Who are the good 1 on 1 Defenders MJ faced?

[Quattro]

Missing Byron Russell, 6'7, 220 from your list. He was a pretty good defender.

Come on guys! Get with the program. The point of this thread is not to list the (large) number of players that the OP didn't include on his list. The point of this thread is to once again point out how overrated Michael Jordan is.

[Shanghai Kid]

You can actually see Rodman guarding MJ in one of the playoff games where he makes a game winning shot.

Also, why are we thinking height is the key to defense? How tall is Tony Allen or Patrick Beverly?

The super high agenda posts trying to "expose" things are really out of control.

[LKN]

I feel like I've had to post this like 500 times over the years... but teams generally used smaller/quicker guys on MJ. Generally they preferred having MJ take jumpers over his defender instead of blowing by guys and getting to the rim.

Again - MJ probably has the best first step for anyone close to his size ever (the only guys clearly better are much smaller guys like Iverson). There just wasn't anyone near his size that could consistently stay in front of him.

[MoochieNorris]

MJ was oversized and an outlier athlete at his position. He always had a physical matchup at his position because you couldn't really defend Pippen with a 4 or a 2. Again more of the reason Jordan never won without Pippen and Pippen was able to win without Jordan.

Washington Jordan failed to make the playoffs. Houston and Portland Pippen continued to make the playoffs.

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stop posting. compare that houston team and those portland teams to the joke wizards with mike on them.

[trickshot]

Kawhi would be too slow to guard Jordan.

Jordan didn't routinely struggle against Dumars and Payton.

There's plenty of games where he lit up Detroit.

Speed isn't why Kawhi would struggle to guard MJ (if he does). You make it sound like we haven't seen Kawhi keep up with players as fast

[trickshot]

This is one aspect MJ was ahead of his time. Thing is if a guy like Bill Russel doesn't get penalised for playing in a league where he was among the first of his kind why should MJ?

[nfmos]

Dan Majerle was also a big, tough defender.

EDIT: just saw he's in your list.

Majerle was not a good defender. His lack of athleticism was exposed when he faced off vs MJ.

MJ was much quicker than anyone else his size.

There were plenty of good defensive players who had trouble with/were bad at defending MJ.

I mean, would you say someone is a bad defender because they have trouble guarding LeBron?

That seems really dumb

To that end..

Watch on YouTube

Does that mean Kahwi has a lack of athleticism?

In the end, a great offensive player is going to get theirs regardless against anyone 1 on 1. To me the team defense and strategy is more important. Back then you get past a Dumars or Starks, and you had Oakleys, Laimbeers, Malones, etc to pound you. Those type of physical interior defenders are a lot rarer today.

[prolific passer]

Well not like Kawhi and Iggy shut Lebron down in their matchups. Point is to make it stuff and guys like Starks and Dumars made it as tough for Jordan as they can. Russell did the same with Wilt and Pettit. Ben Wallace with Shaq and Duncan.

[LKN]

Kawhi would be too slow to guard Jordan.

Jordan didn't routinely struggle against Dumars and Payton.

There's plenty of games where he lit up Detroit.

Speed isn't why Kawhi would struggle to guard MJ (if he does). You make it sound like we haven't seen Kawhi keep up with players as fast

lol what? Who the hell is Kawhi routinely guarding that has a first step anything like MJ?

Kawhi doesn't have enough lateral quickness... not knocking him - no one that size does.

[magicman1978]

There were plenty of athletic players Jordan's size, but most were not quick enough to defend him. Many here are not old enough to remember that. Not sure if many are old enough to remember teams sometimes putting a PG on young Kobe to try and stop him from just blowing by people. Most of the guys you listed - Artest, Draymond, George, Kawhi, Marion - have no chance of staying in front of MJ. It's like trying to defend prime LeBron with a PF.

[nfmos]

I feel like I've had to post this like 500 times over the years... but teams generally used smaller/quicker guys on MJ. Generally they preferred having MJ take jumpers over his defender instead of blowing by guys and getting to the rim.

Again - MJ probably has the best first step for anyone close to his size ever (the only guys clearly better are much smaller guys like Iverson). There just wasn't anyone near his size that could consistently stay in front of him.

There was an interesting article that talked about how physically fitted Jordan was for a basketball player. He had a huge wingspan and hands, his hands are actually slightly larger than Kahwis. But his feet weren't that oversized for his height, they are only a size 13. So that allowed him to have quicker footwork and run around in smaller spaces than many of his peers his size.

[Winsome Gerbil]

Mitch Richmond was one of his toughest defenders.

Note also, young Rodman guarded him at times. So did aging Cooper. So did everybody's best wing defenders.

through the late 80s to mid to late 90s these were all strong defenders Jordan would have been matched against:

Dumars
Rodman
Cooper
Gill
Richmond
N. Anderson
Ehlo
D. Johnson
Elie
Payton
McMillan
Majerle
Maxwell
Starks
Harper
Rivers
Sprewell
Moncrief
Pressey
Robertson
Askins
Shaw

with many others not having bad defense reps -- Lever, Hawkins, Hornacek, Blackman etc.

[HypeMode]

Missing Byron Russell, 6'7, 220 from your list. He was a pretty good defender.

Thanks. That makes sense. MJ shot 42 FG%, 30 3P% against Russell in the finals. He was struggling with his jumper in that series.

[LKN]

Do people think a guy like Charles Oakley or Karl Malone would be a good choice to guard Lebron?

Of course not, you'd use someone smaller than him (like say Pippen or Rodman (pistons years)) with more quickness.

Just like MJ - teams would rather LBJ be a jump shooter.

[DavidSterned]

Dan Majerle was also a big, tough defender.

EDIT: just saw he's in your list.

Majerle was not a good defender. His lack of athleticism was exposed when he faced off vs MJ.

So he was an unathletic, poor defender because he wasn't capable of stopping Jordan? Or because you actually watched him play and familiarized yourself with his abilities? Or maybe some other reason?

[LKN]

Missing Byron Russell, 6'7, 220 from your list. He was a pretty good defender.

Thanks. That makes sense. MJ shot 42 FG%, 30 3P% against Russell in the finals. He was struggling with his jumper in that series.

1997 was by far the worst shooting playoff run of MJs career (and also by far the worst for FTr... those two things are likely related).

He actually had a really good overall series against Utah and his overall scoring wasn't terrible (.532 TS).

The real problem were the series against Atlanta and especially Miami - where he really struggled on offense. So if you want to look at defenses look at those two series.

MJ against Utah was actually elite - 32.3 ppg, 7 rpg, 6 apg, 1.2 spg, .8 bpg, .532 TS, 35.6 AST%, 6.7 TOV%
ORTG - 113 (Bulls overall 104.6)

Not good againstt Miami - 30.2 ppg, 8.0 rpg, 2.6 apg, 1.8 spg, .8 bpg, .475 TS, 15.2 AST%, 7.6 TOV%
ORTG - 108 (Bulls overall 104)

Not great against Atlanta either - 26.6 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 5.2 apg, 2.0 spg, 1.4 bpg, .506 TS, 23.6 AST%, 10.9 TOV%
ORTG - 111 (Bulls overall 114.9)

Now - he did rebound really well (esp on the offensive boards) against both Miami and Atlanta and was great on defense... but those 2 series are some of the worst playoff series of his career on offense.

I'd have to go back and watch to see who guarded MJ (I know Atlanta had Steve Smith and Miami had Mourning, Riley and some young guys with length)

[Picasso]

Jordan always said Mitch Richmond was one of the toughest guys to defend him. He guarded Jordan pretty much as well as one can and was still able to also score as well as a player can against those bulls teams.

[prophet_of_rage]

MJ was oversized and an outlier athlete at his position. He always had a physical matchup at his position because you couldn't really defend Pippen with a 4 or a 2. Again more of the reason Jordan never won without Pippen and Pippen was able to win without Jordan.

Washington Jordan failed to make the playoffs. Houston and Portland Pippen continued to make the playoffs.

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this is the stupidest thing i have read

Okay, let's think basketball.

With a Scottie/Michael duo can you defend Pippen with a small guard?

If the answer is no then you have to put that small guard on Jordan.

Advantage Jordan, correct?

When Jordan came back to Washington, could you put a smaller defender on Richard Hamilton and a bigger more athletic one on Jordan?

Could you put a small guard on Pippen in Houston and Portland? No. Size and speed mismatches were always an advantage in match ups.

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[prophet_of_rage]

MJ was oversized and an outlier athlete at his position. He always had a physical matchup at his position because you couldn't really defend Pippen with a 4 or a 2. Again more of the reason Jordan never won without Pippen and Pippen was able to win without Jordan.

Washington Jordan failed to make the playoffs. Houston and Portland Pippen continued to make the playoffs.

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Just more ridiculousness. Jordan was 38 when he returned after taking 3 seasons off and that team won 37 games. The best player playing with him was Richard Hamilton that year and basically trash after that.

When Pippen was 38, he was playing for the Bulls and they won 23 games, and he retired after that season. He also had players like Rasheed Wallace, Z Randolph, Sabonis, Stoudamire, Olajuwan, Barkley etc on those Houston and Portland teams with him.

Even at 38, Jordans advanced stats were better than Pippens last 4 years.

The stuff you guys come up with, I swear.

This isn't an argument about who's the better player. This is about matchups. Pippen always gave the backcourt scorer a mismatch because you couldn't play a smaller guard on him to take away a size mismatch.

And then you can play him on that perimeter scorer. That's why he continued to win and make playoffs and Jordan, who was still playing his game, couldn't.

Jordan was a better player than Pippen but Pippen was a cheat code second guy who made any backcourt scorers job much much easier.

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[Fencer reregistered]

Dennis Johnson is being disrespected in this thread. That's somewhat excusable, given the age difference between DJ and Jordan and also the story of 63-point playoff game. Still, DJ was a good defender during the early part of Jordan's career.