Trade Ideas Thread

[hugepatsfan]

In my opinion it would not surprise me if Gordon Hayward was traded if he opts into his last year of his contract.

This is a very Ainge thing to do. Trade a vet on the last year of his contract for a young player, vet and draft pick.

Also puts the Celtics in a better cap position.

I honestly would be surprised if this doesn’t happen.

Not disagreeing with the logic here but when you actually look around the NBA and think about the teams who would be interested, what they could/would offer, our own roster spot crunch, and then our status as a contender a trade feels very unlikely.

Im quite confident the Warriors would flip Wiggins and their pick to get Hayward and 17. Ainge would then need to figure out who he could flip Wiggins into in combination with several of our other picks.

Would people be mad if we flipped Hayward and 17 into the Warriors pick and Horford? I think I’d be down for that.

Not sure we can financially afford that. The reason people are thinking about trading Hayward instead of re-signing him is because of money. Wiggins and Horford are each on long term deals for probably higher salaries than Hayward will get in FA next year. A top 5 pick can also be up to $10M/year. Financially I'm just not sure we can afford that type of deal with the luxury tax implications.

[Parliament10]

Not disagreeing with the logic here but when you actually look around the NBA and think about the teams who would be interested, what they could/would offer, our own roster spot crunch, and then our status as a contender a trade feels very unlikely.

Im quite confident the Warriors would flip Wiggins and their pick to get Hayward and 17. Ainge would then need to figure out who he could flip Wiggins into in combination with several of our other picks.

Would people be mad if we flipped Hayward and 17 into the Warriors pick and Horford? I think I’d be down for that.

Not sure we can financially afford that. The reason people are thinking about trading Hayward instead of re-signing him is because of money. Wiggins and Horford are each on long term deals for probably higher salaries than Hayward will get in FA next year. A top 5 pick can also be up to $10M/year. Financially I'm just not sure we can afford that type of deal with the luxury tax implications.

Yeah. Wiggins, and especially Horford are making too much on the long-term, to be worth trading for.
Though that #1 probable pick, is intriguing.

[djFan71]

Not disagreeing with the logic here but when you actually look around the NBA and think about the teams who would be interested, what they could/would offer, our own roster spot crunch, and then our status as a contender a trade feels very unlikely.

Im quite confident the Warriors would flip Wiggins and their pick to get Hayward and 17. Ainge would then need to figure out who he could flip Wiggins into in combination with several of our other picks.

Would people be mad if we flipped Hayward and 17 into the Warriors pick and Horford? I think I’d be down for that.

Not sure we can financially afford that. The reason people are thinking about trading Hayward instead of re-signing him is because of money. Wiggins and Horford are each on long term deals for probably higher salaries than Hayward will get in FA next year. A top 5 pick can also be up to $10M/year. Financially I'm just not sure we can afford that type of deal with the luxury tax implications.

I actually brought that Wiggins trade up a while ago, and of course got killed. I didn't do the Horford part, though. Either way, the money is the tough. But, it's far from a given we let Hayward walk for nothing anyways. And, Wiggins and assets we could flip easier than Hayward so you gain some flexibility.

Something based around Wiggins, Langford 26, 30 to ORL for A Gordon, Birch could be a decent basis. We keep #1.
GSW & ORL could just eliminate us, tho: Wiggins & 1 for A Gordon, Birch & 15.

But, GSW might rather have our Gordon than ORL's. We would as well, but consolidating our picks & Langford for #1 could tip the scales. I'm not enough of a draft guy to know if #1 this year is worth it. And with lotto odds, it isn't necessarily #1.

[bucknersrevenge]

In my opinion it would not surprise me if Gordon Hayward was traded if he opts into his last year of his contract.

This is a very Ainge thing to do. Trade a vet on the last year of his contract for a young player, vet and draft pick.

Also puts the Celtics in a better cap position.

I honestly would be surprised if this doesn’t happen.

Not disagreeing with the logic here but when you actually look around the NBA and think about the teams who would be interested, what they could/would offer, our own roster spot crunch, and then our status as a contender a trade feels very unlikely.

Im quite confident the Warriors would flip Wiggins and their pick to get Hayward and 17. Ainge would then need to figure out who he could flip Wiggins into in combination with several of our other picks.

Would people be mad if we flipped Hayward and 17 into the Warriors pick and Horford? I think I’d be down for that.

Just so I'm understanding, you're suggesting we acquire Wiggins and their pick and then move Wiggins to Philly to get Horford back?

[SmartWentCrazy]

Not disagreeing with the logic here but when you actually look around the NBA and think about the teams who would be interested, what they could/would offer, our own roster spot crunch, and then our status as a contender a trade feels very unlikely.

Im quite confident the Warriors would flip Wiggins and their pick to get Hayward and 17. Ainge would then need to figure out who he could flip Wiggins into in combination with several of our other picks.

Would people be mad if we flipped Hayward and 17 into the Warriors pick and Horford? I think I’d be down for that.

Just so I'm understanding, you're suggesting we acquire Wiggins and their pick and then move Wiggins to Philly to get Horford back?

Yes, or any other vet.

Horford is getting over hated on and its kinda funny. He’s the same player he’s always been, he’s just miscast as a PF defensively in a drop big system and forced to chuck 3’s at a rate way above his comfort level due to poor spacing. His deal will really suck in year 4, but his play will recover when shifter away from volume 3 point shooting and being a 5 again.

[bucknersrevenge]

Im quite confident the Warriors would flip Wiggins and their pick to get Hayward and 17. Ainge would then need to figure out who he could flip Wiggins into in combination with several of our other picks.

Would people be mad if we flipped Hayward and 17 into the Warriors pick and Horford? I think I’d be down for that.

Just so I'm understanding, you're suggesting we acquire Wiggins and their pick and then move Wiggins to Philly to get Horford back?

Yes, or any other vet.

Horford is getting over hated on and its kinda funny. He’s the same player he’s always been, he’s just miscast as a PF defensively in a drop big system and forced to chuck 3’s at a rate way above his comfort level due to poor spacing. His deal will really suck in year 4, but his play will recover when shifter away from volume 3 point shooting and being a 5 again.

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

[SmartWentCrazy]

Just so I'm understanding, you're suggesting we acquire Wiggins and their pick and then move Wiggins to Philly to get Horford back?

Yes, or any other vet.

Horford is getting over hated on and its kinda funny. He’s the same player he’s always been, he’s just miscast as a PF defensively in a drop big system and forced to chuck 3’s at a rate way above his comfort level due to poor spacing. His deal will really suck in year 4, but his play will recover when shifter away from volume 3 point shooting and being a 5 again.

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

That pick wont help GS win with its current core. Hayward is a perfect fit for that group at the 3. Wiggins is a volume scorer that wont get the touches with everyone healthy. It also sheds the 60M+ that Wiggins is due to make after this year.

[bucknersrevenge]

Yes, or any other vet.

Horford is getting over hated on and its kinda funny. He’s the same player he’s always been, he’s just miscast as a PF defensively in a drop big system and forced to chuck 3’s at a rate way above his comfort level due to poor spacing. His deal will really suck in year 4, but his play will recover when shifter away from volume 3 point shooting and being a 5 again.

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

That pick wont help GS win with its current core. Hayward is a perfect fit for that group at the 3. Wiggins is a volume scorer that wont get the touches with everyone healthy. It also sheds the 60M+ that Wiggins is due to make after this year.

You don't think that core would benefit from an infusion of youth and talent, not to mention cost-control? And hell, why wouldn't GS deal directly with Philly?

[hugepatsfan]

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

That pick wont help GS win with its current core. Hayward is a perfect fit for that group at the 3. Wiggins is a volume scorer that wont get the touches with everyone healthy. It also sheds the 60M+ that Wiggins is due to make after this year.

You don't think that core would benefit from an infusion of youth and talent, not to mention cost-control? And hell, why wouldn't GS deal directly with Philly?

I think GS would prefer Hayward to Horford which is why he pulled it in as a 3 team trade.

[SmartWentCrazy]

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

That pick wont help GS win with its current core. Hayward is a perfect fit for that group at the 3. Wiggins is a volume scorer that wont get the touches with everyone healthy. It also sheds the 60M+ that Wiggins is due to make after this year.

You don't think that core would benefit from an infusion of youth and talent, not to mention cost-control? And hell, why wouldn't GS deal directly with Philly?

First point: No. I think they have a 2-3 year window. Best case scenario is this player would help out at the end. Cost control is nice, but they want to win IMO.

Second point: Fair; my only counter would be them preferring Hayward as a fit given how weak they are at wing.

[threrf23]

First point: No. I think they have a 2-3 year window. Best case scenario is this player would help out at the end. Cost control is nice, but they want to win IMO.

Second point: Fair; my only counter would be them preferring Hayward as a fit given how weak they are at wing.

I don't think GS would entertain the idea. Wiggins is the more versatile defensive player alongside Klay, he obvi has more upside than Hayward, and they likely chose to acquire him because they saw potential in him. Hayward meanwhile is slightly redundant alongside Klay, shoots poorly in the clutch, and remains under contract only for one more season if he opts in.

Sure, Hayward is a great offensive fit, and a better option than Wiggins if the goal is to win now, possibly a better option than Wiggins over the long run even. But the difference is not significant enough for them to consider giving up the #1 overall pick. It's a tough sell without any salary implications, considering they can easily use the pick on a player who could contribute immediately, but as noted the #1 pick is also cost controlled while the Warriors don't stand to be able to do anything meaningful cap-wise with or without Wiggins' contract at any time in the near future and they have questionable depth.

Also, Al considers himself a PF. He purportedly agreed to sign with us in part because we were committed to pairing him with a center like Aron Baynes. He like chose to sign with Philly in part because he likely wanted to play alongside Embiid. He might or might not be happy moving back to Center. Even if he were, the contract is really risky given his legs, Hayward rebounds almost as well as Al, and Hayward's defense is at least underrated from a fundamentals standpoint.

Of course, the #1 pick would likely make everything worthwhile for us.

[hugepatsfan]

First point: No. I think they have a 2-3 year window. Best case scenario is this player would help out at the end. Cost control is nice, but they want to win IMO.

Second point: Fair; my only counter would be them preferring Hayward as a fit given how weak they are at wing.

I don't think GS would entertain the idea. Wiggins is the more versatile defensive player alongside Klay, he obvi has more upside than Hayward, and they likely chose to acquire him because they saw potential in him. Hayward meanwhile is slightly redundant alongside Klay, shoots poorly in the clutch, and remains under contract only for one more season if he opts in.

Sure, Hayward is a great offensive fit, and a better option than Wiggins if the goal is to win now, possibly a better option than Wiggins over the long run even. But the difference is not significant enough for them to consider giving up the #1 overall pick. It's a tough sell without any salary implications, considering they can easily use the pick on a player who could contribute immediately, but as noted the #1 pick is also cost controlled while the Warriors don't stand to be able to do anything meaningful cap-wise with or without Wiggins' contract at any time in the near future and they have questionable depth.

Also, Al considers himself a PF. He purportedly agreed to sign with us in part because we were committed to pairing him with a center like Aron Baynes. He like chose to sign with Philly in part because he likely wanted to play alongside Embiid. He might or might not be happy moving back to Center. Even if he were, the contract is really risky given his legs, Hayward rebounds almost as well as Al, and Hayward's defense is at least underrated from a fundamentals standpoint.

Of course, the #1 pick would likely make everything worthwhile for us.

Wiggins is a versatile defender in the sense that you can put him anywhere 1-5 without changing the fact that he's trash. He is not a good shooter. He is not a good passer or even a willing one. He is not good at anything except taking lots of shots. Hayward is better than him in any and every way. He's better at literally everything you would ever ask someone to do on the court. Even though he's only signed for one year and could walk (though tough to imagine a better situation for him) there's great value in simply being out from under Wiggins' albatross contract that they only agreed to to take on to get a pick for D-Lo.

[threrf23]

Wiggins is a versatile defender in the sense that you can put him anywhere 1-5 without changing the fact that he's trash. He is not a good shooter. He is not a good passer or even a willing one. He is not good at anything except taking lots of shots. Hayward is better than him in any and every way. He's better at literally everything you would ever ask someone to do on the court. Even though he's only signed for one year and could walk (though tough to imagine a better situation for him) there's great value in simply being out from under Wiggins' albatross contract that they only agreed to to take on to get a pick for D-Lo.

He is athletic, he can score, motivation is a question mark. He scores more than Hayward and the difference in efficiency is not that substantial within context. His (he) also averaged about 4 assists per 36 this season. He has lots of unfulfilled potential and should be motivated in his current environment.

But anyways, my point isn't that Hayward isn't a better player in just about every way, it's that Wiggins isn't dead weight. He gives GS a scorer off the bench at worst, and potentially a lot more at best. And I mean, if you are right that they viewed his contract as an albatross and agreed to take on his contract solely to land a 2021 first round pick for a guy like DAR who was also wanted by other teams, what makes anyone think that they would give away the #1 overall pick in next year's draft so easily? I mean, they were clearly tanking to some effect last (this) season. They either planned all along to keep the pick, or they are after something more substantial than a Wiggins for Hayward swap.

[SmartWentCrazy]

First point: No. I think they have a 2-3 year window. Best case scenario is this player would help out at the end. Cost control is nice, but they want to win IMO.

Second point: Fair; my only counter would be them preferring Hayward as a fit given how weak they are at wing.

I don't think GS would entertain the idea. Wiggins is the more versatile defensive player alongside Klay, he obvi has more upside than Hayward, and they likely chose to acquire him because they saw potential in him. Hayward meanwhile is slightly redundant alongside Klay, shoots poorly in the clutch, and remains under contract only for one more season if he opts in.

Sure, Hayward is a great offensive fit, and a better option than Wiggins if the goal is to win now, possibly a better option than Wiggins over the long run even. But the difference is not significant enough for them to consider giving up the #1 overall pick. It's a tough sell without any salary implications, considering they can easily use the pick on a player who could contribute immediately, but as noted the #1 pick is also cost controlled while the Warriors don't stand to be able to do anything meaningful cap-wise with or without Wiggins' contract at any time in the near future and they have questionable depth.

Also, Al considers himself a PF. He purportedly agreed to sign with us in part because we were committed to pairing him with a center like Aron Baynes. He like chose to sign with Philly in part because he likely wanted to play alongside Embiid. He might or might not be happy moving back to Center. Even if he were, the contract is really risky given his legs, Hayward rebounds almost as well as Al, and Hayward's defense is at least underrated from a fundamentals standpoint.

Of course, the #1 pick would likely make everything worthwhile for us.

They wouldnt trade the pick in this deal if it were 1; 3-5 and were talking. And Wiggins is a trash defender— Hayward is significantly better on that end.

I think Al would like a re-do on his FA decision, personally. He never seemed happy in Philly and I think he’d be nore than happy to return.

[threrf23]

They wouldnt trade the pick in this deal if it were 1; 3-5 and were talking. And Wiggins is a trash defender— Hayward is significantly better on that end.

I think Al would like a re-do on his FA decision, personally. He never seemed happy in Philly and I think he’d be nore than happy to return.

I did forget that the bottom three teams now have an equal chance at the #1. Plus the lottery tends to be manipulated against tankers. So 3-5 isn't out of question.

[celtxman]

First point: No. I think they have a 2-3 year window. Best case scenario is this player would help out at the end. Cost control is nice, but they want to win IMO.

Second point: Fair; my only counter would be them preferring Hayward as a fit given how weak they are at wing.

I don't think GS would entertain the idea. Wiggins is the more versatile defensive player alongside Klay, he obvi has more upside than Hayward, and they likely chose to acquire him because they saw potential in him. Hayward meanwhile is slightly redundant alongside Klay, shoots poorly in the clutch, and remains under contract only for one more season if he opts in.

Sure, Hayward is a great offensive fit, and a better option than Wiggins if the goal is to win now, possibly a better option than Wiggins over the long run even. But the difference is not significant enough for them to consider giving up the #1 overall pick. It's a tough sell without any salary implications, considering they can easily use the pick on a player who could contribute immediately, but as noted the #1 pick is also cost controlled while the Warriors don't stand to be able to do anything meaningful cap-wise with or without Wiggins' contract at any time in the near future and they have questionable depth.

Also, Al considers himself a PF. He purportedly agreed to sign with us in part because we were committed to pairing him with a center like Aron Baynes. He like chose to sign with Philly in part because he likely wanted to play alongside Embiid. He might or might not be happy moving back to Center. Even if he were, the contract is really risky given his legs, Hayward rebounds almost as well as Al, and Hayward's defense is at least underrated from a fundamentals standpoint.

Of course, the #1 pick would likely make everything worthwhile for us.

They wouldnt trade the pick in this deal if it were 1; 3-5 and were talking. And Wiggins is a trash defender— Hayward is significantly better on that end.

I think Al would like a re-do on his FA decision, personally. He never seemed happy in Philly and I think he’d be nore than happy to return.

I'm not sure what the infatuation is with Horford is at this point. He was a great signing, but even the younger Boston Horford had us questioning what he was getting paid for many times He did not play well in his last Celtics playoffs intangibles included. If there is any moves that involves freeing up that kind of cap space, I'd look at other possible options. Keep Theis, sign Baynes, and if you can make a splash with a trade, go somewhere other than Horford.

[SmartWentCrazy]

I don't think GS would entertain the idea. Wiggins is the more versatile defensive player alongside Klay, he obvi has more upside than Hayward, and they likely chose to acquire him because they saw potential in him. Hayward meanwhile is slightly redundant alongside Klay, shoots poorly in the clutch, and remains under contract only for one more season if he opts in.

Sure, Hayward is a great offensive fit, and a better option than Wiggins if the goal is to win now, possibly a better option than Wiggins over the long run even. But the difference is not significant enough for them to consider giving up the #1 overall pick. It's a tough sell without any salary implications, considering they can easily use the pick on a player who could contribute immediately, but as noted the #1 pick is also cost controlled while the Warriors don't stand to be able to do anything meaningful cap-wise with or without Wiggins' contract at any time in the near future and they have questionable depth.

Also, Al considers himself a PF. He purportedly agreed to sign with us in part because we were committed to pairing him with a center like Aron Baynes. He like chose to sign with Philly in part because he likely wanted to play alongside Embiid. He might or might not be happy moving back to Center. Even if he were, the contract is really risky given his legs, Hayward rebounds almost as well as Al, and Hayward's defense is at least underrated from a fundamentals standpoint.

Of course, the #1 pick would likely make everything worthwhile for us.

They wouldnt trade the pick in this deal if it were 1; 3-5 and were talking. And Wiggins is a trash defender— Hayward is significantly better on that end.

I think Al would like a re-do on his FA decision, personally. He never seemed happy in Philly and I think he’d be nore than happy to return.

I'm not sure what the infatuation is with Horford is at this point. He was a great signing, but even the younger Boston Horford had us questioning what he was getting paid for many times He did not play well in his last Celtics playoffs intangibles included. If there is any moves that involves freeing up that kind of cap space, I'd look at other possible options. Keep Theis, sign Baynes, and if you can make a splash with a trade, go somewhere other than Horford.

No it didnt.

[celtxman]

They wouldnt trade the pick in this deal if it were 1; 3-5 and were talking. And Wiggins is a trash defender— Hayward is significantly better on that end.

I think Al would like a re-do on his FA decision, personally. He never seemed happy in Philly and I think he’d be nore than happy to return.

I'm not sure what the infatuation is with Horford is at this point. He was a great signing, but even the younger Boston Horford had us questioning what he was getting paid for many times He did not play well in his last Celtics playoffs intangibles included. If there is any moves that involves freeing up that kind of cap space, I'd look at other possible options. Keep Theis, sign Baynes, and if you can make a splash with a trade, go somewhere other than Horford.

No it didnt.

Maybe you never had reservations, but his many 7 point 5 rebound games had many wondering what the Celtics were doing signing him other than to show free agents could sign in Boston. I was beginning to think Al hired Scalabrine for his. PR director as Horford was getting bashed weekly.
In the last minute, the unlikely attempt to keep Horford after Kemba was on board I would have been OK to bring him back even if the last year or two might have had really diminished returns. He had an overpaid but important function that once you are over the cap is hard to replace. But now that he's gone, with Theis' rise, the hope that Timelord can be healthy and a shot at going after Baynes, the Horford ship has sailed

[wco81]

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

What's that about?

[Feed Your Head]

I agree with the assessment on Horford though I'd be shocked if he made his way back to us. Still if it brings his sister back to Boston, I'm down. Realistically though, the Warriors top pick and a 20 ppg wing is a LOT of capital to give up to get Hayward and the 17. I need help understanding their incentive to make a deal like that in the first place.

What's that about?

She’s the best, and she LOVES Boston.