Potential sleepers

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Fischella
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1721 » by Fischella » Mon Jun 15, 2020 1:40 pm

getrichordie wrote:
Fischella wrote:
getrichordie wrote:
And he wants to be a Celtic. He was a big fan of Ray Allen so it is his dream to play for Boston.

WUT?


What is the point in this post?

That's a head scratcher, Ray Allen is not known from his Celtic tenure (Bucks-Sonics much more) and he left Boston in a bad way, so what you said makes 0 sense
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1722 » by getrichordie » Mon Jun 15, 2020 1:46 pm

Fischella wrote:
getrichordie wrote:
Fischella wrote:WUT?


What is the point in this post?

That's a head scratcher, Ray Allen is not known from his Celtic tenure (Bucks-Sonics much more) and he left Boston in a bad way, so what you said makes 0 sense


Then just say this instead of, "WUT?"

Just saying what Queen said in the article. Maybe he fell in love with those Boston teams. Idk. Who cares? The point is he wants to play for Boston.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1723 » by Catchall » Mon Jun 15, 2020 7:25 pm

Lamine Diane looks like a young Jeff Green, imo.

;t=41s
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1724 » by karkinos » Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:19 pm

getrichordie wrote:If Celtics don't buy a late 2nd and draft Queen, I'm going to hate the Celtics for life.

https://hoopshype.com/2020/04/12/2020-nba-draft-trevelin-queen-new-mexico-state-interview/


0:55
the audacity lol
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1725 » by Stillwater » Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:36 pm

Queen still riding the coat tails of that hot streak against Grand Canyon in the WAC championship and in the first round loss against Auburn last seasons big dance where he went off but then badly missed a last second corner 3 that would have been a walk off winner. He has some admirable qualities as a defender and a prospect that has good size and shooting ability but overall could easily go undrafted being 23 already and not a great floor general that could have made him a late first lock with that size.
I might buy into the late 2nd for him though...just not sure anyone else actually will.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1726 » by getrichordie » Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:12 am

karkinos wrote:
getrichordie wrote:If Celtics don't buy a late 2nd and draft Queen, I'm going to hate the Celtics for life.

https://hoopshype.com/2020/04/12/2020-nba-draft-trevelin-queen-new-mexico-state-interview/


0:55
the audacity lol


Haha, yeah. I remember watching that. Queen is silly.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1727 » by Fischella » Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:39 am

one real sleeper, and it's weird cause he plays for a big program is Immanuel Quickley, it is not hard to think of him as a movement shooter in time and he was a good floor general and lead guard in HS (Cal as a supressor of skills has happened before)

He is smaller but I don't think he is super far from Landry Shamet, for example
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1728 » by King Ken » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:55 pm

Fischella wrote:one real sleeper, and it's weird cause he plays for a big program is Immanuel Quickley, it is not hard to think of him as a movement shooter in time and he was a good floor general and lead guard in HS (Cal as a supressor of skills has happened before)

He is smaller but I don't think he is super far from Landry Shamet, for example

What's Quickley NBA position to you?
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Re: G/F 6'7 CJ Elleby (Washington State Sophomore) 

Post#1729 » by doordoor123 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 7:29 pm

getrichordie wrote:
He’s more like Malcolm Brogdon. He has huge hands is a good ball handler. He was playing really well in summer league last year. He had two games where he looked really good, but Nickeil Alexander-Walker also looked great so take it with a grain of salt. His game is made for the space in the NBA.


That's a hot take for someone who is projected late 2nd to undrafted.


I’m pretty sure he’s a lefty too
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1730 » by doordoor123 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 7:33 pm

I keep saying how crappy this draft is, but I think it’s just with the usual bigger schools that tend to have a lot of talent and of course the top of the draft. The smaller schools have some players I keep forgetting about. It’ll be interesting to see what teams go with the bigger school players and get busts and which teams go for the Derrick White types.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1731 » by clyde21 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 7:55 pm

it's not a great draft but the depth is decent enough and if you know what you're looking for you can find some good players later on
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1732 » by getrichordie » Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:28 am

This is weird, and maybe a fluke.

N'Doye in his only game this season where he started at the 4 for Cholet (usually plays either at the 1 or 2, sometimes the 3):

28 MP
6-6 FGA
2-2 3PA
2-2 FT
6 REB
7 AST
4 TOV
6 STL
1 BLK
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1733 » by karkinos » Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:23 pm

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1940982&hilit=quickley&start=800

wrote about quickley getting underrated last month so i guess his name finally made it to this thread
i'm much higher on him than most though
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1734 » by getrichordie » Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:28 pm

karkinos wrote:viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1940982&hilit=quickley&start=800

wrote about quickley getting underrated last month so i guess his name finally made it to this thread
i'm much higher on him than most though


Why, though? He's not going to be a ball-handler at the next level. He's a small relocation C&S guy. He doesn't provide much value. He likely doesn't get much bigger.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1735 » by BlazersBroncos » Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:32 pm

That's a fluke. N'Doye is a swing in this league, you cant play a 185lb guy at PF. Even Isaac is 210lbs.

I do think N'Doye would best fit as a SF who can facilitate a bit. Despite his age, the late growth spurt makes him super interesting. I would love his fit in Portland at SF. He has some Batum to his game, but seems more aggressive with a less developed stroke. Given his wingspan, if he can develop a consistent 3PT shot he should be able to get it off even if the release stays slow IMO. I hope he is there in R2 when we pick but I think he rises to a late 1st guy, that range where playoff teams are looking for more instant impact types who can fill a role off the jump.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1736 » by getrichordie » Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:55 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:That's a fluke. N'Doye is a swing in this league, you cant play a 185lb guy at PF. Even Isaac is 210lbs.

I do think N'Doye would best fit as a SF who can facilitate a bit. Despite his age, the late growth spurt makes him super interesting. I would love his fit in Portland at SF. He has some Batum to his game, but seems more aggressive with a less developed stroke. Given his wingspan, if he can develop a consistent 3PT shot he should be able to get it off even if the release stays slow IMO. I hope he is there in R2 when we pick but I think he rises to a late 1st guy, that range where playoff teams are looking for more instant impact types who can fill a role off the jump.


I like POR as a fit, too. The kid is going to be able to at least hold his own on the defensive side. He's a big wing. And his C&S game is fairly strong. I was watching his scouting tape and I swear he knocked down like 14 C&S 3s in a row. I was shocked. His pull-up game, however, is god awful. His feel for the game is subpar on the offensive end, but he's showed some interesting things to make you think he can be better with more spacing. His floater game looks elite at times, and at other times, it can be a real head-scratcher. Same thing with his ability to finish around the rim.

But he's a decently nice 3&D prospect at the very least if a coach can reign his weaknesses in and not ask him to do too much.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1737 » by BlazersBroncos » Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:05 pm


But he's a decently nice 3&D prospect at the very least if a coach can reign his weaknesses in and not ask him to do too much.


Which is basically what Portland needs at SF. Stotts runs an offense that, when running most efficiently, has a SF that can handle the ball and play unselfish, cut to the rim / other side of the court once he hands the ball off, hit the open 3 and play defense. Its why Batum was such a great fit. N'Doye isn't the caliber prospect as Batum, mostly because of age, but he certainly seems like an ideal fit.

This is somewhat why I never understood the Little pick until I realized that sometimes you swing for the fences if a talent falls regardless of fit. Nassir is a pretty horrible ball handler, but his athletic potential made him just too good to pass up.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1738 » by karkinos » Fri Jun 19, 2020 3:45 am

getrichordie wrote:
karkinos wrote:viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1940982&hilit=quickley&start=800

wrote about quickley getting underrated last month so i guess his name finally made it to this thread
i'm much higher on him than most though


Why, though? He's not going to be a ball-handler at the next level. He's a small relocation C&S guy. He doesn't provide much value. He likely doesn't get much bigger.


my approach to evaluating players has always held a strong bias towards players with high floors versus low ceilings. why? because statistically most players don't get a contract beyond their rookie contract. if a franchise can consistently draft people who can play beyond their first contract, then they've now got an asset. it's a boring approach, and while the perception is that you're more likely to miss out on superstars like the next giannis, i don't really think it misses at a significantly less rate than any other approach since most people strike out in the draft to begin with. i would prefer it if teams drafted a lot of high floor/low ceiling guys in the late first round.

for quickley, his floor for me is shooting. 40% from 3 and 90% from the line. want to make a coach happy? hit 3's and make all your free throws. not a great defender? doesn't matter in today's game. i think he has the offensive toolset to get minutes. he's quick enough and has the ball handling skills to get anywhere he wants. he's young enough to build strength and weight. i don't see why his overall game can't get better either.

so why wasn't he more successful this year? i think calipari had less than an ideal team this year imo with no true playmaker and a combination of players that honestly had too many redundant skills at the same position. quickley, maxey, and hagans is kind of a blessing and a curse for any coach. the game won't be pretty or efficient but there's enough talent alone to win games and that's exactly what they did.

what are the things i expect people to say he needs to work on? weight, strength, finishing at the rim? ok. he's young and has room to grow. maybe add more to his offensive game by creating shots off the dribble? well he has the mechanics to do it, just needs the reps. i mean, if he does at least these two things, i feel like it's not unreasonable that we could see a jeff teague 2.0. (actually really hope this happens. loved jeff teague at wake forest)
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1739 » by Stillwater » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:55 am

Quickly doesnt really have a high floor but his game is far from on full display. Definitely a solid starter potential pg with above average shooting.but most likely a bench scoring option at best as it pertains to draft stock.
His stock was hurt as a pg being the only guard between him Hagans and Maxey who can actually shoot. Granted the other 2 are better defenders maxey a better slasher Hagans the much better floor general etc id bet given some reps at the next level early on he can be just as impressive as graham was in Charlotte.
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Re: Potential sleepers 

Post#1740 » by King Ken » Fri Jun 19, 2020 8:01 pm

Stillwater wrote:Quickly doesnt really have a high floor but his game is far from on full display. Definitely a solid starter potential pg with above average shooting.but most likely a bench scoring option at best as it pertains to draft stock.
His stock was hurt as a pg being the only guard between him Hagans and Maxey who can actually shoot. Granted the other 2 are better defenders maxey a better slasher Hagans the much better floor general etc id bet given some reps at the next level early on he can be just as impressive as graham was in Charlotte.

You severely underrate how good of a PG, Graham is. The issue with Quickley is he doesn't have a NBA position

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