infamously pair pneumonia deaths with flu.

https://aspe.hhs.gov/cdc-%E2%80%94-influenza-deaths-request-correction-rfc


US data on influenza deaths are false and misleading. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) acknowledges a difference between flu death and flu associated death yet uses the terms interchangeably. Additionally, there are significant statistical incompatibilities between official estimates and national vital statistics data. Compounding these problems is a marketing of fear—a CDC communications strategy in which medical experts "predict dire outcomes" during flu seasons.

The CDC website states what has become commonly accepted and widely reported in the lay and scientific press: annually "about 36 000 [Americans] die from flu" (www.cdc.gov/flu/about/disease.htm) and "influenza/pneumonia" is the seventh leading cause of death in the United States (www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lcod.htm). But why are flu and pneumonia bundled together? Is the relationship so strong or unique to warrant characterizing them as a single cause of death? David Rosenthal, director of Harvard University Health Services, said, "People don't necessarily die, per se, of the [flu] virus—the viraemia. What they die of is a secondary pneumonia. So many of these pneumonias are not viral pneumonias but secondary [pneumonias]."

But Dr Rosenthal agreed that the flu/pneumonia relationship was not unique. For instance, a recent study (JAMA 2004;292: 1955-60[Abstract/Free Full Text]) found that stomach acid suppressing drugs are associated with a higher risk of community acquired pneumonia, but such drugs and pneumonia are not compiled as a single statistic. CDC states that the historic 1968-9 "Hong Kong flu" pandemic killed 34 000 Americans. At the same time, CDC claims 36 000 Americans annually die from flu. What is going on?


https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/lawrence-solomon/death-by-influenza_b_4661442.html

FYI - My buddy who is an ER Doc said that this is actually probably wrong and the CDC is mostly right.

Appreciate feedback, but this isn't an opinion at all. They group Pneumonia deaths. Almost no death certificates are actually from the flu. Read the study and the Huff post article and make your own judgment. While I respect the hell out of Dr's, they are wrong about things too. You have to remember the data they receive via certain organizations is treated like the bible for them. They are trained to go with a specific school of thought. It's why you have a lot of outdated dietary recommendations still being taught to young Dr's etc. This article speaks for itself with EXACTLY why the CDC is incorrect in it's tracking. It's based on flimsy data and by aggregating things that aren't related. It would be like you dying from a stroke while in the hospital for a bad car accident with trau

I'm just telling you what I was told. He read the HHS paper you posted and told me he had some issues with it and would still side more with the CDC.

He's been an ER doctor at Johns Hopkins for a long time. Just passing that along.

[Mister Ze]

Is it true that people who recover can get it again - cause if so this isn’t going away anytime soon.

Who is going to give the okay on coming back to work when the cases continue sky rocketing

[SOdisciple]

Drink 6 beers. Surround yourself with 18-22 year old drunk girls in bikini's and see how you're feeling when you're told to go home. Come on man...we were all there once. Some of us were smarter, but I'd hope we can all at least somewhat relate and understand the stupidity of youth.

Understandable, but not acceptable. People need to wake up to the reality of the stakes at hand.

[Jordan-esque]

Sadly, this is not going anywhere because idiots are not taking this serious.

[Jordan-esque]

Sadly, this is not going anywhere because idiots are not taking this serious.

You can say that again...

Read on Twitter

?s=21

[Ainosterhaspie]

I'm not sure "stupid" is the right word to apply to the youth. Maybe "heartless" or "callous", but not stupid. They are a very low risk group and are very unlikely to be personally harmed by the virus. It's not really stupid for them to risk exposure.

And as far as evolution goes, the virus is hitting people who already had their shot at reproducing, not the current breeders, so I don't see this virus doing much to eliminate stupudity from the gene pool.

[Infinite Llamas]

Most teenagers think they’re invincible and live on the edge. I thought that everybody knows this. Counting on them to responsible in a time of crisis isn’t the best strategy. I’m more disappointed in the older adults who should absolutely know better but walk around with an idgaf attitude. Many of these teens probably weren’t even alive when 9/11 happened. This is the first real crisis they’ve probably ever seen.