OT: Democratic Primary Thread

[nedleeds]

Landslide for Sanders fam. I differ with Obama heavily on economic and immigration policy not to mention his treatment of Whistleblowers and expansion on drone strikes.

Obama is the number one draft pick.

My biggest issues with Obama was the drone strikes and spying on citizens. That's exactly why I hated Bush. To have a democrat do that just felt like betrayal if I'm being honest.

But yes, his charisma is up there with Bill Clinton.

Unless Democrats do something dumb like try to stick Hillary in the race (definitely wouldn't surprise me), I feel pretty confident that Trump won't win 2020.

Obama was actually considering cutting Medicare and Social Security during the Grand Bargain. He didn't end the wars and even got us involved in Libya thanks to the other war monger, Hillary. FOH. Change and Hope my ass.

Obama won on his intelligence, charisma and skill as an orator. Less than 1% of polled Obama voters could name one piece of legislation he was involved with as a senator. 36% knew what state he was a senator in.

Obama's biggest failures were continued war mongering in the middle east when it's a losing issue on every level. And setting back race relations by decades, he could have been the great uniting force, a black man that white people trusted. After Ferguson he could have taken a real stand and united black and white people, instead he was scared about the election. Instead of using it to hit the issues that cause people to grow up like Mike Brown he just made it worse.

[GONYK]

At some point, it may be worth examining that it seems that most voters don't care about policy.

[HarthorneWingo]

Bernie hasn't won any elections. In fact, that was said after the Nevada caucus, right before Joe Biden came and pretty much swept the primaries.

So I don't think anything that guy said carries any weight, because the revolution never happened.

Then you're missing the entire point. Trust me, SpittingBack knows that this was filmed after the Nevada primary. It was posted today.

Why are Sanders' policies the most popular?

How was it that the candidate who is the most popular politician in America with the most popular policies in America who won the first three states in the primaries - something that had never been done before in our history! - and then all of a sudden the bottom drops out of his campaign. How. Did. That. Happen?

Well, 3 reasons:

To start, Bernie didn't win the first 3 states. Pete won Iowa

Secondly, the turnout was really low. Iowa and Nevada hold caucuses, not elections, so you can't draw a ton of conclusions from that. 507,000 votes were cast in those first 3 states combined. 539,000 people voted for Hillary in Nevada alone in 2016.

Third, and most importantly, 2 of the first 3 states are the least representative states in the primary. Iowa and NH are rural and small town areas with a minority population of 10-14% and less than 3% of a black population. Does that sound like America as a whole?

Once the primary moved to places where the black vote was more in line with the demographics as a whole, Bernie was never going to win, because the black population strongly preferred Biden. The field consolidating made this choice a relatively binary one.

You can't win the Dem nomination without the black vote.

The bottom never dropped out of Bernie's campaign. He never had more than ~30% support. Once the field whittles down to 2 people, that means 70% aren't his voters.

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow? This will be like a political science research project!

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

[GONYK]

Then you're missing the entire point. Trust me, SpittingBack knows that this was filmed after the Nevada primary. It was posted today.

Why are Sanders' policies the most popular?

How was it that the candidate who is the most popular politician in America with the most popular policies in America who won the first three states in the primaries - something that had never been done before in our history! - and then all of a sudden the bottom drops out of his campaign. How. Did. That. Happen?

Well, 3 reasons:

To start, Bernie didn't win the first 3 states. Pete won Iowa

Secondly, the turnout was really low. Iowa and Nevada hold caucuses, not elections, so you can't draw a ton of conclusions from that. 507,000 votes were cast in those first 3 states combined. 539,000 people voted for Hillary in Nevada alone in 2016.

Third, and most importantly, 2 of the first 3 states are the least representative states in the primary. Iowa and NH are rural and small town areas with a minority population of 10-14% and less than 3% of a black population. Does that sound like America as a whole?

Once the primary moved to places where the black vote was more in line with the demographics as a whole, Bernie was never going to win, because the black population strongly preferred Biden. The field consolidating made this choice a relatively binary one.

You can't win the Dem nomination without the black vote.

The bottom never dropped out of Bernie's campaign. He never had more than ~30% support. Once the field whittles down to 2 people, that means 70% aren't his voters.

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

[j4remi]

At some point, it may be worth examining that it seems that most voters don't care about policy.

This is like 1000% why I'm concerned with Biden vs Trump

[GONYK]

At some point, it may be worth examining that it seems that most voters don't care about policy.

This is like 1000% why I'm concerned with Biden vs Trump

Fair concern

I'm hoping it works both ways though. That people who don't care about policy just vote out of hatred and none of the other tricks register

[j4remi]

Fair concern

I'm hoping it works both ways though. That people who don't care about policy just vote out of hatred and none of the other tricks register

In Bitcofer we trust

[HarthorneWingo]

Well, 3 reasons:

To start, Bernie didn't win the first 3 states. Pete won Iowa

Secondly, the turnout was really low. Iowa and Nevada hold caucuses, not elections, so you can't draw a ton of conclusions from that. 507,000 votes were cast in those first 3 states combined. 539,000 people voted for Hillary in Nevada alone in 2016.

Third, and most importantly, 2 of the first 3 states are the least representative states in the primary. Iowa and NH are rural and small town areas with a minority population of 10-14% and less than 3% of a black population. Does that sound like America as a whole?

Once the primary moved to places where the black vote was more in line with the demographics as a whole, Bernie was never going to win, because the black population strongly preferred Biden. The field consolidating made this choice a relatively binary one.

You can't win the Dem nomination without the black vote.

The bottom never dropped out of Bernie's campaign. He never had more than ~30% support. Once the field whittles down to 2 people, that means 70% aren't his voters.

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I can't believe that you are equating Krystal Ball and Saagar, who is known for being more right leaning, as the equivalent of Fox news which just makes up shyt. Point out one falsehood in this broadcast. And, yes, Bernie supporters have the perfect right not to agree with Bernie and carry on this movement without him in our own way. Bernie is 78 and won't be running for POTUS again.

Since you have unfairly, in my opinion, criticized my news sources why don't you let us know where you get your information from? Also, what kind of work do you do? If find that this information is also helpful in understanding where someone's politics are. Like, I learned that duetta is a Wall Street money mover who's afraid of losing his job. Now I understand why he wants to Wall Street to keep winning.

[nedleeds]

At some point, it may be worth examining that it seems that most voters don't care about policy.

This is like 1000% why I'm concerned with Biden vs Trump

Fair concern

I'm hoping it works both ways though. That people who don't care about policy just vote out of hatred and none of the other tricks register

Trump absolutely won on the frustration with politicians vote. He had almost no policy other than, hillary is a sycophant politician and drain the swamp. People like me who hadn't voted since I voted for Bill Clinton came out and voted for Trump as a massive middle finger to the establishment (pub and democrat), political correctness reigning over common sense and our constant meddling in the middle east and ties with house of saud (something Trump hasn't followed through on).

[GONYK]

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I can't believe that you are equating Krystal Ball and Saagar, who is known for being more right leaning, as the equivalent of Fox news which just makes up shyt. Point out one falsehood in this broadcast. And, yes, Bernie supporters have the perfect right not to agree with Bernie and carry on this movement without him in our own way. Bernie is 78 and won't be running for POTUS again.

Something doesn't have to be made up to be biased. Bias is about the lens the presenters are filtering the information through.

Playing only the part of the Obama endorsement video where he talked about Bernie is bias.
Saying that Bernie has no place to disavow the comments of his former staffer is biased.
Presenting that it is a matter of fact that Obama led to Trump as opposed to other factors is a bias.

All that is is one point of view, among many. It's not news.

Since you have unfairly, in my opinion, criticized my news sources why don't you let us know where you get your information from? Also, what kind of work do you do? If find that this information is also helpful in understanding where someone's politics are. Like, I learned that duetta is a Wall Street money mover who's afraid of losing his job. Now I understand why he wants to Wall Street to keep winning.

I get news from a large multitude of places. I read mainstream, I read blogs, I'll go on message boards, and I'll talk to people. I do everything for both sides as much as I can. So I will look at what Politico or NPR says and then I will check out National Review, and then I will talk to people around me. I've lived in NY, Philly, Denver, and TX. I have access to a fairly wide swath of political viewpoints in my friend group.

I don't go on YouTube or watch a lot of cable news, because I don't really care for opinion shows.

That is the best attempt I can make at finding some degree of objectivity in this world, and even then, I am very much a Democrat.

As far as what I do, I am a former scout who now occasionally freelances as a software developer. I assure you, it is my pragmatism, not my work history, that leads to what I say in this thread.

I deal with how to win within the reality of the circumstances, not the way I prefer things to be.

Me, Liz and Bernie are standing in the same place now. Are you going to question them and their work history too?

[HarthorneWingo]

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I can't believe that you are equating Krystal Ball and Saagar, who is known for being more right leaning, as the equivalent of Fox news which just makes up shyt. Point out one falsehood in this broadcast. And, yes, Bernie supporters have the perfect right not to agree with Bernie and carry on this movement without him in our own way. Bernie is 78 and won't be running for POTUS again.

Something doesn't have to be made up to be biased. Bias is about the lens the presenters are filtering the information through.

Playing only the part of the Obama endorsement video where he talked about Bernie is bias.
Saying that Bernie has no place to disavow the comments of his former staffer is biased.
Presenting that it is a matter of fact that Obama led to Trump as opposed to other factors is a bias.

All that is is one point of view, among many. It's not news.

Since you have unfairly, in my opinion, criticized my news sources why don't you let us know where you get your information from? Also, what kind of work do you do? If find that this information is also helpful in understanding where someone's politics are. Like, I learned that duetta is a Wall Street money mover who's afraid of losing his job. Now I understand why he wants to Wall Street to keep winning.

I get news from a large multitude of places. I read mainstream, I read blogs, I'll go on message boards, and I'll talk to people. I do everything for both sides as much as I can. So I will look at what Politico or NPR says and then I will check out National Review, and then I will talk to people around me. I've lived in NY, Philly, Denver, and TX. I have access to a fairly wide swath of political viewpoints in my friend group.

I don't go on YouTube or watch a lot of cable news, because I don't really care for opinion shows.

That is the best attempt I can make at finding some degree of objectivity in this world, and even then, I am very much a Democrat.

As far as what I do, I am a former scout who now occasionally freelances as a software developer. I assure you, it is my pragmatism, not my work history, that leads to what I say in this thread.

I deal with how to win within the reality of the circumstances, not the way I prefer things to be.

Me, Liz and Bernie are standing in the same place now. Are you going to question them and their work history too?

Something doesn't have to be made up to be biased. Bias is about the lens the presenters are filtering the information through.

Playing only the part of the Obama endorsement video where he talked about Bernie is bias.
Saying that Bernie has no place to disavow the comments of his former staffer is biased.
Presenting that it is a matter of fact that Obama led to Trump as opposed to other factors is a bias.

You were the one who compared them to Fox, which actually does make shyt up. I understand that Krystal Ball is a progressive. Joy Reid and Rachel Maddow are centrists. But what's in issue is which policies work best. Is Krystal "biased" in your eyes if she's promoting policies which scientists back as being sound, like on climate change? The difference is Fox "news" is not credible. That's why the analogy fails.

I get news from a large multitude of places. I read mainstream, I read blogs, I'll go on message boards, and I'll talk to people. I do everything for both sides as much as I can. So I will look at what Politico or NPR says and then I will check out National Review, and then I will talk to people around me. I've lived in NY, Philly, Denver, and TX. I have access to a fairly wide swath of political viewpoints in my friend group.

Yeah, I read HuffPost, NY Times, NYDN, NY Post, Newsday, Politico. I still watch CNN and MSNBC. But I also do read more left leaning publications like Pro Publica and The Intercept. Noam Chomsky is my hero. The Youtube news sources/op-ed are Democracy Now! for straight news (highly recommended) and The Majority Report with Sam Seder for the combination of straight news, guest interviews, and of course "The Fun Half."

You seem to be more on the incrementalist train whereas I strongly believe that the establishment Democrats have gotton too comfortable (and rich) and therefore won't make the necessary changes in the status quo which are needed for use to survive as a middle class.

Have you ever marched for anything?

[Pointgod]

Bernie hasn't won any elections. In fact, that was said after the Nevada caucus, right before Joe Biden came and pretty much swept the primaries.

So I don't think anything that guy said carries any weight, because the revolution never happened.

Then you're missing the entire point. Trust me, SpittingBack knows that this was filmed after the Nevada primary. It was posted today.

Why are Sanders' policies the most popular?

How was it that the candidate who is the most popular politician in America with the most popular policies in America who won the first three states in the primaries - something that had never been done before in our history! - and then all of a sudden the bottom drops out of his campaign. How. Did. That. Happen?

Well, 3 reasons:

To start, Bernie didn't win the first 3 states. Pete won Iowa

Secondly, the turnout was really low. Iowa and Nevada hold caucuses, not elections, so you can't draw a ton of conclusions from that. 507,000 votes were cast in those first 3 states combined. 539,000 people voted for Hillary in Nevada alone in 2016.

Third, and most importantly, 2 of the first 3 states are the least representative states in the primary. Iowa and NH are rural and small town areas with a minority population of 10-14% and less than 3% of a black population. Does that sound like America as a whole?

Once the primary moved to places where the black vote was more in line with the demographics as a whole, Bernie was never going to win, because the black population strongly preferred Biden. The field consolidating made this choice a relatively binary one.

You can't win the Dem nomination without the black vote.

The bottom never dropped out of Bernie's campaign. He never had more than ~30% support. Once the field whittles down to 2 people, that means 70% aren't his voters.

Sanders bet on a campaign strategy based on a split moderate vote and it worked up until it didn’t. There was no Democratic Establishment plot to overthrow Bernie, just his campaign’s own short comings.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/bernie-sanders-bet-big-small-tent-win-democratic-nomination-here-n1179451

It’s not a question Sanders wanted answered: the senator never sought the leading black lawmaker's support and Clyburn endorsed Joe Biden just when the former vice president's bid appeared to stall. An overwhelming win in Clyburn's state at the end of February turned into a dominant Super Tuesday showing that allowed Biden to begin amassing the kind of delegate lead that Sanders, when he dropped out of the race for the nomination Wednesday, acknowledged he could not overcome.

The unsought endorsement underscored a campaign strategy that would eventually prove fatal. The senator and his team bet big on a small-tent strategy: one that spent little effort broadening the base or building a wider coalition, but instead leaned into Sanders' existing supporters in the hopes that a divided presidential primary field would open up a path for him to win the nomination without having to dramatically expand his base.

That strategy counted on him consistently winning 30-40 percent of Democratic voters, as Donald Trump had done with the Republicans in 2016, and it counted on the field staying divided among numerous candidates.

But his early successes in Iowa and New Hampshire revealed a fundamental problem: His support base was actually closer to a quarter of the party rather than a third of it, and that was in states that would be among the most demographically favorable to him.

“You can’t win plurality victories with 25 percent of the vote, you have to get up 40, 45 percent,” Longabaugh said.

“I think the weaknesses of both Sanders campaigns are reflective of the weaknesses of the progressive movement more generally," said Jonathan Tasini, a progressive activist and former Sanders surrogate. "It isn’t always that the Democratic Party is corrupt and in the hands of the party elite. That is a factor, but also a factor is that you have to run effective elections."

You can’t expect to win the Democratic nomination by not building coalitions and **** on Democrats. The Bernie crowd needs to come into the tent.

[spree8]

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I can't believe that you are equating Krystal Ball and Saagar, who is known for being more right leaning, as the equivalent of Fox news which just makes up shyt. Point out one falsehood in this broadcast. And, yes, Bernie supporters have the perfect right not to agree with Bernie and carry on this movement without him in our own way. Bernie is 78 and won't be running for POTUS again.

Since you have unfairly, in my opinion, criticized my news sources why don't you let us know where you get your information from? Also, what kind of work do you do? If find that this information is also helpful in understanding where someone's politics are. Like, I learned that duetta is a Wall Street money mover who's afraid of losing his job. Now I understand why he wants to Wall Street to keep winning.

Yea that was a head scratcher... Saagar is a conservative.

[Pointgod]

Well, 3 reasons:

To start, Bernie didn't win the first 3 states. Pete won Iowa

Secondly, the turnout was really low. Iowa and Nevada hold caucuses, not elections, so you can't draw a ton of conclusions from that. 507,000 votes were cast in those first 3 states combined. 539,000 people voted for Hillary in Nevada alone in 2016.

Third, and most importantly, 2 of the first 3 states are the least representative states in the primary. Iowa and NH are rural and small town areas with a minority population of 10-14% and less than 3% of a black population. Does that sound like America as a whole?

Once the primary moved to places where the black vote was more in line with the demographics as a whole, Bernie was never going to win, because the black population strongly preferred Biden. The field consolidating made this choice a relatively binary one.

You can't win the Dem nomination without the black vote.

The bottom never dropped out of Bernie's campaign. He never had more than ~30% support. Once the field whittles down to 2 people, that means 70% aren't his voters.

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I like Bernie Sanders but some of his supporters are the absolute worst.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[spree8]

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I like Bernie Sanders but some of his supporters are the absolute worst.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

No they’re not

[GONYK]

I can't believe that you are equating Krystal Ball and Saagar, who is known for being more right leaning, as the equivalent of Fox news which just makes up shyt. Point out one falsehood in this broadcast. And, yes, Bernie supporters have the perfect right not to agree with Bernie and carry on this movement without him in our own way. Bernie is 78 and won't be running for POTUS again.

Something doesn't have to be made up to be biased. Bias is about the lens the presenters are filtering the information through.

Playing only the part of the Obama endorsement video where he talked about Bernie is bias.
Saying that Bernie has no place to disavow the comments of his former staffer is biased.
Presenting that it is a matter of fact that Obama led to Trump as opposed to other factors is a bias.

All that is is one point of view, among many. It's not news.

Since you have unfairly, in my opinion, criticized my news sources why don't you let us know where you get your information from? Also, what kind of work do you do? If find that this information is also helpful in understanding where someone's politics are. Like, I learned that duetta is a Wall Street money mover who's afraid of losing his job. Now I understand why he wants to Wall Street to keep winning.

I get news from a large multitude of places. I read mainstream, I read blogs, I'll go on message boards, and I'll talk to people. I do everything for both sides as much as I can. So I will look at what Politico or NPR says and then I will check out National Review, and then I will talk to people around me. I've lived in NY, Philly, Denver, and TX. I have access to a fairly wide swath of political viewpoints in my friend group.

I don't go on YouTube or watch a lot of cable news, because I don't really care for opinion shows.

That is the best attempt I can make at finding some degree of objectivity in this world, and even then, I am very much a Democrat.

As far as what I do, I am a former scout who now occasionally freelances as a software developer. I assure you, it is my pragmatism, not my work history, that leads to what I say in this thread.

I deal with how to win within the reality of the circumstances, not the way I prefer things to be.

Me, Liz and Bernie are standing in the same place now. Are you going to question them and their work history too?

Something doesn't have to be made up to be biased. Bias is about the lens the presenters are filtering the information through.

Playing only the part of the Obama endorsement video where he talked about Bernie is bias.
Saying that Bernie has no place to disavow the comments of his former staffer is biased.
Presenting that it is a matter of fact that Obama led to Trump as opposed to other factors is a bias.

You were the one who compared them to Fox, which actually does make shyt up. I understand that Krystal Ball is a progressive. Joy Reid and Rachel Maddow are centrists. But what's in issue is which policies work best. Is Krystal "biased" in your eyes if she's promoting policies which scientists back as being sound, like on climate change? The difference is Fox "news" is not credible. That's why the analogy fails.

I get news from a large multitude of places. I read mainstream, I read blogs, I'll go on message boards, and I'll talk to people. I do everything for both sides as much as I can. So I will look at what Politico or NPR says and then I will check out National Review, and then I will talk to people around me. I've lived in NY, Philly, Denver, and TX. I have access to a fairly wide swath of political viewpoints in my friend group.

Yeah, I read HuffPost, NY Times, NYDN, NY Post, Newsday, Politico. I still watch CNN and MSNBC. But I also do read more left leaning publications like Pro Publica and The Intercept. Noam Chomsky is my hero. The Youtube news sources/op-ed are Democracy Now! for straight news (highly recommended) and The Majority Report with Sam Seder for the combination of straight news, guest interviews, and of course "The Fun Half."

You seem to be more on the incrementalist train whereas I strongly believe that the establishment Democrats have gotton too comfortable (and rich) and therefore won't make the necessary changes in the status quo which are needed for use to survive as a middle class.

Have you ever marched for anything?

Regardless of how I feel about the policies of each candidate, or my comfort with incrementalism or what I have or have not marched for, that is not the part of my worldview you should be interested in if you want to get to the heart of my values.

The reality is that either a Democrat or a Republican will be president, and that person will get to shape the foreign and domestic agenda and appoint judges.

I'd always rather it be a Democrat. Regardless of my disagreements with that Democrat, I will always have more in common with them than the Republican.

Those are the only 2 options we have. So I pick the one I prefer.

I come from the school of "if you don't vote, you don't get to complain". I acknowledge that not everyone believes that, but I do.

I already said that this election comes down to getting Trump out for me. That's it. I didn't care if Biden, or Bernie, or a glass of milk was the nominee. I'm voting against Trump. I also don't care if Trump advocates for policies I like. He's a cancer and he needs to go.

If Ted Cruz was the only other option, I would trip over myself to get to the ballot box and vote for him.

I don't really see candidates this cycle. I see Trump and not Trump.

When the reality is that there are only 2 options, I play the hand I'm dealt. Sure, I would have preferred some cards over others, but that's not the way the game works.

[GONYK]

That's cool. You don't need us. I get it. It's nice to be wanted but just like Biden said over and over again during the primary "If you don't like me, vote for the other guy." I guess I just have to accept it. You guys don't need us. So, we'll sit this one out. Who wants to go out in public to vote and get COVID-19 anyhow?

Here's a good video on where the establishment social democrats are at.

Watch on YouTube

Well, this is a beautiful example of the biased news you post that I mentioned earlier. This is basically Fox News for the progressive left

They are even starting to turn on Bernie. For shame.

If some progressives want to take their ball and go home, that is 100% their right. That's how a democracy works.

It's just a strange position to take to feel entitled to all the policy changes that Bernie championed when an overwhelming majority of people did not vote for Bernie or were swayed by his policy.

I like Bernie Sanders but some of his supporters are the absolute worst.

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The Krystal Ball tweet is patently absurd.

The other two I can understand, even if that Kyle Kulinski guy is a bit of a tool.

[Stannis]

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The last tweet is fair. A large base of Bernie's supporters wanted those things. If Biden isn't offering those, why would they vote for him if they are voting on policy?

I know it this continues to surprise some, but beating Trump is not the #1 priority for A LOT of citizens. Some rank policy higher. Lot of Americans don't identify with a party, so they aren't just going to vote for Biden just to beat Trump or because Bernie told them to.

[Stannis]

A lot of my right wing family and friends are butthurt Bernie endorsed Biden. They are basically rehashing what Tucker Carlson and Fox News have been saying ("Bernie is a coward, he bends, he's a loser, he's a fraud"). They took a step further and called him a "cuck". They are pissed because they wanted Bernie to start some third party movement right now. It's a pretty clear divide-and-conquer tactic being pushed by righties.

People forget Bernie ran as a democrat. Bernie already said he would endorse whoever the democrat nominee was. He ranks beating Trump higher than the anti-establishment movement. What did people really expect? I get people are going to vote third party this election because they are about policy over beating Trump. But we can't act like Bernie's main mission was to take down the establishment.

Hell Cruz and Trump went at each other when they were running, but both endorsed each other. Why? Because they still want to beat the other party. Same chit with Bernie and Biden, though they never had a heated relationship.

[Capn'O]

Bernie essentially consolidated the left wing of the party with the Greens. The Greens never did vote Democrat. Why would they now?

The majority of Sanders supporters will ultimately vote with pragmatism. I think the emphasis on those that won't is way overdone and probably alienating to that much larger sector of voters.