Just Sad, "Chicago sees deadliest Memorial Day weekend in four years"

[2018C3]

or buy some **** insurance

stuff like this really exposes the flaws in the market and the market-derived way of thinking of people like you: that 'things' are more important than people. and that you fantasize about killing people who take things. it's kind of sick actually.

this whole thread is a disaster -- the first couple posts are literally about sending the military to black neighborhoods in chicago and sending even more people to prison for longer. really disappointed in realgm f=10

Or just.......dont break into and try to destroy my business and nobody gets hurt. Pretty simple solution.

And these businesses that are forced to make insurance claims, you don't think their premiums will skyrocket after this?

There has to be a middle ground though, between just letting looters destroy your property, and your livelihood, and killing someone for breaking a piece of plate glass, or stealing a pair of tennis shoes. Stores that are boarding up their windows are smart. And yes, the police should be used to protect people's property from looting as much as possible. Or the national guard if that's what it takes. I have no problem with stopping the violence. But let's not make it into an armed confrontation, where you have something like the Chicago democratic convention in '68, where the cops just went nuts on people. If protestors are protesting peaceably, the cops should let them. If they start looting, then the cops have the right to move in and stop them. That doesn't mean killing them, though.

Agree, there is always lots of middle ground I once had a situation similar. When I purchased my current home I did not move into it for about two months. At the time my old house did not sell yet, and I was slowly driving items over each day in a minivan. One night I got here pretty late and decided to spend the night on a couch,

It just so happened that some guy tried to break into the backdoor on that night. I heard the noises, grabbed a weapon and walked over to the door, and opened it while concealing the weapon out of view. I then asked what he was doing?

The response i got back was "Does So and So live here?" I replied back that no one by that name has ever lived here", and he quickly re-treated.

The last thing I ever would have wanted to happen is to responsible for a life lost. I was never threatened, or threatened.

If he did break into the house before I opened the door, things may have ended up differently, as that would have been a lot more scary, especially waking up out of a sleep.

Edit: ____________________________________________________

If anyone is wondering how I knew "So and So" never lived here. I purchased the house from a relativess estate under a agreement that I would pay the party it was left to the rest of the due balance once my old home sold. Once it sold I was able to take out another mortgage and pay the recipients of the estate off.

[dougthonus]

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

I wouldn't be so sure. I would imagine some people want to join up for this very reason at this time.

Not saying it's the majority situation by any stretch, and who knows how many opportunities there really are here. Governments aren't flush with cash right now given tehy've all lost just absolute crap tons of tax revenue. I would imagine that most have a hiring freeze at the moment.

[League Circles]

I can say with 100% certainty that is not happening right now.

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

Oops, I thought the motto was change. Grieving is understandable though.

[League Circles]

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

I wouldn't be so sure. I would imagine some people want to join up for this very reason at this time.

Not saying it's the majority situation by any stretch, and who knows how many opportunities there really are here. Governments aren't flush with cash right now given tehy've all lost just absolute crap tons of tax revenue. I would imagine that most have a hiring freeze at the moment.

Ashy said he knows 100% for sure so I assume he has connections at the academy or recruitment office.

[AshyLarrysDiaper]

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

I wouldn't be so sure. I would imagine some people want to join up for this very reason at this time.

Not saying it's the majority situation by any stretch, and who knows how many opportunities there really are here.

I’m an activist who knows hundreds of other activists.

No activist I’ve met, in person or online, would consider becoming a cop. I’m sure there are exceptions, but ‘changing the system from the inside’ is antithetical to their critique of the police.

[musiqsoulchild]

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

Oops, I thought the motto was change. Grieving is understandable though.

In due time.

Now is the anger phase.

That's how we had so many progressives get into government during the post-Civil rights era...and then again during Clinton and later during Obama.

There is enough critical mass there. McConnell is trying his best to change that though. He is pushing Trump to appoint as many conservative judges as possible. It's a clear sign that they dont internally think he is going to get re-elected.

[2018C3]

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

I wouldn't be so sure. I would imagine some people want to join up for this very reason at this time.

Not saying it's the majority situation by any stretch, and who knows how many opportunities there really are here.

I’m an activist who knows hundreds of other activists.

No activist I’ve met, in person or online, would consider becoming a cop. I’m sure there are exceptions, but ‘changing the system from the inside’ is antithetical to their critique of the police.

This is sad to hear, because as it stands. I would consider that method the easiest and most productive way to influence much needed change.

[League Circles]

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

Oops, I thought the motto was change. Grieving is understandable though.

In due time.

Now is the anger phase.

That's how we had so many progressives get into government during the post-Civil rights era...and then again during Clinton and later during Obama.

There is enough critical mass there. McConnell is trying his best to change that though. He is pushing Trump to appoint as many conservative judges as possible. It's a clear sign that they dont internally think he is going to get re-elected.

Weird, I keep seeing post after post and message after message all over the place with "calls to action", telling people to do something substantive. Strange that I haven't seen anyone advocate, you know, DIRECTLY working for change. It's not like it should be some crazy foreign idea, there are already a lot (but not enough) black cops.

[AshyLarrysDiaper]

I wouldn't be so sure. I would imagine some people want to join up for this very reason at this time.

Not saying it's the majority situation by any stretch, and who knows how many opportunities there really are here.

I’m an activist who knows hundreds of other activists.

No activist I’ve met, in person or online, would consider becoming a cop. I’m sure there are exceptions, but ‘changing the system from the inside’ is antithetical to their critique of the police.

This is sad to hear, because as it stands. I would consider that method the easiest and most productive way to influence much needed change.

Disagree. This isn’t about replacing bad apples with good apples. We need sweeping changes to police policies and collective bargaining agreements and our entire understanding of their role in communities.

Nobody I know who’s fighting for those things thinks you can get them by joining a culture where silence is expected and, in many cases, harshly enforced.

[SalmonsSuperfan]

I sure hope a lot of activists have submitted their applications to be police officers in the past few days. Seems like a no brainer step for a lot of people to take especially recent college grads without jobs.

I can say with 100% certainty that is not happening right now.

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

hate the institution of slavery? why not start a plantation, be a kind-hearted slavemaster!

i think you're completely missing the point of this. the institution is the problem, and beyond that i think it's interesting that you would just assume that this institution of white supremacy, the police, would hire ""activists"" to be cops.

some guy said you're thinking about this rationally, but you aren't, you're completely misinterpreting what the problem is and offering unhelpful, uninformed solutions.

[League Circles]

League, you're thinking of this whole thing rationally. Kudos to you for that.

But the folks who are grieving now - whether they are white allies or people of color....the LAST thing they are going to do now is to join the justice system.

That will happen. In due time.

I wouldn't be so sure. I would imagine some people want to join up for this very reason at this time.

Not saying it's the majority situation by any stretch, and who knows how many opportunities there really are here.

I’m an activist who knows hundreds of other activists.

No activist I’ve met, in person or online, would consider becoming a cop. I’m sure there are exceptions, but ‘changing the system from the inside’ is antithetical to their critique of the police.

That's wildly problematic IMO. For the movement. Are no activists already cops?

[2018C3]

I see where you have a distrust of the organization that is currently in place.

I agree changes need to be made,These protests will hopefully provide a positive benefit in policy where bad actions by police will be held accountable, and also greatly reduced.

We will always have police in some form or another as they are much needed I just hope that the activism you actively participate in influences these changes that need to made. I also hope that mistakes made in the past can be limited going forward, and will encourage a more positive relationship between law enforcement, and also the community you are passionate about,

[League Circles]

I can say with 100% certainty that is not happening right now.

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

hate the institution of slavery? why not start a plantation!

i think you're completely missing the point of this. the institution is the problem, and beyond that i think it's interesting that you would just assume that this institution of white supremacy, the police, would hire ""activists"" to be cops.

some guy said you're thinking about this rationally, but you aren't, you're completely misinterpreting what the problem is and offering unhelpful, uninformed solutions.

If the argument is that the very concept of police protection is objectionable, that's fair. It's called anarchy.

[SalmonsSuperfan]

The police and black relationship is definitely worse I can definitely agree to that. I think they both make each other lives a lot harder than it needs to be. I really think they should limit the police in black neighborhoods and only have it be black police officers in those areas. White cops in black neighborhoods has been a brutal marriage that's long overdue for a divorce. White police presence has never made a black neighborhood safer or more peaceful. Limiting presence and having it be black presence would probably go a further way and building some trust between the police and the community. It's worth a shot gotta try something different.

The downside of that is you are probably limiting police tension but increasing racial tension. Also where do you draw the line? Do only black judges / juries / prosecutors work on black cases going forward? Do you do that with companies and hiring? It may only be a small step, but you are moving towards creating a society of segregation and while that may help with this singular problem in the short term, it likely leads to vastly bigger problems in the long term.

White cops aren’t the problem. Racist white cops are. I think segregation of a police force does not help the problem, I do think that having a more diverse police force in those areas though is a huge benefit. I personally am very very anti segregation. Having a force though that is a higher ration African American in those communities though makes sense to me.

I think it's interesting to note that the Los Angeles police department has pretty well created a 'diverse' PD that matches the demographics of Los Angeles -- what difference has it made?

[League Circles]

I’m an activist who knows hundreds of other activists.

No activist I’ve met, in person or online, would consider becoming a cop. I’m sure there are exceptions, but ‘changing the system from the inside’ is antithetical to their critique of the police.

This is sad to hear, because as it stands. I would consider that method the easiest and most productive way to influence much needed change.

Disagree. This isn’t about replacing bad apples with good apples. We need sweeping changes to police policies and collective bargaining agreements and our entire understanding of their role in communities.

Nobody I know who’s fighting for those things thinks you can get them by joining a culture where silence is expected and, in many cases, harshly enforced.

It's not an either/or thing. Should blacks who are already cops, including those who respond to calls in so called black neighborhoods to stop violence and crime of all types, quit their jobs?

You have to think through implications. If you don't want any police, you have to accept and own that you're an anarchist. If you want police, WHO do you want to be police? Unfortunately it's as simple as that. Those are two decisions that break down to binary choices.

[musiqsoulchild]

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

hate the institution of slavery? why not start a plantation!

i think you're completely missing the point of this. the institution is the problem, and beyond that i think it's interesting that you would just assume that this institution of white supremacy, the police, would hire ""activists"" to be cops.

some guy said you're thinking about this rationally, but you aren't, you're completely misinterpreting what the problem is and offering unhelpful, uninformed solutions.

If the argument is that the very concept of police protection is objectionable, that's fair. It's called anarchy.

The argument is that the people who sat down and wrote the laws and the various codes that govern us are ALL white men.

And they have ( mostly intentionally and sometimes unintentionally) marginalized black people.

There...that's the argument.

The SOLUTION to that is NOT hiring more black cops. That's way too myopic and it does no good to actually breaking the invisible chains that still exist to this day.

[Dominator83]

The downside of that is you are probably limiting police tension but increasing racial tension. Also where do you draw the line? Do only black judges / juries / prosecutors work on black cases going forward? Do you do that with companies and hiring? It may only be a small step, but you are moving towards creating a society of segregation and while that may help with this singular problem in the short term, it likely leads to vastly bigger problems in the long term.

White cops aren’t the problem. Racist white cops are. I think segregation of a police force does not help the problem, I do think that having a more diverse police force in those areas though is a huge benefit. I personally am very very anti segregation. Having a force though that is a higher ration African American in those communities though makes sense to me.

I think it's interesting to note that the Los Angeles police department has pretty well created a 'diverse' PD that matches the demographics of Los Angeles -- what difference has it made?

Well what we already do know is, white police + black neighborhood = a toxic match made in hell. It hasnt worked out in 70 years. Again, a proven bad marriage that's long overdue for a divorce. Gotta try something new.

[AshyLarrysDiaper]

This is sad to hear, because as it stands. I would consider that method the easiest and most productive way to influence much needed change.

Disagree. This isn’t about replacing bad apples with good apples. We need sweeping changes to police policies and collective bargaining agreements and our entire understanding of their role in communities.

Nobody I know who’s fighting for those things thinks you can get them by joining a culture where silence is expected and, in many cases, harshly enforced.

It's not an either/or thing. Should blacks who are already cops, including those who respond to calls in so called black neighborhoods to stop violence and crime of all types, quit their jobs?

You have to think through implications. If you don't want any police, you have to accept and own that you're an anarchist. If you want police, WHO do you want to be police? Unfortunately it's as simple as that. Those are two decisions that break down to binary choices.

Sorry, how did we go from talking about activists to Black cops?

[League Circles]

I can say with 100% certainty that is not happening right now.

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

hate the institution of slavery? why not start a plantation, be a kind-hearted slavemaster!

i think you're completely missing the point of this. the institution is the problem, and beyond that i think it's interesting that you would just assume that this institution of white supremacy, the police, would hire ""activists"" to be cops.

some guy said you're thinking about this rationally, but you aren't, you're completely misinterpreting what the problem is and offering unhelpful, uninformed solutions.

This is just pure identity politics. I don't believe in group or institutional moral evaluation. All we have are individuals and policy (rules). We need the right rules (which we don't have but are pushing for), and we need the right people, which we don't have enough of. I'm suggesting that the most mindful defenders of black freedom (activists) DO THAT FOR THEIR JOB! It would be beautiful. What's the alternative suggestion, that all blacks boycott police work until there is zero evidence of police racial misconduct? Or that we don't have police?

[AshyLarrysDiaper]

What a shame IMO. An opportunity to improve things first hand, and tremendous job security. If I was younger and debt free I would.

hate the institution of slavery? why not start a plantation, be a kind-hearted slavemaster!

i think you're completely missing the point of this. the institution is the problem, and beyond that i think it's interesting that you would just assume that this institution of white supremacy, the police, would hire ""activists"" to be cops.

some guy said you're thinking about this rationally, but you aren't, you're completely misinterpreting what the problem is and offering unhelpful, uninformed solutions.

This is just pure identity politics. I don't believe in group or institutional moral evaluation. All we have are individuals and policy (rules). We need the right rules (which we don't have but are pushing for), and we need the right people, which we don't have enough of. I'm suggesting that the most mindful defenders of black freedom (activists) DO THAT FOR THEIR JOB! It would be beautiful. What's the alternative suggestion, that all blacks boycott police work until there is zero evidence of police racial misconduct? Or that we don't have police?

You don’t believe in immoral institutions?