2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 3)

[3toheadmelo]

You totally didn't get my point. It wasn't to compare the two players because they aren't the same player. It was to put a pause on using high school highlight reals to judge what a player can and will do in the pros.

Wiseman has played 3 games in his college career, 3 games! Two against teams that have zero basketball talent.

Watch on YouTube

the game against oregon is probably our only really worth while game we can actual analyse from him. I'm not even saying he isn't worth a top 3 pick. Because someone will take a chance on talent.

But to know sure fire what he can and can't do right now is presumptuous. Against small guys he's an animal because he is a big boy (he's got all the measurables) and he is a good athlete (not a great one). He will rebound and block shots.

The only noticeable thing I can see translating that he does better than say Mitch from day one is he has a nice mid range game. I have no clue how or when a post game will tranlates because he has never played against guys even remotely his same size. That is a huge difference if how bigs will tranlate to the NBA game.

The question which I do believe HEZI is making. Wiseman isn't a guy you can just plug and play and he will make an impact right away. He's going to need guards to get him the ball and create for him because Wiseman doesn't create shots for himself. This team needs more playmaking and scoring. Would Wiseman disappear without the proper team around him?

Mitch's high school vid really isn't much different than how he is right now. That vid just mostly consists of open dunks, put backs, blocks and the occassional spot up jumper. Difference is that he isn't taking the occassional open jumper.

Wiseman can for sure create shots for himself. In college he was making fadeaways from the post. Mitch can't even do that. Again the footage is right there of him creating his own shot. I showed you it.

You said the Knicks need playmaking but insist on drafting Edwards over a playmaker like Lamelo. So you're contradicting yourself. But we all know you want Edwards so Frank can start

Holding Wiseman to just one game is foolish (Although he still put up a double double in that game). Especially in that game he was going through a lot with all of the drama around him.

There is footage of Wiseman putting in work against quality big men (that are in this draft) from high school. Go look for it. Youtube is a great thing. Lol

you keep peddling this tired act. When I like both Killian Hayes and Haliburton as prospects.

Did you miss the fact that we need a guy that can playmake AND....wait for it SCORE. A guy that can't buckets off the dribble. And yes that is why I want Edwards over Ball. Because I don't trust Ball's ability to score consistently in the NBA. ANd the fact he wont play any defense either. Doesn't mean he isn't a tremendous playmaker because he is.

I am also trying to put the best talent around RJ + Mitch who are best two young players at the moment. Which is why I'm looking for playmaking but also a guy with a trust worthy jump shot. Which I think is very vital to this team.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know the reason the knicks continue to lose games is because we don't have consistent shooting...when that is the name of the game today. You need guys that can keep a defense honest that have the ball in there hands because spacing is so vital in the NBA.

I also like Tre Jones in the later 1st round with a potential pick if we don't go PG with our first pick. But sorry if I don't spend too much time talking about Ball or Wiseman. I don't even like spending so much time on Edwards because again jumping in the top 3 is not very likely.

Which means I'm focusing more on realistic options for the knicks.

It's cause im stating facts. We all know why you want Edwards and he's not even a good playmaker. He's also an inefficient scorer. Again, you contradicted yourself. Edwards also shot 29% from 3. So to say he has a trust worthy jump shot makes no sense.

You keep saying you focusing on realistic options but keep naming guys like Killian Hayes when we are projected to pick at #6 and Hayes is in the 9-12 range. Also given the Knicks international draft history, we're def not picking him. It's pretty much a given the Knicks are gonna draft Cole Anthony if we don't move up.
I'll let you be cause you not making much sense here

[mpharris36]

Mitch's high school vid really isn't much different than how he is right now. That vid just mostly consists of open dunks, put backs, blocks and the occassional spot up jumper. Difference is that he isn't taking the occassional open jumper.

Wiseman can for sure create shots for himself. In college he was making fadeaways from the post. Mitch can't even do that. Again the footage is right there of him creating his own shot. I showed you it.

You said the Knicks need playmaking but insist on drafting Edwards over a playmaker like Lamelo. So you're contradicting yourself. But we all know you want Edwards so Frank can start

Holding Wiseman to just one game is foolish (Although he still put up a double double in that game). Especially in that game he was going through a lot with all of the drama around him.

There is footage of Wiseman putting in work against quality big men (that are in this draft) from high school. Go look for it. Youtube is a great thing. Lol

you keep peddling this tired act. When I like both Killian Hayes and Haliburton as prospects.

Did you miss the fact that we need a guy that can playmake AND....wait for it SCORE. A guy that can't buckets off the dribble. And yes that is why I want Edwards over Ball. Because I don't trust Ball's ability to score consistently in the NBA. ANd the fact he wont play any defense either. Doesn't mean he isn't a tremendous playmaker because he is.

I am also trying to put the best talent around RJ + Mitch who are best two young players at the moment. Which is why I'm looking for playmaking but also a guy with a trust worthy jump shot. Which I think is very vital to this team.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know the reason the knicks continue to lose games is because we don't have consistent shooting...when that is the name of the game today. You need guys that can keep a defense honest that have the ball in there hands because spacing is so vital in the NBA.

I also like Tre Jones in the later 1st round with a potential pick if we don't go PG with our first pick. But sorry if I don't spend too much time talking about Ball or Wiseman. I don't even like spending so much time on Edwards because again jumping in the top 3 is not very likely.

Which means I'm focusing more on realistic options for the knicks.

It's cause im stating facts. We all know why you want Edwards and he's not even a good playmaker. He's also an inefficient scorer. Again, you contradicted yourself. Edwards also shot 29% from 3. So to say he has a trust worthy jump shot makes no sense.

You keep saying you focusing on realistic options but keep naming guys like Killian Hayes when we are projected to pick at #6 and Hayes is in the 9-12 range. Also given the Knicks international draft history, we're def not picking him. It's pretty much a given the Knicks are gonna draft Cole Anthony if we don't move up.
I'll let you be cause you not making much sense here

as far as edwards go it was shot selection for the most part that destoryed his percentages. He has a translatable shot. Georgia was just so bad he was asked to do too much but yes the shot selection is concerning.

There’s a clear trend line running through everything Edwards does: He’s better when the game is simplified for him. According to the tracking numbers at Synergy Sports, Edwards goes from ranking in the 88th percentile of scorers nationwide in transition to the 45th percentile in the half court. We see the same drop-off with the types of shots he takes. Edwards is in the 56th percentile of players in catch-and-shoot situations and the 30th percentile when launching off the dribble.

He is a pretty decent catch and shoot guy and with better players around him I am project his shooting %'s to go up.

Who's not making sense? We actually have the lowest odds to stick at 6 outside of dropping all the way to 9.

7-8 is probably our bread and butter (50% odds). 7-8 considering I don't think we will be picking Obi or Okoro would put us right in the range where Hayes/Haliburton/Anthony will be picked.

And again if I'm suggesting we are probably going to be picking a point guard where we land outside of landing the #1 pick (which I hope will happen and expect to ahppen) how does liking Edwards more than LaMelo have anything to do with Frank other then like I said you peddling nonsense? I think Edwards is point blank a better player if he pans out. You don't need to look much further than that. Most if not all mocks have it that way as well.

[jvsimonetti0514]

right now my preference at 7 or 8 (which we have a 50% chance of landing)

that range is the :

Cole Anthony
Killian Hayes
Tyrese Haliburton
Isaac Okoro
Onyeka Okongwu
Obi Toppin

I like Okoro and Okongwu as prospects I just don't think the knicks can select them right now.

So right now I would prefer Hayes with a backup option as Haliburton

Not as high on Cole Anthony or Obi Toppin for the list above (obi can score but he's too old of a prospect. Kinda has a defined ceiling already in my eyes. Will score a bit and rebound but won't do much else for you.

Cole Anthony I can see the lure (NY kid, father played here). But RJ is already a pretty shaky efficiency guy it would be tough to bring in another low efficiency, high volume guard with questionable vision.

I think if I'm going to rank the guards in our range it's going to be Hayes, Cole, then Haliburton. I've spent a few weeks trying to talk myself into Cole and I'm at the point now where I'm okay with drafting him. I kinda worry that Hayes and RJ won't be great fits because they're both lefties that aren't great athletes. He's kinda a combo of the things I like about Cole(scoring/shooting) and the things I like about Haliburton(playmaking).

If we do draft Cole, we should definite play Frank with him and RJ. He'll definitely cover for Cole's playmaking weakness.

[mpharris36]

right now my preference at 7 or 8 (which we have a 50% chance of landing)

that range is the :

Cole Anthony
Killian Hayes
Tyrese Haliburton
Isaac Okoro
Onyeka Okongwu
Obi Toppin

I like Okoro and Okongwu as prospects I just don't think the knicks can select them right now.

So right now I would prefer Hayes with a backup option as Haliburton

Not as high on Cole Anthony or Obi Toppin for the list above (obi can score but he's too old of a prospect. Kinda has a defined ceiling already in my eyes. Will score a bit and rebound but won't do much else for you.

Cole Anthony I can see the lure (NY kid, father played here). But RJ is already a pretty shaky efficiency guy it would be tough to bring in another low efficiency, high volume guard with questionable vision.

I think if I'm going to rank the guards in our range it's going to be Hayes, Cole, then Haliburton. I've spent a few weeks trying to talk myself into Cole and I'm at the point now where I'm okay with drafting him. I kinda worry that Hayes and RJ won't be great fits because they're both lefties that aren't great athletes. He's kinda a combo of the things I like about Cole(scoring/shooting) and the things I like about Haliburton(playmaking).

If we do draft Cole, we should definite play Frank with him and RJ. He'll definitely cover for Cole's playmaking weakness.

i agree with most of this post.

If the knicks are picking around that 6-8 range

it will be one of Hayes/Cole/Haliburton

I will be fine with any of them but I have my preferences.

[mpharris36]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

[HarthorneWingo]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

But we’re never going to get into the top 4. We’re looking at 6-8

[mpharris36]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

But we’re never going to get into the top 4. We’re looking at 6-8

most likely. So that would rule out Edwards, Ball, Wiseman, Deni in whatever order.

So the draft would then start at 5...

[HarthorneWingo]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

But we’re never going to get into the top 4. We’re looking at 6-8

most likely. So that would rule out Edwards, Ball, Wiseman, Deni in whatever order.

So the draft would then start at 5...

I think we’re looking at

Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Toppin

[god shammgod]

it's gonna be cole or hayes depending on who's there and who they prefer, unless we move up. then it will be lamelo or edwards. oh yeah.....and you'll like it.

[HarthorneWingo]

it's gonna be cole or hayes depending on who's there and who they prefer, unless we move up. then it will be lamelo or edwards. oh yeah.....and you'll like it.

Cole’s slipping. He might not even make the top 10. Try and keep up grandpa.

[god shammgod]

it's gonna be cole or hayes depending on who's there and who they prefer, unless we move up. then it will be lamelo or edwards. oh yeah.....and you'll like it.

Cole’s slipping. He might not even make the top 10. Try and keep up grandpa.

i want you 6 feet from all my posts. social distancing. thank you.

[god shammgod]

somebody let fatboy down easy

[HarthorneWingo]

I like Deni too.

[mpharris36]

But we’re never going to get into the top 4. We’re looking at 6-8

most likely. So that would rule out Edwards, Ball, Wiseman, Deni in whatever order.

So the draft would then start at 5...

I think we’re looking at

Haliburton
Hayes
Okongwu
Toppin

add in Cole Anthony too for sure and that is the 5 we are probably lookin at. With more interest in the guards.

[mpharris36]

it's gonna be cole or hayes depending on who's there and who they prefer, unless we move up. then it will be lamelo or edwards. oh yeah.....and you'll like it.

probably

I would go Edwards then LaMelo at 1 and 2.

The real question is what if we are picking 3 or 4 and Edwards/Ball are off the board?

I don't see them picking Wiseman...I also think that is a bit early for Anthony and Hayes.

So do you think they go with Deni? Or possibly trade down? to get a future asset?

Kinda like what ATL did? move down afew spots let someone move up for Wiseman and get a future 1st and still get one of the guards moving down?

[god shammgod]

it's gonna be cole or hayes depending on who's there and who they prefer, unless we move up. then it will be lamelo or edwards. oh yeah.....and you'll like it.

probably

I would go Edwards then LaMelo at 1 and 2.

The real question is what if we are picking 3 or 4 and Edwards/Ball are off the board?

I don't see them picking Wiseman...I also think that is a bit early for Anthony and Hayes.

So do you think they go with Deni? Or possibly trade down? to get a future asset?

Kinda like what ATL did? move down afew spots let someone move up for Wiseman and get a future 1st and still get one of the guards moving down?

they might have some interest in deni but i could see them preferring to move down. gonna be interesting how this all happens now. will there be workouts ? will guys even be in shape if there are ? you'll be working with less information than ever before most likely.

[3toheadmelo]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

Lemme guess.. you would trade down lol

[mpharris36]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

Lemme guess.. you would trade down lol

1. Edwards
2. Lamelo
3. Trade down (for a team looking for Wiseman)
4. Deni

[3toheadmelo]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

Lemme guess.. you would trade down lol

1. Edwards
2. Lamelo
3. Trade down (for a team looking for Wiseman)
4. Deni

Close enough.

Not sure how I feel about Deni. He's good but I am not sure about his ceiling. I would prob pass on him but I need to look into him more

[spree8]

the better question you should be asking me Melo is what I would do if I was the knicks were to get the #2, #3, or #4 pick and Edwards is off the board.

then you would get my true feelings on how I rate my top 4 options for the knicks. And Hayes/Cole/Haliburton aren't in my top 4 big board.

Lemme guess.. you would trade down lol

1. Edwards
2. Lamelo
3. Trade down (for a team looking for Wiseman)
4. Deni

How do you think Wiseman is that bad where you’d prefer to trade down instead of drafting him? I don’t get it.

I really don’t care who we draft btw, I like a lot of these prospects, but Wiseman is clearly the best of the bunch in terms of potential... I just don’t think we will be able to land him so I’m not even getting my hopes up. I just don’t understand the hate on the guy or people not wanting him on this team.