Mikal Bridges says LeBron would get 90 a game against 86' Celtics (Burning Bridges ?)

[og15]

why do people act like LeBron is not a freight train and wont get through McHale just like people walk through turnstile gates?

btw Jordan scored 19pts against them in the next game and I guarantee that wouldn't ever happen to LeBron, he would be an automatic 30 and 10 assists

You guarantee that something that has already happened to young LeBron would never happen to him? 22 year old LeBron was not an automatic 30/10 against any defense in the post-season.

In the 2007 playoffs, the Cavs lost game 1 vs the 41-41 Nets ranked 15th in Ortg, he had 18 points. Heck, after he dropped 48 on the Pistons, he had 20 pts on 3/11 FG. They win the game, but that's because his team was better than what Jordan had in 86 and the opponent was much inferior.

The Celtics were 1st in Drtg in 85-86, they gave up 102.6 pts/100. The 06-07 Pistons were 7th in Drtg and gave up 104.2 pts/100.

Lebron is a great player, but Jordan is a superior individual scorer and certainly was more so when both were younger. LeBron's jumpshooting was very inconsistent and he didn't trust it, that was even true with him part of the way into his prime let alone at 22. Jordan vs Boston that season is more comparable to LeBron vs the Spurs in the finals if we're actually talking about the level of the team and their level of defense.

The Celtics had Parish and Walton in the middle, they would probably put someone like DJ on him, but even McHale would be fine, because against 22 year old LeBron you're playing off him, you know the help will be there and you're making him a shooter. He was not a dynamic scorer at that stage, Jordan was much more so. He would almost certainly have a more difficult time against the Celtics than Jordan at that age with that level of a supporting cast.

None of that is a dig against LeBron, it's simply a reality of comparing both players at that stage in their careers and understanding their skillset.

I guaranteed that it would never happen to LeBron playing against the 86 Celtics

all you need to do is clear everyone out and he will go to work, its not going to look as cute as jordan but its going to look like a guy a generation ahead of everyone else

Part of the reasons that top defenses are top defenses is that they maximize the rules to their benefit. Just like teams are in the key more than 3 seconds multiple times a game, similarly, teams circumvented illegal defense rules as much as they could. Packing the paint was a common tactic, the best teams knew how to do it effectively. Part of the reason more tall big men were useful and could stay on the court in the past is that they did not have to leave the paint on defense, there was no counting and coming out, this makes it a lot easier for a rim protector on defense. Even after they had to start doing that, teams didn't switch hunt or have as many 3PT shooting bigs. They had a much easier time being in position against a drive and didn't have to move as much.

Also we're not sending 22 year Lebron to 85-86 with multiple 3PT shooters to space the floor and 2020 offensive strategies, that makes no sense. The comparison has to make sense. This would be Lebron on a team that takes around 3-4 3PA/G and with 80's strategies. This is not saying 22 year old couldn't have good games, but Lebron is not as shifty as Jordan, he's not a guy that slices and dices the defense to get an opening to score as much, and he generally attacks in a more straightforward manner. Then add that at that stage with his weak and unreliable jump-shot that he himself didn't trust, it would not be a good matchup for him individually and certainly not better than it was for Jordan at the same age. Jordan did a lot of damage getting to the line when he scored 63 points, but a lot of it was also on jumpshots off the dribble and pulling up, that was not a strength for Lebron.

Lebron would similarly be able to force switches and attack good matchups to score, he would certainly be capable of dropping a big scoring game on them by getting to the basket and to the line, but he would be less efficient than Jordan in the possessions where he's unable to get to the basket or to the line.

[so_bored]

Lol. Yep. Say that to the poster above who believes LeBron wouldn’t generate more than 5 shots per game in the paint in the 80s. An era where far inferior players lived in the paint. But no not LeBron, what a total scrub.

Lol you're one of those guys that just look at the raw number and think apples and oranges are the same. If you didn't know, Lebron likes to initiate from the top of the key. Whether he is passing or scoring, he always tries to drive lane. However, you seem to not get that lanes were absolutely clogged up in the 80s and 90s making it much more difficult for someone like Lebron to operate. Also, unlike many perimeter players back then, Lebron is not a slasher off ball to receive more looks near the rim. He would have to settle for post ups, but he is not a comfortable back to the rim player. He is and has always been a front of the rim player. Many of the inferior players you mentioned lived and roamed near the paint by moving without the ball constantly and received the ball close to the hoop to begin with, unlike Lebron who always has the ball and starts from the top. But keep counting your apples and oranges together buddy.

Lmao. So many inaccuracies and inferences about my basketball approach. Keep going dude.

Lmao, all you can do is lmao, lol, etc, with nothing back to argue. Are you a kid? At least your emoji's are gone. How were you once a mod? What a disgrace to all mods.

[magicman1978]

I don't understand why people think it would be fair to take someone today - with the advantage of having access to the best trainers, nutritionists, supplements, doctors, etc. (especially with the amount they get paid and the investments teams make now) and just time travel that player back into the past. That's like playing the free version of COD Warzone and coming up against a squad that has their full loadout unlocked from the full game. It's an uneven playing field.

[jrask]

Lebron would do great against the 86 Celtics

but, like MJ..... he would be swept by that team (with the same squad that MJ had)

[SeattleJazzFan]

he's right.

[mademan]

people really think a league that played faster and called fouls at a higher rate would be worse for Lebron?

[The Rodzilla]

Part of the reasons that top defenses are top defenses is that they maximize the rules to their benefit. Just like teams are in the key more than 3 seconds multiple times a game, similarly, teams circumvented illegal defense rules as much as they could. Packing the paint was a common tactic, the best teams knew how to do it effectively. Part of the reason more tall big men were useful and could stay on the court in the past is that they did not have to leave the paint on defense, there was no counting and coming out, this makes it a lot easier for a rim protector on defense. Even after they had to start doing that, teams didn't switch hunt or have as many 3PT shooting bigs. They had a much easier time being in position against a drive and didn't have to move as much.

Also we're not sending 22 year Lebron to 85-86 with multiple 3PT shooters to space the floor and 2020 offensive strategies, that makes no sense. The comparison has to make sense. This would be Lebron on a team that takes around 3-4 3PA/G and with 80's strategies. This is not saying 22 year old couldn't have good games, but Lebron is not as shifty as Jordan, he's not a guy that slices and dices the defense to get an opening to score as much, and he generally attacks in a more straightforward manner. Then add that at that stage with his weak and unreliable jump-shot that he himself didn't trust, it would not be a good matchup for him individually and certainly not better than it was for Jordan at the same age. Jordan did a lot of damage getting to the line when he scored 63 points, but a lot of it was also on jumpshots off the dribble and pulling up, that was not a strength for Lebron.

I don't care about if they can shoot or not, send anybody out there, the defence has to act like they are not playing zone, so they have to clear out as well and will spend their time judging when the best time is to collapse, LeBron will punish them

Watch on YouTube

im watched the highlights of the Jordan 63pt game and the only reason the help arrived or they packed the paint was because jordans teammates are standing close enough for them to do it

[og15]

Part of the reasons that top defenses are top defenses is that they maximize the rules to their benefit. Just like teams are in the key more than 3 seconds multiple times a game, similarly, teams circumvented illegal defense rules as much as they could. Packing the paint was a common tactic, the best teams knew how to do it effectively. Part of the reason more tall big men were useful and could stay on the court in the past is that they did not have to leave the paint on defense, there was no counting and coming out, this makes it a lot easier for a rim protector on defense. Even after they had to start doing that, teams didn't switch hunt or have as many 3PT shooting bigs. They had a much easier time being in position against a drive and didn't have to move as much.

Also we're not sending 22 year Lebron to 85-86 with multiple 3PT shooters to space the floor and 2020 offensive strategies, that makes no sense. The comparison has to make sense. This would be Lebron on a team that takes around 3-4 3PA/G and with 80's strategies. This is not saying 22 year old couldn't have good games, but Lebron is not as shifty as Jordan, he's not a guy that slices and dices the defense to get an opening to score as much, and he generally attacks in a more straightforward manner. Then add that at that stage with his weak and unreliable jump-shot that he himself didn't trust, it would not be a good matchup for him individually and certainly not better than it was for Jordan at the same age. Jordan did a lot of damage getting to the line when he scored 63 points, but a lot of it was also on jumpshots off the dribble and pulling up, that was not a strength for Lebron.

I don't care about if they can shoot or not, send anybody out there, the defence has to act like they are not playing zone, so they have to clear out as well and will spend their time judging when the best time is to collapse, LeBron will punish them

Watch on YouTube

im watched the highlights of the Jordan 63pt game and the only reason the help arrived or they packed the paint was because jordans teammates are standing close enough for them to do it

So you believe Lebron's 1986 teammates would be spreading the floor like his teams in the 2000's? Lol

[The Rodzilla]

Part of the reasons that top defenses are top defenses is that they maximize the rules to their benefit. Just like teams are in the key more than 3 seconds multiple times a game, similarly, teams circumvented illegal defense rules as much as they could. Packing the paint was a common tactic, the best teams knew how to do it effectively. Part of the reason more tall big men were useful and could stay on the court in the past is that they did not have to leave the paint on defense, there was no counting and coming out, this makes it a lot easier for a rim protector on defense. Even after they had to start doing that, teams didn't switch hunt or have as many 3PT shooting bigs. They had a much easier time being in position against a drive and didn't have to move as much.

Also we're not sending 22 year Lebron to 85-86 with multiple 3PT shooters to space the floor and 2020 offensive strategies, that makes no sense. The comparison has to make sense. This would be Lebron on a team that takes around 3-4 3PA/G and with 80's strategies. This is not saying 22 year old couldn't have good games, but Lebron is not as shifty as Jordan, he's not a guy that slices and dices the defense to get an opening to score as much, and he generally attacks in a more straightforward manner. Then add that at that stage with his weak and unreliable jump-shot that he himself didn't trust, it would not be a good matchup for him individually and certainly not better than it was for Jordan at the same age. Jordan did a lot of damage getting to the line when he scored 63 points, but a lot of it was also on jumpshots off the dribble and pulling up, that was not a strength for Lebron.

I don't care about if they can shoot or not, send anybody out there, the defence has to act like they are not playing zone, so they have to clear out as well and will spend their time judging when the best time is to collapse, LeBron will punish them

Watch on YouTube

im watched the highlights of the Jordan 63pt game and the only reason the help arrived or they packed the paint was because jordans teammates are standing close enough for them to do it

So you believe Lebron's 1986 teammates would be spreading the floor like his teams in the 2000's? Lol

yes, get a 500ib former sumo wrestler standing out there if you want, the defence have to stand out there with him or double team LeBron

are you telling me with your guy standing in the corner 3 that you can stand 15ft away from him near the paint waiting for LeBron?, or even worse 2 or 3 guys doing that?

how do you achieve this?

[Leslie Forman]

All this talk of so-and-so would score 50 a game in whatever era is stupid. Basketball scoring just doesn't work like that and hasn't since Wilt in the early '60s.

What is valid IMO is that mediocre wings of today would probably be regular 20-25+, All-Star level wings back then. Random wings with so-so handles, no three-point range and not even much of a low post game could average around 20PPG back then. Even wings who are stuck being 3-D guys today are better ballhandlers and shooters than a lot of those guys were.

I don't understand why people think it would be fair to take someone today - with the advantage of having access to the best trainers, nutritionists, supplements, doctors, etc. (especially with the amount they get paid and the investments teams make now) and just time travel that player back into the past. That's like playing the free version of COD Warzone and coming up against a squad that has their full loadout unlocked from the full game. It's an uneven playing field.

And back then you could take all the steroids you wanted to.

[magicman1978]

All this talk of so-and-so would score 50 a game in whatever era is stupid. Basketball scoring just doesn't work like that and hasn't since Wilt in the early '60s.

What is valid IMO is that mediocre wings of today would probably be regular 20-25+, All-Star level wings back then. Random wings with so-so handles, no three-point range and not even much of a low post game could average around 20PPG back then. Even wings who are stuck being 3-D guys today are better ballhandlers and shooters than a lot of those guys were.

I don't understand why people think it would be fair to take someone today - with the advantage of having access to the best trainers, nutritionists, supplements, doctors, etc. (especially with the amount they get paid and the investments teams make now) and just time travel that player back into the past. That's like playing the free version of COD Warzone and coming up against a squad that has their full loadout unlocked from the full game. It's an uneven playing field.

And back then you could take all the steroids you wanted to.

And the type of steroids that were available and known to them would have done nothing for them in basketball. Players today have access to much better supplements, legal and illegal.

[so_bored]

I don't care about if they can shoot or not, send anybody out there, the defence has to act like they are not playing zone, so they have to clear out as well and will spend their time judging when the best time is to collapse, LeBron will punish them

Watch on YouTube

im watched the highlights of the Jordan 63pt game and the only reason the help arrived or they packed the paint was because jordans teammates are standing close enough for them to do it

So you believe Lebron's 1986 teammates would be spreading the floor like his teams in the 2000's? Lol

yes, get a 500ib former sumo wrestler standing out there if you want, the defence have to stand out there with him or double team LeBron

are you telling me with your guy standing in the corner 3 that you can stand 15ft away from him near the paint waiting for LeBron?, or even worse 2 or 3 guys doing that?

how do you achieve this?

You obviously have no idea how illegal defense works. It doesn't mean defenders have to be right next to the guy standing out in the perimeter. Defenders were allowed to sag off them as much as near the free throw line. Hence, free throw line and below was always jammed regardless who was on the floor.

[dacrusha]

I don't understand why people think it would be fair to take someone today - with the advantage of having access to the best trainers, nutritionists, supplements, doctors, etc. (especially with the amount they get paid and the investments teams make now) and just time travel that player back into the past. That's like playing the free version of COD Warzone and coming up against a squad that has their full loadout unlocked from the full game. It's an uneven playing field.

Of course it’s an uneven playing field... but the real curiosity of this thread is that there are people that argue that the greatest player of this era would be stymied and held in check by players from an era of lesser talent, skill, athleticism, training, diet, and health.

It’s like saying Wayne Gretzky would struggle vs players from the 50s or the modern day Yankees would have a difficult time with the 1927 version.

[Leslie Forman]

All this talk of so-and-so would score 50 a game in whatever era is stupid. Basketball scoring just doesn't work like that and hasn't since Wilt in the early '60s.

What is valid IMO is that mediocre wings of today would probably be regular 20-25+, All-Star level wings back then. Random wings with so-so handles, no three-point range and not even much of a low post game could average around 20PPG back then. Even wings who are stuck being 3-D guys today are better ballhandlers and shooters than a lot of those guys were.

I don't understand why people think it would be fair to take someone today - with the advantage of having access to the best trainers, nutritionists, supplements, doctors, etc. (especially with the amount they get paid and the investments teams make now) and just time travel that player back into the past. That's like playing the free version of COD Warzone and coming up against a squad that has their full loadout unlocked from the full game. It's an uneven playing field.

And back then you could take all the steroids you wanted to.

And the type of steroids that were available and known to them would have done nothing for them in basketball. Players today have access to much better supplements, legal and illegal.

"Nothing for them in basketball" LOL yeah I guess some people still refuse to face reality.

And I can guarantee you if players had a choice, they would rather have '80s-'90s steroids with literally NO oversight rather than have to deal with all the hoops they have to go through now to piss clean. Flo Jo's records STILL haven't been beaten.

[magicman1978]

I don't understand why people think it would be fair to take someone today - with the advantage of having access to the best trainers, nutritionists, supplements, doctors, etc. (especially with the amount they get paid and the investments teams make now) and just time travel that player back into the past. That's like playing the free version of COD Warzone and coming up against a squad that has their full loadout unlocked from the full game. It's an uneven playing field.

Of course it’s an uneven playing field... but the real curiosity of this thread is that there are people that argue that the greatest player of this era would be stymied and held in check by players from an era of lesser talent, skill, athleticism, training, diet, and health.

It’s like saying Wayne Gretzky would struggle vs players from the 50s or the modern day Yankees would have a difficult time with the 1927 version.

If you time travel him back, LeBron would destroy the competition. Anyone who thinks otherwise is being biased. But I don't like the comparison. Just like when people say so and so would struggle today because they couldn't shoot the three. A time travel scenario is not fair to past players.

[The Rodzilla]

So you believe Lebron's 1986 teammates would be spreading the floor like his teams in the 2000's? Lol

yes, get a 500ib former sumo wrestler standing out there if you want, the defence have to stand out there with him or double team LeBron

are you telling me with your guy standing in the corner 3 that you can stand 15ft away from him near the paint waiting for LeBron?, or even worse 2 or 3 guys doing that?

how do you achieve this?

You obviously have no idea how illegal defense works. It doesn't mean defenders have to be right next to the guy standing out in the perimeter. Defenders were allowed to sag off them as much as near the free throw line. Hence, free throw line and below was always jammed regardless who was on the floor.

what are you talking about you cant sag off 15ft and if you can then im sending my teammates back to curry 3pt range

the distance you had to remain near your man is exactly the same as defensive 3 seconds now, sure you can get away with some stuff but not stay away and make it obvious

[magicman1978]

All this talk of so-and-so would score 50 a game in whatever era is stupid. Basketball scoring just doesn't work like that and hasn't since Wilt in the early '60s.

What is valid IMO is that mediocre wings of today would probably be regular 20-25+, All-Star level wings back then. Random wings with so-so handles, no three-point range and not even much of a low post game could average around 20PPG back then. Even wings who are stuck being 3-D guys today are better ballhandlers and shooters than a lot of those guys were.


And back then you could take all the steroids you wanted to.

And the type of steroids that were available and known to them would have done nothing for them in basketball. Players today have access to much better supplements, legal and illegal.

"Nothing for them in basketball" LOL yeah I guess some people still refuse to face reality.

And I can guarantee you if players had a choice, they would rather have '80s-'90s steroids with literally NO oversight rather than have to deal with all the hoops they have to go through now to piss clean. Flo Jo's records STILL haven't been beaten.

Your statement shows a lot of ignorance in terms of advancement of sports nutrition and training. No basketball player would rather have 80s steroids to what is available to them today. Unless you think Basketball players themselves have advanced so much in the last 35 years, while medical and training advancements have stagnated.

[MikeM]

Lebron would score 90 a game in 1986. But if you take McHale, Parish, Bird and Co. and let them train for years from 2000 to 2020, Lebron would not score 90 on them.

That's all it comes down to.

[Leslie Forman]

And the type of steroids that were available and known to them would have done nothing for them in basketball. Players today have access to much better supplements, legal and illegal.

"Nothing for them in basketball" LOL yeah I guess some people still refuse to face reality.

And I can guarantee you if players had a choice, they would rather have '80s-'90s steroids with literally NO oversight rather than have to deal with all the hoops they have to go through now to piss clean. Flo Jo's records STILL haven't been beaten.

Your statement shows a lot of ignorance in terms of advancement of sports nutrition and training. No basketball player would rather have 80s steroids to what is available to them today. Unless you think Basketball players themselves have advanced so much in the last 35 years, while medical and training advancements have stagnated.

Unlimited testosterone and EPO with absolutely no oversight? Yeah who needs that.

[magicman1978]

"Nothing for them in basketball" LOL yeah I guess some people still refuse to face reality.

And I can guarantee you if players had a choice, they would rather have '80s-'90s steroids with literally NO oversight rather than have to deal with all the hoops they have to go through now to piss clean. Flo Jo's records STILL haven't been beaten.

Your statement shows a lot of ignorance in terms of advancement of sports nutrition and training. No basketball player would rather have 80s steroids to what is available to them today. Unless you think Basketball players themselves have advanced so much in the last 35 years, while medical and training advancements have stagnated.

Unlimited testosterone and EPO with absolutely no oversight? Yeah who needs that.

Modern day nutrition, supplements, training, PEDs - no thanks. Give me those 80s steroids instead and it'll do all the work for me.