OT: COVID-19 thread #2

[musiqsoulchild]

FL governor blames spike in COVID-19 cases on "overwhelmingly hispanic" day laborers and ag workers. problem is, most of the new cases are in non-ag areas and most of those workers have moved north to follow the harvest

That guy is evil.

This is the same guy who:

1) Refused to close down Florida
2) Out Trumped, the Trumper himself...and declared WWE as essential during COVID
3) Opened up the state too early

Now he's race baiting.

I am so done with these low lifes.

[Dresden]

The democrats had some strong debaters on stage with Biden, and everyone kept expecting Biden to lose ground when he had to debate. But it didn't really happen. All he had to do was not completely fall on his face, and he managed to do that in all the democrats debates, for the most part. I expect it will be the same with Trump- Trump will try to use his name calling and his bullying tactics, and Biden will just let them roll off, or he'll respond and give it back. Either way, I think Biden will hold his own, and Trump is just going to look like the bellicose idiot that he is.

Plus, this time around Trump has to run on his record these past 3 years, and that's not going to be in his favor- 1) being impeached, 2) doing a terrible job with the pandemic, and 3) seeing the economy shed 20 million jobs or so.

trump is not capable of "clowning" anybody in a debate

"when his show didn't get an emmy, he claimed the emmys were rigged" - clinton
"should've gotten it" - trump

"putin, from what i see, has no respect for hillary"
"that's because he would rather have a puppet as president"
"i'm not a puppet. you're the puppet"

"i think my strongest asset by far is my temperament. i have a winning temperament"

"under a president clinton we will have a 2nd amendment that is a small replica of what it is today"

"i know nothing about russia"

"you've been fighting ISIS your entire adult life" - trump to clinton

donald trump the debater

He mucks it up so that it's impossible for the other party to win. That's his super talent. He's going to muck it up against biden and biden is going to forget what's going on.

Biden may not be that intellectually sharp anymore, but he's clever enough to know how to outfox Trump I think. He's not afraid of getting down into the mud with Trump, unlike most of the others, and he's also got that working class, average Joe kind of persona that I think people will gravitate to, when seen in comparison to Trump's bullying.

As long as Biden doesn't get too carried away, and try to make too many frivilous attacks on Trump that he can't back up, I think he'll be fine.

Don't forget, Trump is showing signs of decline, too. He slurs his words, he can't put together complete sentences, he mispronounces things all the time.

[TheStig]

I don't think Trump is much of a debater. He's a showman, and he caught a lot of people off guard in 2016, including Hillary.

Biden was losing in the polls because there were too many pulling away the moderate votes, like Buttigieg and Klobuchar. Once they dropped out, the field was all his, and when Bernie couldn't get the AA vote to go his way, it was effectively over.

In all the post debate analysis I read, critics typically would say something about Biden like "well, he didn't win the debate, but he didn't have to either. And he didn't do anything to lose support, and even had one or two strong moments".

So I don't think his debate performances ever really cost him any support. All he had to do was be the last man standing in the moderate camp, and he managed to do that.

I was a Bernie or Elizabeth Warren supporter myself, so I"m no fan of Biden either, but I still think a Biden presidency is worth supporting, given the alternative is Trump.

Yes, exactly, once the people with his point of view that were beating him quit, he magically started winning. He started with a huge lead, lost it till he was almost out of it, then every body in his way but Bernie drops out and he magically wins, all of 2 days before super tuesday. He was out of money, losing badly and then the DNC parted the red sea for him. This what I don't like about politics and at the end of the day they will lose badly for it. Their only chance is if the corona virus gets worse in the fall and/or the stock market actually has any connection with reality. No body is excited about Biden.

Most of the early debates he didn't do anything. That's why a few days before super tuesday he was broke and people were thinking he'd drop out. Everyone else ate up his whole base. He lost everything but SC. He was supposed to run away with it before the primaries actually started.

You know, I am a Bernie supporter (and he lost it by being to cozy with Biden and going off of his strong financial and populist arguments that had him do so well last time) and I just can't do it after I heard all of that for Clinton. Biden isn't even trying to incorporate them. He's playing identity politics and I'm not as bad as Trump and I knew Obama. And I just can't support the candidate that doesn't give a damn about me but needs my support. His projected cabinet looks more like Trump's than any democrats should and he's just not going to do anything valuable, nor do I think he's actually capable or qualified to be president. I didn't like Hilary but at least I could see the skills necessary to succeed. Biden's just going to be a gaffe machine that gets played by everyone. Trump at least will put american corporations first (not the people) and only really get played by china.

The DNC playing these games and pushing the most disliked candidate in Hilary and this boob in Biden deserve to lose. I refuse to encourage their recklessness. I think for the long haul and actually having a democratic party that stands for anything, they have to have a decissive loss because the Shumer's and Pelosies are just republicans who play identity politics. They really need to clean house or the progressives need to go tea party on them and hold them accountable.

[TheStig]

trump is not capable of "clowning" anybody in a debate

"when his show didn't get an emmy, he claimed the emmys were rigged" - clinton
"should've gotten it" - trump

"putin, from what i see, has no respect for hillary"
"that's because he would rather have a puppet as president"
"i'm not a puppet. you're the puppet"

"i think my strongest asset by far is my temperament. i have a winning temperament"

"under a president clinton we will have a 2nd amendment that is a small replica of what it is today"

"i know nothing about russia"

"you've been fighting ISIS your entire adult life" - trump to clinton

donald trump the debater

He mucks it up so that it's impossible for the other party to win. That's his super talent. He's going to muck it up against biden and biden is going to forget what's going on.

Biden may not be that intellectually sharp anymore, but he's clever enough to know how to outfox Trump I think. He's not afraid of getting down into the mud with Trump, unlike most of the others, and he's also got that working class, average Joe kind of persona that I think people will gravitate to, when seen in comparison to Trump's bullying.

As long as Biden doesn't get too carried away, and try to make too many frivilous attacks on Trump that he can't back up, I think he'll be fine.

Don't forget, Trump is showing signs of decline, too. He slurs his words, he can't put together complete sentences, he mispronounces things all the time.

Trump is way ahead of Biden in stategy and communication skills. He's going to muck it up about hunter, obama generic garbage and negate any advantage and have all the zingers. It's not going to be pretty. Bernie's attacks were coming from his friend of 30 years gently, Trumps going to punch him in the jaw with all of his contraversies and failures. There is a reason that Biden failed running for president 3 other times. And it's all going to come back in the spot light.

It's really not going to be close.

[Dresden]

He mucks it up so that it's impossible for the other party to win. That's his super talent. He's going to muck it up against biden and biden is going to forget what's going on.

Biden may not be that intellectually sharp anymore, but he's clever enough to know how to outfox Trump I think. He's not afraid of getting down into the mud with Trump, unlike most of the others, and he's also got that working class, average Joe kind of persona that I think people will gravitate to, when seen in comparison to Trump's bullying.

As long as Biden doesn't get too carried away, and try to make too many frivilous attacks on Trump that he can't back up, I think he'll be fine.

Don't forget, Trump is showing signs of decline, too. He slurs his words, he can't put together complete sentences, he mispronounces things all the time.

Trump is way ahead of Biden in stategy and communication skills. He's going to muck it up about hunter, obama generic garbage and negate any advantage and have all the zingers. It's not going to be pretty. Bernie's attacks were coming from his friend of 30 years gently, Trumps going to punch him in the jaw with all of his contraversies and failures. There is a reason that Biden failed running for president 3 other times. And it's all going to come back in the spot light.

It's really not going to be close.

I just don't think Trump is smart enough to pull all of that off. I think the only way Biden doesn't come out of the debates looking better is if he gets flustered by Trump, and starts getting too emotional- which Trump can do. But if he takes the high road, and doesn't take the bait too often, just picks his spots to counterpunch, he'll be fine.

I really thought he would get clobbered by the other dems in the debates, and I think on a strictly policy/ideas basis, he did, but on an over all likability level, he was fine. He's got the common man touch, and while the others were arguing about the details of national health care, he was just smiling away, and putting out nice sounding cliches.

As for the DNC, I agree, they made some sort of deal/threat to Buttigieg to get him to drop out at a crucial moment, but that just went to show- when Biden had Bernie one on one- when it was progressives v. centrists, the centrist won. For a long time, Bernie had the progressive vote all to himself (Warren siphoned a little bit off, too), against a field of moderates.

I'm encouraged by the fact that so many progressive ideas are now becoming almost mainstream. 8 years, you never would have heard universal health care being agreed to by almost every single democrat in the field. Student debt relief, green new deal, and other long sought after progressive goals are now almost a given. I"m not convinced Joe's cabinet will be so conservative. He's still got to please the Bernie/Warren camps, and that's going to mean forming a coalition of sorts.

In the end, how much he actually gets accomplished all comes down to if the democrats can take the senate or not. But I'm hopeful that his presidency will actually be much more progressive than Obama's was.

[TheStig]

Biden may not be that intellectually sharp anymore, but he's clever enough to know how to outfox Trump I think. He's not afraid of getting down into the mud with Trump, unlike most of the others, and he's also got that working class, average Joe kind of persona that I think people will gravitate to, when seen in comparison to Trump's bullying.

As long as Biden doesn't get too carried away, and try to make too many frivilous attacks on Trump that he can't back up, I think he'll be fine.

Don't forget, Trump is showing signs of decline, too. He slurs his words, he can't put together complete sentences, he mispronounces things all the time.

Trump is way ahead of Biden in stategy and communication skills. He's going to muck it up about hunter, obama generic garbage and negate any advantage and have all the zingers. It's not going to be pretty. Bernie's attacks were coming from his friend of 30 years gently, Trumps going to punch him in the jaw with all of his contraversies and failures. There is a reason that Biden failed running for president 3 other times. And it's all going to come back in the spot light.

It's really not going to be close.

I just don't think Trump is smart enough to pull all of that off. I think the only way Biden doesn't come out of the debates looking better is if he gets flustered by Trump, and starts getting too emotional- which Trump can do. But if he takes the high road, and doesn't take the bait too often, just picks his spots to counterpunch, he'll be fine.

I really thought he would get clobbered by the other dems in the debates, and I think on a strictly policy/ideas basis, he did, but on an over all likability level, he was fine. He's got the common man touch, and while the others were arguing about the details of national health care, he was just smiling away, and putting out nice sounding cliches.

As for the DNC, I agree, they made some sort of deal/threat to Buttigieg to get him to drop out at a crucial moment, but that just went to show- when Biden had Bernie one on one- when it was progressives v. centrists, the centrist won. For a long time, Bernie had the progressive vote all to himself (Warren siphoned a little bit off, too), against a field of moderates.

I'm encouraged by the fact that so many progressive ideas are now becoming almost mainstream. 8 years, you never would have heard universal health care being agreed to by almost every single democrat in the field. Student debt relief, green new deal, and other long sought after progressive goals are now almost a given. I"m not convinced Joe's cabinet will be so conservative. He's still got to please the Bernie/Warren camps, and that's going to mean forming a coalition of sorts.

In the end, how much he actually gets accomplished all comes down to if the democrats can take the senate or not. But I'm hopeful that his presidency will actually be much more progressive than Obama's was.

I guess that's where the disagreement is because Trump does get people flustered and Biden is already easily confused. And when you muck it up, his end goal is to get both dirty and not win.

It wasn't Biden vs Bernie. It was Biden vs Bernie and Warren. They cleared out every centrist that was left in Kloubucher and Pete, all of them basically equal with Klobucher passing. Warren took more more Bernie people and smeared him right before with her accusation about him saying a woman couldn't win. I think when they saw Bernie was posied to win it, they rigged it. If all the players stayed the same, he was projected to win super tuesday.

You could have fooled me, I thought Obama was putting out progressive ideas in 2008 but he never actually did them. I think the progressive talk is just there to fool us into voting for them. None of them really make it through. It's why I think they need to go the tea party route instead of joining them like Bernie and AOC. They've got to hold them hostage and accountable instead of going along with "my friend joe".

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

[musiqsoulchild]

Trump is way ahead of Biden in stategy and communication skills. He's going to muck it up about hunter, obama generic garbage and negate any advantage and have all the zingers. It's not going to be pretty. Bernie's attacks were coming from his friend of 30 years gently, Trumps going to punch him in the jaw with all of his contraversies and failures. There is a reason that Biden failed running for president 3 other times. And it's all going to come back in the spot light.

It's really not going to be close.

I just don't think Trump is smart enough to pull all of that off. I think the only way Biden doesn't come out of the debates looking better is if he gets flustered by Trump, and starts getting too emotional- which Trump can do. But if he takes the high road, and doesn't take the bait too often, just picks his spots to counterpunch, he'll be fine.

I really thought he would get clobbered by the other dems in the debates, and I think on a strictly policy/ideas basis, he did, but on an over all likability level, he was fine. He's got the common man touch, and while the others were arguing about the details of national health care, he was just smiling away, and putting out nice sounding cliches.

As for the DNC, I agree, they made some sort of deal/threat to Buttigieg to get him to drop out at a crucial moment, but that just went to show- when Biden had Bernie one on one- when it was progressives v. centrists, the centrist won. For a long time, Bernie had the progressive vote all to himself (Warren siphoned a little bit off, too), against a field of moderates.

I'm encouraged by the fact that so many progressive ideas are now becoming almost mainstream. 8 years, you never would have heard universal health care being agreed to by almost every single democrat in the field. Student debt relief, green new deal, and other long sought after progressive goals are now almost a given. I"m not convinced Joe's cabinet will be so conservative. He's still got to please the Bernie/Warren camps, and that's going to mean forming a coalition of sorts.

In the end, how much he actually gets accomplished all comes down to if the democrats can take the senate or not. But I'm hopeful that his presidency will actually be much more progressive than Obama's was.

I guess that's where the disagreement is because Trump does get people flustered and Biden is already easily confused. And when you muck it up, his end goal is to get both dirty and not win.

It wasn't Biden vs Bernie. It was Biden vs Bernie and Warren. They cleared out every centrist that was left in Kloubucher and Pete, all of them basically equal with Klobucher passing. Warren took more more Bernie people and smeared him right before with her accusation about him saying a woman couldn't win. I think when they saw Bernie was posied to win it, they rigged it. If all the players stayed the same, he was projected to win super tuesday.

You could have fooled me, I thought Obama was putting out progressive ideas in 2008 but he never actually did them. I think the progressive talk is just there to fool us into voting for them. None of them really make it through. It's why I think they need to go the tea party route instead of joining them like Bernie and AOC. They've got to hold them hostage and accountable instead of going along with "my friend joe".

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

I think you arent giving Biden much credit. That's your prerogative.

This election will be about Trump.

And about swing state Math.

There are a lot more states at play now....people want to push the Ducey's and the Trumps and the Scott's out.

I can see Biden winning without having to do too much.

It's going to be about surrogates. The Black vote was heavily depressed for Hillary due to "super predators" and the role BLM played in 2016.

Ironically, the organic nature of the same movement now is playing completely in Bidens favor.

What we dont need is liberals trying an ideological purity test that begins and ends with Bernie. But even that will not make a difference this year.

Biden is far more likeable than Hillary was.

And she lost Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania by a net 100,000 votes give or take.

That's the entire Presidency.

[PlayerUp]

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

Me and TheStig share very similar view points.

Big government is failing on both ends. They're overspending and always fighting with very little getting done. Both parties are to blame. Both parties are corrupt. It's been like this for many years. The only true way to fix this is stop government spending, keep the federal government small, and give the states and cities more power. Lets people be free and move to areas of the US that they would be best suited in.

Nothing will change under Biden other than parts of the left will be happy. The far left will still be angry, and everyone on the right will be working to delay anything Biden does for the 2024 election. Biden also doesn't have the mental or physical strength to even be president now yet he thinks he can run the country? It's going to get uglier much uglier no matter who wins in 2020.

[dice]

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

Me and TheStig share very similar view points.

Big government is failing on both ends. They're overspending and always fighting with very little getting done. Both parties are to blame. Both parties are corrupt. It's been like this for many years. The only true way to fix this is stop government spending, keep the federal government small, and give the states and cities more power. Lets people be free and move to areas of the US that would be be suited in.

Nothing will change under Biden other than parts of the left will be happy. The far left will still be angry, and everyone on the right will be working to delay anything Biden does for the 2024 election. Biden also doesn't have the mental or physical strength to even be president now yet he thinks he can run the country? It's going to get uglier much uglier no matter who wins in 2020.

huge upgrade from the current occupant, who spends half his day with fox news on in his residence as he tweets from the toilet

[TheStig]

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

Me and TheStig share very similar view points.

Big government is failing on both ends. They're overspending and always fighting with very little getting done. Both parties are to blame. Both parties are corrupt. It's been like this for many years. The only true way to fix this is stop government spending, keep the federal government small, and give the states and cities more power. Lets people be free and move to areas of the US that would be be suited in.

Nothing will change under Biden other than parts of the left will be happy. The far left will still be angry, and everyone on the right will be working to delay anything Biden does for the 2024 election. Biden also doesn't have the mental or physical strength to even be president now yet he thinks he can run the country? It's going to get uglier much uglier no matter who wins in 2020.

Nothing will really change till you take money out of politics. There is no reason the Clinton's could leave the WH in debt and are now worth hundreds of millions of dollars when Bill was just giving speeches and running a foundation and Hilary had a senate seat and cabinet position. They need to overturn corporations are people, super pacs and lobbyists. In this day in age, with free facebook, twitter, plenty of news channels and such, you don't need giant pacs in elections. And I also wish they'd go back to the rule where you had to give equal time to both parties. I feel like someone watching fox news is living in a different world than the person watching MSNBC.

I'd also like to see socialism for the rich fail. All I hear when taxes and programs and minimum wages is brought up is that capitalism is the best but then we need to continually bail out these companies. And each time we do that, it hurts small business and eliminates the middle class. In 10 years a lawyer or DR or software engineer will be the only ones left in the middle class, you'll basically be left with the rich and poor. And they get away with this because of the shared economy, easy credit and low interests rates. So many people actually own soooooo little.

Anyway, I didn't mean to type a manifesto. I just think these identity politics are hear to divide us on issues that no one can actually win when the main issues are based on class and income inequality. That's where I think Bernie of 2016 was a much better candidate than Bernie of 2020.

I'm also not trying to pick on Biden. I think both him and trump would be/are bad presidents. I don't see major differences between the two. Biden might be nicer or might appear to be more liberal but nothing will really change or improve. By withholding a vote, at least I'm not encouraging the democrats to do the same thing and I think another crushing loss would actually accomplish something because nothings really changed in the leadership from 2016.

[TheStig]

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

Me and TheStig share very similar view points.

Big government is failing on both ends. They're overspending and always fighting with very little getting done. Both parties are to blame. Both parties are corrupt. It's been like this for many years. The only true way to fix this is stop government spending, keep the federal government small, and give the states and cities more power. Lets people be free and move to areas of the US that would be be suited in.

Nothing will change under Biden other than parts of the left will be happy. The far left will still be angry, and everyone on the right will be working to delay anything Biden does for the 2024 election. Biden also doesn't have the mental or physical strength to even be president now yet he thinks he can run the country? It's going to get uglier much uglier no matter who wins in 2020.

huge upgrade from the current occupant, who spends half his day with fox news on in his residence as he tweets from the toilet

Meh, I'm looking for more than ascetics.

[dice]

Me and TheStig share very similar view points.

Big government is failing on both ends. They're overspending and always fighting with very little getting done. Both parties are to blame. Both parties are corrupt. It's been like this for many years. The only true way to fix this is stop government spending, keep the federal government small, and give the states and cities more power. Lets people be free and move to areas of the US that would be be suited in.

Nothing will change under Biden other than parts of the left will be happy. The far left will still be angry, and everyone on the right will be working to delay anything Biden does for the 2024 election. Biden also doesn't have the mental or physical strength to even be president now yet he thinks he can run the country? It's going to get uglier much uglier no matter who wins in 2020.

huge upgrade from the current occupant, who spends half his day with fox news on in his residence as he tweets from the toilet

Meh, I'm looking for more than ascetics.

what the hell does that even mean?

[PlayerUp]

huge upgrade from the current occupant, who spends half his day with fox news on in his residence as he tweets from the toilet

Maybe from your perspective but Biden will spend half his day sleeping because he is just too old.

From a perspective of someone who dislikes both parties, Biden is a terrible candidate and no better than Trump. I personally don't get triggered with what Trump says like you guys do. I only care about the person in office and what he can do to fix and improve this nation. In order to do that, you need both parties coming together and constantly meeting in the middle. This can't be done anymore because both parties are corrupt and only side with their party.

Why I have been saying we need more than a 2 party system (won't happen) or to downsize the federal government and leave it up to the states to decide the bulk of things. Federal government used to be fairly small and it worked decades ago.

[dice]

huge upgrade from the current occupant, who spends half his day with fox news on in his residence as he tweets from the toilet

Maybe from your perspective but Biden will spend half his day sleeping because he is just too old.

well, he doesn't do that now, so...

[TheStig]

I just don't think Trump is smart enough to pull all of that off. I think the only way Biden doesn't come out of the debates looking better is if he gets flustered by Trump, and starts getting too emotional- which Trump can do. But if he takes the high road, and doesn't take the bait too often, just picks his spots to counterpunch, he'll be fine.

I really thought he would get clobbered by the other dems in the debates, and I think on a strictly policy/ideas basis, he did, but on an over all likability level, he was fine. He's got the common man touch, and while the others were arguing about the details of national health care, he was just smiling away, and putting out nice sounding cliches.

As for the DNC, I agree, they made some sort of deal/threat to Buttigieg to get him to drop out at a crucial moment, but that just went to show- when Biden had Bernie one on one- when it was progressives v. centrists, the centrist won. For a long time, Bernie had the progressive vote all to himself (Warren siphoned a little bit off, too), against a field of moderates.

I'm encouraged by the fact that so many progressive ideas are now becoming almost mainstream. 8 years, you never would have heard universal health care being agreed to by almost every single democrat in the field. Student debt relief, green new deal, and other long sought after progressive goals are now almost a given. I"m not convinced Joe's cabinet will be so conservative. He's still got to please the Bernie/Warren camps, and that's going to mean forming a coalition of sorts.

In the end, how much he actually gets accomplished all comes down to if the democrats can take the senate or not. But I'm hopeful that his presidency will actually be much more progressive than Obama's was.

I guess that's where the disagreement is because Trump does get people flustered and Biden is already easily confused. And when you muck it up, his end goal is to get both dirty and not win.

It wasn't Biden vs Bernie. It was Biden vs Bernie and Warren. They cleared out every centrist that was left in Kloubucher and Pete, all of them basically equal with Klobucher passing. Warren took more more Bernie people and smeared him right before with her accusation about him saying a woman couldn't win. I think when they saw Bernie was posied to win it, they rigged it. If all the players stayed the same, he was projected to win super tuesday.

You could have fooled me, I thought Obama was putting out progressive ideas in 2008 but he never actually did them. I think the progressive talk is just there to fool us into voting for them. None of them really make it through. It's why I think they need to go the tea party route instead of joining them like Bernie and AOC. They've got to hold them hostage and accountable instead of going along with "my friend joe".

They had the senate 12 years ago and placated the republicans in most things. Let's face, the big interests have bought both parties but when it's a tax cut, they always find just enough votes and a couple of dems flip. I don't see any real impactful change under biden. They've all sold out.

I think you arent giving Biden much credit. That's your prerogative.

This election will be about Trump.

And about swing state Math.

There are a lot more states at play now....people want to push the Ducey's and the Trumps and the Scott's out.

I can see Biden winning without having to do too much.

It's going to be about surrogates. The Black vote was heavily depressed for Hillary due to "super predators" and the role BLM played in 2016.

Ironically, the organic nature of the same movement now is playing completely in Bidens favor.

What we dont need is liberals trying an ideological purity test that begins and ends with Bernie. But even that will not make a difference this year.

Biden is far more likeable than Hillary was.

And she lost Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania by a net 100,000 votes give or take.

That's the entire Presidency.

Clinton was much more ahead of trump at this point 4 years ago and lost. Biden hasn't been really looked into and picked apart. He's had the easiest road to the nomination that any candidate has. The sexual accusations, Hunter's issues, corruption and his mental decline. He's going to get really punched in the face during these debates. I don't think the ole uncle joe is gonna look so good afterwards. Trump also has sooooooo many more resources than he did last time. He has a complete organization and much more money.

The only way I see this going south is if covid comes back very hard in the early fall and/or wall street actually becomes based on finances.

[chitownsalesmen]

as long as Biden doesn't go hard left and scare off the middle.

yeah go for the middle just like Clinton did in 2016, agreed, play it safe pick up those "reasonable republicans"

[PlayerUp]

well, he doesn't do that now, so...

He'll be 78. He'd be the oldest president ever and clearly suffering from early signs of altermizers. Those who don't see this now will see it eventually. Comparing him to say Obama is a complete joke. Obama had a clear mind, smooth talker and had clear energy to be president. Biden has neither of these things.

[TheStig]

huge upgrade from the current occupant, who spends half his day with fox news on in his residence as he tweets from the toilet

Maybe from your perspective but Biden will spend half his day sleeping because he is just too old.

well, he doesn't do that now, so...

If we went by what he does now, should we just assume that he'd be hanging out in his basement all day making gaffes while trying to sound cool?

[dice]

Maybe from your perspective but Biden will spend half his day sleeping because he is just too old.

well, he doesn't do that now, so...

If we went by what he does now, should we just assume that he'd be hanging out in his basement all day making gaffes while trying to sound cool?

he doesn't do that either. not sure what weird parallel universe you're living in

[dice]

well, he doesn't do that now, so...

He'll be 78. He'd be the oldest president ever and clearly suffering from early signs of altermizers. Those who don't see this now will see it eventually.

thank you doctor

Comparing him to say Obama is a complete joke. Obama had a clear mind, smooth talker and had clear energy to be president. Biden has neither of these things.

please tell me who is comparing biden to obama in terms of fitness to be president