2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 3)

[RHODEY]

That Dallas pick next year is going to be lottery. Luka took the league by surprise this year and they got off to a hot start.

ONE injury to Doncic and we’re looking at a top 10 pick. You already know KP will be in and out all year.

This guy thinks we may use those picks to trade for a disgruntled star...he floated Hield, CP3,and Gobert as possibilities.

Watch on YouTube

[CoreyVillains]

Just dropped a 17 minute breakdown on Tyrese Maxey on my YouTube that you can watch below. I really like Maxey as a prospect. His shot is easily correctable as he just needs to raise his release point. He’s a brilliant finisher at the rim and he’s got so much craft to his game. Defensively I think he’ll be a stud. I think he’s gonna be another Kentucky guard that ends up showing more in the pros. Totally see the Kyle Lowry/Jrue Holiday upside out of him.

Watch on YouTube

[Tron Carter]

Obi has been moved into top 3 across most mock drafts with his landing spot being either Minny or Cleveland. Makes sense for both teams assuming at least one of them stays in the top 3 after the lotto

imagine the defense of topin, towns, and russell sharing the same court

[HEZI]

Obi has been moved into top 3 across most mock drafts with his landing spot being either Minny or Cleveland. Makes sense for both teams assuming at least one of them stays in the top 3 after the lotto

imagine the defense of topin, towns, and russell sharing the same court

Imagine trying to match up with them defensively. That front court duo would be a nightmare to match up with. Towns shoots over 40% from outside on high volume, he's the best shooting big in the league, then you add Obi who is almost as versatile as him, good luck trying to outscore them and that goes out to any front court out there.

[HarthorneWingo]

Kira Lewis can low key be one of the best guards in the draft. Was watching more footage of him and I’m very intrigued.

The only thing I worry about him is he's like 165 pounds. Can he bulk up enough to not be completely bullied on defense? He probably needs to get up close to 200 pounds. That might slow him down some.

It's possible. The player he's compared to the most Fox,weighed similar to him in college as well. (Fox: 169 lbs, Lewis: 165 lbs) Fox has bulked up since then and still has his speed. Lewis could still be the same way

I did think of Fox. But I recall him a 175. Whatever, that's a tiny guard. At least with someone like Nate, he was strong with a low center of gravity. Kira will be like a mosquito to a center rolling to the hoop.

What about Okungwu or that Precious guy?

[RHODEY]

The only thing I worry about him is he's like 165 pounds. Can he bulk up enough to not be completely bullied on defense? He probably needs to get up close to 200 pounds. That might slow him down some.

It's possible. The player he's compared to the most Fox,weighed similar to him in college as well. (Fox: 169 lbs, Lewis: 165 lbs) Fox has bulked up since then and still has his speed. Lewis could still be the same way

I did think of Fox. But I recall him a 175. Whatever, that's a tiny guard. At least with someone like Nate, he was strong with a low center of gravity. Kira will be like a mosquito to a center rolling to the hoop.

What about Okungwu or that Precious guy?

Ja Morant is doing fine.. and he's pretty slight.

[moocow007]

That Dallas pick next year is going to be lottery. Luka took the league by surprise this year and they got off to a hot start.

ONE injury to Doncic and we’re looking at a top 10 pick. You already know KP will be in and out all year.

Maybe the Knicks should hire Tonya Harding?

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[moocow007]

Obi has been moved into top 3 across most mock drafts with his landing spot being either Minny or Cleveland. Makes sense for both teams assuming at least one of them stays in the top 3 after the lotto

imagine the defense of topin, towns, and russell sharing the same court

I'm also imagining when Towns and Russell freezes out Obi on the offensive end and thereby making Obi totally useless.

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[moocow007]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Honestly, Smith looks better in their respective vids.

[moocow007]

Damn forgot about those Dallas picks...

They aren't going to amount to much. They've got Luka and Porzingis locked up long term and a ton of cap space after the upcoming season. Dallas has a strong stable front office, is in a large city, nice weather, has no state tax and already has 2 young stars on it. They'll be able to attract another start to team with the 2 they have (both of whom should be hitting their peak) in the season leading up to the 'unprotected' 1st that Dallas owes the Knicks. Those picks are Fool's Gold. Steve Mills was the Fool and the picks are the Gold. This is the image I have in my head of how the other 29 GM's in the NBA reacted to the news of Steve Mills firing.

Don't care if they are in the 20's. They are cost free assets until drafted, then, X amount of cost controlled, cheap talent after drafted (if Knicks retain those picks)

Not going to re-litigate the KP trade, and Mills sucked and Perry no great shakes, but getting a couple of first round picks, even not great ones, is a positive.
Obviously, how well they scout in that range those years, luck in the draft, luck around any Dallas misfortune, ability to swing a trade with one or both of those picks, that that trade be good, etc all play into just HOW positive it was to get them, but getting extra 1st round picks, even low ones, in the 2 Dallas picks and then the Clippers pick, are positive moves in the right direction for the Knicks.
Even though signing journeyman JAGS, while how they were used sucked, the fact that longer term cap space was maintained (minus Randle - even not bad) was also a positive step.

Might be "GM'ing 101" or "Basics of competent NBA team management" but for the Knicks, that's kind of a big deal.

Which of course they'll probably screw up massively.

Obviously some picks are better than no picks and even late 1sr picks have value in and of itself. The problem is when you factor in the value of what you traded to what you ultimately gained in this case its really not an overall plus in value. Look. The Knicks basically squandered their best player since Ewing by completely misreading the free agency market. They also misread the ability of Dennis Smith Jr to handle the pressure of playing in NY. We can all try to spin it but Dennis Smith Jr was the big get, not the draft picks one of which is protected. So yes Luka Doncic could be a flash in the pan thatll be injury prone and those 2 picks can be lottery just like RJ Barrett can be a taller more athletic James Harden.

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[Knicksfan1992]

That Dallas pick next year is going to be lottery. Luka took the league by surprise this year and they got off to a hot start.

ONE injury to Doncic and we’re looking at a top 10 pick. You already know KP will be in and out all year.

This guy thinks we may use those picks to trade for a disgruntled star...he floated Hield, CP3,and Gobert as possibilities.

Watch on YouTube

Hield would be great. I think there's some hidden scoring ability in him still that gets hidden by Fox dominating the ball a lot.

Kind of dude we can bring in who fits with our young core, put up some numbers and then eventually use to get a real superstar or if you hit in the draft he's a very easy fit next to other stars because he's one of the most deadly spot up threats in the league.

[thebuzzardman]

They aren't going to amount to much. They've got Luka and Porzingis locked up long term and a ton of cap space after the upcoming season. Dallas has a strong stable front office, is in a large city, nice weather, has no state tax and already has 2 young stars on it. They'll be able to attract another start to team with the 2 they have (both of whom should be hitting their peak) in the season leading up to the 'unprotected' 1st that Dallas owes the Knicks. Those picks are Fool's Gold. Steve Mills was the Fool and the picks are the Gold. This is the image I have in my head of how the other 29 GM's in the NBA reacted to the news of Steve Mills firing.

Don't care if they are in the 20's. They are cost free assets until drafted, then, X amount of cost controlled, cheap talent after drafted (if Knicks retain those picks)

Not going to re-litigate the KP trade, and Mills sucked and Perry no great shakes, but getting a couple of first round picks, even not great ones, is a positive.
Obviously, how well they scout in that range those years, luck in the draft, luck around any Dallas misfortune, ability to swing a trade with one or both of those picks, that that trade be good, etc all play into just HOW positive it was to get them, but getting extra 1st round picks, even low ones, in the 2 Dallas picks and then the Clippers pick, are positive moves in the right direction for the Knicks.
Even though signing journeyman JAGS, while how they were used sucked, the fact that longer term cap space was maintained (minus Randle - even not bad) was also a positive step.

Might be "GM'ing 101" or "Basics of competent NBA team management" but for the Knicks, that's kind of a big deal.

Which of course they'll probably screw up massively.

Obviously some picks are better than no picks and even late 1sr picks have value in and of itself. The problem is when you factor in the value of what you traded to what you ultimately gained in this case its really not an overall plus in value. Look. The Knicks basically squandered their best player since Ewing by completely misreading the free agency market. They also misread the ability of Dennis Smith Jr to handle the pressure of playing in NY. We can all try to spin it but Dennis Smith Jr was the big get, not the draft picks one of which is protected. So yes Luka Doncic could be a flash in the pan thatll be injury prone and those 2 picks can be lottery just like RJ Barrett can be a taller more athletic James Harden.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

It doesn't matter to me what KP becomes etc. I wasn't saying the trade was "really good" or "good" or "edge Knicks" or "edge Mavs" etc.
I was just saying the Knicks got picks back in a trade, and even low-ish 1st round picks have decent value, being assets that don't cost a cent on the cap (until drafted), being cheap and cost controlled once drafted, possibly will resemble some low rotation guys (need some luck/skill there), and that accumulating extra 1st round picks to facilitate deals or cheap depth is what good teams do.

At least the Knicks starting showing some signs of how decent teams operate.

Obviously, we can say "decent teams don't trade away their best player for meh deals" but I said I wasn't here to re-litigate the KP trade, just that getting picks back in two separate trades and also being prudent with cap space are things that good teams do. The Knicks needs to make it work and we all know their capacity to f*ck up anything is extremely high.

[thebuzzardman]

It's possible. The player he's compared to the most Fox,weighed similar to him in college as well. (Fox: 169 lbs, Lewis: 165 lbs) Fox has bulked up since then and still has his speed. Lewis could still be the same way

I did think of Fox. But I recall him a 175. Whatever, that's a tiny guard. At least with someone like Nate, he was strong with a low center of gravity. Kira will be like a mosquito to a center rolling to the hoop.

What about Okungwu or that Precious guy?

Ja Morant is doing fine.. and he's pretty slight.

Trey Young not exactly brolic either

To wingo about a player being a "mosquito to a C"

The NBA has been about encouraging offense and discouraging defense for about 20 years now. Please try to pay attention. The rules are constantly being tweaked so that skills players and smaller players can shine, over bigs.

Actually, I'd say the genesis of this starts with the ABA/NBA merger. And the trend has been heading that way ever since.

[moocow007]

Don't care if they are in the 20's. They are cost free assets until drafted, then, X amount of cost controlled, cheap talent after drafted (if Knicks retain those picks)

Not going to re-litigate the KP trade, and Mills sucked and Perry no great shakes, but getting a couple of first round picks, even not great ones, is a positive.
Obviously, how well they scout in that range those years, luck in the draft, luck around any Dallas misfortune, ability to swing a trade with one or both of those picks, that that trade be good, etc all play into just HOW positive it was to get them, but getting extra 1st round picks, even low ones, in the 2 Dallas picks and then the Clippers pick, are positive moves in the right direction for the Knicks.
Even though signing journeyman JAGS, while how they were used sucked, the fact that longer term cap space was maintained (minus Randle - even not bad) was also a positive step.

Might be "GM'ing 101" or "Basics of competent NBA team management" but for the Knicks, that's kind of a big deal.

Which of course they'll probably screw up massively.

Obviously some picks are better than no picks and even late 1sr picks have value in and of itself. The problem is when you factor in the value of what you traded to what you ultimately gained in this case its really not an overall plus in value. Look. The Knicks basically squandered their best player since Ewing by completely misreading the free agency market. They also misread the ability of Dennis Smith Jr to handle the pressure of playing in NY. We can all try to spin it but Dennis Smith Jr was the big get, not the draft picks one of which is protected. So yes Luka Doncic could be a flash in the pan thatll be injury prone and those 2 picks can be lottery just like RJ Barrett can be a taller more athletic James Harden.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

It doesn't matter to me what KP becomes etc. I wasn't saying the trade was "really good" or "good" or "edge Knicks" or "edge Mavs" etc.
I was just saying the Knicks got picks back in a trade, and even low-ish 1st round picks have decent value, being assets that don't cost a cent on the cap (until drafted), being cheap and cost controlled once drafted, possibly will resemble some low rotation guys (need some luck/skill there), and that accumulating extra 1st round picks to facilitate deals or cheap depth is what good teams do.

At least the Knicks starting showing some signs of how decent teams operate.

Obviously, we can say "decent teams don't trade away their best player for meh deals" but I said I wasn't here to re-litigate the KP trade, just that getting picks back in two separate trades and also being prudent with cap space are things that good teams do. The Knicks needs to make it work and we all know their capacity to f*ck up anything is extremely high.

I don't think you and I are arguing about the same types of deals in terms of the usefulness of these specific Dallas 1st round picks and therefore may be in agreement on the value of those picks and having picks being a good thing.

My original statement was referencing the notion of trades where these 1st round picks are "THE" meat and potatoes of a trade that would net the Knicks something significant. Yes of course these 1st round picks have value and could be used to acquire needed depth or can be included as additional incentives to facilitate a trade. My point again is that they are very unlikely going to be the front end (main) component of a trade that will get the Knicks something significant. By significant I'm talking about someone in the star level range that is not being paid a bazillion dollars and already over the hill. Yes, I'm sure if the Knicks are wiling to trade the picks that the Thunder, for example, would entertain trading CP3 and his $40+ million per year contract to the Knicks, for example. But we aren't going to get any in their prime stars with a deal that basically is these picks and salary fillers unless and until, either one of these picks ends up being a lottery pick (or similar valued pick) which I've said, is very unlikely given the current situation in Dallas.

[thebuzzardman]

Obviously some picks are better than no picks and even late 1sr picks have value in and of itself. The problem is when you factor in the value of what you traded to what you ultimately gained in this case its really not an overall plus in value. Look. The Knicks basically squandered their best player since Ewing by completely misreading the free agency market. They also misread the ability of Dennis Smith Jr to handle the pressure of playing in NY. We can all try to spin it but Dennis Smith Jr was the big get, not the draft picks one of which is protected. So yes Luka Doncic could be a flash in the pan thatll be injury prone and those 2 picks can be lottery just like RJ Barrett can be a taller more athletic James Harden.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

It doesn't matter to me what KP becomes etc. I wasn't saying the trade was "really good" or "good" or "edge Knicks" or "edge Mavs" etc.
I was just saying the Knicks got picks back in a trade, and even low-ish 1st round picks have decent value, being assets that don't cost a cent on the cap (until drafted), being cheap and cost controlled once drafted, possibly will resemble some low rotation guys (need some luck/skill there), and that accumulating extra 1st round picks to facilitate deals or cheap depth is what good teams do.

At least the Knicks starting showing some signs of how decent teams operate.

Obviously, we can say "decent teams don't trade away their best player for meh deals" but I said I wasn't here to re-litigate the KP trade, just that getting picks back in two separate trades and also being prudent with cap space are things that good teams do. The Knicks needs to make it work and we all know their capacity to f*ck up anything is extremely high.

I don't think you and I are arguing about the same types of deals in terms of the usefulness of these specific Dallas 1st round picks and therefore may be in agreement on the value of those picks and having picks being a good thing.

My original statement was referencing the notion of trades where these 1st round picks are "THE" meat and potatoes of a trade that would net the Knicks something significant. Yes of course these 1st round picks have value and could be used to acquire needed depth or can be included as additional incentives to facilitate a trade. My point again is that they are very unlikely going to be the front end (main) component of a trade that will get the Knicks something significant. By significant I'm talking about someone in the star level range that is not being paid a bazillion dollars and already over the hill. Yes, I'm sure if the Knicks are wiling to trade the picks that the Thunder, for example, would entertain trading CP3 and his $40+ million per year contract to the Knicks, for example. But we aren't going to get any in their prime stars with a deal that basically is these picks and salary fillers unless and until, either one of these picks ends up being a lottery pick (or similar valued pick) which I've said, is very unlikely given the current situation in Dallas.

I think we are in agreement in all points and I agree with all the points you just made. The Knicks "back end of the first round" picks aren't going to be the way to make any major splash, unless, as you say, the Knicks take on salary, guy is aging (CP3 x2) etc.

It's more like having extra mediocre picks is the BEGINNING of something, a possible incremental step that might pan out.

To clarify - I didn't say it earlier - I've always viewed this picks as useful as trade sweetener - maybe the inclusion of one or two give the Knicks the edge over another team - or maybe a way to move up a couple of spots in a draft - from 8 to 6 or 7 to 5... to land the exact player they want still available - who knows.

It's just in the past the Knicks usually had no asset flexibility at ALL and were generally capped out. Now, I don't think the Knicks are sitting on a "hoard of picks" or are "excellent!" position, just that these things (extra picks and cap space) are generally sound and MIGHT lead somewhere decent.

Knicks would be a lot better off if they drafted better than Frank and Knox, two players I don't have anything against and who may pan out, to one degree or another, but imagining some universe where they had D. Mitchell, SGA, RJ, Meetch, Trier, DSJr and 7 picks in 4 years would a strong position

[robillionaire]

You can’t just write off these late first round picks. Sometimes the best players come from unexpected draft positions. Siakam was the 27th pick. Gobert was the 27th pick. Many such examples. Yes there is a lot of luck involved but you have to give yourself as many chances as possible. Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity, the Knicks will have to prepare by scouting property and make a smart pick and of course they will then have to follow through with proper player development which they have failed to do up to this point, but we can still maximize their opportunities to strike gold by getting as many picks as possible.

[HEZI]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Honestly, Smith looks better in their respective vids.

It does? To you? Yikes!

[Deeeez Knicks]

Kira Lewis can low key be one of the best guards in the draft. Was watching more footage of him and I’m very intrigued.

I actually prefer him over Cole.

Same

I like Kira too. He is a year younger then Cole too since he skipped a year of school. I was surprised when I heard that since he is a sophmore.

He has his flaws, but may have a lot of development time left. His jumper looks pretty good though and has the speed

[robillionaire]

I actually prefer him over Cole.

Same

I like Kira too. He is a year younger then Cole too since he skipped a year of school. I was surprised when I heard that since he is a sophmore.

He has his flaws, but may have a lot of development time left. His jumper looks pretty good though and has the speed

Yeah, he’s actually younger than a lot of the year one players. I would say he reminds me of sexton but that’s probably because they both played for Alabama

[robillionaire]

I think I wrote Kira off too early because I’ve only watched him play a few times in games against Kentucky and he was pretty bad in all 3 of those games, plus just that he was a year 2 guy

In his games against UK
Last season
4-14 12 pts
1-5 3 pts (sec tournament, then they lost to Norfolk st in the ncaa tournament and he again wasn’t impressive to me)
This season
4-11 10 pts

But looking at the game logs it appears these were some of his worst performances so I’ve been watching a lot of other highlight footage on him