Raps 2020 Picks (Prospect Watch, Update: Vecenie Mock Released)

[Dalek]

I'm not saying we should take him at 28, just asking a question. How do people feel about Grant Riller at the 2? He's the same height as Bradley Beal and CJ McCollum, and the same weight as McCollum. His defense leaves a lot to be desired, but I think a lot of that is the James Harden effect where he has to do so much offensively that he doesn't put in the effort on defense.

That elite first step would be deadly against bigger guards. It's already deadly against point guards. I think the worst case for Riller is probably a microwave 6th man type.

I am a fan of his for our pick, and I think he can slot in as a two but it is not as ideal. His catch and shoot is really good (1.138 ppp).

But, look at his scoring with the ball in his hands: pick and roll ball handler (1.103 ppp), excellent in isolation (1.115 ppp), excellent in jump shots off the dribble (1.021 ppp).

The only question marks is that his three only really developed this year, so how well will he shoot it in the pros?

[Dalek]

Someone mentioned Lamine Diane in the draft forum and he definitely seems like a guy Masai would have eyes on.

There’s a player out there that’s coming off consecutive league Player of the Year awards and, in 2019, was the first player to win his conference’s Player, Newcomer and Rookie of the Year awards in the same season. He averaged 25 points and 10 rebounds per game across his two seasons — and you may not have heard of him.

It’s time to get familiar.

Former Cal State Northridge star forward Lamine Diane took to Instagram and announced his official declaration for the NBA Draft with no intentions of returning on April 7. It’s the next step on a basketball journey that began in Dakar, Senegal, where Diane was born. His father is former Senegal national team player Keletigui Diane, and basketball was something he was constantly surrounded by growing up in a country that culturally revolves around soccer.

Starting out as nothing more than a pastime with friends, Diane realized his potential quickly. It became a serious possibility to follow in his father’s footsteps and even take his game outside of Senegal’s borders and overseas if the opportunity presented itself.

“When I was around 13 or 14, that’s when I started feeling like I could be good at basketball,” Diane stated. “That’s when I really started taking things seriously to take it to the next level.”

https://www.midmajormadness.com/2020/5/27/21271853/lamine-diane-csun-nba-draft-mock-prospect-projection-round-basketball-college-gottfried-matadors

https://fansided.com/2016/08/08/2016-adidas-nations-dennis-smith-deandre-ayton/

O’Shae Brisset: 6-8, 200 (Finlay Prep, NV) Age: 18
Position: Wing/Four
Team: Canada

High school teammate of Team Africa’s Lamine Diane, Brisset really flashed his run and jump athleticism in the championship game. He has some skill but is probably a 4 in college, lacking the shooting and playmaking for the wing spot. His measurables and athleticism are very alluring however, and he has the tools to be on the NBA radar with skill and shot improvement.

I have tried to watch him a bit and while he has good footwork and a natural scoring ability, he is not a good passer and has no way to play off the ball. In the NBA, that makes it tough for him, but he does have talent.

The vibe I get from him is being a lot like Deng Adel who the Raptors had in Summer League. A very toolsy sort of guy but a bit of tweener and does not play well enough without the ball. Great for a G-League invite.

[BoyzNTheHood]

I'm not saying we should take him at 28, just asking a question. How do people feel about Grant Riller at the 2? He's the same height as Bradley Beal and CJ McCollum, and the same weight as McCollum. His defense leaves a lot to be desired, but I think a lot of that is the James Harden effect where he has to do so much offensively that he doesn't put in the effort on defense.

That elite first step would be deadly against bigger guards. It's already deadly against point guards. I think the worst case for Riller is probably a microwave 6th man type.

I am a fan of his for our pick, and I think he can slot in as a two but it is not as ideal. His catch and shoot is really good (1.138 ppp).

But, look at his scoring with the ball in his hands: pick and roll ball handler (1.103 ppp), excellent in isolation (1.115 ppp), excellent in jump shots off the dribble (1.021 ppp).

The only question marks is that his three only really developed this year, so how well will he shoot it in the pros?

I'm not too worried about his 3. As a freshman he shot .333 on 3 attempts per game, which improved to .394 on 4 attempts as a sophomore, then to .329 on 4 attempts as a junior, and finally .362 on 4 attempts as a senior.

[Indeed]

Someone mentioned Lamine Diane in the draft forum and he definitely seems like a guy Masai would have eyes on.





https://www.midmajormadness.com/2020/5/27/21271853/lamine-diane-csun-nba-draft-mock-prospect-projection-round-basketball-college-gottfried-matadors

https://fansided.com/2016/08/08/2016-adidas-nations-dennis-smith-deandre-ayton/

O’Shae Brisset: 6-8, 200 (Finlay Prep, NV) Age: 18
Position: Wing/Four
Team: Canada

High school teammate of Team Africa’s Lamine Diane, Brisset really flashed his run and jump athleticism in the championship game. He has some skill but is probably a 4 in college, lacking the shooting and playmaking for the wing spot. His measurables and athleticism are very alluring however, and he has the tools to be on the NBA radar with skill and shot improvement.

I have tried to watch him a bit and while he has good footwork and a natural scoring ability, he is not a good passer and has no way to play off the ball. In the NBA, that makes it tough for him, but he does have talent.

The vibe I get from him is being a lot like Deng Adel who the Raptors had in Summer League. A very toolsy sort of guy but a bit of tweener and does not play well enough without the ball. Great for a G-League invite.

Not surprised he will be a G-League invite, and with the connection of Brisset, hope he would consider us to join our G-League.

[casual_raps_fan]

I'm not saying we should take him at 28, just asking a question. How do people feel about Grant Riller at the 2? He's the same height as Bradley Beal and CJ McCollum, and the same weight as McCollum. His defense leaves a lot to be desired, but I think a lot of that is the James Harden effect where he has to do so much offensively that he doesn't put in the effort on defense.

That elite first step would be deadly against bigger guards. It's already deadly against point guards. I think the worst case for Riller is probably a microwave 6th man type.

I don't think it matters if he plays 1 or 2.

Offensively, he fulfils the skills required to play both positions. I would compare his game to guys like Harden, Beal, Lou Williams. It doesn't really matter if those guys play 1 or 2 because of their combination of good ball handling and scoring at all levels. You hand them the ball in pretty much any situation and they will go to work.

Defensively I don't see him having an advantage or disadvantage defending either position.


edit: A closer comparison might be Dinwiddie.

edit2: Another comparison that came to mind is Fred Van Vleet's offensive game (not his defensive game for obvious reasons)

[Psubs]

I'm not saying we should take him at 28, just asking a question. How do people feel about Grant Riller at the 2? He's the same height as Bradley Beal and CJ McCollum, and the same weight as McCollum. His defense leaves a lot to be desired, but I think a lot of that is the James Harden effect where he has to do so much offensively that he doesn't put in the effort on defense.

That elite first step would be deadly against bigger guards. It's already deadly against point guards. I think the worst case for Riller is probably a microwave 6th man type.

I don't think it matters if he plays 1 or 2.

Offensively, he fulfils the skills required to play both positions. I would compare his game to guys like Harden, Beal, Lou Williams. It doesn't really matter if those guys play 1 or 2 because of their combination of good ball handling and scoring at all levels. You hand them the ball in pretty much any situation and they will go to work.

Defensively I don't see him having an advantage or disadvantage defending either position.


edit: A closer comparison might be Dinwiddie.

edit2: Another comparison that came to mind is Fred Van Vleet's offensive game (not his defensive game for obvious reasons)

I was thinking of a comparison and John Starks came to mind, with less hops. Tough road. Very unlikely story!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Starks_(basketball)

Early life

Starks was born in Tulsa, Oklahoma where he attended Tulsa Central High School.[2] At Tulsa Central, Starks played only one year on the basketball team.[3] After high school, he enrolled at Rogers State College in 1984. While at Rogers State, Starks was on the "taxi squad" of the basketball team for backups to replace injured or suspended players; taxi squad players did not suit up and instead watched games from the stands. However, Starks was expelled from Rogers State for stealing another student's stereo equipment in retaliation for the student breaking into Starks' dorm room and the college holding him and his roommates financially responsible for the damage.[4] Starks transferred to Northern Oklahoma College in spring 1985, made the basketball team there, and was sentenced to five days in jail for the robbery. He served the sentence during spring break.[5] In the fall of 1985, Starks averaged 11 points per game with Northern Oklahoma but left the college after being caught in his dorm smoking cannabis.[6] Having worked at a Safeway supermarket, Starks enrolled at Tulsa Junior College in the summer of 1986 to pursue a business degree.[7] While playing intramural basketball, he came to the attention of Ken Trickey, the former coach of Oral Roberts University who was then starting a basketball program for Oklahoma Junior College. Starks played there for a season, then earned a scholarship at Oklahoma State University in 1988, where he finished his collegiate career.[3][8]

n 1990, he tried out for the New York Knicks. In one practice, he tried to dunk on Knicks center Patrick Ewing. Ewing threw him down and Starks twisted his knee. The team was not allowed to release him unless it healed by the end of December. When it did not heal by that time, the Knicks could not release him.[9] As a result, Starks has referred to Ewing as his saving grace.

Wow, the stars aligned.

Actually, maybe Randy Foye would be a better comp.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

[casual_raps_fan]

I'm not saying we should take him at 28, just asking a question. How do people feel about Grant Riller at the 2? He's the same height as Bradley Beal and CJ McCollum, and the same weight as McCollum. His defense leaves a lot to be desired, but I think a lot of that is the James Harden effect where he has to do so much offensively that he doesn't put in the effort on defense.

That elite first step would be deadly against bigger guards. It's already deadly against point guards. I think the worst case for Riller is probably a microwave 6th man type.

I don't think it matters if he plays 1 or 2.

Offensively, he fulfils the skills required to play both positions. I would compare his game to guys like Harden, Beal, Lou Williams. It doesn't really matter if those guys play 1 or 2 because of their combination of good ball handling and scoring at all levels. You hand them the ball in pretty much any situation and they will go to work.

Defensively I don't see him having an advantage or disadvantage defending either position.


edit: A closer comparison might be Dinwiddie.

edit2: Another comparison that came to mind is Fred Van Vleet's offensive game (not his defensive game for obvious reasons)

I was thinking of a comparison and John Starks came to mind, with less hops. Tough road. Very unlikely story!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Starks_(basketball)

Early life

Starks was born in Tulsa, Oklahoma where he attended Tulsa Central High School.[2] At Tulsa Central, Starks played only one year on the basketball team.[3] After high school, he enrolled at Rogers State College in 1984. While at Rogers State, Starks was on the "taxi squad" of the basketball team for backups to replace injured or suspended players; taxi squad players did not suit up and instead watched games from the stands. However, Starks was expelled from Rogers State for stealing another student's stereo equipment in retaliation for the student breaking into Starks' dorm room and the college holding him and his roommates financially responsible for the damage.[4] Starks transferred to Northern Oklahoma College in spring 1985, made the basketball team there, and was sentenced to five days in jail for the robbery. He served the sentence during spring break.[5] In the fall of 1985, Starks averaged 11 points per game with Northern Oklahoma but left the college after being caught in his dorm smoking cannabis.[6] Having worked at a Safeway supermarket, Starks enrolled at Tulsa Junior College in the summer of 1986 to pursue a business degree.[7] While playing intramural basketball, he came to the attention of Ken Trickey, the former coach of Oral Roberts University who was then starting a basketball program for Oklahoma Junior College. Starks played there for a season, then earned a scholarship at Oklahoma State University in 1988, where he finished his collegiate career.[3][8]

n 1990, he tried out for the New York Knicks. In one practice, he tried to dunk on Knicks center Patrick Ewing. Ewing threw him down and Starks twisted his knee. The team was not allowed to release him unless it healed by the end of December. When it did not heal by that time, the Knicks could not release him.[9] As a result, Starks has referred to Ewing as his saving grace.

Wow, the stars aligned.

Actually, maybe Randy Foye would be a better comp.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

I've heard that story about John Starks before but he was before my time and I never watched him play.

Randy Foye I remember watching him in the NBA and I can see the comparison. If I recall correctly, Foye's ball handling was decent enough that you could let him handle the rock but he didn't impact the game as a scorer or as a floor general which kind of takes away the point of making him a 1. As a 2, he didn't have size or scoring and most of his value came from shooting 3s. He's a classic case of a tweener guard who's skills didn't scale up well to the NBA's level. If Riller's scoring doesn't scale up to the NBA's level like Foye, I can definitely see a similar trajectory.

Had no clue about his condition. That is very interesting.

[LoveMyRaps]

Another player Raptors might consider for the 58th pick... or possibly another undrafted prospect to target.

Tajuan Agee from Iona:

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Siakam/Boucher hybrid.

[LoveMyRaps]

Also, Nembhard is returning to college (smart decision) and will be transferring from Florida.

[Psubs]

Another player Raptors might consider for the 58th pick... or possibly another undrafted prospect to target.

Tajuan Agee from Iona:

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Siakam/Boucher hybrid.

78.7% FTs

Weak school. Eye test seems as good a prospect as Paul Eboua.

Though so many turnovers and fouls in a weak conference.

More likely candidate for undrafted invite. I'd rather take Malik Fitts, but he's less lanky so less of a shotblocker. Still have Boucher.

[Mark_83]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

[Psubs]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

This is how I feel about Paul Reed.

I think FVV has good lateral quicks and probably did well in agility instead of the 3/4 sprint. I think Bane fits this hustle despite negative wingspan. He just is so strong and works hard.

[Psubs]

[youtube]https://youtu.be/0IRgtNL9zEA?t=185[/youtube]

Not under duress bank... not drafting him at #28.

[Mark_83]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

This is how I feel about Paul Reed.

I think FVV has good lateral quicks and probably did well in agility instead of the 3/4 sprint. I think Bane fits this hustle despite negative wingspan. He just is so strong and works hard.

Other than the defense part I'm not sure if Reed really fits in the same category. He's quite athletic, has very long arms and quickness. I've heard from people who watch DePaul though that his effort off the ball is not really there consistently, and his IQ and reads need work. Not saying he's bad or anything, just that he's not the making the most of limited tools type from what I've heard.

[Indeed]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

VanVleet got quick hands, and you can see him disrupting ball penetration.
There is no measurement on quick hands, but I guess overall steals may give you some idea.

[Indeed]

Another player Raptors might consider for the 58th pick... or possibly another undrafted prospect to target.

Tajuan Agee from Iona:

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Siakam/Boucher hybrid.

78.7% FTs

Weak school. Eye test seems as good a prospect as Paul Eboua.

Though so many turnovers and fouls in a weak conference.

More likely candidate for undrafted invite. I'd rather take Malik Fitts, but he's less lanky so less of a shotblocker. Still have Boucher.

Doesn't have a lot of coverage, will have to see his basketball IQ, but seems like decision making can be a problem with those turnovers.

[LoveMyRaps]

Another player Raptors might consider for the 58th pick... or possibly another undrafted prospect to target.

Tajuan Agee from Iona:

Watch on YouTube

Reminds me of a Siakam/Boucher hybrid.

78.7% FTs

Weak school. Eye test seems as good a prospect as Paul Eboua.

Though so many turnovers and fouls in a weak conference.

More likely candidate for undrafted invite. I'd rather take Malik Fitts, but he's less lanky so less of a shotblocker. Still have Boucher.

Yeah, his turnovers is a major concern. I love his intangibles though. He has great defensive upside. Definitely worth a consideration for the summer league roster IMO. (if there even is one).

[casual_raps_fan]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

VanVleet got quick hands, and you can see him disrupting ball penetration.
There is no measurement on quick hands, but I guess overall steals may give you some idea.

Some players stay at home more than going for the steal which may reduce numbers and vice versa. If there is a stat for deflections, that might be a better option.

edit: Couldn't find college deflection stats. :/

[casual_raps_fan]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

This is how I feel about Paul Reed.

I think FVV has good lateral quicks and probably did well in agility instead of the 3/4 sprint. I think Bane fits this hustle despite negative wingspan. He just is so strong and works hard.

Other than the defense part I'm not sure if Reed really fits in the same category. He's quite athletic, has very long arms and quickness. I've heard from people who watch DePaul though that his effort off the ball is not really there consistently, and his IQ and reads need work. Not saying he's bad or anything, just that he's not the making the most of limited tools type from what I've heard.

Most of those things you're saying are improvable.

Defensive effort is the least of my concerns. If he doesn't show full effort, Nurse won't give him minutes. He has a motor so I'm confident he will improve on that.

From what I've seen, I actually thought he looks like a toolsy player. He handles the ball, shoots, passes, drives, can read the defence. These skills are just at a very primitive stage which makes him look like he's limited kind of like Siakam in his rookie season.

I guess I'm a glass half full type of guy and I'm seeing a guy who has the potential to improve on many things and has the physical attributes tailor made for the NBA.

[casual_raps_fan]

I was watching defensive highlights of Vanvleet last night and I got to thinking, how does this thicc, short armed, unathletic guy play such good defense? The only answer I could come up with was effort and IQ.

The guy works his ass off on defense (no pun intended), and he reads plays so well. It shows you don't have to be this long armed, chiseled uber athlete to be a good defender, you can be a good defender with high effort and IQ.

It got me to thinking about Xavier Tillman. He's not a leaper or elite athlete. Not super quick, and doesnt have elite size or length. But he's one of the best interior defenders in the NCAA averaging two blocks and a steal a game.

I really want to see what this guy would look like in our rotation. He's a lot like Vanvleet in that he seems to do more with what he has physically than most players. If you watch him, the number of reflections he gets with his reads and active hands is insane for a big man.

Would be happy with him at 28, or alternatively to acquire an early second to be able to take him.

I like Tillman's game a lot but have mostly been neutral with him because of his limitations (scoring, size) but recently, for the exact reasons you stated, I've been warming up to the idea of drafting him.

When I really think about his limitations, they probably won't negatively impact him THAT much.

Somebody mentioned that he is basically the same size as Al Horford so I compared their measurements and yes, they pretty much are the exact same size (height, wingspan, weight). I am pretty convinced Tillman would be able to bring something similar to Horford's defence to the table.

Offensively, his scoring does bother me a bit but having a bigman with his passing and vision is far more valuable than a center who is marginally better at scoring. He has shown some potential to be able to knock down jumpers as well. His place in the league will hinge on his shooting improvements and the Raptors do a really good job of teaching 3 point shooting. It could be a good match.

My comparison is a smaller Marc Gasol or Al Horford without scoring.